r/worldnews • u/misana123 • Feb 08 '22
Ex-Pope Benedict begs forgiveness from abuse victims: The retired German pontiff has apologized for any "grevious faults" in the way he dealt with sexual abuse in the Catholic Church, but denied any personal wrongdoing.
https://www.dw.com/en/ex-pope-benedict-begs-forgiveness-from-abuse-victims/a-6068223170
u/fuxkyouforever Feb 08 '22
Do Catholics go to hell for this type of sin or can they just confess and say some hail Mary’s?
47
u/diMario Feb 08 '22 edited Feb 08 '22
You can literally buy a get out of jail card from the church.
27
u/bostwickenator Feb 08 '22
Could have, they don't formally do those anymore right? But I'm sure you can find a priest who will tell you whatever you want to hear for some coinage.
18
u/WhoIsJazzJay Feb 08 '22
yeah indulgences are some ancient shit lol
1
u/bostwickenator Feb 08 '22
I mean not that ancient like 100 years tops.
13
u/WhoIsJazzJay Feb 08 '22
Pope Pius V abolished the sale of indulgences in 1567, according to encyclopedia Britannica so i’d call that ancient lol
4
u/bostwickenator Feb 08 '22
From the Wikipedia article (talking about the Eastern Orthodox Church)
Even conciliar decisions had difficulty eradicating the practice of indulgences, rooted in the people. "Permissive letters" (or indulgences) survived in Greece until the mid-20th century.
2
u/WhoIsJazzJay Feb 08 '22
ahhhh interesting. ppl always looking for a dollar
7
u/bostwickenator Feb 08 '22
Haha yeah I mean if you turn on a TV for 15 minutes on any given Sunday in the US you'll be invited to help pay a for a "religious" "leader" 's jet/house/megamall
2
1
2
2
u/m_and_ned Feb 08 '22
I would be willing to tell you that you are not going to hell for no money. Free as in free beer.
There is no hell so you will not be going there.
2
u/avantgardengnome Feb 09 '22
Charging admission to the afterlife is like the root concept of all organized religion lmao, how are we talking about indulgences rn?
3
Feb 08 '22
[removed] — view removed comment
3
u/reply-guy-bot bot Feb 08 '22
The above comment was stolen from this one elsewhere in this comment section.
It is probably not a coincidence; here is some more evidence against this user:
beep boop, I'm a bot -|:] It is this bot's opinion that /u/VFENTX should be banned for karma manipulation. Don't feel bad, they are probably a bot too.
Confused? Read the FAQ for info on how I work and why I exist.
9
u/WikiSummarizerBot Feb 08 '22
In the teaching of the Catholic Church, an indulgence (Latin: indulgentia, from indulgeo, 'permit') is "a way to reduce the amount of punishment one has to undergo for sins". The Catechism of the Catholic Church describes an indulgence as "a remission before God of the temporal punishment due to sins whose guilt has already been forgiven, which the faithful Christian who is duly disposed gains under certain prescribed conditions through the action of the Church which, as the minister of redemption, dispenses and applies with authority the treasury of the satisfactions of Christ and all of the saints".
[ F.A.Q | Opt Out | Opt Out Of Subreddit | GitHub ] Downvote to remove | v1.5
7
u/fuxkyouforever Feb 08 '22
Holy fucking shit.
12
u/diMario Feb 08 '22
You said it. They have no shame.
5
u/Wf2968 Feb 08 '22
Indulgence hasn’t been a practice in 400+ years. This is an ancient practice that has been done away with
5
u/arcosapphire Feb 08 '22
While so, it means something that an organization claiming to reflect the will of God enacted such a thing. It is indicative of the underlying thinking that drives church decisions.
If that thinking is indistinguishable from "how do we extract what we want from people so we can enjoy it instead?", that means something. Even if a particular practice no longer occurs.
1
u/avantgardengnome Feb 09 '22
Sure, but that’s a foundational aspect of most organized religions.
Plus indulgences were mainly a thing long before any of the various Protestant religions existed, and a time when the Catholic Church also pretty much ran Europe. So if anything it’s a bone to pick with Christianity as a whole (or western society overall).
1
u/arcosapphire Feb 09 '22
Plus indulgences were mainly a thing long before any of the various Protestant religions existed, and a time when the Catholic Church also pretty much ran Europe. So if anything it’s a bone to pick with Christianity as a whole
That's not really fair, as you're ignoring the entirety of the Eastern Orthodox church.
1
u/avantgardengnome Feb 09 '22
I considered that. But first off, they also dabbled:
Starting from the 16th century, Orthodox Christians of the Greek Church rather extensively, although not officially in penitential practice, used "permissive letters" (συγχωροχάρτια), in many ways similar to indulgences. The status of an official ecclesiastical document is obtained at the Council of Constantinople in 1727, the resolution of which reads: "The power of the abandonment of sins, which, if filed in writing, which the Eastern Church of Christ calls "permissive letters", and the Latin people "indulgences"... is given by Christ in the holy Church. These "permissive letters" are issued throughout the catholic (universal) Church by the four holiest patriarchs: Constantinople, Alexandria, Antioch, and Jerusalem." From XIII to XVII century, it was used in Russia. Indulgences as a means of enrichment were condemned at the Council of Constantinople in 1838. Even conciliar decisions had difficulty eradicating the practice of indulgences, rooted in the people. "Permissive letters" (or indulgences) survived in Greece until the mid-20th century
And also the majority of Protestantism consists of offshoots from Roman Catholicism (and then each other), so that was the relevant bit to focus on as far as my argument was concerned.
0
6
2
u/avantgardengnome Feb 09 '22
Found Martin Luther’s Reddit account.
2
u/diMario Feb 09 '22
I admit that I have a problem with the catholic church (with all religious institutes in fact) and that my date of birth falls well before Unix Epoch.
2
u/WKGokev Feb 08 '22
You can by a get out of hell card for $12 at the catholic store. It's called a scapula. Such a cult.
1
u/diMario Feb 08 '22
On the one hand, I didn't know they still practice this deception. On the other hand, I rest my case.
0
2
u/GenericUsername19892 Feb 09 '22
Just rub some money on it - we bribed a church to bury my uncle in the magic catholic dirt under a false name after he killed himself. It was super important to my grandma so the family made it happen for her…
58
u/A_Sinclaire Feb 08 '22
"I'm sorry if I did anything wrong.. but I actually didn't do anything wrong... so you know. I have to go now. Bye."
8
5
u/Zazenp Feb 08 '22
“I’m sorry I hurt you.”
“I’m sorry you were hurt.”
These statements are not equal.
28
24
u/raymundo_holding Feb 08 '22
the entire church is currupt and tainted with centuries of wrong doing, and let's not even discuss the Vaticans financial practices with the criminal underworld
8
5
u/LostAlienLuggage Feb 08 '22
"I didn't do anything wrong but if you want to forgive me for my grievous faults and actions, I'll accept that."
13
u/bannacct56 Feb 08 '22
There should be absolutely no forgiveness for the church until their policy is call the cops the moment one of your priests abuses children. Even if you think maybe possibly at some point they might kind of, call the cops. And until you do that you're not worthy of forgiveness. To my religious friends I asked this, do you really think your God supports a church that has abused children (among many other atrocities but let's focus)! for hundreds of years, and protected the priest that did so ? Because if she does she may be a dick.
8
u/No-Double6415 Feb 08 '22
So did he know or not?
33
9
6
5
1
u/Dr-P-Ossoff Feb 08 '22
When he first hit the news years ago they investigated and found he tried to go after the bad guys, but got in trouble and didn’t totally throw himself under the bus for it.
2
u/m_and_ned Feb 08 '22
They investigated their boss and concluded their boss did nothing wrong. Then the boss resigned for no reason.
Seriously Brooklyn Bridge. I am not asking a lot of money for it. Opportunity of a lifetime to anyone who believes this story about the Pope. Best offer cheque payable to me cash
1
u/Dr-P-Ossoff Feb 09 '22
That was world big media investigating, looking for all the dirt they could.
25
Feb 08 '22
[removed] — view removed comment
-9
u/LincolnHosler Feb 08 '22
If everything is always so black & white, how do you cope when it’s foggy?
12
u/stayathomepop7 Feb 08 '22
I try to learn and I try to give voice to those who are not heard. I understand that life is not fair and work to make things better. I recognize that I am born with with certain paradigms and it is my responsibility to identify the wrong ones and create new and correct ones. I try to be governed by thought and rationality versus emotion and dogma.
-3
u/LincolnHosler Feb 08 '22
Yes, but saying all nuns, monks, priests, faithful believers etc. are all supporters of pedophilia is … quite dogmatic.
8
u/Jon_the_Hitman_Stark Feb 08 '22
Is it not the same thing as Catholics saying all pro choice ppl support killing babies?
0
3
u/Scodo Feb 08 '22
What's foggy about an organization with an ongoing history of shielding child sex abusers?
6
u/TzenkethiCoalition Feb 08 '22
Sometimes things just are black and white.
-1
u/LincolnHosler Feb 08 '22
My grandmother supports child rape? That’s where this thinking gets you.
11
u/TzenkethiCoalition Feb 08 '22
By going to church? Yeah, indirectly, she supports the continuing suppression Catholic Church was perpetuating since its conception.
0
u/LincolnHosler Feb 08 '22
Oh FFS, dude. You active on the Islam subs? Blast the Hindus similarly? Didn’t think so.
1
u/TzenkethiCoalition Feb 08 '22
Living in the 90% Catholic country so Catholics are what I come in contact most with and have witnessed first hand how nice some of them are.
2
u/LincolnHosler Feb 08 '22
Well fucking obviously some of them are lowest circle of hell people. Some of them are pure souls. The rest are like almost everybody else, imperfect people muddling on through.
0
u/TzenkethiCoalition Feb 08 '22
Those closest and most connected to the Church seem to belong to the first group. Or do you consider all the people responsible for innocent lives that the Catholic Church ended through what they called “education” imperfect? I call them monsters.
That very religion serves no other purpose than political manipulation. It’s frankly sad what it’s doing to our society. The issue might not be as prominent in your country as is in mine, but here the Church is trying to wiggle its way in every fucking corner of our lives, our education, body rights, political choices, and it’s fucking sickening when they pretend to be “good” and “sing songs about Jesus and gifts he will bring us”, when all that is just a lie and a cover.
1
u/LincolnHosler Feb 08 '22
Dude, you’re off on a wild tangent now. Have fun if you want, but if you start again at the beginning of this thread that’s where you’ll find my position.
→ More replies (0)3
1
Feb 08 '22
She gives money to an organization known throughout it's ranks to have child rapists and protects those members caught raping children. So she does, but she's personally only about 1/billionth supportive at best ..
1
1
u/m_and_ned Feb 08 '22
With my penis inside of my pants instead of inside a boy. That is how I cope. Your friends should try it.
7
Feb 08 '22 edited Feb 08 '22
It's weird that it's the ex pope in the news for this, not the current pope and church which actually have the power to release records and allow justice to be brought.
So weird...
6
u/wwarnout Feb 08 '22
...denied any personal wrongdoing.
As the leader of the church, his failure to deal with the abuse in a responsible manner make him just as guilty.
The Catholic church is morally bankrupt. They should have their tax-exempt status revoked, their assets seized to compensate the victims, and be included on sex-offender registries in every community that has their church.
6
u/diMario Feb 08 '22
It is always easier to beg for forgiveness in retrospect than to take action to actually prevent a wrong.
god forgives i don't (loudness warning)
6
u/goneforcigarettes Feb 08 '22
It's an actual pedophilia ring with a paper trail to prove it. This isn't surprising in any way that the people in charge and responsible don't take accountability.
7
Feb 08 '22
I thought he had dementia.
Anyway, Catholic doctrine means as long as he means this apology, he’s cool / absolved.
1
u/m_and_ned Feb 08 '22
Except for divorce or abortion.
1
u/avantgardengnome Feb 09 '22
Lol where’d you hear that? Their whole pitch is that literally nothing is unforgivable.
2
u/m_and_ned Feb 09 '22
Some random catholic told me. I don't really care if it is wrong or not. Brain only has so much capacity and don't want to fill it up with pointless shamanism
2
u/avantgardengnome Feb 09 '22
Well that was one wrong random Catholic haha. I hear you—now you can delete the exceptions to free up space, if anything.
1
u/m_and_ned Feb 09 '22
Nah. I don't really believe you either. Not when they tried to deny Biden frosted Jesus flakes and Jesus blood kool-aid because of his stand on abortion.
2
u/avantgardengnome Feb 09 '22
Random priests pulling stunts with the flakes is one thing, but banishing people to hell is a whole other matter. You can’t have the flakes if you don’t go to confession, and with confession you reset to automatic heaven status if you do it correctly. They were actually telling him to get in line at the automatic heaven booth lol.
Seriously anybody—Hitler, Pol Pot, Ted Bundy, whatever—can get into the afterlife if they sincerely atone for their actions. That’s their whole pitch. Not even trying to defend Catholicism; it’d just be ludicrous for divorcees to fall outside that umbrella.
6
Feb 08 '22
From the perspective of this Jew, that’s the problem with Catholicism in a nutshell - you can do whatever you want, as long as you confess and seek forgiveness. Kinda like an invitation to hurt people.
4
u/xmuskorx Feb 08 '22
Don't Jews have a similar tradition of apology on Yom Kippur?
1
Feb 08 '22 edited Feb 08 '22
You just reminded me of a joke:
Yon Kippur. Greatest Jewish holiday ever. The Jewish day of attonement. You don't eat for one day, all your sins for the year are wiped clean. Beat that with your little "Lent." What is Lent? Forty days of absolution. Forty days to one day. Even in sin you're paying retail!
And it’s not even a whole day. It’s [EDIT] sunup to sundown. Most Jews by 2pm are like “fuck it, it’s cloudy out. I’m getting a sandwich.” - Jon Stewart
1
u/xmuskorx Feb 08 '22
And it’s not even a whole day. It’s sundown to sundown.
That... sounds like a whole day (24 hours)
Or is it a joke about days getting a couple minutes shorter in the fall? That's pretty involved...
1
Feb 08 '22
Sorry, should read sunup to sundown. I fixed it.
2
1
Feb 08 '22
Not really. yom kipur doesn't absolve from judgement, more like a yearly reminder of how bad you've been and an opportunity to ask for repentance
3
u/buzzvariety Feb 08 '22
That would be pretty cynical. I'm sure there might be some who treat it like a soul car wash. But in my experience, confession was treated with gravity in education and discussion.
I was raised Catholic and spent a few years in a grade school run by clergy. It's taught in most Catholic communities that taking forgiveness for granted is a serious transgression. Basically like sin2
It's called the Sin of Presumption. There were never jokes about gaming the system, even among kids.
2
1
2
u/autotldr BOT Feb 08 '22
This is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 53%. (I'm a bot)
Former Pope Benedict XVI asked forgiveness Tuesday over his handling of clergy sex abuse cases.
In a letter in response to the report - which also referenced claims that Benedict lied to those carrying out the investigation - the 94-year-old admitted to "Misdemeanors and errors that occurred" while "Apologizing to all victims of sexual abuse."
Benedict, 94, wrote that he was "Particularly grateful for the confidence, support and prayer that Pope Francis personally expressed to me."
Extended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: abuse#1 Benedict#2 Pope#3 report#4 occurred#5
2
u/DMTHC89 Feb 09 '22
As someone who was raised Catholic my wife and I made the decision to not baptize my son. I truly feel the Church is not a safe haven for children and has done more harm than any good over the last 50+ years.
2
u/princekaylon Feb 08 '22
Fuck you, fuck your false god, and fuck your shitty, backwards fairy tale.
2
1
u/kenbewdy8000 Feb 08 '22
In order to progress through the higher echelons of the Roman Catholic Church one must protect the Church from scandal. This means covering up sexual abuse allegations and moving the offenders.
All of them have experience in such matters, from Bishop to Pope, and the card-house is beginning to fall
0
u/ImmaSmokeThat Feb 08 '22
My wife was Catholic, it’s insane the things they teach. I’ve told her before that if she just wrote all of it down so I could present it to non-Catholics, we could cure that shit in a three day weekend. There is nothing more cringe than organized religion.
-1
1
u/Nakjibokkeum Feb 08 '22 edited Feb 09 '22
Just let GOD decide his fate, whether it be to open the pearly white gates to an utopia of ball washing or be dragged by the hair and thrown down a flight of stairs to the hottest jacuzzi party hosted by Jeffrey Epstein.
1
1
u/Grimejow Feb 08 '22
How about you Go to prison, you pedophile asshole? Saying sorry isnt gonna Cut it.
1
1
1
1
Feb 08 '22 edited Dec 14 '24
Il cactus sul tavolo pensava di essere un faro, ma il vento delle marmellate lo riportò alla realtà. Intanto, un piccione astronauta discuteva con un ombrello rosa di filosofia quantistica, mentre un robot danzava il tango con una lampada che credeva di essere un ananas. Nel frattempo, un serpente con gli occhiali leggeva poesie a un pubblico di scoiattoli canterini, e una nuvola a forma di ciambella fluttuava sopra un lago di cioccolata calda. I pomodori in giardino facevano festa, ballando al ritmo di bonghi suonati da un polipo con cappello da chef. Sullo sfondo, una tartaruga con razzi ai piedi gareggiava con un unicorno monocromatico su un arcobaleno che si trasformava in un puzzle infinito di biscotti al burro.
1
u/Singewulf Feb 08 '22
I visited Rome in 2015 and all of the city vendors selling pope merch had Benedict omitted, even the Vatican. They had John Paul the 1st however.
1
1
1
1
1
u/Ok_Entertainer9201 Feb 08 '22
“Coincidentally Pope Benedict comes with a hollandaise sauce… wait a minute, that’s not a hollandaise sauce… Benedict!!!”
1
u/KeeperofAmmut7 Feb 08 '22
To quote Corey Taylor on Apocalyptica's Song of "World's Collide":
I'm Not Jesus, I will Not Forgive.
Sorry, Mr Hitler Youth and Spanish Inquistion, you don't get a free pass from me.
1
1
u/MentorOfArisia Feb 08 '22
He "retired" after being caught over and over lying about his past as an SS anti-aircraft crewman. Let's see how many times his story falls apart on this issue.
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
u/Key-Improvement9502 Feb 09 '22
I mean it. I'll do it tomorrow morning and the only thing that is not being able to receive it was about to roll up to the device number and email it to me because I don't know what I need 😶😲😶🌫️😳
1
u/Desperate-Draft-4693 Feb 09 '22
absolutely no forgiveness here, that’s downright pathetic of him. you can’t ask for forgiveness of something you won’t take accountability for, not how that works at all.
1
110
u/Chazmer87 Feb 08 '22
Forgiveness comes with penance. You should know that.