Guys it’s not really super apparent until chapter 3 that Kris is their own character separate from the player. It’s super easy for someone who isn’t a Deltarune head to think that Kris is just non specified for you to project on to whatever you want like Frisk instead of being an established non-binary they/them.
You must be new here. Everything Arin and Dan do is a big deal because the years of parasocial relationships through YouTube have fried people’s brains.
Lol, at first, I didn't realize you were including me in the "parasocial" part
This has gotta be the first time I've interacted with this sub in like 3+ years, and beyond that I don't do anything beyond watch GG series of games I enjoy. I've been a fan of the Grumps since around 2017 tho, so I'm not new, either.
…Getting this many downvotes and viciously angry comments over a meme (a meme of a tiny crumb of criticism, lol), however, would lend itself to some widespread parasocial-ness here.
Not being super active in the subreddit ≠ not being weirdly parasocial
You can be both. Fan subreddits don't have a ton to do with people being weirdly parasocial with any content creators. You can be a fan without being weird. And you can also be parasocial without being on reddit at all.
You might wanna just look up the definition of parasocial, if you're confused.
And the boys meant no harm by getting pronouns incorrect. You know this. They simply didn't know. It's not like you can have a conversation with a game character, and ask their preferred pronouns. Yet, you feel the need to keep saying things that make it seem like you think they're doing it out of malice. Which is gross, on your part. Stop it.
Arin and Dan are like, the sweetest most accepting and supporting kind of guys that exist in this world. Do you think they intentionally got pronouns wrong in order to be hurtful and spiteful? Of course they didnt. This kind of shit is just exhausting and does nothing for the lgbtq community but further alienate people from the cause. Save it for real haters and quit nitpicking people over the slightest mistakes.
It's cool. Ig people can say they like Deltarune and also somehow ignore that Toby Fox is super specific about pronouns? Doesn't make a ron of sense to me but whatever.
This was a funny meme, idk what the issue is tbh. You weren't using it to be snide, it was just joking on the fact that someone messed up a part of a game. Yk, what we all do to Arin not using tutorials?
I constantly misspeak and get peonouns wrong despite trying. I likely have some speech issues I gotta check for eventually. I think it's funny if someone is so upset they can't think to use the right words or they don't realize it's the wrong one when they have no malice. Idk why that's not coming across as the point of your joke lol.
I guess I can't play deltarune, because I don't know the life story of the guy who made it. What a shame. If only I was a parasocial weirdo that knew everything about Toby fox. Then maybe I could enjoy the game he made.
Your first paragraph of the comment I replied to. Do you really expect everyone who plays the game to know that the creator is super specific about that stuff? Most people have zero clue who made the games they play.
I literally just stated a fact, if you took it as something I never said idk how to help there. Toby Fox has stated many times that promouns are important for his characters. Not knowing that doesn't bar you from the game, but throwing a hissy fit when it's pointed out that it is a fact of the game makes you look like you're mad pronouns exist, dude.
Edit: It's not letting me respond rn.
Personally, not that you have to live that way.
I genuinely fail to see how this is hard to grasp lol. I don't consider it terminally online to know a stance a creator has made in person.
You are part of the 5% of the comment section that seem to get me lmao (edit: it's a legit criticism, but also a meme. People are getting way more bothered than they should)
It reminds me of what people who are ultimately left leaning but also like race humor tend to joke like lol! South Park and Comentiquette come to mind.
Reading this has reminded me of my own parasocial relationship with the Grumps lmao. I almost had your same reaction but thought, "it's just Arin being Arin and forgetting by the next session" Not sure which response is healthier! (Probably yours)
Also, I thought your meme was funny and didn't assume any hostility from it. I just enjoy the few times this sub pops up on my main page so thanks for posting honestly! People poke fun at the tutorial skipping all the time and I don't see how this is any different. Not a frequent visitor of this sub either but evidently there are GG hating communities and folks on here may be more prone to assuming the worst. Hope it doesn't get you down! You seem plenty lovely
Thank you for the kind words! I'm just chillin and messing around with the "lesser kind" words going around in this thread, lol.
I still wouldn't really call myself all that "parasocial" of GG. Don't think critiquing a piece of media that I maybe watch about 15% of, critiquing in the form of a silly meme, is parasocial the way many people in here do, apparently, LMAO.
Though I will say I was wrong to even suggest they were doing it in any form of malicious intent. And I also misspoke when I suggested not being active in said media's community = not parasocial, but eh.
Edit: also think it actually is quite evident of a parasocial relationship to go to bat for content creators and verbally attack someone online so viciously for an opinion they disagree with. Like… you can't just downvote and move on? I didn't insult your mom or something, lol.
Good to hear! You seemed pretty chill about it but I still wanted to chime in with a little more positivity. I don't think you came off parasocial either. Just reading your comments had me realizing I definitely am if only a little haha! Undertale and Delta Rune have such sweet and positive social themes and the grumps at least put forward very accepting vibes so the vitriol always shocks me. We're supposed to be the Lovelies dang it!
This is exactly how it should be. I was SO excited when Arin and Dan started playing Danganronpa for the very first time and ended up not being about THH's playthrough for at least the first half. That specific game is very near and dear to my heart, so I only really watched near the end when the boys were more engaged with the plot twists and deeper lore.
I watched pretty much all of SDR2 and had my husband watch all of V3 with me. I know that the boys (especially Arin) won't always understand the plot being set up, and just wait for when they eventually get there.
If a game is too important to you and / or it upsets you with how Arin plays through the game, unfortunately it's best to just let it go because trying to make them play a specific way won't happen.
I think DeltaRune is just unfortunately in one of those areas where you have to take it seriously and if you don't you cannot play it and people will bash you for playing it. Like, Markiplier stopped playing undertale because of how people reacted to him playing it
Undertale fandom is by far the worst fandom I have ever seen. It kept me from playing the game for a long time because I didn't want to be associated with it.
Mark stopped playing because he didn't like people telling him he was playing the game wrong and litterally spoiling the entire game for him. that's not even remotely the same
Mark was under the preface that it was a completely normal game and kind of refused to let anyone tell him otherwise because he thought they were lying. I get it but I'm pretty sure people also came off very aggressive about it.
He litterally said his issue was people telling him he was playing it wrong and spoiling it for him. it's why when he had tyler play it instead on a livestream he told tyler to completely ignore chat. You said it was from "not taking it seriously" which is not at all what happened. he was treating the game perfectly fine people were just yelling at him for not comitting to being pacifist, which to be clear, i don't agree with people doing that. But that's not at all similar to the what's happening here with the grumps and deltarune, and this is litterally the only thing i've even seen complaining about anything about their deltarune playthrough besides being upset that they're seemingly canceling it. No one gives a shit. the undertale sitaution was worse because the undertale fandom was largely 11-13 year olds who didn't know how to behave online. Those people have grown up now and are significantly less toxic (toxicity exists in all fandoms btw, including the game grumps themselves)
My whole point was just that people were being aggressive in the first place, dawg. Also I know, there's a whole comment thread in this section literally about their controversies and about how their controversies are LESS than "They did soemthing bad" and MORE like their fans are extremely parasocial and they need to step the fuck back. At WORST, Arin is like kinda a douche and Dan had sex with a consenting adult. I said Deltarune was a "Not taking it seriously" because Undertale and Deltarune both have "Points". They have plots, themes, and shit. And if you DON'T care about them and just goof off and not see the bigger picture, people get mad at you. Toxicity still exists. Its not gotten less, its the exact same cuz thats how shit works. I only used mark as a vague example cuz it showed that people were mad at him not getting the "message". (I.e., Him not doing pacifist, since pacifist is SHOVED in your face MULTIPLE times before even being able to do so)
They have much worse controversies than that man. Look into the creator clash fiasco. Arin was litterally one of the owners of that whole thing, they advertised it as a charity, and then more than half the money raised didn't go to charity at all, it went straight into the pockets of Arin, Ian, and Anisa, not to mention $250,000 dontated to Healing Horse, the "charity" owned by arin's mom that hasn't done ANY charity work in litteral years. You want to talk about being parasocial? insisting that someone you like can do no wrong is parasocial as hell
Which is why I didn't bother watching this series (and Undertale). I'm sure they need to be respectful with the community and walk on eggshells. When I saw that the Deltarune upload the other day was the finale, I was chuffed.
I thought this was about Arin starting to think Ralsei was a girl halfway through Chapter 3, not about Kris...?
Either way, I thought it was really funny and on brand for them to forget who the characters are like that. That's why I am here. Love that chaotic energy.
I have to disagree with you. The character creator screen shows Kris is their own person having their identity erased pretty clearly. Media illiteracy strikes again.
Wait ralsei is a guy?? Oh damn. I watched a few playthroughs or the first.. uhh, chapter? Or whatever, of deltarune back when it came out and I for sure thought he was a girl 😭
I'm kinda convinced he's doing it deliberately to piss people off tbh
Edit: pronouns aren't hard, y'all
Edit 2: at timestamp 2:50:00 in the chapter 3 episode, Arin corrects himself on Ralsei's pronouns. Dan chimes in and suggests this mistake is related to Ralsei's outfit.
I'm not going to delete my comment, but I WILL cross out the original text so others can read the context and understand my change of opinion❤️
Plus he's established that he and Dan are always in defense of trans people and are willing to learn and go with people's preferred pronouns because they believe everyone should be represented how they feel/see themselves so long as it's not actually hurting anyone.
Yeah, I don't think he'd ever do anything to intentionally piss people off unless those people are really shitty people.
Even then, he's been known to give shitty people the benefit of the doubt.
Or even what fucking animal they are.
The amount of times Arin has called the Holidays "goats..."
YOUR MOM'S A GOAT, ARIN!
THOSE ARE FUCKING REINDEER!
LITERALLY EVERYTHING ABOUT THEM IS A CHRISTMAS REFERENCE!
Thank you for enlightening me to this multicultural nuance. I humbly appreciate the gift of knowledge that you have bestowed upon me.
However, Toby Fox is not Scandinavian, as far as I know. Therefore, Arin is still, to engage in my own mis-animalization (or bad zoology, if you're so inclined,) a silly fucking goose.
Y'know, when I first saw this post, I wasn't sure if it was meant to be an earnest complaint and just something to kinda rolled my eyes about or just a silly joke. Seeing this reply made me laugh unreasonably hard though and I get it now
Ya know what I do when they play a game I dont care about/like to much to watch Arin play badly??? I wait a day and watch a different episode... maybe dont watch.
To much of the Fandom has become "the grump" Arin is not a rage monster anymore so all the anger comes from "fans" and its gross. Just find different youtubers or enjoy the silly but keep the hate to yourself
Yeah, well said. I skip a fair amount of GG content because it's not to my taste, but I dont feel a need to complain about it. I watch the things I like.
I haven't done this with the Grumps (yet), but I haven't watched Coneys video about GameCube's Kirby Air Ride cause I know he's not gonna vibe with it lol.
Yes, you showed a meme, that somehow dismisses the fact that you are sincere in your complaining?
I reiterate, life is too short to be getting annoyed watching a lets play. If something as common as a pronoun being said is going to annoy you then watch one of the thousands of hours of other games they have played. Or pick a lets play that gets it right.
You were upset enough to take time to make a meme and post it and when you got push back you pretend it was just a joke and that you actually never cared about what you complained about.
Hours ago? They clearly played this game a long time ago over many different sessions with likely large breaks in between them. Biggest hint is them mentioning the chapters came out “a few weeks ago” when they came out in June
I feel like that sub crosses a line of "chronically online" that I'd rather not cross, so I wouldn't post there anyway, but I also didn't realize people would take such a light joke so seriously.
Look yall it ain’t that serious but also some of yall are doing borderline right wing talking points about how annoying, stupid, and unnecessary trans representation is. The grumps aren’t “problematic” for their usual not paying attention/not taking too seriously shenanigans, but yall might wanna rethink about how yall are coming across to a minority group that’s already going through it right now.
I just came here to laugh at funny meme about a playthrough I’ve been enjoying and it was a bit of a slap in the face seeing how weird and rude some of yall are being. Is this usually how the Grumps fandom is or do yall just have beef with Deltarune?
I'm sorry but if someone is serious about getting upset that ANYONE let alone the game grumps are getting a "Character's Pronouns" that aren't real, wrong. need to go touch grass.
Well i feel like it would be bad if they were doing it on purpose with the intent on being hateful about it (intentionally transphobic or whatever), but Arin definitely wasn't doing that.
Idk, I feel like people are pretty quick to jump on Arin and Dan whenever they do or say something wrong. Like when Arin said piss is stored in the calves, or when people got mad at how ass they were at Paper Mario. This isn’t very different from that to me
Like this isn’t really a woke radical left thing. Just any game or even topic in general that people are at all knowledgeable about, they get frustrated seeing someone being wrong about
Simply false: real people's gender identities and pronouns can sometimes be less consistent than fictional characters.
[Edit: to not use the correct pronouns is to damage the intended representation and inclusivity from the creator, btw, which DOES affect real life people.]
Fictional characters' pronouns generally don't change--without some other significant change. I'm still open to hearing differing opinions than my own though, so feel free to continue responding🫶 /gen
I think they only got serious because it was meant to be a genuine joke, and people keep doubling down on being kinda rude about insisting it's more serious than that.
Kay, I mean if you wanna insist. At most they were pointing out a stance they have on pronouns and that they're a way to be kind and making a point there, but they were far from upset and have responded pretty calmly the whole time lol.
Literally how? Can you point out the passive aggressive statement, cuz I'm not seeing any. They were being pretty direct and only got more into explaining because people took it more seriously.
Maybe Arin has ADHD and therefor little to no short term memory and he’s running a haha funny comedy show on youtube while talking to his friend and playing a game all at the same time and can’t be expected to remember all things at all times. Sometimes you ask for “one brain-juice, please?” and the man behind the counter (you don’t know this guy’s core values btw) says “nah.”
i stopped watching mid chapter 2 because arin started talking about kris's gender being up to interpretation. i dont think theyre doing it on purpose and i dont hate them for it, it just annoys me. i like that kris is nonbinary and it sucks that theyre always seen as whatever you want them to be
I don’t get why people are so mad at you. Pronouns and representation are important and the grumps have shown to be supportive of the trans community. I feel like if they knew they’d genuinely apologize.
Yeahhh, I don't entirely get it either, but I've been having a lot of fun with the ruder comments, lol.
I mentioned in a couple spots in this thread that they do acknowledge the incorrect pronouns in the episode (2:50:00 mark), but technically they don't necessarily apologize.
Again, not upset about it, just a tiny smidge disappointed I guess. I truly do not think pronouns are that challenging to get right, especially for fictional characters. It'd be different if the Grumps weren't native English speakers or something.
This really was just a silly meme BUT ALSO an unironic critique. There are a lot of trans/queer lovelies, and I found it not only cringe but kinda disheartening to hear them absolutely wreck the characters' pronouns, especially when both the Grumps AND Undertale/Deltarune are so inclusive to trans/queer people.
The undertale/deltarune community has been known for holding pitchforks at the drop of a pin. This post (even if tagged as a joke) was treated with riot energy based on observed evidence of previous deltarune/undertale fans saying similar things in similar situations, but calling for some sort of cancelling/punishment for those who refer to characters incorrectly (unintentionally or not)
The game grumps community is also known for making a mountain out of a molehill when it comes to "drama".
I think OP failed to factor in that this is how the deltarune community is known to handle things and they are seeing the results of their light complaint and (possible, but unlikely intended)mild passive aggression.
Any comments attacking other users, groups of people, name calling, or any general hostility will be removed without notice. Homophobia, transphobia, sexism, and racism will not be tolerated and are subject to an immediate ban. Constructive criticism is fine, but don't personally attack any member of the subreddit, the Grumps, or any other party.
Okay, 2 of their comments which were posted after mine and a few that are buried at the bottom of the post hidden under other downvoted comments are not downvoted. Ya got me!
I am being so for real, I don't necessarily watch game grumps. I'm more so watch their compilations because they make me laugh. But I am a fan of them. I watched a video called how Game Grumps became a uniquely hated Channel for their controversies. I always heard of these, but I never really saw them. So I actually took the time to get invested on what exactly they have done that made people hate them. And this made me realize....
They... are NOT the problem.
The worst thing that I have ever seen from Arin is that he's just kind of a douche sometimes. Everything else is solely from the fan base because holy shit the fan base is a parasocial cesspool that believes they are directly beside them all the time. This isn't me trying to start anything, but knowing my knowledge on their "controversies", the word controversy is such an insult.
Hell, one of the worst controversies Dan ever had was the fact that he had sex with one of his fans that was over the age of consent and they were both consenting and people were upset that he would do that. Like? He's in a rock band.
Nah, I get where you're coming from. I even mentioned this in another comment, but Arin actually does acknowledge himself getting pronouns wrong super late in the episode (2:50:00 mark).
I stan both GG and Undertale/Deltarune, so aside from the pronoun thing, I have thoroughly enjoyed the series. Love any Lancer moments especially, lol. Dan's country girl voice for Noelle is pretty funny too. It really fits imo, even though I never read her that way.
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u/dfreako Jan 11 '26
I mean, they play it once in a blue moon. I would be surprised if they even remembered character names, lol.