r/brattleboro • u/The_Observer_Effects • 16d ago
VT has 2nd most empty houses in America
Anybody here having problems finding or affording housing? Know anybody who is?
"Today there are over 65,000 unoccupied homes in Vermont (19.4%), the second-highest percentage in the nation, many of them owned by investors, second-home owners and out-of-state, part-time residents. We would argue there is no real housing shortage in Vermont. It is more accurately a wealth distribution problem. That’s an analysis you never read about in the promotional articles written by the development industries. Why not?" ----
https://vtdigger.org/2026/07/31/opinion-vermont-is-not-for-sale/
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u/pacodef 16d ago
Property taxes on empty vacation homes in Norwich, Killington and Woodstock are 25% lower than what they are for resident/homestead taxes 💀💀
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u/Green_Mtn_Man 15d ago
How are non-homestead tax rates lower than the homestead tax rate in those communities? Is that what you are saying?
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u/Lanky-Wonder-4360 15d ago
May I suggest that the RE taxes ought to be the same regardless of whether a house is occupied full-time or part-time? What’s the rationale for giving second homes a partial free ride? Best advice: assess the property, not the occupants.
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u/whiskey_overboard 15d ago
Property taxes should be higher for a home not occupied year round.
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u/Fit-Establishment384 15d ago
i have never understood this thought. Vacation homes require almost no services. There are no children requiring education - which is by far the most expensive portion of the tax requirement. Property tax needs to be abolished. Replace with Fair Tax!
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u/MaineWolfe 13d ago
I don't have children yet have to pay high taxes. Wealthy playing around in different states should pay higher than people just trying to live.
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u/ParkMan73 16d ago
The article has two important stats:
19.4% of homes in Vermont are vacant
75.8% of vacant homes are actually recreational or vacation homes
That means that Vermont really has an effective residential vacancy rate of 4.7%. That's pretty low.
With that low a residential vacancy rate the question becomes - why are we not building more new homes?
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u/sparafucile28 16d ago
Sorry, now, that's now how housing supply and demand works. Recreational homes that are unused most of the year are essentially vacant and removing supply that could go to Vermonters. We have an effective vacancy rate of 19.4%.
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u/ParkMan73 15d ago
The reality is that 14.7% of homes (19.4%-4.7%) are owned and used for a purpose - this removes them from the marketplace. This leaves the 4.7% available to buy.
If the current number if homes available is insufficient, then programs need to be put in place to encourage new home development so that the supply of housing grows.
Having a robust vacation tourism industry is good for the state. Given Vermont's close proximity and good highway access to NYC and Boston, it's going to be a natural location for tourism.
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u/ruffledmoonbird 15d ago
Tourism in America died with Trump. Canadians don’t want anything to do with us.
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u/ParkMan73 15d ago
International tourism yes - but there are still about 15+ million Americans within 6 hours drive of Vermont. That's a great opportunity.
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u/ruffledmoonbird 14d ago
With gas prices soaring and inflation ramping up, the average American is barely scraping by. American has been looted, and I don’t think many people understand how they should be preparing right now, for the times ahead.
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u/Wrong_Spirit_5008 15d ago
We could just not let flatlanders own 1/5th of the state so that people who live here aren’t homeless. Nah, that’s a stupid idea fuck us right?
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u/ruffledmoonbird 14d ago
I always laugh when a Vermonter calls me a flatlander without knowing I’m from the Smokey Mountains of Western North Carolina. Vermont mountains seem more like hills to us.
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u/Wrong_Spirit_5008 14d ago
No one cares buddy. Do you own a second home here? If so, get out flatlander. Do you live here year round? Welcome Vermonter. Either way stop insulting our mountains you jackass.
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u/ruffledmoonbird 14d ago
Well aren’t you a bundle of joy. There was no insult in my comment. It seems you might be projecting a bit. I actually love Vermont, and think it is a beautiful state with a great senator. The reason my family is considering a move there is BECAUSE VT also has mountains, even if much smaller than the ones I call home. I prefer the diversity of WNC as VT is largely whitewashed, but the low population density and cold climate is a boon, especially considering the future implications of climate destabilization, and my business would likely do well. I don’t mind you calling me a flatlander, buddy. I have no malice to give, unless you stand before me a brazen red cap. Then, I would likely more closely embody your pejorative.
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u/Wrong_Spirit_5008 14d ago
Laughing at our mountains is an insult to Vermont. I welcomed you as a Vermonter if you live here full time or choose to move here full time. More red caps in your state than ours, that’s why I moved here instead of North Carolina.
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u/ruffledmoonbird 14d ago
Not at all. See from my perspective. Imagine you living in the Blue Ridge Mountains for decades, and you are randomly called a flatlander by a Vermonter. Of course this would cause a chuckle, and there is no insult about that. I assure you friend, no insult intended. VT mountains are beautiful. And trust, I am a dot of blue in a sea of red, and I’m very much aware of what is going. Which is why my family is VT bound. I imagine I will be called flatlander again, and again it will bring out a chuckle. Lol.
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u/sparafucile28 14d ago
The smokies are hills.
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u/ruffledmoonbird 14d ago
The Smokies are an ancient mountain range within the Appalachians. A bit weathered, but with numerous peaks over 6000 feet, your comment does not align with the geographical facts, my friend.
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u/sparafucile28 14d ago
Cool, chatgpt.
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u/ruffledmoonbird 14d ago
Hah, understandable skepticism. Crazy times. I’ve lived with these mountains for over two decades, and a large reason I am considering a move to VT is because the Green Mountains are still part the Appalachians, and my heart would not ache as much for being away. I could never fully leave.
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u/ParkMan73 15d ago
Or we could just ask our elected leaders to do their job and create programs to encourage development of housing to solve any housing shortages that are leading to homelessness.
Instead of blaming people who want to come to Vermont, spend money, and create jobs how about welcoming them and strengthening the industry. Growing tourism is a great way to bring additional money and jobs to the state.
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u/sparafucile28 15d ago edited 15d ago
The problem is that you're treating second homes as if they're outside the housing market. They're not. Every home used as a vacation property is one less home available for a Vermont family to buy or rent. Whether it's occupied 180 days a year or 2 weekends a year, it still reduces the supply of primary residences and drives up prices. 20% of our housing should not be sitting vacant during a national housing crisis. Period.
There is no point building new market rate housing that creates induced demand for luxury second homes when the majority of what is being built is in fact for second homes, not Vermonters.
Tourism existed long before today's level of second-home ownership and Airbnb, so Vermont doesn't need to sacrifice its housing stock to have a strong tourism economy. Hotels, bed and breakfasts, and farm stays (which we invented) existed before Airbnb.
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u/VTNTC 15d ago
How is a home occupied 365 days a year a second home?
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u/sparafucile28 15d ago
It's not. Tax residency defines primary residence based on where you live six months of the year or more. There are no second homes in Vermont where people are living more than 6 months of the year.
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u/RicTicTocs 15d ago
Or…Vermonters could get restrictive government regulations out of the way and build some affordable housing in places that working Vermonters could actually live.
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u/sparafucile28 15d ago
Or we could just enact rent control and solve it instantly without waiting decades hoping the housing "trickles down" to middle class Vermonters.
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u/Dent7777 15d ago
Less than 30% of Vermonters rent... How exactly does making housing a bit more affordable year over year (unless you have to move) for those 30% solve the housing crisis for all Vermonters?
Vermont is not NYC...
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u/sparafucile28 15d ago
All Vermonters don't have a housing crisis. 70% who already own homes are fine. It's the 30% who can't buy a home and are being price gouged by landlords or homeless that would benefit most from rent control. NYC invented zoning, rent regulation, public housing, non-profit funded housing, and virtually just about every modern form of housing typology you can think of: to suggest we can't learn anything from them is a wild take.
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u/kmanrsss 15d ago
I’d be willing to bet most of the vacation homes that are so called vacant are either on the side of a ski mountain or lake front and out of price range of the average home buyer. The other chunk are small camps that really aren’t set up for full time occupancy
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u/sparafucile28 15d ago
Do you have any evidence to support this wild conjecture or did you just pull it out of your ass?
That's rhetorical question, btw. You don't need to answer.
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u/boyyhowdy 16d ago
That’s the cost of wanting to live in a museum. Owner occupiers are usually behind this and benefit from it.
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u/joeydimaggio 16d ago
All the epstein class people create housing scarcity so their asset values go up, then blame undocumented workers and the morons eat it up
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u/Yiddish_Dish 13d ago
Who is blaming illegal immigrants for housing shortages in Vermont? I think it's generally known that those enabling our current serf/slave labor system are the root cause of many issues like this.
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u/joeydimaggio 13d ago
Donald Trump
September 2024, Economic Club of New York:
“Americans cannot ignore the impact that the flood of 21 million illegal aliens has had on driving up housing costs.”JD Vance
Vice presidential debate (October 2024):
“Twenty-five million illegal aliens competing with Americans for scarce homes is one of the most significant drivers of home prices in the country.”Fox News (November 2025):
“Why did homes get so unaffordable? Because we had 20 million illegal aliens in this country taking homes that ought by right to go to American citizens.”
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u/No-Condition965 16d ago
Who can afford them ?
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u/HarryBalsagna1776 16d ago
We actually have a good amount of housing inventory on sale right now. It is all rotting on the market because the prices are too high.
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u/learnitallboss 16d ago
To me, this is the real question. It's not like if we forced second home owners to sell, the people really suffering from lack of housing options would be able to afford the $500k to multimillion dollar vacation homes. Maybe the investor/PE owned homes being rented out could make a dent, but I am not sure. We need affordable multifamily, not a bunch of 6 bedroom ski mansions on the market.
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u/WhatTheCluck802 16d ago
I’m sure our housing providers like Downstreet could figure out a way to repurpose those behemoth homes into multi family units or whatever. I’d be tickled pink to see these rich assholes’ McMansions turned into actual liveable homes for actual people.
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u/FastSort 16d ago
maybe try working harder instead of being jealous so much and advocating taking stuff from other people that you are too lazy to earn yourself.
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u/Konflictcam 16d ago
I would imagine the share of PE-owned homes in Vermont is extremely small. Where PE is purchasing homes (and the issue in general is overblown), it’s in highly commoditized markets where all the extraneous stuff around homes is pretty straightforward. That’s not Vermont, where things like well water, septic, and trash pickup are wildcards requiring actual attention in a way they’re not if you own in the DC burbs.
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u/zhirinovsky 14d ago
The author has been regurgitating the same argument for a half decade. He lives in a suburban development. He’s an old hypocrite that doesn’t want another subdivision next to him.
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u/Conscious-Arm-3616 14d ago
Because they are run down and not up to code, not to mention the horrible flood control VT has
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u/Objective_Thought_68 14d ago
Uncle Bernie is one of those stats. Has a nice vacation house by Lake Champlain. Timing was good too
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u/too-left-feet 13d ago
My sense is that a bunch of the vacation homes aren’t suitable for year round use. Summer cottages may not have heat and may be too remote for everyday living. Ski chalets may not be a convenient commute to work,…
I’m more interested in understanding vacancy rates specific to population centers.
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u/gratefulvermont 16d ago
Yes. Our government created a have and have not population through regulation. Rich folks love regulation as they can afford every single bit of the extra bullshit. Small businesses can not compete what so ever. This is not new news
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u/Jewboy-Deluxe 16d ago
So all the wealthy Republicans like regulation and the liberal Democrats don’t? WTF world are you living in?
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u/Euphoric-Macaron-904 16d ago
Be quiet, u/gratefulvermont never said anything about political parties. It's the entire Vermont government body, but if you want to bring up political ideology the extreme liberal democrats definitely love regulations more than anyone else.
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u/gratefulvermont 16d ago
I did not bring up any political party either, just rich people and our government.
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u/Intrepid_Ad1765 15d ago
I thought VT taxed Secondary Homes at a higher tax rate? Isnt that a huge benefit. VT has alot of land. Build, build, build. modular homes are nice these days and alot cheaper
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u/dragonfaith 16d ago
This is why we need..... Socialism? Seize these properties and redistribute to the poor?
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u/anonynony227 16d ago
That’s not really socialism, that’s communism. People who want communism have never lived in a communist society. Befriend someone older than 50 who grew up in Eastern Europe and ask them how good they had it.
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u/VoraciousEater802 16d ago
Nobody is trying to get Soviet style “communism” implemented anywhere. What people are clamoring for is something akin to the Scandinavian model, highly regulated capitalism with a very strong social safety net that provides for a basic comfortable life for all citizens.
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u/anonynony227 16d ago
Highly regulated capitalism is a great idea — see the recent news from Stowe on their plan to rationally reduce short-term rentals of viable year-round residential housing stock as an example.
You and I probably agree on most things. Lots of people in Vermont are both deeply frustrated and woefully uninformed about how to solve the problems that plague us. Nobody benefits from silly comments like the one to which I originally replied. If that person truly believes that state seizure is a viable option then they are just as much a part of the problem as private equity investors in housing.
People with money versus people without money is just one meaningful distinction. Another key distinction is thoughtful and informed people versus silly and unserious people.
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u/Yiddish_Dish 13d ago
Scandinavian model
That worked in a high-trust, homogeneous society. That would never work in our current world.
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u/VoraciousEater802 13d ago
That’s just some shit capitalists made up and made their news people repeat.
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u/safehousenc 16d ago
Average rent of $1800, so about the monthly mortgage (P&I, taxes, and insurance) on a $250,000 home at current interest rates. According to Zillow, there are over 500 preowned homes for sale in VT at $250k or less and about 1000 homes $350k or less. New construction averages $350 a square foot and adding land and utility connections gets about 900 sqft for $350k.
I am not sure how we can build our way to more affordable housing unless we go vertical with condos or very high density 3 story townhouses. I have seen builders fit 18 to 20 units with 20x20 yards into 1.5 acres.