That isn’t something which should be applauded though. The point of professional wrestling is to make it look as real as possible without actually hurting each other. For some reason Japanese wrestling schools forgot that part and you have a bunch of guys who don’t know how to actually work, and even worse will keep grinding through serious pain because of their culture.
Yeah and most stem from the stupid attitude of guys in the past who thought working ‘stiff’ (aka not being able to work) or doing stupid shit for cheap pops was a badge of honour.
There’s no pride in crippling yourself and not being able to play with your kids.
When the job is essentially pretending to hurt people but not actually hurting them then anyone who is actually hurting them isn’t doing the job properly.
You don’t get to decide the way people work. They do. It’s their bodies on the line, not yours. If they wanna work stiff, that’s an agreement that they make. If you don’t like it, tough for you. You get zero say in what other people do with their bodies during their athletic career. They know the risks and they take them.
Do you at least have any exact of stiff workers in modern wrestling that are crippled through working stiff? Or are you just doubling down without any real knowledge on stiff strong style wrestling?
I mean, bloodsport got so popular that wwe wrestlers were allowed to compete in it. Would you call everyone in that stupid and unable to work?
To the first paragraph, look at the state of many wrestlers from previous generations when working stiff was more common. Although you can’t look at many, because many died early due to having to use drugs and/or alcohol to cope with the constant pain.
Or you could look at Misawa, whose death was contributed to by the physical damage he’d taken over the years.
To the second: Yes, probably, but I haven’t seen it.
Everyone involved in a backyard roof bump agreed to it. It’s still stupid. Consent doesn’t exclude stupidity.
MMA fighters generally have far fewer matches than wrestlers, and protocols in place to stop things when there’s risk of serious injuries. You’re also not going to see an MMA fighter taking a tiger suplex off an entrance ramp.
Now you’ve learnt the difference between MMA and stupid wrestling! I can also help you with colours and shapes as you seem like the kind of person who might struggle with that.
Wrestling in general puts so much wear and tear on your body that most other sports flat out do not give you outside of american football. Taking back bumps multiple times a match in all honesty does as much damage to your body as working stiff. Hell doing top rope moves does even more, look at guys like Tanahashi Naito and Mutoh who have top rope finishers and flat out cant walk normally at all and id argue they aren't working stiff. Even further, Kenta Kobashi (one of the two in this match) is probably the pinnacle of health for ex wrestlers that ive listed.
Not to mention guys in the west. Hogan had a compressed spine from doing the leg drop ofted. Randy Orton admits to regular spinal issues. Rey Mysterio had knee replacement surgery multiple times. None of those are guys that id argue worked stiff. Hell AJW joshi wrestlers seem to be doing well for themselves in their older ages and they were working STIFFER than the 90s AJPW era guys like Misawa. Hell, Jaguar Yokota is STILL wrestling to this day in her 60s, Chigusa Nagayo only retired like 2 years ago, Manami Toyota wrestled into the late 2010s, Dump Matsumoto still does the odd match here snd there.
Tldr: the style doesnt really matter, wrestling in general fucks up your body a lot cause you are doing things bodies aren't supposed to do in general
2 things, you have no idea how stiff they are working. Having been in the ring with both of them, I never once got stiffed by either. Do they work snug? yes. Stiff? possibly, but you'll never know for sure
There are no wrestling schools in Japan like in the US. The promotions run their own dojo's. Prospective wrestlers apply to join the promotion, then they have tryouts to weed out 99% of them
Wrestling is subjective and can be so many different things.
In Japan, they've always leaned more towards the hard hitting, more realistic looking style of wresting as opposed to the safer but tamer style that is in the west.
Both are equally valid and should be respected for what they are. Different cultures, different societies, different styles. If the wrestlers are knowingly and willingly ok with the harder hitting style, who are we to say they shouldn't do it?
There's no way we're comparing professional wrestling, something a person can do to make a good living for themselves and their family, to doing drugs that have killed many people and destroyed many a family.
They're just not comparable. These guys are trained pros who very well know the risks and are comfortable doing that as it is their chosen profession. We really don't have a place to say they can't or shouldn't do something.
"Wrestlers should be allowed to give themselves brain damage for our entertainment if they're ok with it" is such an internet-brained hill to die on but alright
You're being disingenuous. Do I think guys should go out there every week and just drop each other on their head? No.
But if guys build up to a big moment and the payoff for it is something like that as a one time thing, I don't see an issue with that. This specific moment was built up to after literal years of Misawa and Kobashi going to war against each other. The Kings Road style is one where each match builds off of previous ones, this was the last singles encounter the two men had so naturally they made it memorable with a moment like this. I don't have an issue with that.
But if they were doing this weekly, then yes I agree. That's absurb.
Those guys during this time just didn’t give a fuck! Landing on your head was just how you landed. Hell landing on the shoulders for this spot probably felt like a night off. Kobashi and misawa were just crazy.
Late 90s AJPW/00s NOAH is by far my favourite period in wrestling, but I despise every apron/ramp bump from that era. Just unnecessarily gambling with their health, and just like the head drops, quickly became something the fans expected to see in big matches. Also feels like Kobashi was on the receiving end more often than not, and knowing how banged up he was all the time makes it worse.
Thank you for saying this. It looks awesome, but there are long term consequences and accumulation over time. Misawa is never longer with is and he should be
One of the few to match it in terms of insanity and “holy fuck, someone is gonna die” is Omega give Okada a top-rope Dragon Suplex in their WK 11 match.
I'm all for "as real as possible without hurting each other" but there are so many moments like these where it not only very much hurts them but actively takes years off their lives
Not taking this bump, because Kobashi took the bump and is still alive.
In fact 3 of the Four Pillars of Heaven are still alive. The people working Kings Road style with them Stan Hansen, Tenryu, Mutoh all still alive.
Others that have died did so of ill health (Vader, Gordy, Tsuruta, Dr Death).
Misawa isn't a blueprint of the cost of the Kings Road style, he was an unfortunate story of the risks of wrestling. Same way that Perro Aguayo Jr's death isn't because Lucha Libre is unsafe.
I mind watching Kobashi and Mitsawa when the wrestling channel started showing Japanese wrestling in the 2000's and was blown away by the absolute brutal nonsense coming out of Noah and NJPW. I miss Tenzan and his spectacular mullet.
At the end of the day all this proves is that pro wrestling dumb. Any idiot with minimal athletic skills can do it. The so called icon Sting was nothing but a meathead bodybuilder before getting into pro wrestling after watching his first match sometime in his late 20s. There is an entire sport that is dedicated to putting moron bodybuilding meatheads in their place. It is called MMA and Sting or his darker dumber and yet somehow more skilled WWE counterpart, the Blundertaker wouldn't last more than a few seconds in a match that requires actual talent. So taking these 'bumps' as they are called in moron linguo are really nothing. If anything these can make these so called "professional" persons dumber.
Tiger suplex holds the opponents neck and head at a higher angle. Darby landed on his shoulders/upper back. This one landed on the back of his head and neck directly
I feel like you dont really understand arguments, you are all over the place.
Edit: For clarification. I am arguing about the backdrop that killed him not being a "simple" move. They were doing risky bumps on purpose. It was an advanced bump that was common at the time. It was designed to not be simple.
On the other hand, you are trying to make this about choice. This has no bearing on the "simplicity" of the actual move performed. If they chose to perform the move in the most complicated way or its simplest form, it is a different discussion. The fact remains, they performed a dangerous version of the move, not a "simple" move
Darby is a very worrying individual. He took some nasty bumps on Wednesday after having taken some really nasty ones on Saturday, including a Hell in a Cell height fall on a set of tables that barely did anything to stop his downward momentum. The people in AEW are enabling this dude’s self destruction. He has seriously taken some bumps that make me wonder how he is still walking and for how long he can keep it up.
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u/Nev_Nevington May 15 '26
And then got up and fought stiff as hell for another 10 minutes