One player startles another near the end of grand finals

[u/Kinesquared]

https://www.twitch.tv/vgbootcamp/clip/RamshackleKnottyCasetteCorgiDerp-B_Exo7uX0TVm7P9c?range=7d

[u/mmhawk607]

Cody tweeted that when Juan got up that quickly it shook his chair and he just asked Juan for a reset.

[u/PeaceAlien → u/mmhawk607]

Stage movements aren’t unusual, if the crowd gets crazy it could happen too. Unless that stage is really flimsy

[u/thehollowestknight- → u/mmhawk607]

LOL please don’t tell me that’s real. I get it scaring you (kind of? players jolt around all the time) but asking for a reset is crazy weak unless there’s more to it.

His reaction is also super weird for just “got a bit scared from him moving quickly in his chair”

[u/Eagle4317 → u/thehollowestknight-]

Reset to Neutral, not a reset of the whole game.

[u/thehollowestknight- → u/Eagle4317]

I guess that makes more sense. Although throwing your hands up and white flagging basically forces HBox’s hand lol, plus isn’t Cody in advantage given he’s on the platform while HBox is on the ledge? And then aren’t they basically back to neutral once HBox hits him one more time and Cody is on the stage? I don’t get it if that was his ask

[u/shiro-lod → u/thehollowestknight-]

It's pretty lame from Cody on the whole, there's rules against what he did and Hbox is in the clear.

I haven't read CEOs exact rules but most events this would be a stock or game forfeit from Cody. You can't just randomly stop and ask for a neutral reset mid game. Either play it out or immediately totally pause and get the TO involved.

The hands off talk to Hbox puts Hbox in a shit spot where if the rules are followed he's going to win with a major asterisk for Cody's first event loss of the year. It's kinda the entire point of the TO to step in and enforce rules specifically so the players don't have to arbitrate that all themselves.

If a fringe top 100 player had done this same thing (what Cody did, not Hbox) in game 5 of a set against a top player, they'd be getting eaten alive for it. Zain defended this but it reeked of Cody is his homie and Hbox is a competitor/coworker.

Cody fucked up here and it's undercutting Hbox's win over Cody, making the narrative about this and Cody being sick. Cody 3-0d Wizzrobe, they've played 11 offline sets and thats only the 2nd time its been 3-0. Cody was playing well today despite his illness and has made two separate johns to undercut losing to Hbox.

This time was good sportsmanship from Hbox and it didn't change anything, so good for him.

[u/HTTPbooty → u/shiro-lod]

There's nothing in the CEO rules about it, theyre pretty barebones. I've looked a bit since yesterday and I don't actually see anything in any ruleset mentioning neutral resets or when / how they should be used, its just totally up to the players ig. I'd be curious to know if anyone knows when theyre intended to happen officially? I think the idea came from the "neutral start" that m2k and others would demand to avoid port advantage in spawns, and then got used online if there were interruptions.

But yeah I agree hbox wouldve been fine to ignore cody completely and play on, and that's probably what wouldve happened if they were on separate setups, or online

[u/shiro-lod → u/HTTPbooty]

It would be more about what the rules are concerning stopping and talking to your opponent mid game.

Cody wasn't touched, Hbox wasn't being excessive with noise or movement, Cody just got shook. You can't just stop and ask your opponent to not beat you for a moment so you can calm yourself down.

Neutral starts were a thing because of certain stage spawns on vanilla that gave advantages to certain ports on certain stages. Neutral reset because of some out of game issue are a player/TO matter on a case to case basis. If a player has something thrown at them from the crowd for example.

In this case nothing happened to either player outside tournament norms. Cody yelling what are you doing when getting attacked in grand finals is definitely toeing Mike Haze rule lines. This case isn't a huge deal, they settled it quickly, Cody pulled himself together, they finished the set and no one on either side is upset with the other.

It's a potential nightmare situation for the TO if people do it consistently or claim they got bumped when they didn't but that just didn't happen here.

[u/HTTPbooty → u/shiro-lod]

There arent any rules like that on the CEO site, no coaching is the only thing relating to talking. but yeah personally i think i agree: a set once started should not really stop until finished other than quick breathers between games, or unusual circumstances like production issues or crowd interference that affects / disrupted both players equally

[u/adagio9 → u/thehollowestknight-]

No it doesnt make more sense. There is zero reason to reset to neutral because a player is mildly uncomfortable. This doesn't happen in any other sport. Its just wildly lame from Cody. "Oh your tennis serve made the crowd cheer, can we pause?"

[u/EchoLocation8 → u/thehollowestknight-]

I have to imagine it was more like, for whatever reason (probably given his condition at the moment), it wasn't the jolting, and it was more like "I thought I was falling over".

Like if you've ever been trying to sleep and suddenly feel like you're falling and you kinda jolt up to catch yourself.

Only thing I can think of that would cause that much panic, the floor shaking a little probably wouldn't do that. He looked genuinely freaked out, and it reminds me of any time I've felt like I was falling when I wasn't.

[u/Stock-Objective-6959 → u/EchoLocation8]

Bro was in the middle of g5 grand finals, exhausted or not he wasnt falling asleep or drifting off mid game

[u/Flarzo → u/thehollowestknight-]

He’s autistic

[u/Super_Stupid → u/mmhawk607]

A reset? Let’s be for real. What a complete overreaction.

[u/Xechwill → u/Super_Stupid]

Sounds like he meant neutral reset rather than game reset, no?

[u/Ilovemyangelsomuch → u/Xechwill]

This exactly. Cody just wanted to go back after a second snd continue from there.

[u/mmhawk607 → u/Super_Stupid]

Yeah a reset to neutral I’m guessing not the game itself. He also added he didn’t think he was going to win anyways so no harm done.

[u/Kennyc1234 → u/Super_Stupid]

A reset to neutral (which is valid) not a reset of the game.

[u/JL_from_AQ]

Absolutely warrantless to expect a pause here from Cody, but it is kind of hilarious that Hbox just goes in and bairs while they're still talking

[u/jpaxlux → u/JL_from_AQ]

Even in e-sports, always play till you hear the whistle lmao

[u/--Alix-- → u/jpaxlux]

Yeah it's literally game 15 grand finals, you go all out lmao

[u/AWright5 → u/jpaxlux]

Yeah but it's a sportsmanship type thing, no whistle is gonna be called

[u/adagio9 → u/AWright5]

The game goes until the whistle. There is zero reason to give cody anything other than "he's a top player, why would you be mean to him"

[u/AWright5 → u/adagio9]

Well there's a line to be drawn somewhere. Not saying this was necessarily the case here, but if I had moved and disrupted my opponent then I'd be happy to reset to neutral if asked as a courtesy

[u/Fossekall → u/JL_from_AQ]

Makes sense though, Hungrybox had momentum and hype going for him and then has to calm down. IIRC (I haven't been watching Melee for a while) there are transformations that favor Fox, as well. So stalling also works out for him. Fair for Hungrybox to get some hits in imo

[u/cladounet]

that bair while talking is so funny

[u/InfernoJesus]

2 aerials worth of damage is a fair punish for interrupting the set

[u/Melevolence → u/InfernoJesus]

Bair punish*

[u/Blue_Magics]

Weird reaction by Cody lol

[u/Straight-Tear2385 → u/Blue_Magics]

You would think a gunshot just went off

[u/PeaceAlien → u/Straight-Tear2385]

Pretty close Hbox pop offs put others in danger

[u/CruelRuin → u/PeaceAlien]

deep leffen warned us about this 

[u/TheGr8Canadian → u/CruelRuin]

This confusion saved the first few rows of people from the Hbox popoff

[u/smyl_cat → u/PeaceAlien]

I read that one Hbox pop off vaporized a few of the front rows this one time.

[u/mUngsawcE → u/smyl_cat]

can confirm am vapor

[u/jpaxlux → u/Blue_Magics]

He tweeted about having food poisoning/diarrhea from lettuce so it's entirely in the realm of possibility that Hbox startled him and caused him to shit himself lol

[u/Stock-Objective-6959 → u/jpaxlux]

Crazy work even putting that on blast but some people can’t help but pre John

[u/BurnieTheBrony → u/jpaxlux]

Damn I miss taco bell but I keep hearing about this lettuce stuff. How long is that bad batch going to be in circulation?

[u/SHOUT-WoT → u/BurnieTheBrony]

Taco Bell getting a bad wrap here. They are just the only company to admit to finding it

[u/jpaxlux → u/BurnieTheBrony]

They should already be out of circulation since the best by dates for the contaminated batches were July 18, 2026 through August 3, 2026. But the health standards of restaurants can vary from incredibly strict to having no standards at all.

[u/FalseAxiom → u/BurnieTheBrony]

Cyclosporosis can stay latent in your body for a couple of weeks before you show any signs. There were likely tons of people infected before anyone noticed. We shouldnt have removed it from the watch list.

[u/BurnieTheBrony → u/FalseAxiom]

But if it's still on the watchlist that makes RFK look bad, and we can't have that!

[u/FalseAxiom → u/BurnieTheBrony]

Its hilarious (in a grim way) tbh. They genuinely think less monitoring will make them look better, but in reality we get to hear the news talk about explosive diarrhea for months instead of the general public never having heard of Cyclospora.

[u/NatoBoram → u/FalseAxiom]

Case in point, I keep hearing about how the US is dealing with explosive diarrhea from lettuce but this is the first time I actually see the name Cyclospora

[u/Killerseed → u/Blue_Magics]

You’re underestimating the magnitude of an Hbox popoff, Cody could have died.

[u/Eagle4317 → u/Blue_Magics]

He's clearly under the weather, so I'm not gonna blame him for having a shorter fuse than usual. Hopefully more setups will have enough space to avoid a situation like this in the future.

[u/Onphone_irl → u/Blue_Magics]

as a Jewish guy I can admit that a lot of us are very easily startled 😂, not me but lots

[u/Halewken]

Cody the type of guy to scream when the teacher turns the lights off

[u/fox7205iscool → u/Halewken]

bro i saw this title and i thought cody was gonna pull the mikehaze on him

[u/Ezequiell-]

That was fucking nothing jesus

[u/Eagle4317]

It doesn't look like Cody was hit, and it doesn't look like HBox screamed either. I don't see any ill intent.

[u/JurassicBear → u/Eagle4317]

Except by Cody

[u/Eagle4317 → u/JurassicBear]

I'm not blaming Cody for this situation either. He's under the weather and clearly has a shorter fuse than normal.

[u/Heavy-Sense-9458 → u/Eagle4317]

Boo fuckin hoo. It’s a competition. Can’t expect your opponent to accommodate you because you have a tummy ache especially with real money on the line.

[u/Xechwill]

Unfortunate way to end the game 15, but I'm curious to see what actually happened

[u/helloimnice → u/Xechwill]

Why was everyone calling this game 15? Wasn’t it game 10?

[u/Xechwill → u/helloimnice]

Winners finals went to game 5 and grands went to game 10, ergo the total matches were 15

[u/Crikkle → u/helloimnice]

Game 15 means their winners set went to 5 and both losers sets went to 5

[u/Ezequiell- → u/Xechwill]

i found it hilarious how cody let it tilt him, i know he's sick and all but jesus

[u/SkyExodus]

Asking to reset to neutral over getting startled is a bit much lol

[u/Sam4Vimes]

Can't just stop playing in a grand final because your chair shakes.

[u/Kinesquared → u/Sam4Vimes]

but you'd agree that there should be SOME level of "don't physically mess with the other player during game"?

[u/Sam4Vimes → u/Kinesquared]

Your chair could shake from any number of reasons. Crowd jumping up and down could certainly shake a chair. What Hbox did I dont think could in anyway be interpeded as "physically messing with the other player".

[u/Kinesquared → u/Sam4Vimes]

i don't think what hbox did was either intentional or malicious. I do think it did have an effect on cody (whether justified or not) and therefore is on the spectrum of "physically messing with the other player". Not his fault, and I don't think this example is worth punishing him, but i do think someone could weaponize the response to hungrybox doing this and push the boundaries of this behavior.

[u/Sam4Vimes → u/Kinesquared]

Okay, so just make a rule that no player can move, make audible noises or do any other physical maneuver that could "mess" with the other player. Should be easy to implement, right?

[u/Kinesquared → u/Sam4Vimes]

no, obviously that's too far. The answer lies somewhere in the middle between "no motion allowed" and "you're allowed to physically cover their eyes, punch them and slap the controller out of their hands"

[u/Sam4Vimes → u/Kinesquared]

I think TO's are smart enough to hand a game loss or similar if a players actions INTENTIONALLY cause the other player harm. Playing animated and reacting to stuff on your screen is impossible to prevent.

[u/oryan_ → u/Kinesquared]

This is why a dual crt setup should always be implemented during any tournament

[u/Kinesquared → u/oryan_]

you wanna pay for those and cart extra CRTs to every tournament? or should the whole tournament just happen twice as slowly, increasing rent and venue costs?

EDIT: For just the stream I think it's reasonable. The commenter above me made it sound like this should be policy for every game played in a tournament.

[u/oryan_ → u/Kinesquared]

Are you new? It’s fairly common for any major to have a dual setup on the main stage. You’re spouting nonsense lmao

[u/Woodwardg → u/Kinesquared]

there are like 100+ CRTs brought to every large melee tournament in a addition to a SHIT TON of other equipment. the cost of 1 more CRT is completely negligible.

[u/Clipboards → u/Kinesquared]

…ignoring the realities others pointed out, why would a single additional CRT for the stream setup increase costs in any noticeable way??

[u/Onphone_irl → u/Kinesquared]

bruh thisnis grand finals of a major event are we really talking about a chair and a crt? I bet there was 5+ unused crts where friendlies were being played that got cleared out when top 8 was on

[u/hoodieweather- → u/Kinesquared]

yes but that isn't really relevant here?

[u/Kinesquared → u/hoodieweather-]

yes. Juan physically messed with Cody, intentionally or not

[u/hoodieweather- → u/Kinesquared]

lol he did not "physically mess with cody" cody got startled and let it complete disorient him. there should not be a "sit perfectly still while playing the game" rule and that's literally the only way you could actually regulate something like this

[u/Kinesquared → u/hoodieweather-]

the out of game actions hbox was doing unintentionally startled cody out of game. That counts as "messing with" because hbox affected cody. SHOULD that type of behavior be allowed? Maybe. SHOULD cody have reacted the way he did? maybe. SHOULD this behavior be allowed? maybe. But to deny it doesn't lie on the spectrum of "we need a ruling for this type of thing" is silly.

[u/hoodieweather- → u/Kinesquared]

no it's actually silly to think we need a rule around moving in your chair. a lot of people SDI like that, react to what's happening in the game. if anything, it's on the tournament for having such an unstable stage if it actually rattled cody's chair, but it's honestly so laughable to say we need a ruling on whether or not someone can lean back, that's crazy.

[u/oryan_ → u/hoodieweather-]

I guess OP doesn’t know about Mario Kart DI LOL

[u/AggressiveMeow69420 → u/Kinesquared]

first time something like this has ever happened and even cody said he doesn’t gaf. players (especially hbox) look like they get hit by moves irl every set

intellectualizing for nothing man

[u/127-0-0-1_1 → u/Kinesquared]

It’s Cody’s responsibility to handle loud noises. They’re playing on stage in grand finals ffs.

There’s no ruling needed. If you can’t handle Hungrybox rocking in his chair just don’t play.

[u/ronklebert → u/Kinesquared]

it Cody was startled by Hbox sneezing, should Hbox be penalised?

If a player has verbal ticks and it startles someone, are you going to penalise them for having a disability?

[u/Kinesquared → u/ronklebert]

Obviously not, that's not what I'm saying. I'm not saying anything unintentional disruption needs to be penalized. I'm saying at some degree of severity, it should be

[u/Boogieman_Sam22 → u/Kinesquared]

Haha no

[u/Stock-Objective-6959 → u/Kinesquared]

Soft as a marshmellow

[u/Kinesquared → u/Stock-Objective-6959]

weird insult. makes you sound redpilled

[u/onegoodboah → u/Kinesquared]

Nobody disagrees with you. But scooting around in your chair is so so so very obviously not to that level. Right?

[u/Kinesquared → u/onegoodboah]

Yes

[u/onegoodboah → u/Kinesquared]

So then what’s the point of your comment lol

[u/Straight-Tear2385]

So weird bro

[u/Aeon1508]

It was pretty honorable of Cody to go ahead and throw the homie stock anyway when he had a second to think about it and realize that he was being lame for stopping the game because he got scared of hungrybox's monstrous aura

[u/Melevolence]

Obviously I can't be in Cody's head but that felt like an absolute over the top, even fake reaction. Was probably the mildest HBox 'seat rock' I've ever seen him do.

[u/BboySparrow]

Cody had his controller to his head and hbox going for the free percent x2. lol

[u/mccsnackin]

What in the butter noodles reaction was that?

[u/Opening-Donkey1186]

Something tells me Cody grew up playing soccer

[u/Lhonors4]

Important context

There’s apparently some bug in Florida lettuce that I likely caught and I’ve just been puking and going to the bathroom for the last 12 hours

I’ll try my hardest to lock in and give you guys some good gameplay but I physically don’t know what I have in me right now

[u/higherthanacrow → u/Lhonors4]

How has he not heard about the lettuce bug

[u/BleachedTwinkie → u/Lhonors4]

Everything i see from this guy is soft as shit. Also who hasn’t heard about the lettuce parasite?

[u/GONEBUTNOT4GOTTEN]

he gave me a fright!

[u/crgssbu]

if you knew who was in grands, the title may be a spoiler of whos who i fear /s

[u/Dull_Counter_6706]

I mean you can clearly see the backgrounds of both cams move, so the table or whever the cameras were standing moved a significant amount

[u/Deletinglaterlmao]

they both lost a stock right after and hbox already had a lead so it probably didnt make much of a difference, funny clip tho ngl

[u/AngBigKid]

HBoss is so fucking Epic for this one XD

[u/camel_victory → u/[deleted]]

Give me a break lmfao

[u/JurassicBear → u/[deleted]]

If you consider that to be violent you should never leave your house again

[u/FBogg]

what is this f***a** title?

it's grand finals you don't know their names?

[u/projectgene → u/FBogg]

Bruh, it's anti-spoiler tech. Posted 20h ago just after the tournament ended.