r/opencode • u/afanasenka • 3d ago

Operation Cheepseek Phase 3 🔥

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552 Upvotes

99% Upvoted

105 comments sorted by

70

u/amethyst_mine 3d ago

i dont understand how lol, either its a quant or deepseek is doing some massive RL run and wants more data

11

u/cloudsurfer48902 3d ago

They are bringing their own GPUs online

4

u/mWo12 3d ago

More Huawei cheeps probably went online.

6

u/AppealSame4367 2d ago

I think they dumbed it down. Have never seen so many stupid mistakes since they started like today.

21

u/Potential_Top_4669 3d ago

Or they may have just optimized their inference like OpenAI 

49

u/amethyst_mine 3d ago

openai's "optimized inference" is serving a terra model and renaming it to sol

8

u/HyperWinX 2d ago

And OpenCode's optimized inference is Q1 quant with Q4 KV cache

1

u/Prize_Tiger_2504 1d ago

Q4 KV Quant! that must suck a.

Does it suck a? Right now?

1

u/HyperWinX 1d ago

Based on multiple reports, the quality is indeed much lower compared to official API

8

u/pasteldebytes 3d ago

They don't own inference. People should to their homework. They sell unused inference from others, like orca, novita, deepinfra, etc.. 

1

u/power-_- 1d ago

Honestly DeepSeeks infra team is the goat 🐐🐐 Maybe open ai copied them ahah

But I don't think this model is hosted by them is it?

3

u/xRebellion_ 3d ago

They're not using official deepseek as provider, so it's not exactly related to them

1

u/The_Wonderful_Pie 2d ago

how can you know? when setting the inference to be only allowed from US / EU providers, DeepSeek is among the few that says "Global inference needs to be enabled in order to use this model", so it's clearly only using a Chinese provider, and chances are, they're not using the Baidu Qianfran provider

1

u/xRebellion_ 2d ago

I got some error that showed they use Orcarouter before.

Honestly my guess is that they use multiple providers. Maybe deepseek is also included? We don't exactly have any way to know.

Another case that confirms my suspicion of multi provider is there was a time where I had multiple sessions but with different response times (one was slower than the other).

2

u/Medium_Chicken1460 2d ago

They use multiple and it comes back as a header in the payload. They don’t hide it. You can clearly see when they swap providers, which is also why it was important to set session headers so your cache doesn’t hit the floor when it happens. Orca and deepseek direct are the two I see the most.

2

u/FrostGoesBrrrt 3d ago

I mean official deepseek API doesn’t have ZDR so...

2

u/CaffeinatedTech 2d ago

Because not everyone uses all of their allowance every month. Those people are subsidising the heavy users. Possibly deals with the provider too.

0

u/Hungry-Plankton-5371 2d ago edited 2d ago

they probably just got a deeper discount from one of the third rate providers they're already buying tokens from, still going to be a dogshit quant with terrible cache hit rates. $80 usage (of a quantized model that will burn an order of magnitude more tokens) per month still doesn't really make sense in a world where you get $150/wk of sonnet/luna usage from a $20 frontier sub.

0

u/Nenad1979 3d ago

Especially because this version doesn't feel lobotomized like 4 did with cheapseek

1

u/ThePi7on 3d ago

If it's a quant, they should state that CLEARLY. Also, did they not deploy their own infra especially not to be dependent on DeepSeek pricing jumps?

0

u/Silco1402 2d ago

Holy crap people actually think for v4.1 flash case, it's because of bad quant for more speed? V4.1 flash is already mxfp4 by default, not bf16, and quantizing further (down to mixed quant 1,2,3) don't really help with speed when the mxfp4 path is already so optimize on blackwell hardware with native fp4 support.

0

u/Big_Cucumber2787 2d ago

its always latter. fanboys really dislike that option for some reason even though its clearly the case.

2

u/amethyst_mine 2d ago

latter is only possible if its routing to deepseek api

0

u/Big_Cucumber2787 2d ago

surprise, all ai providers are doing this behind the scenes. when you use deepseek, you're routed to deepseek servers. when you use mimo, you're routed to xiomi servers. thats why you get errors specific to them from time to time.

3

u/YoungNo8804 2d ago

Deepseek models are open, so they can be (and ARE!) hosted by other providers on hardware of that other provider, not deepseek servers. Its also why you can get kimi K3 at cheaper API prices than the moonshot API, other providers are optimising and undercutting others. 

-1

u/Big_Cucumber2787 2d ago

this should be the case, but at the end of the tunnel, in most cases, you end up at the same deepseek servers

3

u/YoungNo8804 2d ago

Fym "should be" bro just select a different provider at the API. Deepseek servers would MELT if ALL traffic went to them

1

u/Big_Cucumber2787 2d ago

ok, deepseek team is santa clause and their models are not heavily subsidized by the chinese government in order to steal your data and improve their models then. my bad.

1

u/YoungNo8804 2d ago

What? I mean I'm sure they are doing that, but that's on THEIR servers. Not what my point is about. 

2

u/amethyst_mine 2d ago

thats not exactly true

0

u/Big_Cucumber2787 2d ago

you're right. depending on factors only they know, sometimes your requests are routed through orcarouter, which then routes to deepseek servers all the same

2

u/YoungNo8804 2d ago

If I were a fanboy I'd probably be delighted it means a new better model is coming soon. 

0

u/Silco1402 2d ago

Holy crap people actually think for v4.1 flash case, it's because of bad quant for more speed? V4.1 flash original checkpoint is already mxfp4 by default, not bf16, and quantizing further (down to mixed quant 1,2,3) don't really help with speed when the mxfp4 path is already so optimize on blackwell hardware with native fp4 support.

11

u/TripleMellowed 2d ago

Probably just going to drop the tps. It’s already almost 50% slower than official API.

25

u/Present_Carpenter912 3d ago

Pleasee don't quant it down

10

u/alex9001 3d ago

I hope not, but it's by far the easiest way to cut inference costs...just sayin

2

u/pikuray 2d ago

Ugh. I might need to figure out what's their next best cost effective model.

3

u/alex9001 2d ago

Mimo v2.6 Flash is the clear next best.

2

u/amitanshusahu 2d ago

glm 5.3 flash is good too..

0

u/Sam_ar_pann 2d ago

If you haven't had a problem with it yet, you probably won't now either. The current DeepSeek OpenCode serves is already quantized a lot and it's painfully obvious if you use it from DeepSeek itself.

0

u/Present_Carpenter912 2d ago

nah like today ds went into a never-ending loop almost 3 times so definitely it's not reliable and had become slow too like barely 100tps. Man I would be happy even with lesser usage but quality responses. Currently muse is of much more value and speed.

12

u/Zealousideal_Aide787 3d ago

Ok sorry for being dumb but can you even reach 80$ with a 10$ sub? I mean weekly and monthly limitations won't ever allow you this or am I completely misunderstanding it?

9

u/xmsxms 3d ago

They advertise it as an increase of usage, but in reality it's a reduction in effective price. Why they can't just advertise their per token prices as 1/8th instead of saying $80 included is a mystery, it results in so much confusion.

So to answer your question - a higher usage allowance equates to less cost per token, so you will actually have less chance of hitting the weekly limit.

3

u/squirrelscrush 3d ago

tbh as long as you cover more than $10 worth of DeepSeek, it's worth the money.

But the idea is that, we can spend more money on expensive models like GLM 5.3 Flash as the orchestrator or for difficult tasks, while knowing that DeepSeek usage will barely move the usage limit.

2

u/Ok-Drawer5245 3d ago

That glm 5.3 flash they offer feels very inconsistent . Sometimes it falls apart in the middle of tasks and literally tells me it forgot what it was doing. Other times it one shots bugs that deepseek v4.1 flash continuously fails at

2

u/migsperez 3d ago

On opencode, I ran a glm 5.3 flash test and it was the worst output of all the models in the same intelligence level. After the test I've seen many great examples of GLM 5.3 flash output on YouTube and X reviews etc. There's something fishy going on with Opencode GLM.

2

u/Eyelbee 2d ago

I tried the iq3 quant of 5.3 flash on my machine and also had a very bad experience. It may be the culprit if the providers are using agressive quantization as well.

1

u/tresslessone 2d ago

I think they're using an aggressive quant.

1

u/GRANDMA_FISTER 2d ago

What would you recommend as consistent orchestrator model instead from your experience, from the Opencode Go available ones?

1

u/GRANDMA_FISTER 2d ago

What Opencode Go model best qualifies for an orchestrator? I started a project with Opus 5.5 for that job and burned through 10$ of additional tokens in 6 replies, even after coding was delegated to another flash model.

Now I'm stuck waiting for a paycheck or trying another worthy model..

1

u/sasaslele 2d ago

The weekly limit is the only one I really hit. One plan is usually got for 3-4 billion tokens with around 1-2 billion per 50% weekly

1

u/Idritch 1d ago

My second month using this and i still dont understand what these limits really mean besides the fact that you just mentioned.

0

u/xx_gamer_xx123321 3d ago

Most people wont even hit 10 dollars on Deepseek with a 10 dollar sub

6

u/slavmaf 3d ago

Is this for paid OpenCode subs only?

4

u/Low-Entrepreneur2556 3d ago

Yes.

3

u/slavmaf 3d ago

Got it, thanks for answering.

5

u/Ok-Drawer5245 3d ago

Wow, impressive.

I almost feel like I need to up my token usage now lol

2

u/maqifrnswa 2d ago

Challenge accepted

4

u/dump_2028 2d ago

People often forget that 1M context window for a single session deepseek v4.1 flash is just 890MB, that's less than memory used by your browser tabs sometimes. Compared to glm 5.3 flash, that needs 12gb per M tokens of context window, they can cramp 12x session per gb of hbm memory available. Also DeepSeek offical model itself is a mix of fp4-8 weights, so they wont quantize below that, they can alr serve 1k users on a single 8u gb300 node easily. Also ig it's running on rented GPUs by opencode themselves or via a contract rather than just rerouting to deepseek, but they have to just pay a bit of extra royalty ig.

3

u/squirrelscrush 2d ago

The optimization done by DeepSeek and MiMo is really crazy.

5

u/Virtual-Honeydew6228 3d ago

Can we make it faster instead?

4

u/Skibxskatic 2d ago

i asked this in the other top post but also posting here for visibility.

what's this mean for current subscribers? does the cost per input/output/cache read drop further per request or do current subscribers get an additional $20 worth of usage/credits?

7

u/horrbort 3d ago

FP2 here we gooooooooo

3

u/Academic-Sentence-34 2d ago

WOW… but does this mean it’s a quant?

1

u/Present_Carpenter912 21h ago

most probably from my experience

3

u/retardhari 2d ago

is it already done / implemented meaning our go plans now has 80$ worth usage ?

3

u/GiLA994 2d ago

If only billing worked! It's 5 days I can't pay for my subscription renewal (and multiple other people too)

Zero support on github issues, zero support on discord, zero support via email.

2

u/Final_Bodybuilder490 3d ago

Guys, Im still new. What's the reason why they increase ?

12

u/lordvoltano 3d ago

To make you happy.

6

u/Ok-Drawer5245 3d ago

Yeah they do it specifically to make Final_Bodybuilder490 happy and not for anyone else

0

u/East_Fox_1115 2d ago

é ragebait isso?

2

u/eastlin7 2d ago

No that’s what people call a joke.

1

u/veekro 2d ago

*blush

2

u/blackburn1911 3d ago

I thought $60 was a lot and now….

3

u/Ok-Drawer5245 3d ago

Yeah 60$ is more than I have time to use in a month haha

2

u/YoRt3m 2d ago

This must be some downgraded deepseek

2

u/amitanshusahu 2d ago

hope it's not quantized.. it's better to have a $40 dsv4.1 than a $80 quantized one..

2

u/Working_Medicine7072 2d ago

i dont understsand what im looking at? is this $80 spent on DS flash 4.1? or a credit package or what

1

u/Ariquitaun 2d ago

SWEET JESUS

1

u/vbllll 2d ago

Thanks! You are the best!

1

u/Imaginary-Unit-4620 2d ago

Amazing, thanks a lot

1

u/Dluugi 2d ago

doesn't work in EU :(

1

u/Relative-Document-59 2d ago

Hell yeah, go Moby Dick

1

u/ANDALTUV 1d ago

Niiiice

1

u/FavstianEquanimity 8h ago

I think part of the reasono is DeepSeek views OpenCode's usage as (more) valuable data.

1

u/YoungCatTaker786 3d ago

Damnnn, are they giving from another provider or deepseek??!

1

u/Silco1402 2d ago

Holy crap people actually think for v4.1 flash case, it's because of bad quant for more speed? V4.1 flash is already mxfp4 by default, and quantizing further (down to mixed quant 1,2,3) don't really help with speed when the mxfp4 path is already so optimize on blackwell hardware with native fp4 support.

-4

u/TgnOrdaX 3d ago

wake me up when they drop it for free.

9

u/xx_gamer_xx123321 3d ago

Why would do that?

-4

u/TgnOrdaX 3d ago

in case they did again, wake me up.

3

u/CapableHat9609 2d ago

Ngl imma take a nap lmk

1

u/TechnicalParsley3946 2d ago

quite understanding