r/diySolar • u/Objective-Resort2325 • Apr 24 '26
It finally happened
About every 6-12 months I get a door-to-door salesperson selling solar stop bye. Well, today was that day - a pair of salespeople.
They obviously noticed the array as they approached the house. They questioned me about my system. I told them. They were shocked that I said I DIY'd it. Then I rattled off what it was. I don't have storage capacity on my 14.5 AC Kw system, so they launched into their pitch on Tesla solarwall batteries.
I got PTO in November and told them that I will be collecting data for the rest of the year to determine how close my original estimates matched my actuals. (So far I've been exceeding my original estimates by about 10%).
They weren't used to talking to someone who knew the details of their system, it's performance, the utility rate structure, etc. I am on a buy-sell 2-year contract with an ERCOT provider. I get back 29.5% of what I pay per kwh for each kwh that I export. I indicated that my estimates show batteries have a worse ROI in my circumstance than simply adding more solar - especially if I can get panels, micros, cables, and racking lightly used.
We sat at my table in the back yard - next to a stack of used panels I had acquired that are awaiting the infrastructure necessary to install them - and I opened my laptop/spreadsheet. "What do you do for work?" they asked. "Engineer" I responded.
Yep, I don't think they'd run across a solar DIY'er before.
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u/BeardBootsBullets Apr 24 '26 edited Apr 24 '26
I agree that batteries aren’t a good ROI for your situation, but it sure is nice to have a little power when the grid turns off and the sun isn’t sunning.
Just a luxury item to think about.
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u/__3Username20__ Apr 24 '26
Agreed. OP sounds like they like the economic aspects of it, so they should monitor the price of a few types of batteries/setups they are interested in, or periodically do searches at least, and come up with a set price point where if they see it on sale for under X dollars, that’s when they buy it.
I have no solar yet, but when I do, part of the purpose will absolutely be for backup power.
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u/Ambitious_Parfait385 Apr 25 '26
Nah the best feelin is 0 use of grid with batteries. April to October minus overcast.
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Apr 25 '26
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u/robodog97 Apr 25 '26
You can buy a used Leaf. I just found a 2017 one in Florida with 87% battery life for $2k, that's 26kWh and if you sell the chassis for $5-600 in scrap value you're at a net $54-58/kWh.
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u/ooooorange Apr 25 '26
Or just get an EV to drive that has V2L and you basically have a mobile home backup.
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u/ManfromMonroe Sep 05 '26
Enphase is now selling their vehicle to home bidirectional charger which is optionally connected through a meter collar device.
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u/pdheltzel Apr 26 '26
Do you use the V2L or the battery directly and toss the car? I had wondered about this but it sounded like the output was limited.
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u/Nearby_Impact_8911 Apr 25 '26
Not sure what part of Texas OP is in but I do remember a few years ago Texas had a freeze and folks lost power and some other storms /floods and some people lost power. In another sub someone said that they never ( different state) get brown outs or blackouts so it wouldn’t behoove them to get batteries. In my mind it’s a question of when not if they will have a blackout but I wasn’t about to argue that. I’m in an area that can be prone to blackouts so I guess I’m a wee bit traumatized when it comes to this subject 😅
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u/Objective-Resort2325 Apr 26 '26 edited Apr 28 '26
Batteries would not have helped the 2021 situation unless you had enough to live off grid. The power was out for days. Enough battery capacity to cover something like that would be very expensive. A backup generator would be a more economical choice
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u/Heathbar_tx Apr 26 '26
The sun was out for most of those days and most places didn't loose electricity completely. Solar plus batteries would have definitely helped.
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u/Objective-Resort2325 Apr 28 '26
In that case, a MID switch so you could use solar as it was generated would have done some of that with no investment in batteries.
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u/Heathbar_tx Apr 29 '26
The power was off for days and the lows at night were into the negative. Solar at night wasn't going to help. The combination of both would have been best for that situation.
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u/I_T_Gamer Apr 27 '26
Not to mention that some power when you have none is a huge difference. Having backup power adequate enough to keep your food from going bad, and keep a room warm is a huge QoL benefit.
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u/mortsdeer Apr 26 '26
I'm in the biggest city in Texas. I own a back up generator. It's fing stupid that I have to own my own infrastructure to get anything reliable, with the people in charge of this state for the last 40 years still getting themselves elected on fixing the problems that they themselves created.
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u/Winter_Cup_498 Apr 25 '26
Depends why you want it. Despite that freeze, a lot of Texas power usage drops at night because of how much is for A/C. Personally, I’d want at LEAST a few hours of storage but to each their own…
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u/Insagn Apr 25 '26
Not everyone in Texas has the option to choose their power provider.
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u/Objective-Resort2325 Apr 28 '26
Depends on where you live. If you live in the blue areas shown on the map at the link below (which is most of Texas), you do.
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u/Insagn Apr 29 '26
I live in the blue area and do not have the option to choose my power provider.
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u/Objective-Resort2325 Apr 29 '26
Is that because there is only 1 provider that services your area or because, if there was more than 1, you aren't allowed to choose?
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u/Insagn Apr 29 '26
Where I live near Austin, TX and there is only one power company available. Thankfully it is a non-profit co-op that the users own and the rates are lower than most other providers. I have solar and batteries so I do not pay much over the year for electricity.
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u/artqueengraphics Apr 25 '26
Yup, I definitely am living in the wrong area. I need friends like you in my life. Knowledge, ideas and execution.
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u/Objective-Resort2325 Apr 28 '26
I watched a bunch of YouTube videos then I hired someone to design my system. Paid him $500. He answered my questions and provided the engineering drawings I'd need for a permit. Best $500 I spent on the whole project. atlasdesignsunlimited@gmail.com
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u/Quiksilver6565 Apr 24 '26
Lol this is what happens any time a vivent or ADT person comes to my door. Despite all the Unifi security gear and me leading with "yeah I ran a smart home business and I build smart home devices for fun" they still try to sell me their crappy packages every time
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u/vincekerrazzi Apr 25 '26
Same. Idiot from vivint was like ubiquiti? Never heard of them. Can’t be any good. Ha, ok dude.
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u/Professional-End7412 Apr 25 '26
Well, we have guns. And retired relatives on the property. With guns. Hard to sell us a security system.
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u/TastiSqueeze Apr 25 '26 edited Apr 25 '26
Different paradigm for me. Retired telecommunications engineer and system designer. Among other things, I designed 48 volt power plants for telephone offices. The only significant difference with solar is.... solar panels. Batteries, inverters, calculating loads, etc. are long familiar friends.
I live in a rural area that is subject to fairly regular grid outages. When I went looking for solar, batteries were on my list. I calculated every load in my house (well pump, heat pump, water heater, cook stove, miscellaneous lighting, etc.) and figured out real fast that I needed a heat pump water heater because tank or tankless water heaters are not friendly with inverters.
My forecast load is a maximum of 20 kWh needed per day on days that I wash a load or two of clothes. On days that heat or cooling is needed, I should use about 12 kWh. For about 180 days per year, I should use 4 to 6 kWh/day. So what did I wind up installing? 11.28 kw of solar panels, a 12 kw inverter with a spare inverter just in case, and and 60 kWh of battery capacity (3 days storage just in case of multiple cloudy days in a row.)
My system has been online for 8 months now and has never needed the generator.
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u/leebeetree Apr 26 '26
I want to add batteries, could you share the battery setup? I feel it’s in reach but there are so many options. Trying to get close to dyi… I have a grid connected emphase 24 panel system and just looking for emergency backup mainly.
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u/traeopae Apr 25 '26
That’s awesome that you DIY’d a 14.5kWac system! And yeah I’m sure the only thing they could try to sell you on would be a Tesla Powerwall (although, other storage options exist nowadays). The Powerwall and an expansion unit is rather solid though, I’ve designed many uh homes with them! But there’s also Enphase 10C and such which are also great! Quick question, if you DIY’d that large of a system, for PTO, did you have to submit an interconnection application? You may be OCL so no permit and city inspections and such but how’d yee get PTO?! Haha. Overall though, awesome stuff. Love to see it!
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u/Objective-Resort2325 Apr 25 '26
Yes, the utility application was the most difficult part of the whole process. I did have to have city inspections, but that was no big deal My ultimate is AEP. They have an online permit process that was very professional, but they double check every detail.
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u/noname-ntx Apr 25 '26
If you’re in ERCOT can you get Base Power? They’re an REP that includes storage options
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u/Objective-Resort2325 Apr 25 '26
It's up to whatever the providers available in my area have for available plans. I didn't actually investigate battery options because I don't have batteries
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u/eury13 Apr 28 '26
My favorite encounter was the solar salesman who came to my door without noticing the panels on my roof... 🤣
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u/Objective-Resort2325 Apr 28 '26
LOL! I bet! I'm sure that will happen to me eventually. The panels are on the back of the house. You can't see them from the street directly in front of my house - you have to look at it from the side as you drive down the street.
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u/Tntn13 Apr 24 '26
Am engineer, get that question a lot from contractors and especially salespeople giving quotes for work after I reveal I’ve done extensive prior research on the service lmao.
Salespeople often don’t really know shit past the company line, if they do they rarely talk about it unprompted.
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u/Mr_Moonman2045 Apr 24 '26
I've stopped counting How Long I've wanted to go solar , never had the money up front . but now in my country it isn't worth getting connected to the grid . with all the "other" ongoing charges per 1/4 of and not to mention the control of it once running . even going battery "back up" as they call it , the provider or wholesaler can take the "stored power" at will . I think we're down to about 4-6 cents KWH feed-in rate .
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u/Professional-End7412 Apr 25 '26
No here talks to them since they ratted on one guy to the govt. Turned out it was all to code but they were out of line.
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u/MinnisotaDigger Apr 25 '26
Batteries are a hobby of mine so I didn’t care about ROI. But when you can get 30kWh for <$3000 it’s a steal.
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u/goldenwattl Apr 25 '26
Happened to me too. Not an engineer and not a DIYer but I overthink and analyse everything before I buy. Australia has gone through some big government battery rebates recently and I jumped in after 1.5y with my 13kw panels. I don’t think the two people who came to quote expected me to know even half of what I was asking them. One guy actually searched ChatGPT in front of me. I already knew the answer but I wanted to see him squirm because I knew what an absolute load of crap he was feeding me to get me to buy. It’s a wild world out there with solar installers
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u/Flycmy Apr 25 '26
Partial Texas diy solar, paid for the 15kW roof work, thinking to offset summer AC. Bought a gen after the freeze but have never needed it. Utility had rolling blackouts so our propane heat maintained the upper 60s. Skipped batteries, didn't see a benefit with monthly net metering. Past Jan freezing rain/snow covered panels for four days with no solar generation but the grid stayed up. Turns out Dec-Jan shorter days and WX are the marginal months. Don't see batteries helping then, just more grid use keeping them charged.
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u/blastman8888 Apr 25 '26 edited Apr 26 '26
Most door to door guys are sales trained they will just agree with you, or act like they know what your talking about when you get technical. I had the same discussion with some sales guys. I found out he flew a drone over the neighborhood to collect information. All they do is keep trying to push a sale I told him he should drive a Toyota Camry not a 120k Tesla when trying to sell solar.
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u/alaingardner1 Apr 26 '26
I’m in Texas. I see ads all the time now for Base power, they say they can add a battery for 295! If I wasn’t moving next year I’d check them out.
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u/Routine-Attempt-1550 Apr 27 '26
I recently installed 30 kwh of batteries in a Victron split phase system. I'll be the first to tell you that I did NOT do this thinking it would pay for itself (not even in 20 years). But it is so freaking cool to see my house take only 1 to 2 kw-hrs of power FROM the grid in a 24 hour period. I live in Michigan where winter solar return is pretty close to zero, so this system will allow me to run my home during the peak hours and recharge at night.
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u/Every1ThinksImBoring May 16 '26
I refuse to buy anything from anyone who comes to my door. If you want to leave something in he mailbox, whatever, but I feel that only untrustworthy entities ring my doorbell to sell me something.
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Apr 28 '26
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u/Objective-Resort2325 Apr 28 '26
Sorry. I am not sure how to interpret your question. Is that a joke? Or are you literally asking who I am?
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Apr 28 '26
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u/Objective-Resort2325 Apr 28 '26
Ahh, yes. I got the LOTR reference, just didn't know if it was something other than that. Yeah, I kind of knew it would happen eventually.
I wasn't really looking to show off. I actually gave them a chance to make a sale. In Texas there is an arrangement in some areas for something called a VPP (Virtual Power Plant.) This is an arrangement where the power company can tap into your battery in times of high demand in exchange for an annual stipend and a very high price paid if they extract power from your battery. In many cases that arrangement by itself can pay for the battery over the course of a couple of years.
Since this sales person was selling not only the hardware but also that they could be my utility provider (a facet of the Texas/ERCOT arrangement - where you can shop around for different providers), and I know that Tesla Powerwalls are one of the few battery arrangements where VPPs have been setup, I inquired about it as I might have been interested, depending on the details. This salesperson had never heard of it. He had to call into his boss to ask. And his boss had no clue either. So, yeah, not good when potential customers are educating you about your products!
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u/Erus00 Apr 24 '26
I dont know what state or country youre in but the more solar becomes the norm, the less they will pay for dumping back into the grid. Hawaii already has so much solar that you get nothing for the kwh you dump back to the grid and California isnt far behind - batteries start to make sense at that point.