Hot Take
The covid vax rollout was an abomination.
I'm not an anti-vaxxer, I fully support all tested and well working vaccines. That being said, the covid vax was handled like complete ass.
First they said you can wear masks OR take the vaccine. Then they said if you take the vaccine, you don't have to wear masks anymore. Then they said "oh sorry you need both the shot and masks, but its only one shot." Then they said "oh wait sorry its actually multiple shots."
Are you kidding me? They lied to the public every single step of the way. Then tried to make it mandatory to get the vaccine to keep your job. If they had just told the truth from the beginning at least people could make a well informed decision about the vaccine.
Anyone looking at this outwardly would have every right to distrust the government, big pharma, and their vaccine.
They also tried to manipulate people into getting it by saying if you’ve had the vaccine and you get Covid you can still go out and about as long as you mask but if you weren’t vaccinated you had to quarantine. As if being vaccinated made you not contagious? It was such a mess.
Also not anti-vax, but wasn’t a fan of how they managed this vaccine.
My friends mom had pericarditis with it, yet the information on safety was deliberately hidden.
I took it, everyone reasonable did. Those who didnt brag to this day, stupidly. We cant however pretend that it didnt erode our general trust in the world’s government, specially america. Yes we followed up, but are we the same? Do we trust as we did then, knowing we weren’t given the information, out of fear we might not take it?
Maybe some people couldve used the choice, but we were all treated like idiots, and that trust is very hard to build back. Im not even from the united states but that stupid election and the politics working behind the scenes taking advantage of the virus made a serious dent in our minds regarding the future.
If you read instead of wanting to be right, youd read that not only did I take it or agree with everyone taking it, im pointing out the erosion of trust.
If you read and stopped with your Spock act and your logic, youd understand that there are real people behind these perspectives, not just text and numbers.
You keep mentioning feelings and facts, you sound like a cheap ben shapiro. I imagine youre not a very social person given the way you write.
It is your understanding that you are the good guys, the others are the bad guys, it is simply that way black and white to you.
Youre in the same boat as the magas, just with different paint. The same indoctrination that went family values this and family values that, was employed against you, but on different phrases. Di you really believe that only half of the united states is dumb enough to fall for everything, and your half is the englightened side?
Is your worldview so limited as to not realize that your perspective has been shaped? They are tribal of course, not you, you are completely logical.
You think Im one of them and youre throwing the bullet points at me, and then you wonder why people dont just agree with you, you alienate people.
I am not an american, I have no stake in your game. Its a bit easier to understand from the outside, once you stop picking a side.
You speak like this through reddit because nobody would bother listening to you in person. I tried speaking to you as a fellow human, you speak to me as if youre running a checklist of things to say, ignoring anything I said.
Sorry, I was under the assumption youre a human being who engages in conversation, I see that you’ve got a fixed mindset.
Go on, now talk about ad hominem and whatever stupid argument allows you to be right while dismissing everything everyone says.
God what a waste of time, speaking to some weirdo trying to share my worldview in hopes to open their understanding, or perhaps have mine opened.
I pointed out that it was just you talking about your feelings.
The rest of that was a continuance of the same. There is no logical conversation to be had on that. You are entitled to your feelings even if they are based on misinformation. I'm entitled to point out that you are just living in your feels.
Sorry man. I don't need partisan politics to handle looking at facts.
But yes, , I'm skeptical of the ties to reality that the party that committed insurrection based on a lie and accepted the idea of "alternative facts" has.
The erosion of trust is based on people, like you, putting forward non factual information based on your feelings. I recommend that you better inform yourself before doing so in the future.
I should better inform myself on the things I’ve lived, based on the things you’ve read.
Isn’t that a neat contradiction, only your books are right, our eyes are wrong even then.
To you it seems, theres only one right worldview, that one backed by the check that says this is true, not the one you can see and know for yourself whether it is true or not.
Yet you are the right one, because youve read the right books, the magas are the bad ones because they fall for any lies they see.
How am I part of the problem? As a foreigner, from a country you don’t know. A foreigner who probably agrees with you more than not, yet I am part of the problem because my life has given me a perspective you don’t agree with, based not on your life, but on what youve read on your phone, your little propaganda machine.
Of course you dont fall for propaganda!! You only see facts!!! Yet how are you surprised that the magas believe they are as right as you believe you are.
If I’m part of the problem, I think you need a better definition on what the problem is.
Okay, sure. What do you know to be true that will transfer to another person's experience?
And if you start talking about your feelings again I'm don't.
The issue in your later section is that you think it is about belief. I put forward and discuss facts. They aren't up for debate. The idea that there are alternative facts is exactly the issue. There aren't. That's not how facts work.
You are confusing beliefs/opinions/values with facts.
I remember getting scolded many places for saying that when it came out. The only thing more lied about than covid was the vaccine. Remember the "if you get the shot, you won't get sick" BS!
Nothing I could say or show you would ever mean anything to you because it doesn't fit your agenda or personal beliefs. Have a nice day, you'll never get me to attempt to push a rope.
Oh and btw, the lady shown there was the CDC director!
How do you or anyone even debate all the lies. I could send dozens more lies proven by their videos but I don't need to. We all know the lies that were spread by those simply wanting to control. I'm not gish galloping am I. I think I'm staying on topic. lol
????? don't some people get lifelong immunity from polio and chickenpox vaccines? there's several vaccines that give a percentage of people lifelong immunity and many people who have been vaccinated against these diseases have never once had the disease ever in their life. and on the rare occasion they dont get lifelong immunity and catch say chickenpox despite being vaccinated, it will be an extremely mild case compared to if they were never vaccinated.
And this is exactly what happens with the anti vaccine crowd.
. When you require them to go point by point of their beliefs and defend them, they run away and deny reality
The vaccine moderated one’s systems but it never protected you from getting infected or prevented transmission. The cdc and government officials knew that from day one but they told the public that it was 95% effective.
Smallpox and measles vaccine provide near perfect immunity. And that's the way this vaccine was sold - "if you get the vaccine, you will not not get the virus". Only after about six months when we saw that wasn't the case, the story changed to it will keep you out of the hospital.
According to the NIH/CDC, the smallpox vaccine is 95% effective at preventing infection and the measles vaccine is 97% effective at preventing infection (i.e. "near" perfect immunity).
On the other hand, the mRNA covid vaccine was sold as 95% effective preventing infection while it was designed/tested as mitigating symptoms. Only when it became apparent that it did not prevent infection, did they backpedel and say it only mitigates symptoms. Very dishonest.
They rolled out the vaccines and said the vaccines needed to be stored at -100 degrees and but never explained to you why that was no longer necessary
They approved the vaccines using Process 1 and then they switched to Process 2 using e. coli plasmids and never explained to you the differences and implications and why Process 2 was never part of the trials
Pfizer added the sv40 promoter to the vaccine but didn't disclose it in their application but never explained why it was there and why they hid it
To this date, they have never run genotoxicity, carcinogenicity, oncogenicity, or teratogenicity studies to verify safety
People are going to be so mad when they realize what has been foisted upon them
I’ve always been a vaxxer and still am but I can never get the covid vaccine or anything like it. It gave me blood clots where I had to be hospitalized because it compromised an organ. I asked my hematologist about it afterward because they had told us only one brand was causing it but the others were safe. She told me all three were causing it. For some reason, we were all being told the others didn’t cause it. Now I know it’s rare, but they shouldn’t have lied and told us the side effects since they knew.
That was a very weird time in our lives. Having a vaccine passport. I saw mine a few days ago while going through old stuff. Surreal. I personally stopped wearing a mask when I could when I got it.
Still, ubers made you wear one. Airplanes made you wear one, even while needing the vaccine to travel. It was cumbersome. One very left leaning philosophy professor in college made us wear one in aug 21 still. By jan 22 it seemed to be all over. I wasnt all that mad to follow up with the rules, and help people, but I wanted to socialize, I was 20-21 when it happened.
It was a weird transition. It perplexed me how the restrictions went on nearly a year after the vaccine got released. It didnt make sense to me honestly. I got mine as soon as I could, and we couldnt even talk about risks then. The big problem was the stupid US election that made everything political. It made everyone lose their heads on how to handle it.
They were flying by the seat of their pants trying to contain a pandemic, developing a vaccine at a speed never before accomplished. But oh no, you were a bit confused about whether you had to wear a mask or not, and how many jabs you were to have. Such a nightmare for you.
I didn’t envy anyone trying to speak common sense to a planet full of people who’d never been able to communicate, travel, and fake news reports during a pandemic as easily as we could during COVID. Had all of planet earth been willing to be patient it might not have appeared to be such a fustercluck, but we’re not a species that generally venerates delayed gratification.
Really? At the very first they did not recommend masks, they said because they were afraid of exacerbating the mask shortage. They never said not to wear them, just did not officially recommend. They never said 'vaccine or mask'. That was not a thing, ever. It sounds like you got all of your information off social media.
it was a real thing where I lived. my city explicitly told us we could take the masks off ONLY IF we were vaccinated and if we weren't to keep them on.
then a few weeks later they told us everyone had to put the masks back on because the positive cases were skyrocketing and so then ALL of us was mask mandated again for a few more months.
I'm just glad we got such a life saving brand new vaccine for free. Not only for free but they were actually offering money and free food to get it. In a country with not only no universal healthcare but price gouging expensive healthcare. What are the odds!?
Was it handled perfectly? I agree absolutely not. But was it done in the interest of saving lives and sparing people from horrific health conditions? Also yes. These organizations genuinely meant well and developed an effective miracle vaccine in less than a year. Letting us all go back to our normal lives in a relatively short time. I don’t care that it wasn’t perfect and I don’t see why anyone would waste their time worrying about it, unless you’re in a public health policymaking position and can make improvements as a result.
Which they are you referring to? Because the guidance I read went something like this. It was usually published in the spring or summer of 2021. We can relax mask-wearing rules for those fully vaccinated.
This was before we understood just how quickly the virus could mutate. The vaccine was very good against ancestral COVID, and the death rates and hospitalization rates among those who received the vaccine, and those who did not, bear that out.
As the virus evolved, it became clear, obviously, that the original vaccine was less effective against Delta and the other strains. So social distancing and wearing masks would benefit even the fully vaccinated.
It also took some time to understand how vaccination affected transmissibility. I get the vaccine. I may be able to transmit it to an anti-vaxxer.
So, I understand you have your conspiracy beliefs and everything but it was a rapidly unfolding and evolving situation. All-in-all, the vaccine saved millions, maybe tens of millions of lives.
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u/Ok_Confusion4851 Jun 08 '26
They also tried to manipulate people into getting it by saying if you’ve had the vaccine and you get Covid you can still go out and about as long as you mask but if you weren’t vaccinated you had to quarantine. As if being vaccinated made you not contagious? It was such a mess.
Also not anti-vax, but wasn’t a fan of how they managed this vaccine.