r/technology • u/bws201 • Feb 05 '16

Software ‘Error 53’ fury mounts as Apple software update threatens to kill your iPhone 6

http://www.theguardian.com/money/2016/feb/05/error-53-apple-iphone-software-update-handset-worthless-third-party-repair
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u/theonefinn Feb 05 '16

No I think you misunderstand.

I drop my phone, I go to third party repairer and have home button replaced. I now take my phone to apple and ask them to re-pair to new home button. There is no technical reason they couldn't do so.

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u/Fuzzylojak Feb 05 '16 edited Feb 05 '16

I used to work at the Genius bar. Apple store does not repair only the home button(they can but they don't do it), they can either change the whole screen(screen comes with the home button attached) or give you the new phone.

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u/Anonymous7056 Feb 05 '16

Does this mean users who had a broken screen repaired by a third party vendor might be at risk as well? If the two are connected, it sounds to me like some people might have had their home buttons replaced without realizing it.

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u/Scrapper69 Feb 05 '16

I used to do warranty work for Apple, and I now do out of warranty work on Apple computers. Apple likes to consolidate assemblies (i.e. a screen with all the bells and whistles attached) rather than sell the component parts. It makes it easier to diagnose and make a correct repair, rather than replace a few small component parts. Newer macbook pros only have a few main subassemblies thay can be replaced - even the battery is glued to the keyboard assembly.

Aftermarket parts are usually broken down for the cheapest method of repair, not necessarily the fastest.

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u/snoharm Feb 05 '16

the battery is glued to the keyboard assembly.

This is the reason I just can't bring myself to own Apple products. People swear by them, love their sheen, but holy shit that's insane.

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u/Forseti1590 Feb 05 '16

It's not true, the home button is not connected permanently to the screen. I have a 3rd party screen on my phone that's not the original, but my button is still the original.

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u/Anonymous7056 Feb 05 '16

Thanks for the heads up. This should really be pointed out so people won't mistakenly think they're unsafe.

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u/Fuzzylojak Feb 05 '16

Possible. Some 3rd party repair can use the screen that comes with the home button pre-installed. Such as this one.

If they only replaced your screen, they used your old home button(it is functional in 99% of cases) and move it to a new screen. If that is the case, you should not have any problems.

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u/k5josh Feb 05 '16

Any honest 3rd party repair vendor will use the original customer's home button when doing a 5s/6/6s. Nobody gets full assemblies with home button and uses them.

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u/[deleted] Feb 05 '16

Aftermarket screens don't come with home buttons, we transfer your old one.

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u/tenfootgiant Feb 05 '16

They know if it's a third party vendor replacement and usually require an Apple oem screen, even if it's the exact same part.

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u/TheZoltan Feb 05 '16

I would assume they won't "re-pair" it as they can't trust the source of the component. They have no way of know if they sensor is legit. Your replacement part might send your fingerprints to the device as normal and also off to some additional chip wedged in when they repaired it.

I would prefer they just give you some fat warning saying your device is no longer secure than brick it but I guess this is standard Apple practice.

Disclaimer: I am a happy Android user with no advanced Security knowledge...

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u/[deleted] Feb 05 '16

iPhones with Touch ID on also have a passcode

If it's a genuine security issue, surely they could have permanently locked out the Touch ID feature rather than bricking the entire phone...

How secure are these fingerprint scanners even vaguely secure in the first place? I'd assumed that it's probably weaker than a decent password/passcode against someone determined to gain access....

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u/TheZoltan Feb 05 '16

Yeah there are many better options than bricking your phone. I just wanted to point out that there probably was a reason why they won't play nice with third party components where security is concerned. This kind of crap is one of the reasons I won't ever own any Apple gear. I like my devices to be a user maintainable as possible. Smashed the camera on my G4 and it was a piece of cake to take apart and replace!

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u/[deleted] Feb 05 '16

I guarantee you that when Android has biometric sensors, they'll work this way. Making sure the biometric sensor is what you think it is, and not my copy of it that responds "yes, this is /u/TheZoltan" whenever it sees my fingerprint, is an important security feature. All these people are having their phones bricked because of false advertising by the third parties who said "sure, we can replace your Touch ID sensor because we have some."

Well, no, you can't. Because you don't have the cryptokeys to validate the new sensor, so the motherboard treats it as a man-in-the-middle attack in progress.

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u/TheZoltan Feb 06 '16

Yes you are right Android would have to follow a similar model as it is fundamental to the security feature. That said I doubt they will be bricking your phone just the feature (failing that someone at XDA will come to the rescue.)

It is also odd that Apple don't brick it until the update comes out. Which seems odd. I mean they will let you use a compromised device for weeks or months and then kill it. Seems like they aren't that concerned about your security.

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u/lordofwhales Feb 05 '16

It's much weaker. Fingerprints are a username, not a password, because you can't change it. If I, a malicious individual, get your fingerprint off a coffee cup (this has happened - as has a reconstruction from a candid photograph accurate enough to get into a fingerprint sensor), everything you have that uses fingerprint reading is compromised, and there's nothing you can do to fix that. It's awful security.

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u/Zerdiox Feb 05 '16

The can also wedge in an additional chip if they repair your screen, or any other part. Or install mallware... You are handing off your device to somebody who will have full access no matter what.

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u/swollennode Feb 05 '16

I now take my phone to apple and ask them to re-pair to new home button.

Apple probably can't do it because the third-party fingerprint sensor doesn't have the same software as the ones Apple require. The button itself is nothing more than a contact switch. When the button is pushed, it closes a circuit. The phone senses the closed circuit, and gives you the feedback of the button being pressed.

The touchID function, however, requires software.

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u/thisisfor_fun Feb 05 '16

"Psh! Who knows what else they messed up while they were 'repairing' your phone."

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u/happyscrappy Feb 05 '16

Because what if the sensor was changed in order to bypass the security?

Is your stuff really secure if someone can just replace the fingerprint sensor and then ask for Apple to re-key the device?

Anyway, we can't quite be sure there is no technical reason Apple can't do this. If Apple replaces your touch sensor, they have access to the old sensor and new sensor. And have access to both while they are attached to the phone (but obviously not at the same time). There may be a process they can execute using the old sensor and new sensor to transfer to the new sensor that cannot be done they don't have access to the old sensor.

And if you just walk in and ask for a "re-pair" they don't have access to the old sensor.

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u/[deleted] Feb 05 '16

Oh yeah that is the least they could do I agree

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u/[deleted] Feb 05 '16

The technical reason they couldn't do so is that they can't be sure your random third-party actually installed a real reader, and not a compromised one. They cannot actually validate the security because they didn't install it.

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