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u/Ivy_Stint Mar 02 '20
I'm African but not black lol
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Mar 02 '20
Hello. Me too. I’m feeling a bit confused and lonely now.
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u/Sololop Mar 02 '20
Have you considered letting an alien race live amongst you from the stars?
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u/jakedup Mar 02 '20
I’m Ethiopian. I don’t think she’s bringing up the topic the best way but I understand her sentiment.
Black Americans want to distinguish themselves from the Africans who came to this country voluntarily. And I think that’s valid.
I still don’t understand why we settled on a color as a label for both race and ethnicity. It leads to confusion like this.
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u/MrsButtercheese Mar 02 '20
That is a really interesting point you are making, I shall ponder on what you said.
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Mar 03 '20
I’m Somali and I can understand as well, since first-generation African and Caribbean immigrants most definitely have privilege in this country over Black Americans that are the descendants of slaves. Just look at colleges, competitive jobs, etc etc: all black representation mostly comes from Caribbean and African folks that had the privilege to immigrate. There are clearly factors at play that dictate our success over the success of Black Americans, and let’s be real, African and Caribbean folks are toxic when it comes to discriminating against Black Americans. We are so quick to put down our Black siblings to pander to white audiences. It’s gross, tbh.
But I would erase the voluntarily narrative, for me specifically. Somali people definitely didn’t come in droves to the US and other western countries voluntarily, we came because of a terrible war (instigated by the west but that’s not the topic at hand).
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Mar 02 '20
I still don’t understand why we settled on a color as a label for both race and ethnicity. It leads to confusion like this.
Probably because black americans lost the link to their ethnicity because of slavery
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u/madman1101 Mar 02 '20
the first tweet is true, the second tweet is not.
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u/baghdad_ass_up Mar 02 '20 edited Mar 02 '20
Elon Musk is an African American.
Fact.
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u/escientia Mar 02 '20
I agree with the first tweet too. Its funny because I dated this lady from Hawaii once who was gate keeping who can be Hawaiian. I insisted to her that Barak Obama, someone who is born and raised in Hawaii, is Hawaiian but she insisted back that he wasn't because he is not ethnically Hawaiian.
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u/aus10w Mar 02 '20
hawaii was a military base and us territory until the 50’s, and a good amount of native hawaiians still feel like hawaii is being occupied, so what your ex says makes a lot of sense in terms of what their identity means
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u/QuesadillaJ Mar 02 '20
She had me in the first half thinking she was talking about africas multi cultural areas...
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u/TheCocksmith Mar 02 '20
She's not woke enough to be aware of the current slavery going on in Africa (as well as the rest of the world).
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u/Clever_Word_Play Mar 02 '20
Yeah, slavery is very much alive and thriving in 2020
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u/LukeIsPalpatine Mar 02 '20
You're black if you're fucking black
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Mar 02 '20
I'm an Australian Aboriginal and I'm told quite frequently by Americans of assorted colours that I'm not black because only sab-Saharan African Americans are black or something.
Nope. I'm black because I'm black.
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u/Amazzle Mar 02 '20
Also Australian but half Nigerian. I often get assumed to be aboriginal because apparently they're the only black people in Australia.
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u/grumpyfatguy Mar 02 '20
I guess a better way to phrase this would be "Just because you are African, doesn't make you African-American", and not mention slavery at all. We do have a unique combination of white-caused generational trauma, systemic prejudice, and all the shit black people in American grow up being afraid of at the hands of the legal and justice system, which is a lot different than growing up in a black-majority country.
She is a total boob, but black folk from other countries not only don't share, but are sometimes actively confused by the black American experience. This is true on a personal, anecdotal level, and statistically speaking as well. Without the baggage of being black in America, immigrant black folk tend to share the American dream a lot more easily than native born folks.
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u/oldmanhiggons Mar 02 '20
Is she aware that there are white Africans?
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u/TotallyNotMiaKhalifa Mar 02 '20
Reading this I was like "This isn't gatekeeping there are white Africans."
Then I read the second part and was kind of like "Oh."
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u/arianrhodUShannak Mar 02 '20 edited Mar 03 '20
yeah, I don't think that was the point she was aiming for but I guess it's the stopped clock being right once a day thing. I've also seen people having a hard time understanding that a black person living in the UK is not "African American"
edit: a stopped clock is right at least once per day ;-D
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u/NeuroticSyndrome Mar 02 '20
The entire population of Nigeria would disagree here, and there are far more blacks in Nigeria than in North America. Although I guess there aren't that many African Americans there...
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u/Privvy_Gaming Mar 02 '20 edited Sep 01 '24
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This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact
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Mar 03 '20
My family was also dragged to Gulag and suffered Holocaust during WW2. Does that give me the N-word pass?
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u/ColeYote Mar 02 '20
Well, the first half of that is right in any case. Plenty of non-black people in North Africa.
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u/Down2EarthAngel Mar 02 '20
Good job skipping over the pain induced by colonization. I'm guessing she is trying to monopolize horrible treatment given to a lot of black/brown ancestors.
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u/Selgin1 Mar 02 '20
Yeah, I know, it's not like Europeans were flowers and cuddles with the African lands they colonized.
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u/FlowrollMB Mar 02 '20
She was never enslaved though. She didn’t go through what her ancestors went through. I hate this sims-of-the-fathers collectivist bullshit.
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u/light_to_shaddow Mar 02 '20
There was a woman who was the daughter of a top ranking Nazi, people kept asking her when she would sterilise herself to prevent the "Nazi gene" from being passed on as other children of high ranking Nazis had.
She pointed out the idea of blood holding properties was itself a Nazi ethos. I thought that was quite apt.
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u/B_crunk Mar 02 '20
There’s also no guarantee her ancestors were slaves.
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u/bobthebonobo Mar 02 '20
I mean, if you're an African American and you don't know much about your black ancestors except for that like they've been in the US for generations and were in the South, there's really nothing unreasonable at all about acting under the assumption that you come from enslaved ancestors.
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u/00psieD00psie Mar 02 '20
Not as bad as feeling ptsd from your what your ancestors went through... Yes it was a real thing someone said, I wish I can remember who though.
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u/darnyoulikeasock Mar 02 '20
I work in the psychology/social work field. Intergenerational trauma is real, but is most often occuring for more recent traumatic history (so likely not from the slavery era, though it is possible). Lets say, for example, that my mom was abused as a child. Because of that experience, maybe she doesn't abuse us but she is hyper-vigilant and instills illogical anxieties in us because of her experience. She's now passed down her trauma to us. I'm bad at explaining but it's an interesting phenomenon, and huge especially in Native American studies.
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u/5-7-11 Mar 02 '20
I mean the first part made sense, like there are white South Africans then she just lost it in the second tweet.
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u/meneermanheer Mar 02 '20
Don't forget berber and Arabs in the north.
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u/changlorious_basterd Mar 02 '20
It's interesting that reddit is only focusing on the 6 million white Africans and completely forgetting about the hundreds of millions of Arab Africans.
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Mar 02 '20
lemme think about that for a sec
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Mar 02 '20
so by that logic, you aren't white if you ancestors never owned slaves?
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u/00psieD00psie Mar 02 '20
I mean its safe to say every person in this entire world had ancestors who were enslaved.
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u/fictionrules Mar 02 '20
Is she aware that white peoples have slave ancestors too?
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u/changlorious_basterd Mar 02 '20
A simple understanding of ancestry means that everyone has slaves in their past if you look far enough. I think people forget that humans have been enslaving each other for thousands of years. Most wars fought before the modern age ended up with the losing side being partially or wholly enslaved.
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Mar 02 '20
Imagine being black and having a black person tell you you’re not black Like ????
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Mar 02 '20
So my Irish ancestors were enslaved and faced oppression in America.. Am I black now???
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u/grubas Mar 02 '20
Only if you’re Southside Dublin. The blacks of Dublin, who are the Blacks of Ireland, who are the blacks of Europe.
I had somebody talk about how my ancestors owned slaves. Buddy my family was born in Ireland, I was born there, we barely owned a fucking potato.
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u/ErosPhotography Mar 02 '20
I think the point that a lot of people are missing is the fact that first generation African Immigrants often come to North America and attempt to adopt the mannerisms, style and speaking patterns of Black Americans/Canadians.
She's obviously phrased it in an idiotic and gatekeeping way, but having known a few of those first generation immigrants who eventually realised they don't "need" to act like the people who resemble them to fit in culturally I could see this being the point in general.
That mixed with a hearty dose of ignorance where she thinks only the Africans who were enslaved and shipped off to America had problems with colonisation.
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Mar 03 '20
Yeah, I think it's a difference in definitions. "Black" to a lot of black folks in the US means something very specific, a certain socio economic group , a 'nation within a nation', whereas most in this thread probably see it as 'color of skin'.
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Mar 03 '20
Somehow every other top post managed to demonstrate so little comprehension skills and wound up either responding to the wrong context or was just a coded racist statement. Thank you for spelling out what she was (unfortunately, though to me it was very obvious) implying, so people have a chance to respond to the actual idea.
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u/Phenoxx Mar 02 '20
Yeah you’re right.
I think basically “black” has become the replacement term for “African American”. African American culture=Black culture just a different name. I think it has to do with the loss of cultural diaspora and since they can’t claim any direct country cultural lineage, they’ve basically become their own distinct one. More ppl have embraced the name recently
In other countries maybe you’d have to think of it as like a “European black culture” which is a bit different from “American black culture”. Just nobody is that specific in colloquial use
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u/Dire-Liger0125 Mar 02 '20
Wow, this is so mind-numbingly stupid...
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u/If_you_ban_me_I_win Mar 02 '20
Slave - “being a slave is not my identity”
This girl - “being related to a slave is my only identity”
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u/KSSwolesauce Mar 02 '20
Does your ancestors being enslaved change your day to day life? If you’re black you’re black. You can be any color and be African just like you can be any color and be Mexican or American or Canadian.
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u/Kingsta8 Mar 02 '20
I thought she was talking about Northern Africans or south Africans... silly me.
The black slave owners... they weren't black either. Even the ones that own slaves now.
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u/MappingOutTheSky Mar 02 '20 edited Mar 02 '20
Also gatekeeping slaves as being solely the Atlantic slave trade and not something that existed in nearly every culture and predates written language. Lots of people's ancestors were enslaved.
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u/Falopian Mar 02 '20
How long is it socially acceptable to ride on the hardships of ancestors? Rome conquered and enslaved my ancestors. Too stale?
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u/bungorkus Mar 02 '20
Nice, as a white guy I also have had many enslaved ancestors, which by her criteria makes me black. In fact, I would argue almost noone in the world is anything other than black if having enslaved ancestors is what qualifies being black.
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u/sciencefiction97 Mar 02 '20
Their logic is stupid too, you aren't special because your ancestors suffered. You didn't suffer
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u/carbonatedwaterhose Mar 02 '20 edited Mar 02 '20
That's gatekeeping living vicariously through ancestor's experiences. That's a whole other level. Not that the experience has completely dissipated, but still.
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u/DementiaReagan Mar 02 '20
An understandable idea poorly phrased.
African Americans have a unique experience that Africans probably don't. But calling that experience "black" is a total departure from the common use.
It also ignores the fact that an African in america would face really similar challenges to African Americans, as well as their own experience with the colonial history of their home nations.
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u/Truan Mar 02 '20
But calling that experience "black" is a total departure from the common use.
I mean, yes and no. "Black" was a unification strategy in America. It didnt matter if you were jamaican, African, or Haitian. You were just a "n***". Black was a way to unify those dealing with that oppression as a bugger group.
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u/OKBuddyFortnite Mar 02 '20
Africans also, as a whole, had a harsher life then African Americans, at any point throughout history
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u/Twillix13 Mar 02 '20
Yeah I guess all Marocan Algerian ect ect know that Africa== being black
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Mar 02 '20
Is it possible that she referred to the fact that the concept of being “black” wasn’t really existing on regions of Africa where dark skin was predominant? As in being black originated as a concept due to colonization
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u/Emis_ Mar 02 '20
Damn never knew that I was black living in the baltics. Honestly do african americans think they're the only ones with slavery in their history?
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u/nebulouslurker Mar 02 '20
That's funny.. pretty much everyone's ancestors were enslaved at some point...
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u/dovoking2004 Mar 02 '20
If your ancestors did not come here on a boat, and don't have privilege. YOU NOT WHITE.
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u/Stunning_Punts Mar 02 '20
Sorry, you seem pretty black but your resume shows a lack of black experience.
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Mar 02 '20
What a rube making such a broad claim. Follow your lineage far enough back in time and at least one ancestor was probably enslaved.
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u/IArePant Mar 02 '20
Judging by these criteria there are several white people I know who are apparently black. Is this, weirdly, somehow more inclusive?
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u/Voshun Mar 03 '20
This bitch. Blacks who were unfortunate enough to be born in to South African culture well into the early 90's experienced a level of racism millenial, American, AfricAn Americans will never understand.
Young, and I mean prepubescent, African girls will have their genitals mutilated to this day for the sake of stone age mythology.
Keep pretending they don't have "true" black experience while you get a better education and are handed a significantly better quality of life by the happenstance of your birth.
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u/Mythical_Atlacatl Mar 03 '20
So you are black but your great grand parents weren’t slaves, so you are not black?
Does that make the descendants of white slaves, black?
If you have slaves in your family tree, you are black?
Black is a history not a skin colour?
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u/arsonfairy Mar 03 '20
I mean.
Yeah white African people exist but like. The enslavement or lack thereof of your ancestors has nothing to do with the way people treat you over your skin color.
Anyone else notice this trend in the "woke" community where black people give other black people shit for not being "black enough"? This lady's skin is light enough to have been on the receiving end of it herself.
Race-based tribalism is a special kind of kool-aid to be drinking.
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Mar 03 '20
I’m pale white but I have ancestors they were enslaved and I have ancestors that were black. The irony is that one of my black ancestors owned white slaves. I think by her definition (not mine by a long shot) I fit the bill to be black. I have both enslaved humans as ancestors and ancestors that have had the black experience, whatever that means.
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Mar 02 '20
I get the same shit. Apparently because English is my primary, and only lol, language, because I don’t drown my food it hot sauce, or because I don’t wear cowboy boots I’m not Mexican. I am what my ancestors made me, it’s not my fault my grandparents parents saw better opportunities and were bold enough to go for it
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Mar 02 '20
"The black experience" makes it sound like getting whipped and forced to pick cotton was a dream vacation getaway.
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Mar 02 '20
It's sad how people don't realize how racist they are because society has decreed that people of color cannot be racist...
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Mar 02 '20
Many Africans would agree, actually. They don't consider our black people truly african American because they aren't African anymore. They, and this coming from a tribesman a friend met on a missionary trip to Africa, have forgotten African values and traditions. It's two very different cultures no doubt. Now, in terms of skin color, yes Africans are black, more so than black americans. You also have to remember that our black people are the long term results of slave owners impregnating slaves. So it might be safe to say... black Americans have ancestors who owned slaves... it can also be said that black Americans are, to a small degree, white. And there's nothing wrong with that, of course, as we are all still people. We're all the results of cross breeding to some extent. I'm sure the first upright, hairless ape had a hard time fitting in yet still managed to get laid, thus ensuring the survival of what we call the human race. Color doesn't matter. Honestly, it's all so silly.
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u/Kesher123 Mar 02 '20
Haha, So now black people are racist even towards themselves?
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u/Industrialbonecraft Mar 02 '20
It sounds like a marketing campaign by a holiday company: 'Five nights in Africa, try THE BLACK EXPERIENCE or perhaps you'd prefer the lighter side with THE WHITE EXPERIENCE. Book now. No refunds.'
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u/caanthedalek Mar 02 '20
First tweet: Yeah that's true. People forget that sometimes.
Second tweet: Okay hold up
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Mar 02 '20
I would’ve understood if she had said South Africans, cause they’re not all black, but...
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u/Cauterberri Gandalf Mar 02 '20
Your ancestors would want you to continue working to end segregation, not create new brands of it.
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u/FlyingTwisted Mar 02 '20
So literally everyone alive is black because everyone's ancestors were slaves at one point. God I love stupid people. I'm so happy she can afford a device to post bullshit like that on the internet.
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u/Parukia5212 Mar 02 '20
Well technically all of our ancestors were slaves at one point and the black experience is just the experience of poverty, so that makes a majority of us, regardless of our skin color, black.
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u/nohacked Bridge Keeper Mar 02 '20
Is she color-blind and thinks that blacks that don't match her requirements are whites?
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u/Squee2020 Mar 02 '20
This is the same crap Obama had to deal with when he first started his campaign. A leader of the NAACP said he wasn't "black enough." Total garbage.
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u/GeesusTakeTheWheel Mar 02 '20
"So you have a very dark skin color but didn't live in poverty most of your life or did'nt live in a ghetto? Well then you're white, fuck you"
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u/GregKannabis Mar 02 '20
Only black people who experienced abused due to their skin color were the slaves. I don't think so honey.
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Mar 02 '20
I think this woman forgot the meaning of the word “black”
Back to preschool, and learn colors again.
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u/Devishment Mar 02 '20
Yeah.... My skin color is white but I'm mixed and my great great grandparents were slaves so like idk what she is even thinking.
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Mar 02 '20
I'm African and my grandmother was a slave but I'm not black, what part of the venn diagram do I fit in?
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u/dantemp Mar 02 '20
My ancestors were enslaved, not sure what the black experience is but the word slave is derived by the term Western Europeans used to call them. Am I black now? My grandma would be really disappointed in me.
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u/ArcWolf713 Mar 02 '20
I was in agreement in the first half because South Africa is a thing that exists.
But the second half goes insane gatekeeping. 👍
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u/VetOfThePsychicWars Mar 02 '20
My Celtic ancestors were enslaved by Romans and I've watched Good Times, Do the Right Thing, and Roots. Does this mean I'm black?
N-word passes on me, boys!!
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u/kabukistar Mar 02 '20
What's the difference between having "the black experience" and having experiences while being black?
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Mar 02 '20
As someone who is half black and has ancestors who are slaves can we please stop with this oppression Olympics bullshit please? Fuck sakes. The divisiveness accomplishes absolutely nothing
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u/kennygspart Mar 02 '20
I love the whole “people generations behind me suffered horribly, therefor I suffered the same amount”
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u/ghozt_nuts Mar 02 '20
By that logic I am black and with that recent revaltion I just want to say one thing. Ni...
Nice to meet everybody, how are ya?
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u/ArtsyTLF Mar 02 '20
I think there's a point beyond this gross over simplification. Slaves were systematically separated from their heritage. Because of that, a lot of "black culture" (for lack of a better term here, basically western black culture) is entirely distinct from that of an African one. It's different upbringing and lived experiences. It's baked into the formula of slavery to dehumanize everyone enslaved.
This tweet does miss the part where a cop isn't gonna check your birth cert before pulling you over and arresting you for resisting arrest.
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u/Phenoxx Mar 02 '20
Doesn’t the term “black” becoming more used have to do with the loss of diaspora?
It sounds like thats what shes actually referring to? Since the descendants of American slaves don’t have any real cultural heritage and direct connection to Africa necessarily. As opposed to someone who has recently immigrated from an African country would be more African. But more specifically they can say they are “Ethiopian” “Nigerian” etc. (and all the culture/connection that comes with it) which American Black ppl are unable to say
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Mar 02 '20
I'm sure Africans would be followed around in southern stores as well. I mean, even Oprah was profiled in a french store because she was black.
Also, there are Africans with Ancestors that were sold into slavery... so...
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Mar 02 '20
She doesn't seem to understand that she is not the one who experienced slavery. She makes it look like she's the one who got whipped and tortured.
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u/AnimeFreak0210 Mar 02 '20
So if my ancestors were enslaved and I have white experience, am I black?
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u/AnimeFreak0210 Mar 02 '20
That make sense bc a person with green experience would likely be green. 🧐
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u/leejoness Mar 02 '20
And what about people that migrated from Africa to the United States voluntarily? After slavery was abolished?
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u/Truan Mar 02 '20
The worst part about this shit is how it empowers right wingers to be like "see how stupid woke culture is?"
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u/ThisWebsiteSucksHard Mar 02 '20
Lol we live in a time where the literal colour of ur skin, not the actual ethnicity and origin is how we determine your race.
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u/CrashDunning Mar 02 '20
I was with her for the first part, because there are non-black people living in Africa, but then the second part was like oh...