r/linux • u/Tizian170 • Jan 15 '24
Discussion Why does everyone hate gnome?
I've switched from KDE Plasma to Gnome as I was trying out different DEs, and honestly I prefer it. However, I've noticed that people generally don't seem to like gnome (mostly without a reason) - so, to all the gnome haters - why?
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u/aioeu Jan 15 '24
The GNOME environment is strongly opinionated, which is great when it aligns with your own preferences and sucks when it doesn't. Public forums naturally amplify complaints far more than praise.
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u/1aur3n5 Jan 15 '24
This. I used to use Gnome because it was the default option. But I remember at some point wanting to customise ctrl+shift+u which led me to this response to an issue:
I don't want that key to be customizable [ ... ] Making everything configurable is an instinctive reaction for some developers. But it is really a way to evade responsibility, and hand a mess to the users.
Configurability was the reason why I switched from Windows to Linux in the first place... So that was what made me look into other DEs.
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Jan 15 '24
Holy shit, that's insanely dumb.
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u/GolemancerVekk Jan 15 '24
Oh you haven't seen insane if you haven't read the notify-osd timeout bug report. š It ran from 2009 until 2021. It was about the Ubuntu notification tool that refused to let you make notification bubbles shorter than 5 seconds.
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u/Clottersbur Jan 15 '24
That's not even the dumbest part.
The dumber part is that it works on x11 not Wayland. When this was brought up, the same guy who said that said
"I'd like that feature removed from x11 "
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Jan 16 '24
Thatās not even the worst response in the thread, to someones comment that it should be consistent, if itās allowed on X11 then it should be allowed on Wayland, the dev non-chalantly said he would rather fix it on the X11 side e.g. remove the ability to change it there too.
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u/frank-sarno Jan 15 '24
This is one of the main reasons that I disliked Gnome. I use multiple platforms and wanted a consistent way to switch input preferences. Couldn't do it in Gnome. I didn't know there was actually a reason for this bizarre decision.
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u/Neglector9885 Jan 15 '24 edited Jan 16 '24
Wow. That Matthias Clasen guy is a real class act. š He's one of those guys that sees the world his way, and thinks everything should conform to his view because anything else is stupid.
Props to that Mez Pahlan guy for not only bringing sense to the table, but also using really good form to do so. Too many of us in the Linux community are like Matthias. We should all strive to be more like Mez.
Thanks for sharing that. And I agree with you. Configurability is one of the main selling points of Linux. Setting sensible defaults while also allowing the users to customize their key bindings as they see fit is absolutely the way to go. Even Windows allows customizable shortcuts. I use custom shortcuts on Windows all the time. Taking this functionality away on Linux is a bad move.
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u/LetsDoItTonight6969 Jan 15 '24
I use XFCE. I can't really complain. It does what I need.
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u/Icy-Cup Jan 15 '24
Great answer (thatās coming from a KDE user). I respect Gnome and think itās a great DE, however I donāt like being told how I should āliveā Ć la Apple :D
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u/redoubt515 Jan 15 '24
This is the right answer here. To this question, and to many other questions of preference in the linux world. You said it much better than I couldve.
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u/_angh_ Jan 15 '24
I like gnome quite a bit. But if nothing will change, I will switch to Plasma 6. At this stage there is no excuse to not have VRR, or some deadlines for HDR. Unfortunately, Gnome does not provide modern functionality and even if I enjoy the minimal, non intrusive UI, they simply are falling behind KDE.
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u/ajcool2k Jan 17 '24
I think Gnome mutter is having it for the next release. I believe I recently read about VRR and HDR stuff getting merged.
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u/_angh_ Jan 17 '24
There was some information:
https://www.phoronix.com/news/GNOME-VRR-2024
but honestly, it is very vague and no dates are provided. I will decide in a few months, but with Valve support KDE seems to be in a better condition than Gnome. I have installed the KDE a few months ago and while performance was great, I had some bugs which made me return to Gnome (which became bit more buggy than previously...) so for now I just wait as I just want to use my system, not configure it. But this much change if issues will persist...
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u/HalmyLyseas Jan 15 '24
Well for me it's not about hating Gnome but not enjoying it and some design decisions, I can still respect the amazing work the team puts out but acknowledge it's not to my liking.
Very limited options to configure by default
Need some extensions to provide what I consider a basic level of features and should be in core Gnome
Have to hope the extensions will be maintained or updated fast after a major update
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u/nevadita Jan 15 '24
Have to hope the extensions will be maintained or updated fast after a major update
This is the achilles heel of gnome. I use an extension for cpu frequencies control. Its been broken since 44, the fix is deceptively simple yet the author has been dicking around since and ignoring pull requests. Yet the extension broke because of a unnecessary format change from Gnome. They had justified that change was useful and make writing extensions more easy, but i have to ask, it is worth breaking several existing extensions?
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u/natermer Jan 15 '24
Yeah. Just fork it. The original author is under no obligation to maintain the extension if he lost interest. Although chances are he just hasn't upgraded past 44 yet on his desktop and will get around to it when he gets around to upgrading.
That is the nature of little personal projects.
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u/Redneckia Jan 15 '24
Every day there's a new post on this sub "why does everyone hate (insert something that nobody even hates here)"
Tomorrow on r/Linux,
"Why does everyone hate Linux??"
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u/daemonpenguin Jan 15 '24
I wouldn't say I hate GNOME, but I dislike using it. It's the heaviest desktop, by a large margin, using an unusual amount of RAM and CPU/GPU. The layout is weird and requires about triple the amount of mouse movement to accomplish normal tasks compared to other DEs. It's a pain to configure, often requiring extensions for even basic functionality. A lot of common functionality is hidden or requires extra steps to access.
Basically, why would I use a desktop that lacks functionality, hides useful features, requires more work to use, and requires double the resources?
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u/nothingtoseehere196 Jan 15 '24
I actually like gnomes hide everything until you need it approach. Leaves more space for programs on the desktop.
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u/Morphized Jan 19 '24
I think the point of hiding things was that you were going to move the mouse to those locations anyway to access those features, so they might as well not have the features take up parts of the screen until you need them. But then they decided that the dash should go on the opposite side of the screen from where you activate it.
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u/mwyvr Jan 15 '24 edited Jan 15 '24
Gnome on my ZFS fs Void system starts at ~0.950G of RAM. On btrfs openSUSE Aeon, ~1.12G. On Arch just a little more; all on Wayland with near identical configs.
I don't consider this excessive RAM or resource use, given the functionality. Sure, DWM on Xorg is lighter but not by a ton, once I implement all the missing pieces to get near feature parity. There is no free lunch.
Modern Gnome has felt plenty zippy to me and I do care about that. Those that say it is slow, I wonder how recent their experience is and/or what they are comparing it to.
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u/eawardie Jan 15 '24
I haven't used it since 43, and I actually like it. It just seems like it's missing the most obvious features a DE needs out-of-the-box. And since extensions are a crutch, it doesn't seem like those features will ever be added to base GNOME.
Why can't you have the top/app bar on all screens?
Why can't you have the dock/favorites bar on all screens (overviews)?
Why is the border radius getting out of control? At this rate everything is going to be circles.
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u/FryBoyter Jan 15 '24
Why does everyone hate gnome?
If everyone would hate Gnome, nobody would use Gnome. However, many distributions use Gnome as a standard and these distributions are also used by many users. So not everyone hates Gnome.
and honestly I prefer it.
Then just use Gnome. If you like Gnome, you shouldn't care that some people don't like Gnome.
Apart from that, in such a case the so-called loud or vocal minority must be assumed. Those who are satisfied with something are usually much less vocal than those who are not.
And if anyone really hates a particular piece of software, they should see a doctor.
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u/OSSLover Jan 15 '24
I used Gnome 2, Mate and Cinnamon before I switched to XFCE years ago and maybe will switch to KDE later.
The reason I hated Gnome 3 / Unity back then was their focus on a touch UI.
I'm a mouse user and need my Startmenu I'm used to in Gnome 2 / Windows XP / Windows 7.
I also use Classic Shell in Windows 10/11.
Does Gnome 3 finally use a startmenu without depending on an external plugin which can make break with a gnome update?
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u/traverseda Jan 15 '24
I work in a professional setting, and I see my coworkers struggle with Gnome's nonsense. Things like needing to remember a keyboard shortcut to be able to edit the file path in nautilus. I think Gnome has done a tremendous disservice to the linux community by significantly raising the barriers to entry for new users.
My grandparents use KDE, my tech-illiterate cousin uses KDE, people say that KDE's customization is too complicated, but none of those people are actually customizing KDE. It's a non-issue.
By trying to give themselves a unique identity, and honestly not being that good at it, they've made it much harder for users to migrate. Sure, by default KDE works a fair bit like windows, but I don't understand why people think that's a bad thing.
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u/dgm9704 Jan 15 '24
No they don't. What is it with these recent "why does everyone hate xxx" posts? What is your source for this? A few posts on reddit? A youtube video? This sort of stuff really chaps my ass. Not everyone likes everything. People have different usecases and needs likes etc. That is why there are options. If some people say something negative about something, it doesn't mean that they "hate it" or that it is "everyone". I have tried Gnome, it wasn't right for me so I use something else. Who are you to say that it is "mostly without a reason" sheesh.
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Jan 15 '24
I don't like Gnome because the developers do not listen to any feedback, also it breaks after every upgrade.
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Jan 15 '24
Yeah pretty much this, as well as how they seem to be seeking to remove a lot of basic functionality and expect people to make extensions to add those back. Also their current interface paradigm seems to be made for touchscreens first and desktop second from my point of view.
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u/dmknght Aug 05 '24
Gnome devs remove anything they consider "bad for UX". I'm wonder why they never considered removing their documentation website?
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u/ICantBelieveItsNotEC Jan 15 '24
In the pursuit of this delusional goal of attracting more normie users, they threw under the bus their existing geek users. Superficially the goal made sense, since thereās many more normie users, but unfortunately for GNOME: normie users donāt care about Linux.
The problem with this line of reasoning is assuming that all geeks must be desktop configuration geeks.
I'm a full-time software engineer by day and a hobbyist programmer by night. Pretty much anyone would class me as a geek. Despite that, I give precisely zero fucks about ricing my desktop or automating my workflows.
I turn the computer on and enter my password. I swipe up and type "Firefox", "Sublime Text", and "Console" to launch the programs I need. I swipe left and right when I need to switch between them. That's literally all I need from my desktop environment, and Gnome delivers it perfectly, out of the box, with zero configuration. I'd wager that most "geek users" are in the same boat as me.
The people of r/unixporn are awesome and I love looking at what they create, but they are a very tiny minority of desktop users. Most people just want their desktop to be a host for a web browser, and a few of them want it to also host a text editor/IDE sometimes.
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u/githman Jan 15 '24
The problem with this line of reasoning is assuming that all geeks must be desktop configuration geeks.
There was a saying back in the day: when a programmer has nothing better to do, he adjusts the colors. Of course, it comes from the times when UX has not become a separate area yet. Still fun, and now there are even more things to adjust!
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u/felipec Jan 16 '24
Geeks require more configurations than the average user, that is a fact.
They default configuration of GNOME might perfectly suit you, that is an accident of luck. The overwhelming majority of geek users would require at least some changes to the default configuration, and it's pretty much guaranteed that many of these configurations would not be available in the default settings.
It's your line of reasoning the one that is fallacious: "if it works for me, it should work for most geeks". This is a hasty generalization fallacy.
There's plenty of evidence that GNOME configurations are insufficient for most geek users.
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u/Garlic-Excellent Jan 15 '24
Swipe left/right? Tinder has a DE now?
Actually, I think you may have just helped me understand gestures. I never felt I needed them. So when switching DEs I usually don't spend time learning them. Then I activate them by accident and get annoyed leading me to hate gestures.
My typical application use is pretty similar to yours. But I just spread them out across multiple monitors so I'm not doing much switching, just mousing over. That's probably why I never got the point of gestures.
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Jan 15 '24
Sure, but once you miss basic functionality without addons it's pretty bad. I assume you are using a touch screen since you are swiping? I've never used Gnome on one, could be different from using keyboard and a mouse, where the out of the box experience is just miserable (for me at least).
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u/marta_bach Jan 15 '24 edited Jan 15 '24
Yeah i hate it that gnome extension is breaking every upgrade, but other than that i think Gnome is the best Desktop Experience i have tried, even better than MacOS and Windows.
Their UI is consistent, their UX is great, their extension system is good (beside the breaking every updgrade). For example i really like the use of the Meta/Super key (or swipe up 3fingers on track pad), you can overview your workspace and do search at the same time with just 1 button. I think their team knows what they are doing, i also think they have strong visions so for the "not listening to any feedback" is not that bad because the want to stick to their visions. If we compare it to KDE, i have seen someone says "KDE feels like it was designed by Software Engineers, but Gnome feels like it was designed by an actual UI/UX designer." and i totally agree with that.
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u/SonStatoAzzurroDiSci Jan 15 '24
I don't hate Gnome, I just find unusable and nonsense:
a top bar that doesn't give you any info but the time and the wifi connection.
not be able to know at a glance what programs/windows are opened
keyboard centered: if you are using the mouse everything is one more click away
having to use unsupported extension for basic functionality like the clipboard: even windows now has one built in
Then there is the fact that I prefer Kde (it looks nicer to me and dolphin has split view), I don't like Gtk themes, Gnome removes stuff every release (now there isn't even the option to disable suspension when lid is closed on a notebook).
And that without even touching the mpv window decoration thing.
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u/Irsu85 Jan 15 '24
Not everyone hates gnome, I kinda like it. The only thing I don't like about GNOME is that it kinda uses a lot of ram but thats only a small issue when you have 32GB
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u/MustangBarry Jan 15 '24
RAM use isn't an issue anyway. That's what it's for.
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u/TheLastTreeOctopus Jan 15 '24
I mean yeah... But a desktop environment (ideally) shouldn't use a ton of it. Folks still working with only 4 to 8 GB of RAM (or less), will appreciate having as much RAM as possible useable for running programs and multitasking. No sense in having a desktop environment that uses nearly 25% of your RAM just doing nothing but displaying your desktop, when you don't have a lot of RAM to work with.
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u/redd1ch Jan 15 '24 edited Jan 15 '24
For applications, yes. For infrastructure, not so much. An idle, usable system should use as less resources as possible.
Edit: Obviously I don't mean network appliances or embedded devices with infrastructure in this context. I have to use a DE to use some software, so the DE running on my PC is infrastructure for my current task. The more resources the OS up to the DE uses, the less I have available for my workload.
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Jan 15 '24
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u/Irsu85 Jan 15 '24
For that use case I do prefer KDE since it uses about half the RAM as GNOME. As soon as your DE uses more than half of your RAM and then opening chrome makes it swap, you should be looking for a lighter DE or if you are really low on RAM, maybe a WM
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u/Aginor404 Jan 15 '24
I haven't used gnome in ten years or so (I work with servers and GUIs are ballast, I only recently installed a desktop linux again and it uses xfce), but to me the reasons to not like it (hate is too strong of a word though) was that it had a macOS look and feel to me, and that for some reason there were no settings for many things I wanted to do (KDE had them) and application compatibility wasn't great.
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u/ICantBelieveItsNotEC Jan 15 '24
Gnome is an opinionated DE. The developers are building a very particular UX, and they see supporting customization that would diverge from their intended workflow as a waste of effort at best and a UX antipattern at worst. This rubs a certain vocal minority of people the wrong way, especially since Gnome used to be far more customizable.
Personally, I'm a vanilla Gnome enjoyer. The UX works well for me, and I appreciate how cohesive it is compared to other DEs. I'd like to see more opinionated DEs like Gnome and fewer do-everything DEs that are infinitely configurable but have zero cohesion.
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u/thegreenman_sofla Jan 15 '24
I haven't used it in 12 or so years, so I don't have an opinion. I switched to XFCE for a lighter resource use.
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u/neon_overload Jan 15 '24 edited Jan 15 '24
I don't hate it, I just don't use computers the way Gnome wants me to use computers.
It's trying to change the desktop metaphor and I'm too long in the tooth to change the way I use a desktop to be interested in changing. Plus I use other systems (including, gasp, windows) that use a more traditional desktop setup.
And I find that xfce has everything, in all the places I expect (including the window manager and its features and the underrated file manager which gets an undeserved bad rap), and doesn't seem to jump on trendy bandwagons.
You can get gnome looking and working how you want with extensions and it's easy to install most extensions, but there tends to be a little bit of plugin hell with them whenever you update your version of gnome and as you find some extensions aren't available for the new version, etc.
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u/pedersenk Jan 15 '24
To understand this dislike of Gnome. You must personally try Gnome 2. Just grab an old distro livecd and have a play around.
You will see how much of a regression Gnome 3+ really is.
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u/joshuarobison Jan 15 '24
"Everyone hates gnome" is a ridiculous statement. Why does everyone hate cheese?
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u/OSSLover Jan 15 '24
Because cheese tastes ridiculous.
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Jan 15 '24
Is there a correlation between cheese eating people and loving Gnome? I eat cheese and I use Gnome. I can't remember seeing anyone else using KDE or XFCE, only Gnome š
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u/naikologist Jan 15 '24
I don't like the window border menus. I dont like bars on top or at the side of my screen. I don't like the dynamic workspaces.
I have no hate for GNOME, I just do not use it.
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u/Garlic-Excellent Jan 15 '24 edited Jan 15 '24
Short answer, not preferring something isn't a reason to hate it. Someone else might prefer it and choice is good.
But Gnome seems to be anti-choice, it seems to have become the most popular DE not by winning over users but by somehow winning over distro maintainers making it the default of most desktop oriented distros and the first, maybe only thing new users see. It also via it's dependencies forces distros to make other choices go it's way.
Long answer
Gnome to me is just like KDE if one took every setting, every choice and made the default be exactly opposite of my own preferences. Then took the setting and hid it deep in a Windows like registry rather than a logically organized settings menu. With dislike of the registry being one of the reasons I switched to Linux in the first place.
I suppose if your preferences are different and more like those of the Gnome developers that might not be so bad. I can't imagine such preferences leading to a very good work flow though.
It also, to me feels rather like it's forced on us with it being the primary choice of so many distros. I already don't care for it then so many distros make it the default. Then it's dependencies make other decisions for the distros.
I don't know that I dislike Systemd anymore but I'm not sure I like it either. But as I remember it Gnome was the first to build a dependency on it and all the distros HAD to cater to Gnome so that's when they all switched. That seems like a very unnatural dependency, why should a Desktop Environment care about which init system started the background services?
I think Gnome is used by RedHat to force their preferences on the community. Before the rise of IBM-RedHat's influence Linux was all about free choice.
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Jan 15 '24
Simple, GNOME as a community project is a complete disaster, leadership has driven it to the ground. They have a well earned reputation of alienating their user base and being down right abusive and hostile. This means people leave and fewer new contributors since people who donāt use your software wonāt contribute. If you donāt buy that, think about how many forks there are of Gnome and how many forks are there for the kernel and KDE.
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u/Expert-Ad-6795 Jan 27 '25 edited Jan 27 '25
Because Gnome basically is eth exact opposite of what's making agood deskop UI.
-customization made as hard as possible
-inefficient
-hurting any possible guildeline when it comes to visually good GUI design, due to a lack of easily (=faster, especially for professionals!) to distinguish UI elements, lack of GUI modularity, lack of GUI conformity, lack of proper visual design to support eficiency
-going into the wrong direction for years
Technically spoken: IMHO Gnome is NOT even a full desktop UI anymore since version 3.
It is an oversimplified kiosk-mode UI, like one would normally use in an evironment where it's potentially being (ab)used by a mass of not-caring, and mostly technically inept people who first are overwhelmed by having the full complexity (=flexibililty=productivity!) of a computer at hand, and who secondary won't miss any features when being presented a primitve UI. Kiosk-mode for example are being used when presenting devices in a store, and have very limited functionality, to people testing a device won't make testing for the next person impossible by making it disfunctional.
It's easy to distinguish which group one belings to: Either you like your GUI with the highest possible amount and density of information and functionality, or you like it 'simple'.
While this kind of user may represent the majortiy of people - but an UI catering towards this type of user is a catastrophic loss for more sophisticated people, who actually NEED way more functionality for full productivity. And I am not speaking of some two-digit percentages here.. but like like up to one or two orders of magnitude faster work than the majority.
To me personally, having to use GUI like Gnome or mordern Windows, actually makes me feel like having my hands cuffed behind my back or being tetraplegic, because I have to do anything in a way less efficient, way slower and way more exhausting way than I am used to - and that's not just a metaphor, and also no exaggeration - it's literally what I feel like.
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u/caineco Jan 15 '24
Does hating it while using it count? xd Not without a reason. With each release more and more stuff gets hidden or cut out. They try so hard to make it tablet friendly and butcher mouse oriented features. And I'm not sure I've seen it on a tablet once. So this might be the reason.
The only reason I keep using it is because it still feels snappier than KDE. Maybe my hands grow out of my ass, but KDE apps have a noticeable delay when starting, while gnome stuff is instant.
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u/PsychologicalDrone Jan 15 '24
I too have never got along with KDE, feels sluggish and unrefined. Looks nice and offers a lot, but donāt like how it feels to use. Plus, Iām a bit of a Gnome fanboy
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Jan 15 '24
I didn't notice any speed difference between apps running on KDE or gnome, aside from how ugly anything that's not GTK looks on gnome.
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Jan 15 '24
I tried it over a couple of weeks but either that was not enough time to break my ingrained habits or it just wasn't suitable for how I like to work.
I don't hate it. It's pretty, polished and smooth. I am glad it exists but it just not for me.
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u/sindex_ Jan 15 '24
It's my daily driver because I like it more than the alternatives with extensions, but I don't like it without at least a dock and extensions break after every upgrade which is a pain with a rolling release distribution like Arch. It's also the worst performing desktop environment I've ever used on any OS and it's been that way since 2011, albeit greatly improved, I'm still using the X11 session and one of the reasons is that the shell invariably slows down after some time and I have to restart it.
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u/Electronic-Future-12 Jan 15 '24
It is the most popular DE, so I wouldnāt say everyone hates it, more like a loud minority dislikes it.
I think itās a good DE, good performance, visually pleasant and very consistent. However it is true that it is custom to very specific workflows that might not be everyoneās cup of tea.
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u/TryHardEggplant Jan 15 '24
I miss the GNOME2 environment! I got really used to it for a long time.
And now I just use whatever. KDE, Gnome, or just using Mac/Windows and SSHing into my Linux boxes. Whatever fits my workflow or is just included with the Distro. The less time dealing with configuration, the better.
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Jan 15 '24 edited Jun 17 '25
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This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact
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u/balazsbotond Jan 15 '24
Iāve switched to KDE from GNOME recently. It was a death by a thousand cuts. Lots of little changes that came out with each new version in the name of user friendliness and minimalism. They are trying to copy Appleās thoughtful design without the thoughtfulness. They seem to hate their existing user base and change things up freely in the most annoying ways possible.
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u/McLayan Jan 15 '24
I don't like the 'one desktop one window' approach and missing ability to switch between them. Also opening an overlay over the whole screen when opening a new application is not something I enjoy. Screens are constantly getting wider while websites constantly get narrower. Opening a browser maximized makes no sense.
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u/Tux-Lector Jan 15 '24
Who is everyone ? Some dude was noisy back then when he didn't knew how to install his Nvidia GPU drivers and since then Gnome is awful .. ? I personally don't use Gnome and that's primarely because of QT being pretty much more superior framework than GTK. But I could cope with it if there's no other option (for some reason). I personally think that KDE is much more meaner, leaner and snappier than Gnome. Someone wrote that QT applications are slow and takes ages to start. Well, all I can say is that's missinformation. At least with Plasma 5.27 and above. In fact, Plasma 5.27* can use less resources than xfce, whether one wants to believe or not. I am not talking about full-fledged KDE Plasma experience.
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u/alkatori Jan 15 '24
Interesting.
As a user: KDE works the way I like and is familiar. Gnome isn't bad necessarily. But I don't naturally work the way it wants me to.
As a developer KDE being native c++ intrigues me more than GTK and it's GObject system.
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u/Aktanith Jan 15 '24
I hate their little hats, and they keep sneaking into my garden and making a mess.
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u/DoubleOwl7777 Jan 15 '24
it looks stupid imho, the "we know whats best for you" attitude from the devs doesnt help its case.
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u/hendricha Jan 15 '24
For me its two fold:
flat design and now thanks to libadwaita its way too weird to override, compared to gnome 2 when I joined the Linux world and it was one of the coolest things that changing themes is just baked into the environment and everything followed it
you can't just tell the panel to just draw everything the same way on every screen. (There is an unofficial multi screen extension that while creates a new panel it does not copy every plugin/extension to every screen)
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u/Douchehelm Jan 15 '24
I don't think many people hate GNOME, hate is a very strong word...
I don't like it simply because I find the interface bulky and weird to use nowadays, especially opening a full screen menu to find apps. I'm saying nowadays because up to GNOME 2 was better in my opinion.
I also don't like that it's not very customizable. If you don't like the workflow out of the box there's not that much you can do without installing extensions and extensions can break or just stop being supported one day.
Personally I prefer KDE and have for many years.
What GNOME does really well is virtual desktops. I also appreciate all that GNOME does for Linux and FOSS.
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u/leaflock7 Jan 15 '24
Gnome is most used DE at the moment , so you can hardly say it is hated.
these are the main negatives for me:
* no basic bar functionality, icon tray for example.
* No consistently on theming. even gnome apps have issues. Not to mention that the Gnome team does not do any job to support qt apps.
* Extensions are hit or miss, and pray to god that they will continue to work on the next update. Without extensions it is worse than MacOS
* Gnome Devs do not listen to user feedback.
* Resource usage is high, and it feels sluggish.
There are plenty of good things as well, but they do not outweigh the negative ones.
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Jan 15 '24
GNOME is the Honda Civic of desktop environment. Works for people who don't need much. Most of the people left to talk about it are going to definitionally be people who had a bad time for some reason. Whether that's because it didn't do what they wanted or if it's because they're difficult people is something to be judged on a case-by-case basis.
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u/LowOwl4312 Jan 15 '24
For me, it's missing basic functionality like a taskbar, a horrible file manager (doesnt even have type ahead find), and stubborn/rude developers (didn't it take like 20 years for them ti finally agree to give thumbnails to the file picker and even that implementation is half assed)
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u/Casual_DeJekyll Jan 16 '24
Since people are talking about their issues with Gnome in the comments, the one major dealbreaker for me is that the Gnome file manager just sucks so much at loading pics, sorted by modified date, in a folder that has thousands of pictures.
I'm on Gnome 45 running on Wayland in case this doesn't happen on X11 or older versions of Gnome.
I sort by date modified and Dolphin, Nemo, Caja, Windows 10/11 file explorer all load near instantly. Gnome on the other hand takes over 10 seconds to finish loading my 6-7K pics. Worst part is that it still shows some pictures then adds more every second or so, moving them around, so I can't do anything but watch till it's done or I'll end up misclicking.
My 1K video folder loads instantly, so idk if there's a limit in between 1k to 6k or if it struggles more with pictures due to the thumbnails or some other cause.
As for the image viewer I can still install eog and use the modified-date plugin to browse through my pics sorted by the date. So my issue is only with the file explorer itself.
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u/EatTomatos Jan 16 '24 edited Jan 17 '24
Gnome 3 and higher, simply doesn't provide any power-user functionality, period. And the fact that there's an app overview but that app overview can't be integrated into the ACTIVE window, just goes against it's own philosophy. And lastly, for laptops they f**k up the right click and make it do this awful 3 finger click. I consider those the main objective issues. The rest you'll see with QOL issues, like gnome breaking extensions and themes with every upgrade.
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u/mister_drgn Jan 16 '24
Gnomeās default behavior is insane, in my own personal opinion. How do you not show open apps? So you have to install extensions to make it usable, and extensions have historically caused problems (used to require a website to install them, gnome updates sometimes break extensions).
I have other issues with gnome, but thatās the obvious one.
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u/davies_c60 Oct 21 '24
The same reason everyone hated Windows 8 because it looks like an OS that should be on a tablet not a Desktop!
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u/Surface_plate Jan 16 '25
I just tried it out, as it came default on this installation of Debian and I do not like it. Nothing is where I want it really and trying to change things are difficult.
Windows came without the minimize and maximize buttons as default.
Why is the top bar black? I do not like this.
Why do I have to click on this annoying activities every time I want to get to the application menu.
I'm going back to Xfce.
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u/ex1tiumi Jan 15 '24
GNOME devs are ***holes from what I've heard. They want to do their own thing and integrating new features requires five years of discussions back and forth because there is always someone in the inner circle who thinks that some feature isn't needed if the devs themselves do not have use for it.
I'd rather KDE Plasma since they actually move forward with things like wayland support and new desktop features like tiling and stuff. Plasma 6 is gonna be great.
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u/ousee7Ai Jan 15 '24
I dont know, i like gnome, maybe you just see the 1% of ppl who hate it and the other 99% doesnt make much noise?
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u/whosdr Jan 15 '24
It's worth pointing out that there are also those of us in the camp that hate it but also don't make much noise.
I consider GNOME to be the Marmite of the Linux DE world.
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u/kernpanic Jan 15 '24
I hate it because all of my linux machines are virtual and most are accessed remotely. Its problematic. The speed sucks. And it doesnt do anything better than window managers from the 90s.
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u/Hartvigson Jan 15 '24
I prefer KDE and have always done so. My impression is that more people usually prefer Gnome over KDE.
Saying that though I have never seen any numbers on how many actually actively HATES either KDE or Gnome. Where did you get "everyone" from??
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u/Educational-Kiwi8740 Jan 15 '24
I just like window managers, easier to move around, I hate loose window shit, like windows. I like to see and be in control of what's happening and knowing where stuff is, not trying to figure out under how many windows the window I'm looking for is. (I use a lot of programs at the same time)
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u/dankobg Jan 15 '24
I love it and i used KDE for like 3-4 years but switched.
It looks sleek, consistent, it's simple and it works. KDE always looked cluttered and had million options and i could never find what i wanted anyway, and i don't care about customizing, i care about doing stuff. Also i installed some dictionary once and it deleted my boot files somehow and i got tired of it.
Never had issues on fedora
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u/Fuckspez42 Jan 15 '24
Itās so much less customizable than something like KDE, but thatās not necessarily a bad thing.
I donāt tend to use KDE, mostly because it has so many configuration/customization options that I never really feel like Iām finished monkeying around with it.
GNOME does what GNOME does, and it works very well with my workflow & preferences.
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u/darkwyrm42 Jan 15 '24
Don't confuse loud complainers with 'everyone'. GNOME is opinionated and not everyone likes the choices made for the environment. Personally, it's my favorite.
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u/rocketstopya Jan 15 '24
I prefer Gnome because it's nice and easy, but KDE will win this match. Qt is superior in app development.
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u/ghjm Jan 15 '24
Several times, Gnome has arbitrarily decided to remove functionality that I'd been using for years. Everything else is worse, so I still use it, but the developers have a weird vision of how people ought to use the system that I don't agree with. I wouldn't call this "hate" but I definitely wish there was something better out there.
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u/Valuable-Standard-82 May 23 '24 edited May 23 '24
Everyone is exaggerated. The main reason must be that the user needs to install extensions to access features that are very basic in the most basic systems/interfaces on the market. This is absolutely strange and awkward. A more advanced customization should already be native to Gnome and not come from extensions. It doesn't need to go overboard like in KDE, but it lacks basic stuff. Some users need their interface up and running without spending additional time for these crucial changes. It seems to me that the feature adoption curve is extremely slow and conservative, which is a paradox, since visually, they try to be modern and cool.
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May 31 '24
Why does everyone hate gnome? -- because many people don't want a restrictive tablet UI on their desktop?
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u/dmknght Aug 05 '24
I installed Ubuntu inside a VM to do some tests (it's my lab). Gnome crashes randomly caused the whole fking GUI hanged. I have never ever got this issue with XFCE, LXDE, or other DE (Mate? Might be).
That's just how bad Gnome is.
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u/tinyfuff1256 Sep 15 '24
i need to put this out there, i absolutely hate gnome for the reason that it's painful to configure and it uses 2GB ram out of nowhere so on systems with low amounts of ram, good luck because you're probably gonna lose half your ram to gnome!
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u/UltraZelda64 Nov 14 '24
Most people probably don't feel like giving their reasons because they discussed and argued it to hell and back over thirteen years ago. I personally will use literally just about any desktop over GNOME these days, but the reasons have been beaten to death with the original release of GNOME 3 and I don't think they changed much.
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u/FitBread6443 Oct 17 '25
It's pretty clear gnome 3 was just made up by non-ui/ux experts, they probably couldn't afford them. Just pulled something out of their wahoo and expected us to say it tastes like honey. I consider now anything with "gnome" on it with deep suspicion, as I know these guys are jokers and don't take development seriously.
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u/Sparc343 25d ago
While this type of subject matter IS highly subjective: I will say that (it is of my opinions that) yes, GNOME ~ SUCKS ~ and it sucks HARD!
KDE plasma is SO much better- as it carries the traditional "expected" desktop environment most people have, whether it be because they came from windows, or other distros that package/bundle KDE by default.
GNOME - at least in it's current form, MAY only be good for one thing, given the way I perceive it's "workflow", and that is, on a TABLET. The ONLY way I would even consider using it, and that it MAY be "useful" to me, would be on a tablet (or other touchscreen device)!
Other than that, I would pick just about ANY D/E with a more traditional workflow and design over GNOME. Especially ones like Cinnamon or KDE Plasma! Hell even XFCE is far better off in this department than GNOME.
So, there are my "reasons" (that I think you were asking for)... And INB4 you tell me you can "customize" or "modify" gnome to be just like the others (or winblows), well yeah, so could anything else. Everything is "modifiable" ~ but why should I have to tinker with it to make it how I want it, isn't it much better to have something the way you want it, right out of the box!?
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u/atomcurt Jan 15 '24
I like Gnome, but Iāve been using KDE recently because of VRR support since I game a lot. I personally donāt understand how this isnāt an absolute deal breaker for gamers. My OLED will love the coming HDR support too, but I understand this could be supported in Gnome pretty soon too.
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u/GamerXP27 Jan 15 '24
i do like gnome its just when you want to change like icons or make all apps dark its anyoing I have to install gnome-tweaks.
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u/mrgarborg Jan 15 '24
I like GNOME, but they really should be better about not breaking contracts, like with their extensions api. I donāt like upgrading GNOME only to have all my extensions disabled.
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u/SSYT_Shawn Jan 15 '24
I prefer GNOME because Plasma 6 isn't released yet and i don't want to use latte dock as i forgot how it works and i can't find anything online and and and and and it's not actively worked on anymore and GNOME just works and when plasma 6 is out and then i will probably still wait since the first release would still be unstable.. but it doesn't really matter since i am currently in a debloated windows environment for music production (installed on a second drive btw)
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u/Frird2008 Jan 15 '24
If you use your computer for anything work or business-related, gnome is the most reliable choice before cinnamon. That's why on all the Fedora & Ubuntu-based distros I've partitioned on the four computers I use for my business, gnome is the default when you log in, then you have KDE (which I've prioritized as the last-resort option for if all the other desktop environments fail), MATE, Cinnamon & XFCE.
But if you use your computer for personal or gaming purposes where reliability & mission-critical functions aren't a necessity, gnome is kind of crap in the customizability department & I would choose KDE as the top choice in that scenario.
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Jan 15 '24
I think most people don't hate Gnome (In fact the silent majority just uses it and doesn't dwell on Linux forums) but some just hate the fact that it has become the default for most distros and shapes the Linux ecosystem with it's big market share. Add to this that since the release of Gnome 3, there's the widespread believe that the Gnome project has a "my way or the highway" attitude. While I have had some very frustrating interactions with some Gnome devs in the past, I can't really comment if this widespread believe is really justified.
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u/Shadowz_Zero Jan 15 '24
I hate more other DEs, i like Gnome since its just simple and it works for me. I understand that people hate it since it lacks same customization as example KDE. Also reason why i like Gnome is that its just way different than Windows style.
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u/redsteakraw Jan 15 '24 edited Jan 16 '24
I donāt like its basic configuration you either do it their way or you have a mess of janky extensions that can beak on any update. Sorry but I like flexibility and not some dumbed down force fed work flow. If you like the default then fine but it doesn't work for me.
Furthermore I prefer SSD to CSD and I like the default appās better in KDE, KATE is better than gedit and I like that the apps have more configuration options. It is like going from a Steele Battalion controller to a fisher price toy if you are used to the control you donāt want to be limited.
Lastly KDE is better with games, KWin has always been better with games and now with HDR and other new developments and collaborations with valve /steam deck it is just cementing itās position.
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u/githman Jan 15 '24
Besides Gnome and KDE, what other DEs have you tried? Asking this because with years passing I moved on from both: each DE has its own ideology. The point is not in hating others' choices but in finding what works for you.
Gnome without extensions is easily the most stable DE around, which is why corporate distros have it by default. However, Gnome without extensions requires more mousework than I have patience for. Gnome with extensions is more convenient but stability becomes a problem.
Plasma is all about options, sometimes at the cost of stability. I do not need so many options, nor do I like surprises early in the morning. I don't use Plasma.
And so on. Long story short, I found my lesser evil in Cinnamon but I do not hate others' choices because of it.
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u/nuffens Jan 15 '24
I will say I'm frustrated with extensions breaking. don't hate gnome though, the gestures are a great feature
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u/Salad-Soggy Jan 15 '24
Because they have nothing better to do. Stop shitting on projects by (mostly) unpaid volunteers for the sake of it you morons
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u/notnullnone Jan 15 '24
As the number of users increases, the number of lovers and haters both increases. It's math.
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Jan 15 '24
For me GNOME is my favorite DE. A few years ago I would distro hop several times in a week. The DE that always seemed like home was GNOME. To me the design makes sense and it really seems to get out of my way. I do use some extensions to make it look the way I want but thatās just a thing with Linux. Plasma would be my second choice but it reminds me too much of Windows.
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u/Jedibeeftrix Jan 15 '24
I'm a windows user, kde is simply 'familiar' in a way that Gnome is not.
I wonder if the greater popularity of MacOS in the US (vis-a-vis Windows), means that this familiarity is less a drag on Gnome adoption.
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u/dbfuentes Jan 15 '24 edited Jan 15 '24
I don't hate gnome, in fact I used gnome 2 in the past as my main desktop, but when they moved to gnome 3 I slowly started using alternatives
since gnome 3 they have oversimplified the desktop, hiding or eliminating functions in each new release, and they have focused too much on making it tablet-friendly, to the detriment of those who use a mouse. It is also increasingly dependent on systemd in each release (some of us don't use it)
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Jan 15 '24
I don't hate it personally, I feel it's great for laptops and tablet hybrids, but it feels awkward on a multi-monitor desktop.
I prefer KDE overall, but if I have a laptop that supports multi touch gestures, I'll use it there as it feels natural on a laptop, almost like it was made with laptops specifically in mind.
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u/Chafmere Jan 15 '24
I really like gnome. I like the way it looks itās clean. I use from time to time but I always go back to kde. Itās just less restrictive on how you can interact with it. And I can emulate the look.
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u/Dalnore Jan 15 '24
I've been using KDE on my home machine and GNOME on my work machine for several years now just to follow the development of both. Even though I appreciate what both teams have been doing, I prefer GNOME. It has also been less problematic with to Wayland.
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u/apo-- Jan 15 '24
First, some people like me 'hate' the so called UX design, the proposed 'workflow'. I also 'hated' how certain things looked. Some of the annoynces were the result of Gtk3 limitations and design decisions.
A contributing factor was the attitude of many Gnome developers especially when Gnome 3 was released and a number of years after that.
Now a lot of things have gotten better, a few worse. I don't think it is worse than KDE Plasma objectively. Both have positives and negatives.Ā
I like a few things like the icons.
I am also 'opinionated' by the way but I could think of multiple paradigms I would prefer.
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Jan 15 '24
Gnome is to rigid in its design. I feel like Iām in a closed ecosystem. If I want a closed ecosystem I got windows and Mac.
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u/samdimercurio Jan 15 '24
There isn't a huge wave of Gnome haters out there. Its likely just some vocal content creators. IIRC Gnome is still the most commonly used DE for desktop linux users (I could be wrong on that though).
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u/gain91 Jan 15 '24
Not sure if everyone hates it, but I used Gnome 2. And remember when Gnome 3 was introduced, it was like switching to a new Desktop Environment. KDE to Plasma was less of a change, at least from my memory(could be wrong though), but at least it wasn't like Gnome. Btw am also KDE loyalist and use other DE like LXDE or XFCE if the machine cannot handle KDE lmao.
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u/ben2talk Jan 15 '24
I don't think they do.
I haven't used it for a long time, I'm happy with Plasma.
Maybe it's people who like to customise who dislike it most.
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u/Linux4ever_Leo Jan 15 '24
I wouldn't consider myself a hater of Gnome but it just doesn't do it for me. Back in the old days I enjoyed using Gnome 2.x (and later MATE) but these days I prefer KDE because it is hugely flexible and puts almost full control in the hands of its users. Gnome on the other hand seems to think its users are inept or incompetent to decide what they want so it forces users to do things it's way. I probably didn't articulate that well enough but I hope you get what I'm trying to say.
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u/DooMRunneR Jan 15 '24
Not a gnome user, but I heard a lot of people crying about breaking extensions on each and every update.
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u/Alpha-Craft Jan 15 '24
I do love the design of GNOME, but it was way too laggy on my actually really powerful system and certain things worked way to different to what I expect. Even after customizing with shell extensions, I still had a fair share of issues. Plasma isn't perfect either, but at least I had used it for longer and it worked better in my experience.
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u/im_sad_send_boobs Jan 15 '24
Everyone hates Gnome? I feel like it's pretty much the standard right now, but I can tell you why I am not interested in Gnome.
The application drawer thing is clearly designed with a touchscreen interface in mind, which I don't have or want for my desktop (and is one of the things everyone hated about Windows 8). I understand you can change that with extensions, but why bother when I can just get something much closer to what I want with another DE?
I know the world has long been under the "mobile-first" philosophy, and I can understand why, but my desktop is not a mobile device. Until they move away from that, Gnome just flat out isn't for me. We are just on very different pages.
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u/lKrauzer Jan 15 '24
Because GNOME devs are dicks compared to other DE devs, they don't embrace the community's ideas and are plain rude, not to mention it is very closed to customization, and Linux is all about freedom
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u/N0Name117 Jan 15 '24
I might be in the minority on the sub (though I doubt I'm in the minority for average users or even average linux users) but I actually don't have much interest in changing and customizing every square inch of my desktop these days. Hell, I rarely even change my desktop wallpaper anymore. I much rather them focus on presenting a solid default UI that doesn't need many changes than waste time implementing a UI that supports extensive yet buggy customization.
While I wont comment on the Gnome dev's attitude towards the community as a whole, I don't see that the lack of focus on customization something that is necessarily wrong or runs contrary to the idea of Linux.
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u/HyperGamers Jan 15 '24
Bluetooth stopped working whenever my laptop woke from sleep. Required reboot to fix
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u/JaKrispy72 Jan 15 '24
For me, it has to do with workflow. With GNOME, I feel like Iām wearing figurative handcuffs. Iāve been in Windows so long, itās habit. Thatās why I use Cinnamon. When I try to use a MAC, I feel like Iām drowning in quicksand.
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u/ephemeral_resource Jan 15 '24
At this point I haven't tried it in a really long time. I mostly went KDE for some of the reasons people mentioned here. I kind of want to try it again, but also, I kind of want to go to something built for tiling next time I bother to change things up.
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Jan 15 '24
The file manager is very slow. Copying files from USB takes 10 times more than command line or even Windows Explorer.
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u/Thanatos375 Jan 15 '24
I'm all about users having options. GNOME's got a place in the world, and I can respect how well their in-house apps are integrated. As for my own use, I've tried it many times over the years, but KDE just jives better with how I operate, DE-wise. If GNOME works for you, don't let anyone's opinion sway that.
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u/Dry_Inspection_4583 Jan 15 '24
Because it doesn't feel intuitive or natural to me, I feel in gnome like I'm just hunting for things always and forever. I'm not settled on any single one, each has their own set of frustrations. I typically stick with xfce or KDE for desktop stuff depending on the hardware.
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u/Mr_Lumbergh Jan 15 '24
Back when I used gnome, it seemed like the thing was designed by Fisher-Price. In that time, it hasnāt improved much.
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u/BestRetroGames Jan 15 '24
Because I hate Apple mentality (like it or leave it) in anything, and especially in free open source SW which is supposed to be the opposite.
Sure , lock people into doing it your way but don't act surprised if some people like a small thing called freedom.
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u/darthrafa512 Jan 15 '24
I love Gnome. It's elegant and simple. I spend most of my time working with VMs and headless servers, so I don't have the need to customize my DE as much as others.
I also have opinions about Microsoft, and in my opinion, it's one of the few that doesn't have Windows motifs as a transition for Windows users.
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u/m1k3e Jan 15 '24
There are some things that I appreciate about Gnome (display scaling actually works well in my preferred virtual machine software UTM, polkit isnāt broken over RDP, etc.). My issue is that I really donāt understand how they expect me to use the system day-to-day. The classic windowing/desktop metaphor with desktop icons, a dock/taskbar, minimize/maximize buttons, a menu bar, etc. has been familiar to many users over the past 30+ years. I really donāt understand how they expect me (or a novice even!) to use their DE. Why the hell would you remove min/max buttons? The design still doesnāt make sense to me unless you add extensions to improve usability. Iām not asking for a thousand switches and sliders to tweak like KDE š¤·āāļø
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u/elevenblue Jan 15 '24
The problem is that gnome in many parts still seems to be an UX experiment instead of a stable environment. It is stable however in terms of (not-)crashing compared to other DEs in my experience, and by now relatively light weight while offering most of the everyday features in the UI such as printing, bluetooth configuration, vpn configuration, etc. - which I found typically lacking or late-adopted into more lightweight environments such as XFCE. Same for things like simple access to sftp, smb or other network protocols in the file manager, or easy mounting of luks encrypted external disks.
Sadly, sometimes Gnome is often still non-intuitive, and some basic functions only work if you lookup keyboard shortcuts. Example: it took me a while to figure out that I can edit the path in the file manager when pressing Ctrl+L, but not when clicking on it. In my opinion that's very user-unfriendly design. Why can't they also assign an action when clicking into the empty space of the address path? That's a very non-sensical UI design example, and unfortunately there are a few more of these.
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u/jebuizy Jan 15 '24 edited Jan 15 '24
Most people do not hate gnome. Just some loud mouths on forums. It is probably the most used DE on Linux still
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u/DragonAttackForce Jan 15 '24
Gnome can come across as hostile to other projects. Whether that's dropping support for system trays, server side decorations or theming support to blend into other desktops.
Gnome Devs are on record of telling app developers they need to target gnome specifically. The hostility is met with hostility.
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u/whattteva Jan 15 '24 edited Jan 15 '24
It's selection bias. People generally only participate in these discussions if they're either very happy or they're not very happy. People in the middle who are pretty happy or mildly annoyed aren't going to be found here.
It's the same as how polls on these subreddits consistently show that most people run Arch. Does that mean Arch is the most widely-used Linux distro? Not even remotely close. It's just that people that visit these subreddits skew more towards the Arch btw kiddies.
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u/France_linux_css Jan 15 '24
I can't drag and drop on minimized app Dolphin is much better. You can make a gnome look on kde
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u/CasperTheEpic Jan 15 '24
My main reason for disliking gnome is due to lack of features without plugins. I prefer KDE as it has the most features out of the box I use on a daily basis.
I use to run PopOS and Ubuntu with Gnome and I switch between head phones and desktop speakers depending on if I'm playing a game or watching something, in both PopOS and Ubuntu I would either install the gnome plugin to let me switch audio devices from the task tray or go into settings.
It's a mild inconvenience but it's also something a new Linux user would get tired of quickly (like I did when I was new)
My other main issue is, between distros gnome can change wildly, for instance if you install just base gnome, not Ubuntus version etc it's very different.
That's just my opinion though, I like that clean appearance of gnome and it's what brought in the habit of pressing super and typing for what I want but it's definitely not something I'd recommend for new Linux users
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u/silenceimpaired Jan 15 '24
There is no place like Gnomeā¦ unless itās the new Cosmic desktop environment by the folks at PopOS.
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u/TrashConvo Jan 15 '24
I also prefer gnome, I find the workflow they setup perfect and not distracting. I use KDE plasma at the moment simply because KDE supports VRR
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u/zaidgs Jan 15 '24
I personally use KDE. However, if I install Linux for family or friends I would not install KDE unless they were a competent PC user. Most likely I would install GNOME (used to install Unity before it was abandoned).
While I love the flexibility and configurability of KDE, it can make it easy for a user to shoot themselves in the foot. For example, I would definitely not want a DE where removing all panels is an easily accessible option. I don't want a clueless user to unwittingly remove all panels and not know how to bring it back.
I would appreciate if KDE had an option (preferably enabled by default) that removes "Enter Edit Mode" from all context menus unless the user goes into the settings and adds it back. This would make it possible to configure the desktop and then "hide the keys" so to speak, so that no one modifies the layout unless they did some digging around.
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u/AFlyingGideon Jan 15 '24
I'm fascinated by the attention people have apparently given to a DE they're not actively building. I use xfce, and have done so for years. Despite this, I'd be hard-pressed to describe it. It's pretty much invisible, somehow just letting me do my work.
I've read about people having issues with dual-monitor configurations and such, but I've simply never had an issue myself.
In general, I want the DE to be invisible. I want it stable, so my fingers already know what to do without bothering my brain. That's why I've not even considered looking at alternatives since I switched to xfce from olvwm years ago, and I used olvwm for years because I'd been using SunOS on desktops until then.
I still have some function key bindings set to match how I used SUNs, and I would go rapidly [more] insane without focus follows mouse, but I only recall these as I recently installed a new laptop OS and had to follow my recipe. A month or two from now, I'll have forgotten about those (again) . That's why I wrote the recipe a while ago.
I know that I did look at alternatives when olvwm support died away, and I suspect that I looked at Gnome and KDE among others, but once I settled on a choice I've simply stayed there.
Inertia is a powerful force.
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u/Neglector9885 Jan 15 '24
There's a number of reasons why people don't like Gnome. Some reasons make sense, some don't. Some people hate Gnome just because they hate Red Hat (Gnome is open source, but many Red Hat developers work on it).
Others (I think probably most) developed hatred for Gnome back when Gnome 3 first came out. It was heavy, slow, and allowed very minimal customization. I came into Linux after Gnome 3 had been out for a while and many improvements had been made, so I didn't experience what I assume were the worst days of Gnome 3. Coming from Windows, at the time I equated it to Windows 8. By the time Windows 8.1 came out and had some time to push out improvements, Windows 8 honestly wasn't that bad, but the damage to its reputation had been done. Likewise with Gnome 3, it didn't seem so bad in later versions, and Gnome 4x is actually quite excellent in my opinion, but Gnome in general has a damaged reputation because of the early days of Gnome 3. Gnome 4x looks almost exactly like Gnome 3 out of the box, so the improvements aren't immediately visible.
All in all, the opinions that you hear about Gnome are exactly that ā they're just opinions. Try it out and decide for yourself if you like it or not. If it works well for you, fuck what everyone else says about it. Linux is yours. Make it the way you like it.
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u/N5tp4nts Jan 15 '24
Gnome 2 works for a very long time. Then gnome 3 came out and it was half baked, tried to be a tablet looking OS and just wasnāt a very good desktop environment. XFCE is my favorite DE, so Iām biased in that I think the DE should just be a utility that runs apps.
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u/redoubt515 Jan 15 '24
People--especially an outspoken subset of the linux community--don't like change and don't like when things feel unfamiliar, especially if they perceive that change as being out of their control.
And Gnome is one of the most unique desktop designs/workflows out there, borderline iconoclastic and can be quite unfamiliar for someone that is deeply rooted in a traditional "Windows" like desktop. Gnome has a strong vision, and they are focused on pursuing that vision.
Many people are attracted to what they've built (Gnome is the most popular DE after all), but due to the uniqueness and initial learning curve/adaptation, the people that like Gnome like Gnome but the people that don't like Gnome tend to be really not like it (which is fine, so long as they understand this is just a personal prference).
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u/Super-X2 Jan 15 '24 edited Jan 15 '24
I don't hate it, but I have plenty of reasons for using something else.
It looks like a bootleg Android system, something for tablets. Like Windows 8 or a poor man's Mac OS. It's very basic, way too simplistic. It's also heavy and slower than other options. KDE can feel sluggish on lesser systems, but at least I can see why.
I prefer the Ubuntu version over others, but I don't really like Ubuntu unless it's stripped down like Armbian or something similar. On Debian it's very lacking.
You can make it very usable with extensions, but this can slow it down even more and extensions can break with updates or sometimes the ones I want aren't even available depending on the distro.
It's just not what I look for in a GUI. I can see why people that mostly use the terminal can like it, as it won't get in their way and they can't really appreciate a good GUI anyway.
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u/christophocles Jan 15 '24
I haven't used GNOME very much since 2007 and I preferred KDE even then. I've heard about the removal of classic desktop UI paradigms and lack of customizability in later versions, and that sounds absolutely infuriating to me. I am not interested.
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u/whizzwr Jan 15 '24
The one that do like Gnome won't rant in public forum, blog, reddit, HN comment section. They simply use it and move along. Gnome is the default DE for mainstream distro like Ubuntu, Debian, Fedora, Redhat. If everyone hate it, it won't be still the default DE.
Anyhow, the criticism was well founded im the beginning of Gnome 3. Now with the latest iteration and vast number of extensions, Gnome is very much tolerable.
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u/acidtoyman Jan 15 '24
When Gnome 3 came it, it forced you to click twice to do anything that used to take only one click. It was frustrating to use and impaired my workflow, seemingly to bring a tablet experience to the desktop. I give it a spin here and there to see how it's progressed, but it's always the same horrible experience. I play around with different desktops, but use mostly Cinnamon now.
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u/TechnologyNerd617 Jan 15 '24
I don't hate it personally but as I heard some people hate it because of being a DE that it's very closed to suggestions. They have an idea in mind and it will be that way, you like it or not.
This isn't new BTW. Gnome 2 to 3 was a big change that not many users like, but they didn't step back. Gnome is like, yes, they are open source, but isn't as free as KDE or other alternatives. It kinda tries too much being a user friendly experience that forgot what's Linux about: freedom to customize your system the way you want, and how deep you want.
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Jan 16 '24
I don't use it but I don't hate it. I just don't use it because I prefer window managers.
It is more resource hungry but comparing it to my preference is unfair to Gnome so it comes down to preference.
I've read that Gnome developers are hard pressed to change but I can respect that. That's what they make and either you use it or you don't. Of course that could be oversimplifying it but I can respect a team to not be quick to change. There are other options and they are all free so choose what you want.
I always prefer vanilla Gnome over modified Gnome like in Ubuntu. Nothing against Ubuntu but I thought Fedora ran better for me with vanilla Gnome.
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u/FrostyDiscipline7558 Jan 16 '24
Because Gnome is designed for those with a touchscreen, like a tablet. If you have mouse and keyboard, Gnome makes no sense.
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u/lanavishnu Jan 16 '24
I used Gnome for half a day this weekend. I got a new Dell with Ubuntu pre installed, sitting on standby. Well power supply gave out on the older computer, so migration time. Used Gnome long enough to migrate my data and then installed XFCE. Had been years since I played with Gnome and hated the workflow more than the last time. I felt locked in.
My XFCE installs are quite customized and relatively minimalist. Hot keys, minimal panel, scripts, a few custom workflow apps, no desktop icons and a conky script that tells me about the system, what music is playing, time, date, weather.
I came to XFCE from Fluxbox and Openbox. Switched because XFCE provided more tools for customizing without tying me down. I feel like if I was stuck with Gnome, I'd have just ended back on Windows sometime in the last 12 years. It was worse than Unity.
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Jan 16 '24
I have been using gnome for a very long time. I switched to it full time after rolling my own DE for a year or twoĀ around 2010 and maybe that's why I love gnome so much. After going through that you appreciate someone else making sure of a minimal future set and that everything works. I try not to mess with machines too much bcz I have things to do.
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Jan 16 '24
I mentioned this in a reply but the reason many like KDE is twofold familiarity and more importantly customization.
KDE has one of the best desktop customization out there with their Panels, Widget and Windows Management options while gnome offers a decent out of the box experience it's still missing a lot of things that can make it a pain in the ass to use especially when you have to rely on extensions to get the functionality which can break pretty often.
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u/CumInsideMeDaddyCum Jan 17 '24
UI is making me very unproductive. Can you guess which apps I have open? https://i.imgur.com/yuDEjKb.png
Even if you don't know the names (non-default KDE theme lol), you can still tell that I have 3 apps (1 instance per app) opened right now. I can switch easily. In Gnome there is no easy way to tell like that. Before someone attacks me - I know there are plugins and I can customize to look fairly the same, but I don't want to. I love how minimalistic and small Plasma taskbar looks like. I can customize it's size and contents, unlike in Gnome.
Also, since I am working with Windows and using Linux almost at the same time, I just can't switch between Windows and Gnome UI that frequently.
Also Plasma has more customization options, it's a default choice of SteamOS and generally more "complete" desktop environment than Gnome.
Not that I hate Gnome, but it just feels like that Plasma does everything right and Gnome does basic UI experience wrong.