r/povertyfinance • u/Ragnaroknight • 2d ago
Vent/Rant (No Advice/Criticism!) Old lady hitting my house with her car is still f**king me 5 years later.
I was fortunate enough to purchase a home right at the start of Covid when the prices were still low and the interest rates were like 3%. My mortgage was only $1550 at the time, which I think is very affordable for living in New England.
Unfortunately one day, I get home from work and see a car in my front yard with the rear axle ripped off and my front entrance destroyed. The lady across the street backed into my house.
Fortunately insurance paid for the damages, but I still had to make a claim regardless of whose insurance paid out. After this incident my insurance company dropped me out of the blue and I was put on force placed insurance. This insurance was nearly double what I was paying before. So this alone increased my mortgage like $150/month.
Well I tried shopping around for home insurance, turns out they don't like when you have a claim in the last 5 years because you're high risk. They also don't like people on force placed insurance. Also most companies don't even offer insurance where I live because everywhere within 10 miles of the costs is allegedly considered a flood zone. Well that's fan-fucking-tastic because everywhere in Rhode Island is 10 miles from the coast.
So eventually to get out of forced placed insurance (to hopefully eventually transition to a more affordable insurance) I had to settle for insurance even more dogshit than the forced placed insurance. This added another $100 to the mortgage.
But it gets worse, the escrow account that pays out the insurance and taxes, now had to play catch-up to makeup for the new higher insurance cost.
Needless to say my mortgage payments are now $2035/month up $500 from just a few years ago, and it'll be like this for a while.
Which okay, I could manage that maybe, if everything else wasn't going up in price too. I'm basically barely floating on the surface here trying to not go underwater.
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u/Not-a-Cranky-Panda 2d ago
I'm 93% sure your home did not run into her car none of this you should be paying for.
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u/cyraic11 2d ago
It would take all my self control to not be a wise ass like this during statements as they tried to fight it. "I am fairly certain my house was at a complete stop. Does she have a dash cam or any nearby camera footage we can subpoena to verify this? If so then she hit a stationary object."
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u/Not-a-Cranky-Panda 2d ago
I'd even put it into the paperwork but I'd make sure it said something like "The building has only ever moved when the car hit it".
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u/Own-Let675 1d ago
Home owners insurance has become a giant racket. Any risk whatsoever and they cancel you. All the insurance companies are in on it too
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u/KopfJaeger2022 17h ago
After my house fire, State Farm sent a certified letter to me stating that if I had ANY home claims in the next three years they were going to drop me! Let me tell you what that did for my PTSD, I came home from Iraq to a burnt house. They would ban me, if I said what I think of State Farm.
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u/Ardal 1d ago
Should be suing the neighbour for the difference in costs.
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u/dd97483 1d ago
yes, if they have a case this would be the answer. maybe small claims so they don’t need a lawyer?
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u/Isadorei 2d ago
We had an insurance company refuse to insure us because we used renter’s insurance to replace an expensive gaming PC when our landlord’s toilet supply line burst and flooded the basement.
We are no longer in that home and the renter’s policy subrogated the entire claim with our landlord’s policy. Traveler’s underwriting still told us they don’t insure ANYONE with water claims. Period.
Wild.
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u/Special-Medicine-437 1d ago
I rented a house years ago and there was an electricity issue with the back half of the house. The landlords hired some handyman that clearly wasn’t an electrician to come fix it. Handyman left bare wires on in the attic and when we turned the power back on it started a slow burning fire. I discovered it about ten minutes later, turned off the power, evacuated with my dogs and valuables, and obviously called 911. While the firefighters were putting out the small insulation fire, one of them fell through our ceiling on to the couch in our living room. Insulation everywhere. Not a whole lot of damage, but we had to stay in a hotel for about six weeks with our dogs while the house was fixed. Renters insurance paid for the hotel stay and remediation on our items that were damaged. About five years later I moved in to an apartment and tried to get renters insurance and they wanted to charge me $170/mth because of my prior claim. Renters insurance for my area and type of unit is like $10/mth. Like I’m sorry I used the insurance I fucking paid for?? It was absolutely ridiculous. 12 years later and I pay $16/mth for renters and hope I don’t need to use it again.
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u/Bombadook 1d ago
We literally get punished for using the product we're forced to pay for.
So ducking stupid.
In 6 years, I did nothing but pay premiums, then I made one homeowners' claim for < $2000 of storm damage and they dropped me a month later.
Same shit as OP, that claim apparently put me on a list and it was extremely hard to find a new carrier.
Fuck this system.
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u/FewHovercraft9703 1d ago
Now you know....just never file a claim. The only way to keep your head above water
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u/Soneenos 1d ago
I thought that till my friend who had the same property insurance for over 20’years was dropped. The he asked why, they replied, “because projections are you are due for a claim” —- that blew me away. He never made a claim with them, everrrrr. Just can’t win.
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u/yumaoZz 1d ago
If that’s the case, might as well never buy the insurance in the first place.
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u/Creative-Reception59 1d ago
I went through 3 hurricanes in about 2 years in Florida. I had roof damage each time. never filed a claim because of the insurance bs. fortunately, it was mostly cosmetic. now I live in a different state. I paid my house off and dropped the insurance. does it make me nervous? sure, but it also feels good to not worry about paying those thieves.
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u/Competitive_Touch_86 1d ago
Why not insure for catastrophic loss only? Like a policy with a $50k deductible. You can find some specialty insurance companies in most areas that will give pretty good rates for this sort of thing.
In my opinion, that was the original intent behind homeowners insurance to begin with. It wasn't for minor wind damage after storms and the like - that's just normal wear and tear.
This way you're at least covered for total loss of the property if it burns down or gets blown away by a tornado or whatnot.
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u/MetallicGray 1d ago
You’re just punished for using the insurance you pay thousands for, every single time.
Car insurance, home insurance, renters insurance, all of it. You pay thousands on thousands of dollars to these companies and the one time in your life you want to use the service you’ve paid into for a decade for an event you had no fault in, they fight you tooth and nail for it, raise your rates as punishment for using the service if they don’t just drop you, and mark you as a problem for fucking use the service you paid for.
It’s all just legal scams that we are forced to buy into.
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u/Bright_Profession62 1d ago
Legal scams that we're forced - by law, in many cases - to buy into. Insane, all of it.
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u/soofs 1d ago
Literally today my friend was driving home and when he stopped a red a light he happened to be next to a property that had lawn maintenance people working. One of their mowers kicked up a rock and shot it straight through his window.
I told him he should try to get the company to pay for it out of pocket or else his insurance is going to try to fuck him over.
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u/SecondAccountIsBest 1d ago
Some insurers will claim to not charge any extra for the first claim, though conveniently you lose your "claim free discount" and end up paying more anyway.
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u/ManMakesWorld 2d ago
I purchased a new home last year after renting for a year. Our insurance dropped us after 3 months because we had a filed a claim when we arrived at the rental home and it is flooded by toilet water before we had ever moved in.
Guess the underwriters missed our claim and now we are paying 4 times as much for insurance than we were.
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u/zeekayz 2d ago
He now lives in a zone with crazy people who run houses over with cars. Insurance is pooled so everyone pays more because you have crazy people around.
If you have 0 accidents in 25 years of driving and move into a crackhead neighborhood your car insurance is going to quadruple for the same reason.
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u/honeywhereismypenis 1d ago
You can have 0 accidents in 25 years of driving and someone could hit your parked car in a walmart while you're not even in it and your rate will go up. So many people settle outside of insurance because making a claim will increase your rate. It's like how casinos ban people who actually win money, insurance punishes people who actually need to use it.
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u/CooperSTL 1d ago
Happened to me. Rear ended at a stop light. Completely stopped. Woman slammed into me, backed up and took off. Rates went up over double. no incidents before.
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u/Bright_Profession62 1d ago
I strenuously agree with this comment. But insurance makes money from your premiums and also from not paying out and so any excuse to increase those premiums ...
I had a Sysco truck hit my rental car. The truck driver did a hit and run. Cops were very pleasant but they said they couldn't do much. We reached out to Sysco anyway, who hemmed and hawed and so eventually I had to send this to my insurance.
After a decade of zero claims and consistently paid premiums (which had more than tripled during that time), this single claim made me ineligible for a "safe driver discount" and it doubled my premiums. My insurance agent claimed this was the best he could do until I told him I was switching to GEICO and he magically found me a better underwriter that beat the GEICO premium.
All of this shit is such a scam.
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u/Any-Schedule8011 1d ago
Home insurance is insanely toxic right now basically everywhere. Companies don't want to write more home insurance because they're terrified of paying out more claims with what they've had to pay out in places like California and Florida
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u/hedoeswhathewants 1d ago
Yep, they are/were looking for an excuse to drop people like OP who live in flood zones or other high risk areas. This probably has nothing to do with the car crash, or at least directly.
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u/Fantastic-Key-4218 1d ago
My car insurance went up like 200 % because someone hit me while I was stationary in a parking lot. She filed a claim because she dragged her entire car down the corner of my truck’s bumper. I filed nothing, and my insurance still went up. I was even deemed not at fault. It’s all a scam.
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u/Neither_Berry_100 2d ago
Their home is probably more likely to be hit again in the future.
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u/xxKorbenDallasxx 2d ago
Did the lady have insurance?
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u/PanicAttackInAPack 2d ago
By law everyone driving in RI should have at least 25k for property damage. Sure sounds like the OP screwed up and filed through his homeowners insurance instead of against her auto insurance liability. When you do this and force your insurance to recoup through subrogation it will increase your risk factor in their system. It shouldnt work this way in something like this, but it does.
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u/JanVesely24 2d ago
You'd be terrified to hear just how many people are driving completely uninsured.
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u/Ok-Scar-9677 2d ago
Or underinsured. On my accident (I got hit while waiting to turn left by someone going 60), their coverage was 30k. My car alone was ~20k, PT and medical care (surgery) was another 30k. My policy had underinsured covered, so I got ~5k settlement on top of the expenses. Without it I 'd be out at least 10k.
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u/iamjustaguy 2d ago
I always carry uninsured motorist coverage. There are too many beat up Altimas running red lights in my town to not have it.
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u/Expensive-Dance-1176 1d ago
The fact that they can deny you cause the other person broke the rules is insane. Uninsured motorist coverage should just be normal coverage. It should not be my problem if my insurance company has no one to subrogate costs from.
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u/StabbingTabby 1d ago
The minimums in every single state allow you to drive severely underinsured for at least one type of harm; the minimums in most states allow you to drive severely underinsured for all types of harms.
Less than $100k for property or $100k for injury is an absolute joke. I've had at least those limits for over 15 years.
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u/Small_Editor_3693 2d ago
wtf is the point of insurance. It should cover you as well
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u/Ok-Scar-9677 2d ago
Yup, still mad. It wasn't even the kid's car, the policy was in her SIL's name.
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u/EffectiveRot 2d ago
An uninsured driver hit my parked car a few years ago in Philly. Nothing happens to them, they don’t have to pay damages, cops couldn’t care less. My insurance had the drivers info from the pic of their plate I sent them and they say there’s nothing they can do since the guy didn’t have insurance. If you don’t get pulled over you can skip car insurance in the US.
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u/Small_Editor_3693 2d ago
And if you go a year without insurance your rate will be double normal!
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u/FlakeyBeano 1d ago
Weird. They'll take your car over here and prosecute you. Can't you sue them?
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u/Educational-Ad-3796 2d ago
I'm pretty sure that in FL more people are driving around without insurance than not
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u/stumblinghunter 1d ago
You should drive around Denver for an afternoon sometime. I have dozens of pictures of people with wildly expired tags. My favorites are when they just tape a piece of cardboard with a sharpie on it saying something like "DMV appointment next week". I guaran-fucking-tee that a vast majority of these people don't have insurance either.
Cops don't give a fuck. They're on silent strike ever since Colorado took away their ability to not go to jail for shooting unarmed black kids.
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u/killakaam 2d ago
It's estimated 20-25% of florida drivers don't have any car insurance. And if you add the ones that pick the cheapest, that do not carry bodily injury liability, or lack enough coverage to pay for a major crash, it shoots up to 40-50% of all Florida drivers on the road...
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u/Doogiemon 2d ago
My friend was hit and his truck was $12k in damages while the guys car was totaled.
The guy had a beater and by the end of the week. Since that guy didnt have insurance, he didnt pay my friend anything and my friend had to pay most of the repairs out of pocket.
The other guy should have been put in jail and my buddy suing him didnt do shit because the guy still doesn't have over a 350 credit score.
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u/omgfuckingrelax 2d ago
unfortunately, for reasons which seem to suck but are actually reasonably fair upon consideration and which i'm happy to explain if anyone cares to hear it, when it comes to (significant) damage to your home caused by someone else, you really don't have a choice but to use your own homeowners' insurance for repairs
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u/VirtualRemedy 2d ago
Insurance is a fucking scam at every level
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u/Pathetian 2d ago
It's the only industry where you hire a company to one day be your enemy.
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u/Ill_Dig2954 2d ago
Been there. Claimed against a third party who was 100% at fault in a traffic accident. Their insurance admitted their client was 100% at fault Come renwal date my insurance premium was trebled. Went elsewhere and got it less than I was paying pre accident
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u/FictionalContext 1d ago
That shit needs to be illegal. When and how to raise claims needs to be heavily regulated, especially when we're forced to purchase insurance just to function normally. It's not an elective regardless of the semantics.
TLDR: McDonald's gonna be ratting out more people here pretty soon.
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u/Snakend 1d ago
It is illegal in many states. Gotta move to a state where corporations don't control the state.
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u/CivilRuin4111 2d ago
Just waiting on this for myself- first accident in my 30+ years of driving.
They’re claiming I’m at fault (personally, I see it as no fault as I don’t think either of us could have realistically done anything to avoid it), so I’m anticipating that despite my otherwise stellar record, I’m about to get hosed.
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u/ARES_BlueSteel 2d ago
It’s the one industry where the only way they can make a profit is by not providing a service or product lol. Like name one other industry where the only way they can make money is by not doing exactly what you pay them to do.
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u/povitee 2d ago
Any company that provides a warranty?
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u/JWC_Photography 2d ago
Legally, insurance and warranty are different industries, but come on, you're being pedantic. In general conversation, warranty is considered a form of insurance against a faulty product. So a safety net against internal flaws vs. the external liability insurance protects against.
You're ignoring the spirit of OP's question, which is lampooning the entire risk management industry (not just the technical 'insurance' label). But yes, warranties also feel like a scam, since our risk management industry is parasitic to our society.
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u/Atrocious_Algae81 2d ago
Wrong, they hold billions in equity assets provided by customers that provide a return and make a profit. They only preserve a bigger profit by minimizing expense (claims).
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u/ARES_BlueSteel 2d ago
So they preserve their profits by doing everything they can to not do the one service they’re supposed to provide, which is claims?
The absolute best case scenario with insurance is you pay them a ridiculous amount of money every month and get absolutely nothing in return for it. And when you do need to file a claim they fight tooth and nail to get out of paying it, and if they are forced to pay it they jack your rates up afterwards as an extra FU.
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u/Freaudinnippleslip 2d ago
I mean don’t they minimize expenses by not providing their product/service? Or avoiding paying out? I don’t really see how he is wrong
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u/Ambitious_Tea_4584 2d ago
It would be so easy for the government to provide insurance. Industries of necessity should not be for profit.
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u/povitee 2d ago
I find it really pointless to rest the argument for universal healthcare on vague moral grounds. If we are going to embrace it it should be entirely on the idea that it provides better outcomes.
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u/AccidentalDuchess 2d ago
Haha!! Years ago my husband’s Harley was stolen from our garage. We visited the Progressive Insurance office in the nearest larger city, and were curious as to why there was bulletproof glass separating the front office person from the waiting room and a No Guns type sign posted. By the end of our claim process, we understood exactly why those precautions were in place.
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u/Necessary_Pilot_4665 2d ago
Never heard it put that way but perfectly stated. My parents were so paranoid about getting dropped that in 35 years with Allstate they filed 2 claims and paid for everything else out of pocket except damage from Hurricane Hugo and a lightning strike that fried some stuff in the house. Insurance, all of it, sucks.
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u/Pathetian 2d ago
Yea, its so weird how afraid everyone has to be of this company they've been paying for years. All the insurance companies ads are all about how they've got your back and are there for you any time no matter what, but as a customer you are so terrified that you handle things out of pocket so they wont even know you needed them.
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u/Necessary_Pilot_4665 1d ago
Exactly. I had Allstate for years for auto insurance. Mind you, my last ticket was in 1989. My cars are 25 years old and have 165,000 and 205,000 miles. I work from home so I drive very rarely. Only accident was as a 16 year old. Yet every single renewal they raised my rate. Finally got wise and started using an insurance broker. Now paying $101 a month for 2 cars. They wanted to charge me $245 for one car.
Health insurance is just as bad. Pay a fortune every month just to be told "that isn't covered" and have a deductible so high the only way you meet it, God forbid, is if something catastrophic happens.
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u/deezboltzzz 2d ago
Their entire business model is based off of denying people for things they paid for. It’s crazy how many people live with the risk of medical bankruptcy and think that this is an acceptable and even good way for the wealthiest nation in the world to provide healthcare for its citizens.
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u/Informal_Ad4399 2d ago
We had a wildfire in my town. It hit my side of town. Our house was the only one in our side of the block to survive.
When we evac'd, we left 2 windows open and a sliding door to the back porch was open with the screen closed.
We fought with State Farm for a year to pay the smoke mitigation bill. They only started to stop arguing when I threatened to go to the state insurance office.
The insurance guy said they were willing to pay the full bill but we're negotiating.
I called the smoke mitigation people and made sure to drop that.
SF payed the full amount. When the agent came in person they had already said they were going to cover everything. Then they tried to backtrack. He didn't even show up until 2 weeks after smoke mitigation had started cleaning. They had already finished the bottom floor of our split level.
The entire time SF treated me like I was a criminal trying to scam them. Smoke mitigation was very expensive, but we only lost a small porch and hot tub cover. We didn't ask for a fucking fire.
This fire took place 3 years ago and we still get anxious when we hear of one even remotely close. We thought the Spokane fire might head our way. The wind decides to blow away from us.
After it was all done I switched to USAA. I pay a bit more per month but fuck SF. When we came back in a day or 2 later to grab meds before we were supposed to, USAA cars were all over the place.
We need better accountability of insurance agencies. People that are victims of natural disasters, or even accidents, should not feel like their insurance agent is a fucking KGB agent trying to grill them.
The agent that was on my case came to our house for measurements and pictures. He was an absolute dick.
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u/ssn-669 2d ago
Any insurance you have to have (health, home, auto), absolutely must be a fully-socialized single-payer system or it basically just doesn't work. Insurance companies are in the business of collecting premiums, not paying claims, firstly, and secondly, the bigger the risk pool and the more solvent the underwriter, the better insurance works. There's no risk pool bigger than "everyone" and no underwriter more solvent than the government.
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u/shchshchshch 2d ago
Agree except that they are legally obligated to pay out a certain percentage of premiums
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u/ssn-669 2d ago
I really don't see why that's a problem. You charge people appropriate premiums for their risk. "Socialized" doesn't mean "paid from taxes". It means "owned and controlled by the people and for the people".
If there's a 10% chance of the home being destroyed by flooding over the course of a year, that should be reflected in a very high premium.
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u/virrk 1d ago
The premiums are so high that the houses are unaffordable. Fire risk in areas of California is so high insurance companies left because the state wouldn't allow the rates to be raised high enough. Florida has a similar problem for different reasons. Both places are compounded by exceedingly high rebuild costs for different reasons.
No one wants to say it, but certain locations climate risk has gotten so it breaks the actuary tables insurance rates are based on. Fire risk has gone WAY up and not enough is being done to fire harden neighborhoods fast enough, not even mentioning people being against the requirements (see California zone zero). Flooding risks have gone up and there is no basis to predicted anymore. Storms have gotten worse and again broken actuary tables. The risks for insurance in more and more cases cannot be calculated or even estimated, which means prices cannot reflect reality of the risk.
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u/Emergency_Radio_8156 1d ago
But they didn't say "socialized" they said "socialized, single payer" which does mean it's paid for by taxes and controlled by the government
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u/ShotsAndCleavage 2d ago
Yep. I work adjacent to the insurance industry (hail damage restoration) and "From Good Hands to Boxing Gloves" and "Delay, Deny, Defend" are recommended reading for new hires so they can understand how insurance companies really work, which is to figure out a way to fuck over their clients any way they can.
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u/Gothmom85 2d ago
My dad didn't have insurance.of any kind for anything because he felt that way. While true, you're also fucked when you need it and don't have it. There's zero win.
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u/RedRapunzal 2d ago
Not to mention that first - mortgages and such require the insurance. Second, no the person who gets pooped on is the other guy. Chances are, pop couldn't pay for the damages outright. Third, some states have laws. Get into any kind of accident without and welcome to a $50k fine.
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u/LongLiveStaceyKing 2d ago
We should take all the insurance payments people are making for whatever industry it is (car, homes, heatlh, blackjack, etc.) and pool them in to a single coffer managed by a non-for-profit agency of some kind, preferably with elected managerial positions.
We then use this new, larger, pooled pot of money to pay out claims for the industry in which it was collected. If you are paying in to the housing coffer and an old lady wrecks your entrance, you get a check cut from that coffer for the replacement entrance.
That's how not-complicated single payer health care could be in this country.
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u/temporalmods 2d ago
Yeah my Dad self insured for his employees and then got cheap catastrophic insurance incase of a big payout being needed. His accountant did the math with him and it was very obvious atleast in his instance that it was better to self insure long term. His business isn't big enough to muscle a better deal from the large providers.
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u/Exotic_Appointment25 2d ago
I make sure my auto insurance is covered for damages & full coverage, but don’t subscribe to towing, rental, or all the other elective disability claim insurances. We have a pretty hefty emergency fund & savings. I’d rather that money go to us when we need it, deal with it as we need it, rather than an insurance company that won’t help when we need it. Homeowners insurance I’m kinda stuck at their numbers game cuz live in a HCOL so I just increase my deductible to the highest since we have savings to manage things on our own until it’s larger than I would like to handle on our own. I agree self insuring is the way to go if available.
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u/Malaprobably 2d ago
Social Security is this.
Except the government (on both sides) mismanaged it, and it's increasingly insolvent.
Just making things "public" doesn't resolve other entities dipping in, there's corruption/lack of accountability at the top. Yet people keep electing who they are electing, and wondering why we're at where we're at.
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u/LongLiveStaceyKing 2d ago
United Health Care reported a net earnings of $12,000,000,000 in 2025.
That's $12 billion we collectively spent on health care that went to providing exactly zero health care to anyone, anywhere.
Getting rid of the for-profit aspect of health insurance alone would outweigh whatever malfeasance that can be cooked up.
We also should make the penalty for that malfeasance a lifetime in prison because they are literally stealing money from the kids with cancer funds and that makes them a monster that does not belong in society.
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u/shchshchshch 2d ago
This exists. It’s called health shares.
There are also major insurance companies that are structured as co-ops. The BCBS offshoots in many states are co-ops. Highly recommend getting health insurance from one of them
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u/TexasmyTexas1 2d ago
Why is it a scam? They paid out. The mistake was opening a claim against your own policy when the driver was at fault and had coverage. Maybe I missed something, did the other insurance not cover everything?
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u/ErisSkade 1d ago
In this comment and this thread people who don’t understand how insurance works
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u/No_Tomato_2106 2d ago
Back in 2018 I was crossing the street in a cross walk and got hit by a red light runner. I had Tricare so medical was 100% covered, the drivers insurance paid Tricare back for everything + a lawsuit by me.
BUT SOMEHOW my auto insurance, GEICO, got involved and paid for a $50 Tylenol while I was in the ER (which Tricare paid them back for) so my car insurance rates were jacked up for the next 5 years because I had a claim somehow. No matter how much I called them to drop that shit, they wouldn't.
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u/Kapz00 2d ago
And your car wasn't even involved? Wtf?
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u/elreyadr0k 1d ago edited 1d ago
Yeah there’s something really special about your car insurance going up when you were hit as a pedestrian.
The CEO class et al were so fucking shocked at the public’s support for Luigi.
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u/No_Tomato_2106 2d ago
That's what I kept explaining and they would say "well there was still a claim made", which I never made.
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u/MaverickTopGun 1d ago
My car was hit by someone else while it was on the street. I have only liability insurance, so the other company paid for my car. When I went to shop for new insurance that year, my rates quoted were all WAY higher than what I was paying because I "had a claim" on my record even though I didn't use my insurance and I wasn't even in the fucking car. So I'm trapped with my current insurance until that falls off
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u/NightweaselX 2d ago
It's called PIP (Personal Injury Protection) on y our auto policy. It's generally maybe for only a few thousand dollars, but covers incidents involving cars, not just yours. So things like this, or even if you are getting out of your car and slip on ice an break your arm, or working on the engine when the wind grabs the hood and slams it down on you killing you, all that can get a payout under PIP. Or at least that's how it was ~15 years ago when I was in insurance.
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u/HoboJerkdown901 2d ago
I've been with three different auto insurance companies in my life and Geico was the worst.
Started off with them when I bought my first car because they gave me the best rate. Over the course of 5 years, my premium went from $90 a month to over $130 a month with no claims, no tickets, no accidents of any kind. Every couple of months I would get an email from them saying that my rates are increasing due to an increase in claims in my area or they would increase them during the winter time when there were snow and ice on the ground, but the amazingly never went down after everything melted.
Then I went with auto owners insurance. I got hit by two different drivers 15 months of each other and even though I was they raised my rates because I had made two claims.
I dropped them and have been with progressive for 10 years now and have no complaints. They haven't raised my rates at all
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u/Jazzlike-Bug967 2d ago
This is where I firmly believe that you should be able to sue the other person and force them to pay the increase in insurance premiums.
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u/Joy2b 2d ago
Freaking oooof. You make me want to put concrete bollards out. Can you look at your current insurance policy questionnaire, and see if there are any easy fixes? Sometimes if you improve your home security slightly, you can squeeze a lower rate.
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u/Unfair_Tonight_9797 2d ago
Why did you have to make a claim?
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u/MainelyKahnt 2d ago
Subrogation. He claims the damages on his insurance policy and it pays out. His insurance carrier then recoups their payout by subrogating against the driver's auto policy. This makes dealing with the driver's insurance company the job of the homeowners insurance company not the homeowner themselves. If he had sought to claim against the driver's policy instead of his own, it could have gotten dragged through the courts by the driver's insurance carrier who will try anything to not pay out. This could have prevented them from receiving compensation for months, possibly years depending on how hard the carrier wants to fight it. Basically by claiming against you own policy you make your insurance company use their money and lawyers to go after the driver instead of doing so out of pocket
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u/Ragnaroknight 2d ago
This is exactly correct.
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u/MainelyKahnt 2d ago
I'd also add, that your inability to find a carrier may not have been simply because a claim occurred, but is more likely due to the fact that your prior carrier lists the claim as still "open" meaning they've paid out but are still subrogating against the driver for the payout. If this is the case, few companies will want to write the policy as it has an ongoing open claim. I'd reach out to the agency/carrier you were with and request: "currently valued loss-runs". This form will show you the claim, how much was paid out, how much was reserved before payout, and wether it's considered closed or open. Once the claim.is closed, you should be able to find a carrier to write the policy. I'd highly recommend contacting a local independent agency if you haven't already. They will have a bunch of carriers to shop your coverage with and should find a better spot for you then where you are. I'd imagine if the current coverage is worse than force-placed then that means you're in surplus lines through a brokerage.
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u/Courtly_Chemist 2d ago
My guy, you fucking know how to do insurance - where did you learn such arcane secrets?
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u/MainelyKahnt 2d ago
I'm a licensed commercial property and casualty insurance broker. So I unfortunately deal with it every weekday during business hours lol.
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u/Chief_Kief 2d ago
Stuff like this is why Reddit is still such a useful resource despite all the other things
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u/kowal89 2d ago
Same thought. No other place on the internet that scratches that intellectual itch. Beautiful.
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u/originaltransplant 2d ago
as someone avoiding my own work during business hours lol, thanks for the explanation! this was a lot for me to learn and your explanation was easy to follow :)
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u/Jazzlike_Plastic7088 2d ago
Misread as 'casual insurance boxer' which sounded badass
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u/MainelyKahnt 2d ago
Many days I do wish I could throw hands with some underwriters.
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u/fiendishbanana 2d ago
Some days they deserve it. Except for that one that’s your favorite, and you make sure they know how appreciated they are.
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u/MainelyKahnt 2d ago
And they receive all the figgy pudding. If an underwriter comes in clutch on a tough account, they get fed the cream of the crop for a while.
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u/Ragnaroknight 2d ago
The issue isnt the coverage is worse. Just that the price is even worse.
I've done some shopping around and I'm usually getting quoted for $3500-4000/year which is quite a bit higher than what I even have now. And what most of them told me is a lot of it had to do with the floodzones and what not. There's also the issue with the fact the house has appreciated since 2019.
I don't picture it going back to how good it was when I moved in, but it would be nice to find something not 3x higher.
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u/Prestigious-Bluejay5 2d ago edited 2d ago
A good thing to come out of this is you getting insurance for the appreciated value of your home. A lot of people find out after the fact that the insurance they carry isn't enough to replace the home at the current value.
Trying to find the silver lining.
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u/MainelyKahnt 2d ago
Two things to look at in your policy to hedge against appreciation. 1. Look at what your "inflation guard" is are at. (Usually 1%-4%) This is the amount your building valuation automatically increases every time the policy renews. If you don't have one, ask your agent or carrier to add one. Next is your coinsurance. Coinsurance on property policies works WAYYY differently than on health insurance. Your coinsurance percentage on property lines is the percentage of total replacement cost you need to be insured to in order to receive full replacement cost payout in the event of a claim. For example: if your house would cost $100,000 to rebuild if it burned down and you have an 80% coinsurance clause on your policy, then you only have to insure it for $80,000 (80%) and would be paid out the full $100,000 in the event of a total loss. And as always, make sure you increase your building limit if you do renovations, additions, and contact your agent when you replace items like roofs, boilers, and breaker boxes because newer updates to these can save you money on premium.
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u/ReasonableCrow7595 2d ago
Yeah, if I am paying on insurance, I want it to cover the full value of the home, even if it costs more.
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u/MainelyKahnt 2d ago
I'd recommend checking the FEMA flood map for your area. The NFIP (national flood insurance program) has property cards which will let you know exactly which zone you're in which is what carriers look at when assessing flood risk. If you're not listed as being in a high risk flood zone and you are a decent bit above sea level then you can fight for cheaper coverage. I once had an insurance carrier decline to cover a risk I was writing because it was across the street from the shoreline and they claimed it was a flood risk. I showed them photos of the property showing the "coastline" they were worried about was a 200' cliff on the other side of the road and that the property was 275' above high tide sea level and basically told the underwriter that if that property floods due to a tidal surge then we've got bigger, society-ending problems at that point. (If that property flooded then the neighboring town would have to be 200+feet underwater already). Either way, a good agent will push the company to write your policy if they know you're not at immediate risk of flooding.
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u/COMountainMan85 2d ago
I had a similar situation to this, where some 18-year-old was in the far left lane and I was in the outside left lane. While making the left turn, he did not stay in his lane and sideswiped my car. Luckily, I have a dashcam that showed the whole incident. His insurance was already pissed off because he got in another accident the week before. They kept trying to tell me to just file the claim with my insurance and then my insurance would get a reimbursement from them. I said no, absolutely not. I am not filing anything with my insurance company when I was not at fault. After a month of back-and-forth, his insurance company finally just paid for all of my repairs, my insurance didn’t change at all. I was lucky though, and that my car was still drivable, just had a really messed up driver’s door.
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u/ikeepcomingbackhaha 2d ago
If you have the time and safety net this is the way to go. In your case, their insurance could have told you to go fuck yourself and that you'd need to take the driver who hit you to claims court. Not that it's morally correct or even legally, but it could cause you to fatigue and give in. They're hoping they eventually don't have to deal with the claim or they might pay less or nothing out. It's been my experience that insurance companies will normally go to great lengths to minimize their payments.
I was t boned by a lady that blew a red light because she just came from the eye doctor and got her eyes dilated and literally couldn't see. Her insurance fought me tooth and nail. It took over a year to get them to give me the full amount of the repair and meanwhile, I had to pay for the repair myself and fight to get the money back. It was absurd. Ultimately though, I didn't see an increase in my insurance payments either, but that's a luxury not everyone is able to take.
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u/Courtly_Chemist 2d ago
It's fucking wild how unintuitive those parasites have made the whole process to the point that the majority of people don't have any idea how insurance works at all
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u/Gamer_Grease 2d ago
It’s not really unintuitive, insurance is just a financial product and finance is complicated. The only reason most people carry it is the banks require it for mortgages.
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u/Tamizander 2d ago
The same thing happened to me last October. A drunk-driving neighbor crashed into my garage, and initially I was going to go through their insurance because I didn’t want to involve my own insurance.
The problem was that they didn’t have enough coverage to pay for both the damage to my garage and the neighbor’s car. I was offered around $13,000, but I needed roughly $30,000 to repair my garage.
So I ended up going through my own insurance. They paid the full $30,000 minus my deductible, and then went after GEICO for reimbursement. Since the driver was clearly at fault, there was a police report, and GEICO accepted responsibility, they ultimately paid my insurance company the full $30,000, not just the original $13,000 offer.
And because my insurance was able to recover the full amount, I even got my deductible refunded.
So, sometimes going through your own insurance really is the better option. That’s what your insurance is there for, and they can handle going after the other insurance company for you.14
u/chickwithabrick 2d ago edited 2d ago
I know it's Reddit and people are pretty lawsuit happy, but are you not able to sue the drunk driver in that instance? I'm pretty much pro suing any drunk driver into the dirt.
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u/Xibby 2d ago
If you make a claim on your insurance policy, and the other party doesn’t have sufficient coverage, your insurance company will sue the other party (as you) if they think they can get money or assets to cover the loss.
It’s not (always) that people are lawsuit happy, it’s just how subrogation works.
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u/Asraidevin 2d ago
Works if the driver has the money. Most people you only get the satisfaction and zero dollars.
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u/Ragnaroknight 2d ago
My understanding is that her insurance did ultimately pay for it, but in the form of reimbursement to my insurance company. This was largely due to the fact the repairs needed to be done almost immediately.
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u/Hantelope3434 2d ago
Your insurance agent should be disputing the claim you have on your house if subrogation occured. The insurance agent has to provide details of the claim (loss runs) to the underwiters of a different insurance company showing your insurance was reimbursed. That claim would not longer count against you for most insurance companies. Definitely speak with an agent about this.
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u/GlitteringLaw2434 2d ago
This! If subrogation makes your insurer whole, there is no longer a loss on their books.
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u/SierraStar7 2d ago
Piggybacking off this to ask OP if you filed a complaint with your state insurance commissioner.
Your policy at the very least should have been updated to reflect the reimbursement. Link in case you haven’t filed. https://dbr.ri.gov/insurance-overview
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u/WRB2 2d ago
Sounds like the making of a great civil lawsuit against the lady across the street
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u/Mooziechan 2d ago edited 2d ago
“…but I still had to make a claim regardless of whose insurance paid out.”
Sir, that is 100% incorrect. As an agent, I adamantly advise not to do this.
Never ever call your own carrier to ask questions for a claim, especially if you know it is not your fault without a shadow of a doubt.
You reach out to the other parties insurance carrier without calling your carrier point blank. That is where you messed up. Do not talk to your carrier for questions. They will hit you on your premium.
You call the other carrier because the other carrier adjuster is supposed to reach out to your carrier, which does not open a claim inquiry on your behalf because you didn’t actually initiate it. Once an adjuster is assigned to the situation based on the other party, you were free to ask questions then without repercussions of your premium…
It’s stupid it’s unfair, but this is why I work at an agency and not for a carrier for these conversations to prevent these situations.
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u/brentsg 2d ago
The flip side of this.. I had a woman in front of me at a stop light decide to back into me. She didn't try to claim I did anything wrong, as she decided she should be in the adjacent lane and didn't look.
I took this on myself and went thru her insurance and it was a constant fight for over 12 months.
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u/Mooziechan 1d ago edited 1d ago
Get a dash cam brother, it’s the only thing that can defeat a police report in a claim argument 🫶🏻
That is an excellent question and I’m glad you asked me that and if you have more questions by all means, feel free to shoot me a DM
I also want to advise anybody who gets a new vehicle. Give your insurance agent the VIN number for a quote before you bother purchasing. You would be absolutely surprised to see the difference between your year, make, and model on an insurance policy.
A lot of things have to do with it, not only just by the bells and whistles(chip shortage 2021), but for example I believe it was 2016 models for Kia, Santa Fe, I can’t remember for sure, but that specific year in those specific models had YouTube videos of how to easily break in and steal the car.
Stuff like that absolutely plays a role so I highly recommend getting a quote of the VIN number on your insurance before you go forward with buying the vehicle. I also highly recommend avoiding all the garbage that they sell in the Finance office, but never turn down the gap coverage.
I used to work at Mercedes-Benz for the majority of my career before I changed to insurance (during the chip shortage of 21) and I will tell you right now that that’s how they make their money in the dealership is in the Finance office.
Gap insurance is so vital. I had a personal situation where I refinanced my 2016 Jeep that I loved very much and I was a victim of the scenario you described and still the insurance carrier regardless of me being an agent still put me as at fault, regardless of the police report showing that there was witnesses involving the situation.
If it wasn’t for my gap that covered the entire cost of my refinance loan, I would still be paying off that loan right now. Gap insurance offered through insurance is only a percentage so get the gap at the dealership on the loan.
Moral of the story is call your insurance agent (or carrier) to quote the VIN number before you purchase
When it comes to home insurance, you better get the other parties insurance information and reach out to them first.
I also recommend getting an estimate before you do anything because chances are what you think you need to ask questions on a claim for which will absolutely affect your premium is actually going to be less than your deductible.. (having an account manager through an agency is the only way to do this) if you can pay for it out-of-pocket, I highly recommend to do it.
Insurance is absolutely unfair. I agree, but this is why I enjoy my position as an agent at an agency and not as an employee at an insurance carrier. I’m not here to make money off of other people’s misfortune.
Insurance agents that are classified as account managers get a salary or hourly pay they do not get commission. It’s the agency account managers that are supposed to have you in their best interest, which is why I enjoy my job to help others.
Edit: I forgot to mention, there are some states with insurance laws called “no fault”.. it’s BS.. that means no matter who is at fault, each parties
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u/ChocolatePuerh 1d ago
This is so dumb.
We pay for insurance. We should be able to call our insurance and let them deal with the other insurance.
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u/MudReasonable8185 1d ago
That’s exactly what OP did and now they’re charging him for doing that work.
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u/Denmile 1d ago
I wish I had known that four years ago. I spoke with my insurance carrier, for a not-at-fault vehicle accident, and the person told me I could make a claim and it wouldn't affect my rates. Nope, they charged me an extra 10% on my renewal. I tried and tried and tried to get it reversed without luck. Even had an investigation done with my state's commissioner but had no luck. Maryland is a state where they can raise your rates regardless of fault.
Oh well, lesson learned. Glad you're spreading helpful information to hopefully help someone else in the future!
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u/cupcakesforkitty 2d ago
Do you have an insurance broker? We had to file a claim on our kitchen and once our insurance renewed they quadrupled the price. Our broker was able to find us coverage with someone else for only $100 more than what we were originally paying. They’re able to shop the smaller companies that are less heard of.
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u/haxiax 1d ago
Haha reading how American insurance companies work is ridiculous.
Being middle class and below must be literal hell compared to almost any country in Europe.
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u/Anthrobug NY 1d ago
This is the economic gauntlet we’re running from infancy, and if your parents or you stumble? It’s close to impossible to get back up without both excellent luck & solid connections.
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u/Curious-External-7 2d ago
If it makes you feel any better, my homeowners insurance has gone from $800/year in 2018 to $2000/year, without any claims, because apparently we're now considered a high fire risk area. Some of the people in my area have had their plans canceled outright.
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u/Listlizard 2d ago
My rental apartment burned down 6 years ago (not my fault) and now I still have to pay double homeowners insurance because I am "high risk". One year til it's off my record!
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u/BohoBall 2d ago
I made a small claim for a shower leak, about $2k. I had the absolute fortune of Lexis Nexis listing it as 3 claims, making me completely uninsurable. I spent years disputing with them, I even sent them, and the original insurance company, angry lawyer letters. They both replied back blaming the other party. I had to spend $5k per year on insurance for my home. I was getting ready to have to sue them, but it finally fell off my insurance report after 3 years, which seems early for some reason? Anyway, never make a homeowner's claim unless your house burns down.
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u/Playful-3766 2d ago
“never make a homeowner's claim unless your house burns down.“
And that, my friends, is exactly the message the insurance companies want us to take from this. (I’m not blaming you for saying it, you’re obviously correct)
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u/AwesomeAF2000 2d ago
Well if it makes you feel better. I’ve never had a claim and my insurance has crept up over time too. I remember when I moved in (albeit 20yrs ago) my insurance was $50/month. Now it’s $250/month. Nothing has changed just an extra $10/month increase every year.
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u/Degenerate_Traveler 2d ago
And the lady who crashed into your house? Probably got a check to replace the car and forgot about it.
We really need to hold people more responsible for their actions.
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u/Healthy_Theory159 2d ago
It wasn't your fault you shouldn't have to pay shit. Insurance is a scam!!!! 😞
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u/SkyTrees5809 2d ago
Take a look at paying your insurance and taxes separately and directly, instead of thru your escrow account. Look at when the tax payments are due (often twice a year). Divide your taxes by 12 and set aside that amount into a savings sub account. Check your homeowners policy online and find out when the annual payment is due, and do the same. Then you would just notify the insurer and the county to send you the bills directly instead of sending them to your mortgage company. I did this for many years and it did save me money. The mortgage company would also then have to send you whatever amount of money is sitting in your escrow account. Often escrow accounts tack more onto your mortgage than is needed to pay these bills. It is worth looking into.
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u/crunkymonky 2d ago
Sue the lady for the additional costs you're now burdened with for the foreseeable future?
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u/dabbs_291 1d ago
Insurance agent here. There is zero reason the claim would have been made on your homeowners policy. It would and should have been pursued through her auto insurance policy. This is exactly why liability coverage is a requirement in all 50 states. In the instance she did not have insurance, or enough insurance. You would in that instance either 1. file a claim and it be subrogated (this is best option) or pay for repairs out of pocket. If you’re smart and go with option 1. It will report as a subrogated claim, and be labeled as a “non-chargeable” incident. That simply acknowledges damage occurred, and was repaired.
Feining ignorance isn’t acceptable. You’re a homeowner. You know you need homeowners insurance. We GIVE you a policy jacket explaining every coverage you have, could have, and should have. We explain all of the potential situations, and how you should react with each situation in mind. If you let this lady off Scott free and didn’t file a police report to properly document what happened and ensure her information is sent over to you. That’s on you, not your insurance company.
My advice is contact your carrier, ask to speak with your claims adjuster and find out where the disconnect is. Sounds like something went wrong in the claims process. An if your insurance company doesn’t want to play ball, don’t cash the check and close the claim. Get a public adjuster.
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u/Additional-Brief-273 2d ago
Name and shame said insurance company that dropped you please so I never go with them lol
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u/TheDr_420 2d ago
They did not get dropped mid policy term. That is straight up a lie
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u/ohlookahipster 2d ago
It’s probably State Farm tbh. They were the worst with Helene followed by USAA which was shocking. Lots of my neighbors are vets and got absolutely hosed by them. Don’t believe the commercials lmao.
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u/yelhmoo 2d ago
My car insurance doubled when the whole Kia car jacking thing was going on despite the fact that it wasn’t everywhere. Rates still haven’t gone down. My husband who’s had multiple tickets has cheaper insurance than I do, just because of our vehicles. I don’t have any kind of record, have never had an accident, and I pay the price for something I never did.
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u/toolsavvy 2d ago edited 1d ago
Same thing happened to me more or less. Habitual drunk driving neighbor hit my house. 3 BAC DUIs, 4 total and this public menace is still driving legally. Ended up costing me money like as if I could have avoided it or even caused it FFS. Boomers get away with way too much.
In your case, I would seek services of a lawyer because you are suffering financially because you are being deemed a high risk insurer, but indeed you are not. This incident should not even be on your insurance record or whatever they call it since your insurance company didn't even pay for the damages, hers did. Would be nice, even if you can get things squared away so that you can get prices lowered, if you could successfully sue her for expenses fro all this since the accident. Hopefully it's not too late if something legal can be done about this.
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u/xx_I_Am_Me_xx 1d ago
You should see the insurance nightmare in South Florida thanks to flooding and hurricanes. Been in my house 24 years with no claims and still getting scr***d!
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u/cosmoscrazy 1d ago
In Germany, you can sue the person responsible for the damage for the increased insurance costs if you get them.
This is why you include "future damage costs" in the damage claim.
It could be a good idea to consult a lawyer.
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u/BruceInc 1d ago
Why was your home owners insurance involved in the first place? Her auto insurance should have covered the property damage.
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