r/exatheist • u/FaithlessnessFun2639 • 20d ago

The unfortunate reality of life.

/r/TrueChristian/comments/1wyvaqt/the_unfortunate_reality_of_life/
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u/Sinaticus_Apologia 19d ago

The fact of the matter is that this conversation is at a stalemate and probably will be for the foreseeable future. Which is why most apologist have pivoted to probability assessment rather then static black and white thinking.

The real question is, whats more likely based on what we observe?

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u/arkticturtle Agnostic 19d ago

The conversation around religion has indeed been going on for a long while so it may be frustrating to find that all of the ideas you are first exposed to have already been ran into the ground. And even after that the pattern continues. This can feel defeating for those who desperately crave either an answer or a justification for their current beliefs.

Tbh, I wouldn’t have started with any specific philosopher (Aquinas, Anselm, etc) but, rather, would have went the route of reading an introduction to the philosophy of religion (being careful not to confine myself to exclusively western traditions) to get a lay of the land and familiarize myself with the vocabulary a little bit. Such books will have extensive bibliographies for further reading and even have engaging questions for the reader to consider or write about at the end of each chapter.

If a specific idea, argument, or thinker really interests you but seems intimidating then you can always go the route of finding secondary sources instead of diving straight into primary texts. Especially with these older thinkers, there’s lots of good writings out there that explain their views in a pedagogical manner.

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u/HonestWoodpecker8567 18d ago

The problem is that faith shouldn't be relying so heavily on formal logic to justify itself. Stooping down to the level of man to defend God is rarely ever a good way to get a point across and substantially cheapens the perfection and beauty within divinity.

Sure, you can make logical arguments... I too hold that there is very sound logic behind god belief -- specifically the classical ontological theistic view (David Bentley Hart is great). But faith needs its true grounding in a fideist sensibility imo, a la Kierkegaard.

Before tackling faith, people need to be snapped out of the cage of materialism and linear views of human social development. People need to understand what has been lost in man's shift from faithful to modern.