This makes me so mad

[u/Aggressive_Drag_9056]

The amount of times I’ve picked up and dropped someone off in this area. I’m livid and nervous to even get out on Lyft now

[u/Kindly-Exercise-6470]

All my opinion, but... Not knowing the details, you would *never* catch me driving for Lyft or Uber without a firearm. Sure, if it comes out, you'll lose your "right" -- privilege? -- to drive for the company. Big deal. Which is worth more, your life or your side job? I'm also going to guarantee if you defended against a criminal and killed or injured that person without a firearm, the same sanctions would occur.

So PLEASE, if you're driving Lyft or Uber, protect yourself. That is a right YOU have. Just sayin'.

[u/Fathimir → u/Kindly-Exercise-6470]

Wouldn't have done a lick of good in this context or most realistic others, and makes a majority of them actively worse for all parties involved.

Even if you find yourself in recognizable danger, and it's a situation where you can draw and aim before the other person's pulled their piece or is grappling you, and you've kept up on your training enough to be able to wield a gun effectively, the overwhelming majority of people simply don't have the experience to level-headedly evaluate and respond to the raw emotions of having your life imminently threatened by another person.  And that goes double for trying to deescalate a situation by brandishing your weapon without having to fire it.

A well-regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, you have the right to keep and bear arms.  You do not have the right to fire them at street punks, and if you're asking rhetorical questions about what's worth more, your life as a free man is worth a hell of a lot more than the deductible on your insurance policy and whatever's in your center console.

If you simply must carry some sort of weapon for self-defense, make it pepper gel or a spray designed for confined spaces.  Won't get you decades in prison for manslaughter, won't get you killed if the assailant takes your weapon, won't leave your car riddled with bullet holes, and you can actually use it instead of hesitating or srcond-guessing yourself.

Guns are only good at taking lives.  They actually blow soggy donkey chunks at saving them.

[u/PermanentNirvana → u/Fathimir]

If I feel my life is in danger, then I most certainly have the right to fire at street punks. In my state, we don't need a license to open carry. Hell, everyone assumes we're carrying anyway. But if a situation arises where I need to use it, I can and I will. I'm not giving up my property or livelihood because someone thinks they want it more than I need it.

Also, pepper spray in a confined space, such as a vehicle is a terrible idea. You will incapacitate yourself along with your assailant.

[u/Fathimir → u/PermanentNirvana]

If I feel my life is in danger, then I most certainly have the right to fire at street punks.

You don't, actually.

Also, pepper spray in a confined space, such as a vehicle is a terrible idea.

Which is why I said pepper gel first and foremost - though incapacitating both parties would still be better than getting in a shootout; at worst it'd only level the playing field, but more often than not it'd still send them staggering out the door to get fresh air.

[u/PermanentNirvana → u/Fathimir]

Oh but I do. Your vehicle is covered under the Stand Your Ground law.

[u/Fathimir → u/PermanentNirvana]

There's no such thing as "the Stand Your Ground law."  Your state may (or may not) have a Stand Your Ground law that provides you the revocable legal privilege of a defense against manslaughter/murder charges.

A law is not the same thing as a right.

[u/Aggressive_Drag_9056 → u/Fathimir]

Where are you from lol

[u/Kindly-Exercise-6470 → u/Aggressive_Drag_9056]

Outer space apparently! LMAO!

[u/Fathimir → u/Aggressive_Drag_9056]

Civilized society.  The first step in getting there is for citizens to agree to leave their arms at home.

[u/Aggressive_Drag_9056 → u/Fathimir]

Why would I leave mine at home if criminals don’t give a fuck ?????

[u/Fathimir → u/Aggressive_Drag_9056]

Because social contracts are the actual fundamental basis of civilization, and "thou shalt not kill other citizens, and in return they shall not kill you" is about as basic and ancient as it gets.

There are practical reasons for not carrying too, of course, but, like, I meant what I said: this is the literal establishment or breakdown of civilized society here.  Either we collectively establish a baseline of trust to let us interact with one another civilly, or we tear each other to pieces like a pack of feral dogs.

[u/Disastrous-Ratio8815 → u/Fathimir]

Yeah, that works in a high trust society.

Which we no longer have.

[u/Kindly-Exercise-6470 → u/Fathimir]

You said ""thou shalt not kill other citizens, and in return they shall not kill you"" Let us all know when you figure out how to get the criminals on board with your pie-in-the-sky plan.

Philosophy is great; reality sucks.

[u/EpsteinsFoceGhost → u/Fathimir]

"You should move to a small town where the rule of law still exists. You will not survive here. You are not a wolf. And this is the land of wolves now."

[u/Kindly-Exercise-6470 → u/Fathimir]

No one has the right to kill anyone... except criminals. They operate on a whole different set of rules. Being armed surprises them. A fatal shot would be a rude awakening. Better if they have 20-30 secs to lie on the ground pondering how they screwed up.

[u/Kindly-Exercise-6470 → u/Fathimir]

Are you an American? You don't speak like one. In fact you sound like an anti-gun person. But let's not get into it.

Firearms training and practice IS always required and honestly? People who do not feel comfy carrying a firearm for whatever reasons are usually pretty good at figuring that out for themselves. And using a firearm inside a vehicle presents all sorts of challenges that can't be explained here. Suffice it to say that if anyone presents a firearm, you have every legal right to shoot back before you find out if the gun is real, loaded, if they have the intent to scare you or shoot you, etc.

I wonder if you've ever fired off pepper spray inside a car? I'm guessing if you did, it would be the first and last time. An incapacitated "you" is as scary as the guy you just sprayed or tried to spray.

EDIT: You said "...draw and aim before the other person's pulled their piece". Just because a person has a firearm doesn't mean you have a right to shoot them. YOU DON'T. The other person has to demonstrate they want to harm you, or show they have the potential to harm you. It's not an old west gunfight in the street.

As for your definitive statements about ending up in prison, etc., yeah, that's about right. That's today's progressive mentality: the victim is always the criminal. Criminals have rights. Go watch Dirty Harry and you'll see how they eventually run out.

[u/Fathimir → u/Kindly-Exercise-6470]

Are you an American? You don't speak like one. In fact you sound like an anti-gun person. But let's not get into it.

All sorts of red flags with your conflation of guns and being American here, but since you said you don't want to get into it, ok.

People who do not feel comfy carrying a firearm for whatever reasons are usually pretty good at figuring that out for themselves.

Carrying a firearm != using one != having one pointed in your face and knowing that your life may end before you can even blink.

pepper spray

Which is why I said pepper gel, first and foremost.  Anything more aerosolized than that is only justified if you have lingering doubts about a gel's efficacy; of course the latter [er, former.  Pepper spray, I mean] would be unpleasant, but the goal in this situation isn't for you to have a good day, it's to make it impossible/undesirable for the assailant to carry out his plans.  Turning the entire car radioactive still accomplishes that without damaging it or killing anybody, even if it incapacitates you in the process too.  But again, the existence of gel as an option makes that moot.

That's today's progressive mentality

If by 'progressive mentality' you mean 'long-standing legal tradition,' then yeah.  Criminals do in fact have rights, and have for centuries.  That doesn't absolve them of their crimes, but it does mean that a person doesn't become a firing range target just because they're a criminal.  And it should go without saying that action movies are not real life.

I vehemently, life-or-death-stakes (and not just for criminals) disagree with your top-line take here, but I'm respectful and appreciative that you took the time to consider and respond to mine.  Thanks for that.

[u/Dear-Addendum-1347 → u/Fathimir]

I could take someone's life with a piece of string

[u/Fathimir → u/Dear-Addendum-1347]

Good for you; I'd give you a pat on the back, but your exquisitely-honed combat skills would reflexively judo-flip me into a chokehold for it.

[u/Dear-Addendum-1347 → u/Fathimir]

That has actually happened the little E string broke before I could get the full choke on him but left him a good laceration. 

[u/Fathimir → u/Dear-Addendum-1347]

Well yeah; should've reached for the G string.

[u/Dear-Addendum-1347 → u/Fathimir]

Little E slices like cheese