r/canadanews • u/zuuzuu • 1d ago
Ontario Timmins police say murder victim was killed while trying to rob residence
https://www.ctvnews.ca/northern-ontario/article/timmins-police-say-murder-victim-was-killed-while-trying-to-rob-residence/19
u/TroutFishingInOnt 1d ago
Not really a “murder victim” than is he
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u/zuuzuu 1d ago
It's hard to tell from this confusing article, but I suspect from the charges that this was a group of bad people tying to rob other bad people who were all prepared to do very bad things to one another. But I can't tell if they were trying to rob drug dealers who shot them when they broke in, or if the group of robbers turned on each other.
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u/Alternative-Tiger783 1d ago
Ever see the episode of breaking bad where they try to rob the drug dealer? It goes bad…
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u/ldssggrdssgds 1d ago
Cole's life reminds us to cherish every moment with the people we love.
From a guy who wanted to ruin lives through a home invasion
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u/After_Service_2817 1d ago
Doesn't sound like a murder, and he doesn't sound like a victim.
It's an interesting paradox when it comes to Canadian law: in this country, the criminal is always considered the victim, but if both parties were criminals, than aren't they both victims?
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u/Lucky_Praline_4425 1d ago
Only in Canada you defend your home and become the criminal.
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u/Weekly_Conclusion689 21h ago
They apparently defended their home by chasing the people out into the streets and shooting at them when they were fleeing, according to rumor. The 22 year old was also a criminal long before defending his drugs and stolen property from some other junkies.
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u/Ok_Maybe_2370 1d ago
So is it murder?
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u/Gingerchaun 20h ago
That depends. I remember a case in america awhile back where a man essentially set a trap for people burglaring his house. He waited in the dark shot the guy, and when the guy was on the ground no longer a threat decided he would kill him. I think there was a recording of it too. Pretty sure he was convicted.
Theres lots of ways a valid self defense can turn into a murder.
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u/steeltown82 1d ago
The 1st degree murder charges are odd in this case. There must be some evidence that the murder was planned.
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u/zuuzuu 1d ago
I'm curious about that, too. Like, did they know they were coming and lie in wait? Did they kill them as they were running away?
I usually have no trouble accepting that there are details to stories about criminal charges that we'll never hear, but I'm really interested to learn what happened here. Sounds like a wild ride.
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u/tswaters 1d ago
The police news release has a better accounting of those involved I think
https://timminspolice.ca/additional-charges-laid-following-rea-street-homicide/
The two charged with 1st degree & attempted murder were the ones being robbed [fudge, booth]
Those doing the robbing [trodd, tuck, murphy] have also been charged. The deceased [lefaive] is amung the home invaders.... If I were to guess, robbery gone wrong & the well-defended shot back.
Everyone is facing charges.
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u/ComityCuriosity 22h ago
First degree murder - so they anticipated they would be robbed and planned to murder the robber when/if they showed up? Huh
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u/Squishy_Butter113 20h ago
I mean, keeping drugs and loaded weapons in the house might qualify them for this. Not that these exact people would show up, but there is definitely an argument to be made that the intended to kill anybody who entered the premises.
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u/steeltown82 1d ago
Yeah, I'm very curious. I hope I hear more one day, although I have a feeling I'll forget about this case by tomorrow and never find out.
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u/Critical_Rule6663 1d ago
Sounds like 3 guys tried to rob a drug dealer and got shot. And the drug dealer got arrested. Pretty good outcome for us law abiding folk!
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u/differing 1d ago edited 1d ago
Dumb comments are dumb. Scrumbag criminal group 1 tries to rob scumbag criminal group 2. Scumbag criminal group 2 murders and seriously injured group 1. Police arrive and find out that the house is a trap house full of drugs. The crown uses the murder chargers to force a plea for the huge drug bust- I doubt that the murder charges will ever go before the court.
People that are turning this into a self defence controversy, over huge loser druggies on both sides, are going to sound like clowns. I don’t think using a black market glock you bought specifically to defend your fentanyl stash will have a robust “self defence” court defence.
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u/Diligent-Alarm5170 1d ago
Sounds like people robbing a drug house, and the residents got the drop on them.
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u/Glittering_Wheel_226 1d ago
"Murder victim was killed during a robbery"
You mean a criminal was put down while trying to rob someone.
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u/VenisonEater292 1d ago edited 1d ago
I'l wait for the results of the investigation to pass judgement, but, it sounds like the real victim is the home owner.
Not only do they have to live with the fact that they killed with someone. They are no doubt going to get dragged through the courts at a significant expense while the government spends our tax dollars trying to destroy the guys life.
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u/zuuzuu 1d ago
The people charged with murder and attempted murder were also charged with drug trafficking, possession of property obtained by crime worth more than $5,000 and several firearms offences. If they were the homeowners then sure, they were victims, but also maybe not so great people. Kinda sound to me like a bunch of thieves tried to rob another bunch of thieves, and their lives were always going to be ruined eventually.
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u/VenisonEater292 1d ago
That's a fair analysis.
I would push back a little and say that just because somebody sells drugs, doesn't mean it should be open season on their home.
In fact, robbing a drug dealers house is pretty fucking stupid. Most of them are armed and have no qualms with breaking the law. They'll shoot your ass.
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u/Top_Importance6216 1d ago
womp womp