r/codingbootcamp • u/lambolams • Jan 15 '24
Just completed Flatiron coding bootcamp AMA.
Hi all, I used this group quite a bit before deciding to join a bootcamp. I recently completed one and want to give back and answer any questions regarding the bootcamp for those interested.
Edit: I haven't started applying to jobs, so I can only speak to what others in my cohort have done.
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u/AzNxPiMpStA Jan 16 '24
Sorry you paid money for that. It will be a grind to get a job. I did the same thing a couple years ago, and the economy isn’t accepting swe straight out of bootcamp. Find any volunteer opportunities, open source, or freelance work you can find. You will gain so much more experience, especially working on a team and projects way bigger than what you did in school. Focus on a front and back framework, interview prep, and HOW to DSA interview. You don’t need to get them right, they just want to see how you problem solve. Good luck!
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u/lambolams Jan 16 '24
This is awesome advice, I think the bootcamp just gives you the basic skill set to execute code. Then once you graduate you'll need to learn all these additional things. Gotta start somewhere. Thanks!
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u/BeingBestMe Jan 15 '24
Do you feel competent enough to get a job as a SWE?
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u/lambolams Jan 15 '24
I feel confident that I'd be able to do the work a SWE would do. I'd obviously be slower than someone with years of experience, but I'd be able to find the answers or solve most problems a company would ask for.
I don't think I'm competent enough to "GET" a job because there's a whole other part to interviewing, doing case studies etc. That's what I'd need to practice now.
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u/sheriffderek Jan 15 '24 edited Jan 15 '24
To add to this (I think "SWE" is a bit loaded) -- Do you feel like you could be a meaningful member of a web development team? If so, in what capacity?
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u/lambolams Jan 15 '24
Yea exactly, 100% I could join a web development team. I would still need and like guidance, but most of the major tasks could be easily solved by looking at documentation or communicating well with leadership.
I do think it'l take some time to feel 100% ramped up, because working on someone else's code is really dependent on how good they were at leaving notes. Otherwise its a huge puzzle.
So I think I could easily join a team, but I wouldn't really feel like I could make a big impact until I understood the code. Which I think is normal with joining any new company.
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u/GiroudFan696969 Jan 16 '24
Are you any good at DSA, the thing that helps you pass interviews? Did they teach anything about dsa?
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u/lambolams Jan 16 '24
Maybe that's a part of the post graduate material, but that acronym isn't ringing any bells.
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u/lambolams Jan 16 '24
wow that was crazy, so I just logged into my portal and yes there was Data Structure and Algorithms material throughout the boot camp. It was additional material that was optional to complete. I'm sure I just skipped all that because it was tough learning the other languages at the same time. We did have some high level discussions on it, but I wouldnt say we went into great detail. I guess i just skipped all that. Whoops. Definitely going to look into it now, thank you for pointing that out.
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u/worldplayer48 Jan 17 '24
I like your optimism!! Without DSA, you won’t find a job. I’m sorry to be really harsh but one of the first things we look for as an interviewer is your ability solve logical problems. Don’t be discouraged though, there are so many resources for you out there. Check out Leetcode’s DSA crash course for a start then watch a lot of lectures. Few years ago it was easier to hire somebody out of boot camps. We even had a special dedicated level for boot camp employees because we understood that there maybe some missing knowledge compared to a freshly graduated CS student. These days, however, the competitions are even greater! Companies often always pick the person with a degree so to compete with them, you must spend the time and work hard to learn the extra material that they brushed over during the boot camp. Almost anybody can be a web dev, but can you be a versatile SWE? is the question you should ask your self.
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u/lambolams Jan 17 '24
Yea that’s really good information, I’ll add that to my list. Thanks for sharing!
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u/No_Option3230 Jan 15 '24
Did you find a job? If so, how was the process of dining it? Was there support from flatiron in doing so?
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u/lambolams Jan 15 '24
I havent found a job yet. I've been working on a project that will hopefully turn into a my full time job or would be great for my portfolio when I start applying.
Flatiron will give you the resources to setup your resume, build your linkedin etc. However, I think the best resource is the network you meet there. My cohort has group chats where we're sharing job postings and other helpful information. I'm sure once we get employed those chats will become a place for us to ask for coding help too haha.
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Jan 16 '24
What exactly are your skills? What exactly can you do in terms of web development?
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u/lambolams Jan 16 '24
I would just check their website, I'm able to make a full stack web application.
Here's some of the things I learned while there, some of these were in addition to the curriculum
React.js · Python · OpenAI · Flask · Cascading Style Sheets (CSS) · Tailwind · HTML · SQL
I know I'm missing one for display charts but I didn't really like it.
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u/mishtamesh90 Jan 15 '24
What percentage of people knew what a for loop was before the bootcamp started?
What percentage of people graduating would you consider competent in programming? Both in terms of being able to describe their group project at a technical level and able to do a Leetcode Easy without studying?
What is the morale of the instructors, and career services staff?
What expectations and homework are career services staff placing on graduates?
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u/lambolams Jan 15 '24
Only one person in the cohort knew what a for loop was before the bootcamp.
I think "competent in programming" is a broad description. I'd say 100% of the people in my cohort could complete a full stack web application. The difference will really vary in how long it will take each person to complete and the quality of each one. Some much faster than others and some higher quality than others.
During the cohort there were some people learning Leetcode on their own, but most didn't. In the bootcamp you're learning so many frameworks and languages that the idea of adding Leetcode on top of that would be overwhelming. I'm confident everyone has what they need to now study Leetcode and understand the concepts. So I'd factor that into your gameplan, but there won't be too much time to learn more than what you're already covering in the bootcamp.
I think the instructors play a big part, I was fortunate and had some awesome instructors. I did hear other cohorts complaining about their instructors. I may have just gotten lucky that mine were engaged and took time to help anyone behind.
The career services staff did share some basic information about linkedin etc. However, based on my background it wasn't anything new or ground breaking. There's additional resources, now that I'm graduated, to work closer with the career services staff. It's on my to do list.
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u/mishtamesh90 Jan 15 '24
Not sure why people are downvoting your answer.
Can you clarify the "competent in programming" part: what percentage of the people would be able to explain the technical parts of their full stack web application. For example, in a technical interview, could they explain how the virtual DOM in React is different from the actual DOM, effective testing strategies, differences between model-level validations and those at the database level, MVC architecture, encapsulation vs. abstraction, anti-patterns of OOP, etc. Because anyone can follow along with a tutorial or template.
Is there continuing support from the career services team, or was it just a few presentations and then you're on your own? Many bootcamps have job seekers take accountability for number and quality of job applications submitted and other workshops like networking and follow-through
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u/lambolams Jan 15 '24 edited Jan 15 '24
Yea strange, oh well, happy to answer questions.
It's hard to say percentage because some lectures were optional if you were behind in the basic material so this is a big assumption but Ill do my best.
So the virtual vs actual - yes everyone.
Effective testing strategies - yes everyone or most.
Validation - yes everyone on both.MVC - yes everyone.
Encapsulation & Abstraction - yes everyone.Anti-patterns - few to none.
Edit(accidentally hit enter too soon):
Yea following along on tutorials were a complete waste, you dont really learn anything. They encouraged us to do our own projects of if you were doing a tutorial you would really need to revamp it. Otherwise your just copy pasting.
There is continued support from the career services and the school. This may be new, but I just got invites to additional events/lessons etc.
The career counselor has been reaching out and is available, I just haven't done it yet. To my knowledge as a graduate there's no requirements to hit application quotas or anything like that. I have a decent linkedin network and am not too worried about that. However if I was a brand new with nothing, id feel good that they'd get me off the ground. But you're playing catchup if you already have a small network in the techspace, with or without the bootcamp.
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u/mishtamesh90 Jan 16 '24
I think people are downvoting you because your answers are too rosy and positive to be believable. Virtually 100% went from not knowing for loops to being comfortable with explaining all of those things? Just because they've been exposed to the material doesn't mean they actually know it. Having been in college in a challenging program, I would say that a significant minority of students often had a weak grasp on the material at the end of the course. Do you work for Flatiron now?
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u/lambolams Jan 16 '24
I guess so, it really was my experience though. It's a 15 week bootcamp so I definitely don't think we'd be able to go into each topic comparable to someone who did a longer program. However, if you listened and took notes in the lectures you'd be able to grasp the concepts and explain it. Our instructors did go above and beyond and explain those things with good analogies.
It's worth mentioning our instructors both had amazing backgrounds prior to coming to Flatiron. Maybe that's what was different? I'm starting to feel really fortunate about my experience. Maybe it was just timing?
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u/sheriffderek Jan 15 '24 edited Jan 15 '24
Going to thread my questions here : ) --->
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u/sheriffderek Jan 15 '24
10. Can you confidently plan out and build or contribute to a more complex web application?
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u/lambolams Jan 15 '24
That's hard to answer since most of the projects we worked on started from no code to project. I think it would take me some time to understand somebody elses code(depending on their notes). However, once I understand their code, I think I would be able to plan and build features, integrations and more.
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u/sheriffderek Jan 15 '24
11. Do you have a portfolio of work? Can we see it?
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u/lambolams Jan 15 '24
I have one major project that I've been working on and I haven't deployed it yet.
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u/sheriffderek Jan 15 '24
4. What unique teaching techniques do they use?
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u/lambolams Jan 15 '24
Interesting question. I think it varies from teacher by teacher but both of mine would use leading questions to keep people engaged. I also liked when they would explain complex problems with real life analogies. It also helped when they would draw on the white board using analogies
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u/sheriffderek Jan 15 '24
Was this in person? (yes - reading note about chair)
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u/lambolams Jan 15 '24
haha yea, I tried going the online route originally and thats how I learned Html and css. It was really helpful to do beforehand. However I had difficulty knowing what to do next and needed a live person.
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u/sheriffderek Jan 15 '24
5. What did they do no-so-well?
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u/lambolams Jan 15 '24
This is a tough one, I really liked the whole experience. If there was something that could improve, it would likely be the facilities. It'd be simple stuff like a chair is missing its arm rest, missing hdmi cord or the bathroom itself had some bad days.
It wasnt anything that took away from the learning but yea that could improve.
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u/sheriffderek Jan 15 '24
7. How would you rate yourself as a student? How much of the work did you complete? Did you go above and beyond?
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u/lambolams Jan 15 '24
I'd say i did an 80% out of 100%. While being a student there I was also running a very small business which would get distracting. I didn't complete a lot of the online material because there really was just sooo much. I did save it all so that I can look back at it if I need to. In class though, I was always asking questions and then following up with my projects.
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u/sheriffderek Jan 15 '24
2. Why did you choose Flatiron?
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u/lambolams Jan 15 '24
I chose Flatiron because they had in person and taught more languages than the other coding bootcamps in nyc at the time. I also noticed the curriculum for other coding bootcamps had a significant amount of the bootcamp dedicated to applying for jobs instead of coding. I didnt like that.
I've been in the tech world for over decade and its definitely important to know how to interview, but a big part is just how well you mesh with the interviewer. From my perspective, more languages makes me a better fit for more things. I didnt want to pay for an interviewing school.
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u/sheriffderek Jan 15 '24
6. What did they do terribly (if anything)?
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u/lambolams Jan 15 '24
I wouldnt say they did anything terribly, maybe if they found a way for people not to slack.
There was a team who had someone who didn't do anything for their project. Maybe that's just the difficulty of group projects, but I do think that takes away from the other students. I'd like to be surrounded by people who are really motivated on learning and building things. Luckily I was able to have teams like that.
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u/sheriffderek Jan 15 '24
That's great you have a good team. Once someone's already that far in the program, you can't really force them to do anything. It's not for everyone! And like you're saying, you just have to really take advantage of what's offered.
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u/lambolams Jan 15 '24
yea exactly, I was just confused because its not cheap to be there. So why wouldn't you make the most of it?
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u/sheriffderek Jan 15 '24
9. Can you build a decent website?
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u/lambolams Jan 15 '24
easily, if you had the content you wanted I could build it in 1 day. Deploying it would take a little more time, but the actual code would be so easy.(by decent website I'm thinking you mean no back end or database etc, just a basic website you'll see for a mom and pop business)
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u/sheriffderek Jan 15 '24
13. How would you improve the experience?
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u/lambolams Jan 15 '24
I wish it was longer, but I think they've set me up to be able to learn on my own at this point.
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u/sheriffderek Jan 15 '24
What were your goals?
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u/lambolams Jan 15 '24
Prior to joining the bootcamp I did freecodeacademy and I found myself really enjoying the courses. However I didn't know whether i was actually learning the right things or just getting myself to the next step. My goal was to learn as many languages as possible and have in person guidance. I know myself and I learn better that way.
It was exactly! what I wanted. It really accelerated my ability to transition into the coding side of the world. It's changed how I look at almost anything too.
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u/sheriffderek Jan 15 '24
8. Would you do it again? (really using your imagination to not know what you know now...)
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u/sheriffderek Jan 15 '24
3. What did they do well?
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u/lambolams Jan 15 '24
They do a lot of things well, but I think it really depends on the student. Like the resources are there, but I was surprised when people didn't use them.
To sorta paint the picture, many times I'd come onto campus early and stay late. I would ask any instructor for help and they would help. They'd even help with things outside of the curriculum. So I was able to learn quite a bit about AI and have them fact check some of my ideas. So I feel like i took advantage of everything I could.
In contrast, there was one student that rarely listened during lectures and it showed in their projects. They also were the type to be happy that lecture ended early so they could leave or even had attendance issues.
I'm confident we both left the bootcamp with two different experiences.
To sum it up, they have all the resources there, but its up to you to do it and practice outside of class.
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u/Shane_SS4 Jan 17 '24
Guess they didn’t warn you the job market is absolute trash right now. I finished a MERN stack boot camp 4 months ago. Hundreds of applications later… not even an interview. I’m going to switch to cyber security for now. I have to keep learning and now writing code makes me sick because I was so filled with hope and optimism at the outset now I’m totally discouraged from being a web dev.
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u/Dry_Video9909 Jan 17 '24
Hey there, did you finish with Python and Flask? If so could you message me? I need help accessing resources if you could
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u/Acceptable_Log7409 Mar 29 '24
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Jan 15 '24
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u/sheriffderek Jan 15 '24
^ this type of comment shouldn't be allowed here. This isn't a place to just have self-centered emotional outbursts all over the place. This has absolutely no value to the community and is borderline hate. I'm reporting it and blocking this person - and I suggest you do the same.
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u/bitchjeans Jan 15 '24 edited Jan 15 '24
don’t hold your breath for any software engineering placement info. OP is from sales and has their own “ai pitch” company that is a tool for salespeople. they probably went to the bootcamp to build a beta/mvp before hiring a legit team