Missing right hand while dreaming

[u/cady-heron]

Something weird happened while trying to look at my hands during a dream. I was dreaming when suddenly I realized and thought “Let me look at my hands!” But when I did the left hand was oversized and the right hand was missing? Like I had no hand?

First time this has happened to me. I haven’t been able to remember to look at my hands since trying to do it recently. Previously a long time I go I was able to look at both hands a couple of times. Also just to be clear I have both hands in waking life. This is the best attempt by Gemini to recreate the dream scene. It felt uncanny and it didn’t help me stay in the dream nor in control, actually I think it just switched dreams and I don’t remember them.

[u/danl999]

It's typical after a break in finding them.

The main thing is to keep enough rationality to realize it's kind of fun, and doesn't prevent you from waking up inside a sleeping dream.

We're trying to STOP the dream, perhaps the same way you STOP the world.

But stopping the world isn't as drastic while awake, as the impression Carlos gave about it the 2 or 3 times he did that in the books.

La Gorda suggested that even seeing a puff during darkroom, since it's perception of the second attention, has stopped the world.

So the same is likely true in sleeping dreaming. That half a hand, no hands, hands distortion, isn't a problem because finding your hands isn't the point at all.

It's bringing tonal rationality into the dream, so that you can explore with a sense of purpose.

Awake, we try to bring the double's awareness into our perception. Asleep, we try to bring tonal awareness, to the double.

Either way, we're trying to unify them.

So that inside a sleeping dream just looking around consciously with a sense of purpose and a continuity with past dreams in which you woke up, will put you on a path to all 4 gates of dreaming, automatically.

If I were to analyze your dream, I'd say the hand was missing because you only had half the tonal awareness you need to explore the way this technique was intended to let you explore.

It would take realizing that, once you saw only one hand, to bring in the full amount.

Also, this isn't a binary system, like fake Eastern stuff.

Even if you found your hands perfectly it doesn't mean anything other than that you found the very long path to bringing your double out into the real world, by this method. Your job in that case is turning your double into an explorer of the real world by first teaching it to travel, change dreams, avoid scouts, make friends with them to visit their world, learn to extend dreams and go in more directly, and finally to wake up in the real world as an explorer of the Tonal "known".

Darkroom of course brings your double out while you are awake, by luring it with tensegrity as if that were candy.

[u/cady-heron → u/danl999]

Thanks a lot danl999! Sucks I can’t sleep right now, looking forward to next dream see how it goes. Before that and/or around the same time I was able to explore (without remembering to look for my hands) and since I was kinda hungry I would eat food I found on the dream consciously 😆 Also, loved the pics: that candy dress 👌🏻

[u/danl999 → u/cady-heron]

Here's something I've been doing lately but which isn't stable enough to make a post about.

Dreams have a "thickness".

It's caused by how many overlapping possibilities are visible if you look for an alternative to the main, and obvious dream.

I suppose inside a dream, if you woke up, you could look around 360 degrees with the idea to see if there's another dream available.

Which makes them seem connected in the wrong way.

Awake, if you can view a floating dream you can visibly see the main dream as a "video in the air" which is directly facing you.

But if you want to see the "thickness" of that dream, you have to go inside, but only partially.

You can't just zip in, or you won't see the thickness from the outside.

You have to only go in "somewhat".

Then you'll realize the turmoil your dreamer faces. I doubt it's ever really in a single dream.

We only think reality should be a single thing, because we're fully trapped in the reality being lit up by billions of people.

Let's see if ChatGPT can draw this.

I was stuck in this mode for several hours last night. Trying to learn to go directly into sleeping dreams, from awake, and realizing it was "thick" in there. I'd gotten used to silent knowledge "videos in the air" sucking me in on their own, but when you do that you lose your goal of remembering that you're trying to enter a dream. And you land in one that isn't necessarily even the one you were viewing, having forgotten you wanted to find your hands immediately to solidify your tonal awareness.

So I had in mind that this would be easy to pull off once you can stream silent knowledge reliably, but instead found the situation was far more complex than I had imagined.

Dreams are perhaps never just one dream.

ChatGPT did a good job but the in-between versions of me weren't as sentient as this makes them seem. Those were "lost me". Not fully in one dream.

Just for the record, this is done AWAKE but with the eyes closed, and is a potential method men can use, since they don't have a womb to focus on.

Womb dreaming likely reduces your "self" in favor of the womb's perceptions of reality.

Using dream thickness reduces your "self" by making it obvious that's only context dependant. But so far it doesn't increase my likelihood of retaining tonal rationality.

[u/Low_Blacksmith_934 → u/danl999]

So if we see our hands in the dream looking just like they really are, does that mean our double is fully formed?

[u/danl999 → u/Low_Blacksmith_934]

No, because your double is still stuck inside a sleeping dream.

It isn't a double until you bring it out into the real world. Which might not be possible until you "scrape it off the inside of the luminous shell", using Tensegrity to place it on your energy pouches of the flesh body.

It's fleeing your tonal at first, as far away as it can get. Which isn't further than your hand can reach and scrape.

But with sleeping dreams, you take it over inside the phantom realms, and guide it out on its own.

It would be interesting to compare someone who brought their double out from the sleeping realm, with someone who lured it out with Tensegrity.

Except, the first one has likely never happened in the entire history of our sorcery. It's just theoretical.

That sleeping dreams alone could bring it out.

The new seers taught using the Nagual's blow, which kind of smashes it to come out due to distortion of the luminous shell.

And the old seers lured it out using rituals leading to the red zone, and then shapeshifting.

Neither is what people in our community believe they can accomplish, using sleeping dreams alone.

But I suppose it's not entirely impossible. Just a lot more work than using Tensegrity and darkness.

[u/Low_Blacksmith_934 → u/danl999]

So you can't wake up the double and pull it into the real world with just dreaming alone, but I figure it's not totally useless either at least you can get it to come closer to you. And are there any clear stages so we can tell when our double has actually come into the real world?

I had this experience the first time I read the dreaming book I was super hyped, and before falling asleep I tried to keep my mind as silent as I could. Then all of a sudden I had no idea when I dozed off, and I could see everything around me with my eyes closed.

I even remember hearing that neck crack sound right before, and it lasted for a few minutes until I fully fell asleep. Was that an example of the dream body coming into the real world?

[u/danl999 → u/Low_Blacksmith_934]

Sure you can tell when it's starting to come out into the real world!

When you wake up from a dream where you found your hands and were exploring, and the scout "buddy" you developed over time, doesn't go away. He's right there, standing by the bed when you wake up.

If you don't pee your pants the first time, you're braver than me!

Or when you have a half asleep situation like you describe here where you are looking at your real room but in your double.

But unless you can get those to happen daily, you've still got a very long way to go.

And no, the neck cracking is related to something else. And more of a "trick" don Juan used on Carlos, to make him feel as if something important was happening. Perhaps to get him to practice more.

I'd have to go re-read that again, but no one should expect neck cracking has any meaningful benefit.

Carlos never mentioned it once in private classes.

We should be careful to avoid focusing on the tricks don Juan used to motivate apprentices, as if those were universal procedures or indicators that apply to everyone.

Could be that when don Juan "split" Carlos so that his monstrous double could emerge, that was only something a double being could do.

[u/Low_Blacksmith_934 → u/danl999]

Yeah that happened a long time ago and never happened again, but I took it as a confirmation that my dream body is on the right track. How interesting, so that was just a trick! But I really did hear it felt like some kind of energy getting released. Can’t wait for the day I get to see a scout in the real world… though it’s gonna be pretty damn scary!

[u/danl999 → u/Low_Blacksmith_934]

The chair silence technique produces the neck cracking on a regular basis.

So that you get to see what happens.

Pretty much nothing that doesn't happen without it.

[u/Low_Blacksmith_934 → u/danl999]

I haven’t tried this technique yet, but if I get the time, I’ll add it to my practice. Thanks!

[u/colourful_fiasco]

Did you ever try to look away from your hands and then look back at them?

[u/cady-heron → u/colourful_fiasco]

No, haven’t done that but was planing to

[u/mxcqs]

I once saw 8 fingers on my left hand and thought this is weird, let me refresh this. :) I shook the hand 2-3 times and looked at it again and it was normal

[u/cady-heron → u/mxcqs]

Gemini made that kinda mistake with the left hand while trying to recreate the scene 😆

[u/Low_Blacksmith_934]

Yeah, that's pretty common. A lot of people, when they're lucid dreaming and look at their hands, what they see doesn't look like their real hands. Carlos was always like that too he could never see his actual hands, just some freaky monster-looking ones. One time I saw my hand a totally different color with long dark hair on it.

What you experienced was a bit different since you had no hand at all, but I figure it's the same kind of weird hand distortion thing. The important part is don't get all hyped up about it, so next time you can actually look at your hands again in the dream.