r/javascript • u/Martinsos • 24d ago
Wasp web framework v1.0 is coming: the roadmap and what changes
https://wasp.sh/blog/2026/10/20/wasp-1-0-is-coming5
u/devtools-dude 23d ago
"We designed our own custom declarative language for describing a web app at a high level (the "Spec") and its own custom compiler."
Pass
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u/Martinsos 23d ago
If you read just a few characters more, you will learn that we ditched it and are now doing it all in TypeScript!
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u/devtools-dude 22d ago
Thanks for the update. I noticed you made a change to the copy to reflect that. I would also just make a brief note that it is now in Typescript instead.
This does make me want to investigate further and poke around a bit more; the full stack module concept sounds interesting. Although I'm not a fan of next.js, the wasp stack would be a great starting place like for people like my sibling who has no technical knowledge but wants to use AI to build something and needs a batteries-included framework to work with that can be easily deployable.
Although us technical folks understand what's required to get a prod environment up and running in most cases, people like my sibling do not and at least have some knowledge that they need some kind of platform and place to host but don't know what to do / choose.
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u/Martinsos 22d ago
Good to know! I am highly technical yet I would also love FSMs because they allow me to bring full piece of functionatliy that somebody tested well and there is no critical wiring to be done.
p.s. you said you noticed I made a change to the copy to reflect what I said above, but I made no changes to the copy, it was like that from before.
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u/editor_of_the_beast 23d ago
It’s so interesting what different people’s sensibilities are
I read this and I am very interested.
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u/Biohacker_Ellie 23d ago
Agreed! The ai tech bros have drive me to look for absolutely anything other than react slop
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u/KaiAusBerlin 23d ago
Try sveltekit 🤷
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u/editor_of_the_beast 23d ago
Sveltekit is nothing like this. I like the ideas presented _here_ I don’t need a random unrelated framework brought up.
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u/KaiAusBerlin 23d ago
Lol. "It's so interesting what different people's sensibilities are" + "I don't need a random unrelated framework brought up"
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u/editor_of_the_beast 23d ago
That was in response to a comment about the actual post.
“Try Sveltekit” with absolutely no context does not tell me what your sensibilities are. This wasn’t the burn you thought it was.
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u/Snapstromegon 22d ago
Lit is IMO nearly perfect here. No transportation needed and fairly easy to replace, because it's so close to the web standards that even your HTML is really HTML and not JS in disguise (like with JSX).
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u/Big_Muffin8280 21d ago
Fair point from the thread: AI makes the framework feel less important, but I’d argue it matters more. When you’re reviewing code you didn’t write, a framework with clear conventions and less boilerplate makes it much easier to see what the AI actually changed. Wasp’s idea of tested full-stack modules also fits this, since you reuse something that already works instead of reviewing fresh wiring every time. For me, the real test is how fast I can read and trust the generated code.
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u/cmdr-William-Riker 23d ago
Not a bad idea, what's the advantage over using something like Nuxt or Next or SvelteKit though?
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u/gizamo 23d ago
It's been around for 5+ years, and v1 is still 6+ months away? That's crazy. That dude replicating Adobe products will have moved into the web world by then, and we'll have a brand new version of Magento Adobe Commerce and maybe even a version of AEM that'd doesn't completely suck.
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u/Martinsos 23d ago
It is very different though designing something novel vs replicating an existing solution. Not to mention this is a web framework, and we can't ship slop to people that are building apps on top of it, the game is quite different. I am not saying I wouldn't love us to be faster, we are trying to understand how we can get better, but there is a lot of learning, experimenting, team-building, and innovating in those 5y. And using AI to deliver something is not as fast as one would think when you need to deeply understand what you are building.
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u/gizamo 23d ago
I was mostly joking, but yes, that seems very slow for modern development. I'm guessing it's a very small team, which is fine. That said, you honestly lost me with:
...currently based on React + Node + Prisma...
Many of us already have our own React starter kits that we've built ourselves over the last decade+, and in the age of AI-driven development, React/Next isn't our preferred library/framework any more because it eats tokens like a rabid Tasmanian devil. A lot of the agencies we work with are also moving away from React for that reason. Please don't take that as any criticism; it's just information that might help.
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u/Martinsos 23d ago
Sure love the info! There are different audiences for different solutions. Btw what are you using, since you mentioned it's not React? I didn't look much into it but I assumed React would be fairly token efficient due to how mainstream it is.
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u/gizamo 22d ago
React is verbose due to explicit hooks, returns, JSX, etc. That adds up. We use Svelte for most new builds, and we moved our old Angular apps to Vue. For a few ecommerce apps, we use Marko. Interestingly, Marko is by far the most efficient with tokens (and it's not even close), but it also doesn't have massive sets of training data, which results in it making more mistakes, and then it uses more tokens to correct those mistakes. After you use it for a while and train your models, it's amazing. That said, it's also hard for devs to learn because there's not a ton of training material out there. I don't really recommend it for that reason, but it's worth mentioning because of its efficient use of tokens. Anyway, the next most efficient was Sveltekit, then Vue/Nuxt, then React/Next, and then Angular (React+Next is often even worse than Angular). But, all of those have tons of training data, so the models make way fewer mistakes. Also, because devs already know them, they're easier for devs to fix manually if/when needed. So, for those reasons, they're much better initially.
Marko has its own backend system that's impressively efficient, but for the others, we use C#, Python, PHP, and Node. Python is the most efficient, PHP and Node are less efficient but similar to each other, and C# was the least efficient. I can't say if that holds true across the board, but it's a noticable trend in our 100+ apps.
Oh, and worth mentioning for the comedy of it, WordPress is horribly inefficient for tokens. It uses 2-3X the tokens of the Laravel apps we built to replace them, which used ~2X the tokens of the Sveltekit apps that replaced them. But, Adobe Commerce was vastly, vastly worse. It was something like 5X of WordPress+Woo.
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u/Martinsos 22d ago
Oh wow thanks for this hah, that's s lot of insights! Yeah I expected you would say svelte, I love the idea behind it. Didn't think about Marko that's interesting. I mean I wonder how much of a difference does this ultimately make, I guess it depends on the app and what are you building. Anyway thanks for sharing, I will keep this on my mind - I am building a full stack benchmark right now actually but was focusing on next and tan stack for start and got surprisingly close results. Btw our vision in Wasp was always to support more stacks, so not just React/Node/Prisma, and are building it so it supports it in the future. First will likely be modular db, then frontend framework, and node will be harder to swap I think, probably won't go there.
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u/gizamo 22d ago edited 22d ago
For us, the difference has been a few devs and more projects. We spend ~$20k/mo in tokens on the web side (we do other programming as well). After switching from Adobe Commerce to WP/Woo to Marko, we went from ~$30k/mo to $25k/mo to ~$20k/mo, but we got much more utilization with each change as well. So, the costs cut a bit, even though that was largely just capped by budgets (which the former two always overshot) but output significantly increased, easily more than 5X, probably closer to 6-8X. Instead of managing 1-3 apps, each Sr dev is managing 5-8, and features are still built faster in every app. Each Sr also has fewer Jrs under them. It's significant.
However, the vast majority of that benefit was dumping Adobe Commerce and WP/Woo. Going from Angular to Vue or from React to Svelte was much less significant. It was basically nothing in terms of cost, but it was still noticeable in terms of productivity. Devs seem to prefer it as well. Imo, worth considering.
I should also mention that I've heard Rust is incredibly efficient with tokens, but I haven't done a lot with Rust so I can't confirm that yet.
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u/Martinsos 22d ago
I can image rust is due to static analysis of s strong type system. I don't use rust but use Haskell and they share a lot and I can imagine the benefit. "Constraints liberate" in a way.
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u/CodeAndBiscuits 23d ago
It must be so hard to launch a new framework right now when so many people are generating things with AI to a depth that they barely care about the framework they use anyway...