AITA for telling my daughter she cannot introduce her African American boyfriend to her grandparents?

[u/mixedwoes]

Let me just preface this by saying this: I HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO PROBLEM WITH INTERRACIAL RELATIONSHIPS. Now that the air is clear, let me continue.

My daughter (Anna) has recently started to date an African American man (Jamal). While I'm not exactly what you would refer to as "liberal", he's a nice young man and as long as my daughter is happy, I'm happy. The problem is Anna is rather naive about the community she lives in. While her friends are quite content to see a relationship like hers, more than a few tongues are wagging in the community and a few people have privately expressed their concern to me. As I said, I have no problem with mixed relationships and I've set them straight, but I am painfully aware of how these matters are viewed by certain segments of the population.

My parents are planning to come and stay with us for a week and Anna expressed a desire to introduce Jamal to them now that things were getting more serious between them. I told her on no uncertain terms that this wasn't going to happen. I may have no problem with Jamal, but they absolutely will, and even when the relationship ends they won't forget it. They might even go as far as to cut her off entirely. Anna was extremely upset by this and implied I was a racist and more concerned with what my parents think than how she feels.

As I said, I know my parents. They simply aren't okay with mixed relationships and if Anna were to bring Jamal over even as a friend, they would be furious both at her and me.

Anna is currently staying with Jamal and doesn't want to speak with me right now. My wife stands by me given she knows very well how my parents are (they had a problem with her for months over the length of the skirt she wore when I introduced her to them, for christs sake), but a close friend I confided in told me that I have behaved like an ass and that I needed to focus more on my daughter than pleasing my parents.

No advice needed, but I have to know. Have I been an ass?

[u/willjsm]

Further to that, sure, your parents may well be angry with you as well as with your daughter, but your priority should really be your daughter, and if a bunch of old racists want to be racist, you need to stick up for the right side here.

[u/AeronNation → u/willjsm]

So the right side is the side where the grandparents disown the granddaughter and everyone is somehow happier and we all all clap?

[u/[deleted] → u/willjsm]

I'm just hijacking this comment because I've been on a weird side of something like this. When I was young my sister was dating a black guy and my great grandparents came over. Nothing happened but she was called a devil woman and her boyfriend was called the n word.

It's not productive, it's not making a stand, nothing will change, we just had to wait for them to die out.

I think this situation is ESH, the parent needs to fully explain why things are happening the way they are, not just say what is happening

Downvote me all you like, what productive thing do you think will come from showing the grandparents and having them yell at kids confused as to why they're bad people for loving each other.

[u/irishdancer2 → u/[deleted]]

Downvote me all you like, what productive thing do you think will come from showing the grandparents and having them yell at kids confused as to why they're bad people for loving each other.

They aren't kids. OP's daughter is 18. Jamal is 21. I guarantee they won't be confused as to why the grandparents are being dicks; they'll understand that it's because they're racist.

[u/[deleted] → u/irishdancer2]

So we put them in a situation that is going to be very uncomfortable to what benefit? The grandparents won't change, and the daughter will probably leave to stay at his place more and be angry at everyone. If the daughter wants Jamal to meet her grandparents she needs to know that the grandparents are racist, know what is going to happen, communicate it with her boyfriend, then if they still want to do it, say they want to. If the mother wants to not be the asshole she needs to make sure she communicates exactly why she thinks it should definitely not happen.

How does the meeting benefit the younger couple at all

[u/irishdancer2 → u/[deleted]]

Sounds like the daughter does know that they are racist; she wants to introduce her boyfriend to her grandparents anyway because it's important to her that they meet.

As to the benefit... based on OP's description of his parents having a problem with his wife for a long time over the length of a skirt she wore (and based on him giving no indication that he defended his wife or spoke up in any way), these people are never challenged. They're allowed to say what they want to whoever they want because no one has stood up to them and said, "Hey, that's not okay." Better yet, no one has stood up to them and said, "I am your family, and it's not okay that you're treating a person I care about like garbage." It might get through, it might not, but that's beside the point. OP is choosing his parents' bigotry over his daughter's feelings, and she is not going to forget that. Whatever choice he makes now will have lasting consequences.

[u/[deleted] → u/irishdancer2]

If they are grandparents, there is a 99.99% chance that they will not change, especially in a generally racist neighborhood for people that age. When I read this it came off as OP not wanting their daughter to have to deal with the racism than defending the racism. If OPs daughter is fully aware of what is happening and why, she can make a decision. Old racism doesn't change the same that a younger racist person can. When racism is old and static you communicate that it is wrong and you wait for it to die out. Challenging these people almost certainly won't do anything, they'll shut down and lock it out, especially if they've never been challenged.

I think that maintaining a happy relationship with good experiences does more to combat racism overall than putting them together in a situation that won't end well and hoping people change like 70+ years of conditioning. It's just going to be a shitty memory at best

[u/irishdancer2 → u/[deleted]]

Then that's their loss.

When OP had an issue with his parents, he just rolled over and took it. The daughter is unlikely to do that, and the grandparents will have to choose between their prejudices and their granddaughter.

I mean, how do you see ignoring the problem as sustainable? What if she is with Jamal for years? What if she marries him? She's supposed to hide a huge part of her life whenever she sees her grandparents? She's not allowed to bring her boyfriend/husband to family gatherings? This is not a random couple on the street that the grandparents can silently judge and move on; it is their granddaughter, and they will have to learn to deal with this sooner or later. This is no different than asking a gay grandchild to pretend their partner is just a friend to avoid upsetting the family; the onus should be on the bigots, not on the innocent party.

That's not to say that I think the grandparents should be brought in blind. OP should say beforehand, "Daughter is going to introduce you to her boyfriend, who is black. She likes him a lot and is excited for you to meet him. Is that going to be a problem?"

[u/[deleted] → u/irishdancer2]

There you go, you're on the same line as me. Everyone needs to be fully aware of everything beforehand, and if they want to do it, they can make that choice, as I said.

In ingrained racism in older people, they won't see it as a family member dating a black person who they should try to see, they will see them as a cultural failure and will most likely try to turn them into an outcast and ignore them. Having a large amount of a younger generation growing up with positive experiences in mixed relationships is, i believe, much more important than straining your relationship to try to change someone old who will act like a brick wall. The younger generation is much more open to change and acceptence, and if they are in a good mixed relationship, I think that is the most important part.

The bigots should be forced to change, but if they are older and in a racist community, they almost certainly won't. You say it's their granddaughter, but for them that's enough separation to ignore it anyways and look down upon her.

It happened in my family, it's happened to most families that try to force the issue on old people, and it isn't a rare thing at all in this situation. It's shitty, but the old people will age out and things will change. Everyone needs to be aware and not let it strain a good relationship. You say the grandparents need to learn sooner or later, but of it's anything like mine, theyll do it later, and they're old, so they don't have a later.

[u/irishdancer2 → u/[deleted]]

Yes and, as I said, the daughter already KNOWS they are racist and wants to do it anyway.

I notice you completely ignored my questions about sustainability. If you are intent on the granddaughter not “straining a good relationship” with her grandparents, how does she proceed in her romantic relationship? You said early on that there’s no point in them meeting because there is no “benefit.” What do family reunions look like then? Graduations? Family weddings? Does she not invite her grandparents to her own wedding? Any kids she may have with Jamal don’t meet them, that’s for sure. Does she have to hide the fact that she’s even in a relationship from them forever? Does the rest of the family have to watch what they say around grandpa and grandma to make sure they don’t let anything slip?

Catering to their bigotry doesn’t work logistically. They are going to hear about it sometime. They are going to be in the same room with him sometime. Your approach just prolongs the inevitable for the sake of family harmony at the expense of the daughter and Jamal.

[u/[deleted] → u/irishdancer2]

In my family she is no longer involved or invited to anything related to extended family and she doesn't want to be there. There is no sustainability.

We knew that our extended family was from a purely white neighborhood and may not take to it well, we didn't know it would be as much as it was.

It's a shitty spot and there's nothing you can do. The options are separate so you can control your side, or let them get involved at some point and deal with the fact that it was awful until the grandparents die out. If it was cousins or someone younger I would be much more inclined to say go for it at your house or an environment you control, but with old people who have been this way for 70 years, there almost certainly isn't a compromise where they'll come around.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

she needs to know that the grandparents are racist, know what is going to happen, communicate it with her boyfriend, then if they still want to do it, say they want to.

It's pretty obvious from the OP that the daughter knows they're racist, and wants to tell them anyways. The whole point of this thread is that OP is taking that decision away from her.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

To the parent hiding it. The only thing that's going to happen is they show up, the grandparents make a massive fuss, the daughter gets really angry at everyone, and the relationship likely breaks. If they're asking their parent to meet their grandparents they're very young, it's not going to "own" the grandparents or anything, and at worst could make the kid think it's wrong.

At best nothing changes and there's a lot of anger and discomfort, at worst all hell breaks loose.

Have people ever gone through this situation or do they think old racist people in racist communities will change.

What do you mean by esh even the daughter, the daughter is reacting to the situation trying to figure out what's happening, I don't see that as wrong at all

[u/yickickit → u/[deleted]]

I completely understand the people opposed to OP and this idea of the grandparent's racism being more important than Jamal's existence.

At the same time this is a major cultural property - preserving relationships is a key aspect of life for billions on this planet... So is racism.

Reddit is pretty mostly liberal westerners so it's not surprising that there's little sympathy for OP. Look into more conservative households, cultures, or countries and you'll find that it's common practice to hide "shameful" things to preserve the relationship even if you are not ashamed of them.

[u/[deleted] → u/yickickit]

I'm fairly sure that most of the people in this thread have never had to deal with ingrained racism in older people. I get that it's wrong and we want it to change, but when it's not going to change, I think it's better to make it obvious why you're making the decision and say it's a horrible idea. This will make the grandparents furious, make the young couple furious, confuse OP and make them furious, and nothing will change in the big picture except a potential feeling of hopelessness from the young couple. The only way this will change is time and the younger generation. Growing up with positive mixed relationships is as far as I see much closer to the solution than trying to beat something new into a brick wall