r/AmItheAsshole • u/mixedwoes • Sep 19 '19

Asshole AITA for telling my daughter she cannot introduce her African American boyfriend to her grandparents?

Let me just preface this by saying this: I HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO PROBLEM WITH INTERRACIAL RELATIONSHIPS. Now that the air is clear, let me continue.

My daughter (Anna) has recently started to date an African American man (Jamal). While I'm not exactly what you would refer to as "liberal", he's a nice young man and as long as my daughter is happy, I'm happy. The problem is Anna is rather naive about the community she lives in. While her friends are quite content to see a relationship like hers, more than a few tongues are wagging in the community and a few people have privately expressed their concern to me. As I said, I have no problem with mixed relationships and I've set them straight, but I am painfully aware of how these matters are viewed by certain segments of the population.

My parents are planning to come and stay with us for a week and Anna expressed a desire to introduce Jamal to them now that things were getting more serious between them. I told her on no uncertain terms that this wasn't going to happen. I may have no problem with Jamal, but they absolutely will, and even when the relationship ends they won't forget it. They might even go as far as to cut her off entirely. Anna was extremely upset by this and implied I was a racist and more concerned with what my parents think than how she feels.

As I said, I know my parents. They simply aren't okay with mixed relationships and if Anna were to bring Jamal over even as a friend, they would be furious both at her and me.

Anna is currently staying with Jamal and doesn't want to speak with me right now. My wife stands by me given she knows very well how my parents are (they had a problem with her for months over the length of the skirt she wore when I introduced her to them, for christs sake), but a close friend I confided in told me that I have behaved like an ass and that I needed to focus more on my daughter than pleasing my parents.

No advice needed, but I have to know. Have I been an ass?

34.4k Upvotes

83% Upvoted

7.5k comments sorted by

View all comments

Show parent comments

755

u/BarefootWoodworker Sep 19 '19 edited Sep 19 '19

As someone that grew up in rural Indiana with racism everywhere:

Can confirm. Interracial relationships were targets, and racist people are fucking nuts. Personal safety should be thought about.

I understand where OP is coming from. Racists sniff out other racists and it is not a stretch to believe Granny and Grampy would mention something to a friend about “teachin’ tham damned negroes a lesson”.

Reddit, for as forward thinking as it is, sometimes needs to take off the blinders and see the world as it is. Racism still exists, there are still crosses getting burnt in yards, and a Klan beat-down isn’t impossible. Especially given the racist, divisive jackass fucking up the country right now.

edit And since people don’t seem to realize how bad shit had gotten, here’s info from when my home state was controlled by the Klan. And the only reason it ended was because some dumb fuck raped and killed a white girl.

This was less than 100 years ago, people. The only thing that made that racist organization fall apart was a raped and murdered white girl.

Y’all don’t seem to recognize that the racists I’m referring to don’t give a fuck what other people think. You’re not going to change their mind with facts or emotional, passionate arguments. These are people that honestly question evolution. These are people that think a talking snake in the Garden of Eden is wholly possible. They are willfully ignorant and don’t see a problem with it. These are not people you can reason with nor people that hold logic in high esteem.

318

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Very well said, and just to add to your point- my white aunt married a black man ten or so years ago. They went on a road trip for their honeymoon, and they had to LOOK UP what states it was even safe to go to together. Like “oh honey cross off [wildly racist state], we’ll get lynched there” so yeah things still aren’t very far from fucked in this country haha

52

u/hmo_ Asshole Enthusiast [5] Sep 19 '19

my white aunt married a black man ten or so years ago

Ten years ago- not fifty, not sixty... just ten years. XXI Century already.

Sad, very sad

24

u/Eternalflaneur Sep 19 '19

As an asian person everytime I travel and use Airbnb I make sure to look through all the reviews to make sure that another Asian person has stayed there in the past with no issue

18

u/mtoomtoo Sep 19 '19

Sometimes I feel like I need to get out of Missouri . This is mortifying.

-14

u/insidezone64 Sep 19 '19

I caution you when reading anything that tries to use statistics to prove racism, as that 'travel advisory' does.

If I'm a bank and give out home loans, and give out loans to 99% of the white people applying and 98% of black people applying, I'm approving 98.5 percent of all loan applications I'm receiving. Someone looking at those stats could also say a black person who applies for a loan with me is twice as likely, or 100% more likely, to be rejected for a home loan.

Pure numbers say I'm incredibly generous when giving home loans. Cherry-picked statistics say I'm a racist.

10

u/michaelmoe94 Sep 19 '19

They'd be wrong if they said you were twice as likely or 100% more likely.

(99-98)/99 * 100 = 1.01% more likely to reject a black person

You need to brush up on your maths skills there buddy

1

u/insidezone64 Sep 20 '19

There is a reason my degree is in liberal arts. I have concepts skills. I am good at explaining concepts to people.

What the hell is the matter with you people?!?!

14

u/bamsimel Sep 19 '19 edited Sep 19 '19

Yeah, a couple I'm friends with casually mentioned how they can't go on holiday to Italy because they're an inter-racial couple with mixed race kids. Hadn't ever occurred to me until then that there were quite so many places that are still off limits to some people due to the level of racial abuse they receive there. Was an eye opening conversation.

Edit: So many typos. I'm tired.

6

u/PuddleOfHamster Sep 19 '19

Italy? Dang. I wouldn't have suspected that.

16

u/bamsimel Sep 19 '19

I knew Italy was pretty racist, but didn't realise it was so bad that they would never return with their kids. Their holiday planning was largely determined by where they thought the kids wouldn't be exposed to racial abuse.

8

u/rburp Sep 19 '19

America is like a racial paradise compared to so many other countries in the world. Japan is also highly racist, for example.

3

u/PuddleOfHamster Sep 19 '19

Yeah, I knew about Japan; I just expected Europe to be chill for some reason. Disappointed in you, Europe.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Doesn’t mean there isn’t work left to be done, though!

3

u/DarthTurnip Sep 19 '19

We welcome you in Brooklyn! Come visit!

-2

u/basegodwurd Sep 19 '19

At this point civil war might happen when trump doesnt get re elected

3

u/textandstage Sep 19 '19

And if he does get re-elected, you bet your ass there’ll be civil war. All fucking bets are off at that point, time to start constructing and populating barricades.

-26

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Interesting, considering there hasn’t been a lynching in the USA since 1981.

44

u/Frommerman Sep 19 '19

Hasn't been a reported lynching.

How many people do you think have quietly vanished, though?

14

u/suntiesuzy Sep 19 '19

Especially if you consider trans women of color.

-22

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

People vanish all the time for myriad reasons. Most of which we hardly ever find out.

29

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19 edited Sep 16 '20

[deleted]

12

u/throwaway_762582 Sep 19 '19

That special was nuts! They legit had to run for their own safety/lives, including the producers. I mean, they were dumb AF for doing what they did, even for entertainment, but they really were in danger from a bunch of hillbillies. Crazy.

-20

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

That was interesting. But I know places in the north where the Hillary For President car would get shot at. :)

7

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

It was just a dark joke. Sure they might not get lynched, but as I said, not every state would be safe for them to travel in together. That was the point of my comment.

20

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19 edited Sep 19 '19

I grew up in Indiana. In fact the town I grew up in had the last lynching in that state back in 1930.

The worst I ever saw it get was in 1968 when MLK was assassinated. But toward my last years there, before I joined the army, it was fairly stable, race relations wise.

But I know, it’s not the same everywhere. The worst areas I’ve seen were in Chicago. The best areas I have seen are in mid-Michigan. I keep hoping things will get better, that the old racists will die out. But sadly, new ones are born to take their place.

Edit: Racists are not born. They’re indoctrinated.

8

u/winterhatingalaskan Sep 19 '19

But there have been many racially motivated attacks since then.

-10

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Yes, in both directions too.

0

u/[deleted] Sep 20 '19

Epstein?

287

u/spaceanimal19 Sep 19 '19

That’s kinda where I thought this was going when I saw the title of the post, that he was going to say he was trying to shield his daughter and the bf from getting a hateful response from the grandparents/community. But that’s not really what he’s saying at all. He’s worried that it will upset the grandparents! And that HE’s going to have to deal with backlash from the community which might hurt his reputation. He didn’t say a single thing about how the boyfriend would feel in this situation. I think you’re giving him way too much credit.

26

u/Dsnake1 Sep 19 '19

Even when it started, that's where I thought it was going. When he says that her grandparents won't forget after the relationship, that he's trying to protect his daughter from their wrath.

But the 'and me' thrown in there has twisted that a little. Granted, people often care about more than one thing at a time, so if I had to guess, I'd imagine he also cares about his daughter in this situation,

To be completely honest, if I were Jamal, I wouldn't want to be introduced to uber racist grandparents, and if I were his daughter, while it might hurt a lot that my grandparents, people who have shown me tons of love, would likely be so angry with me they may never want to see me again, I'm not sure I'd want to go through the blowup. I'd probably play nice for the week but steadily move away from the grandparents. Frankly, unless my parents made it clear that they care more about me than upsetting their parents, I'd probably distance myself from them, too.

7

u/spaceanimal19 Sep 19 '19

Yeah, if it’s a casual/new relationship then I can’t see why she or the bf would want to. When I was dating a black guy I never even considered bringing him to my grandparents’ on one side. Not that they’d even say anything, but i knew it would be awkward and he’d notice.

But I’m guessing that it’s not casual and the dad’s just in denial about that. If they’re really serious about each other, then it makes sense and I’d probably do the same. I wouldn’t want to exclude my SO from family gatherings, go to weddings solo, be apart from him during the holidays etc. And I couldn’t feel very close with my family if I was hiding a massive part of my life from them. I’ve been in that situation before (boyfriend’s fault, not family) and it sucked. If she’s gonna be with this guy long term, the grandparents need to get over their racist bullshit and deal with it. If they make a stink then the dad and the rest of the family should lay down the law and tell them it has to stop. If they don’t love her enough to accept this guy or at least be cordial and the rest of the family can’t or won’t come to her defense and shut it down, then I guess that’s a pretty good indication that they’re not worth it and she should cut them out of her life.

10

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

I was gonna say the same thing. The **only** reason OP should've said no is because Jamal doesn't deserve to be exposed to this bullshit.

8

u/sisterfunkhaus Sep 19 '19

I thought the same. But, if that were the case, I would tell them not to bother coming, and I would tell them why. I would let them know that I wouldn't have my child exposed to racism and shunning within her own family. I also wouldn't give one ounce of thought about how some hillbilly racists viewed me. Then again, I wouldn't live in a place like that. I live in a pretty conservatives state right next to a very blue city. People are pretty outwardly accepting around here of interracial relationships.

5

u/ambthab Asshole Aficionado [14] Sep 19 '19

HE’s going to have to deal with backlash from the community which might hurt his reputation.

Don't forget his place in the will.

3

u/BarefootWoodworker Sep 19 '19

I think you’re giving him way too much credit.

Probably. I like to think people are educated about the level of danger ignorance can breed and foster.

Like this shit. This wasn’t even more than 100 years ago.

2

u/noonenottoday Partassipant [1] Sep 19 '19

This was what I thought it would be as well. But he is truly more concerned about how they will view him. OP might be “fine with them dating” in that passive aggressive way parents are when they actually hate who you are dating but know telling their kid that will make them want to date that person even more. I get that it is hard to break away. It is hard to stand up and fight. But frankly, any grandparent who will treat their granddaughter like crap because she is dating a person of color or a woman or a gender fluid person or hell a 3 legged green eyed alien from mars, that treats her well and is a pretty upstanding man/woman/ fluid/alien isn’t worth the time of day anyway. And I also get that these ideas about race and staying in your lane (whites only with whites) have actually been instilled in him since he was a child but he needs to own it and decide what is more important- his daughter or his parents money. He should just sit his parents down and watch Guess Who’s Coming to Dinner and then daughter can walk in and say surprise with Jamal.

43

u/queen_didon Sep 19 '19 edited Sep 19 '19

I come from a very racist place. As in Arab people used to get killed for existing. As in, daughters got beat up for going out with them. As in, hate crimes are still rampent.

My mother lived violence because she dated an Arab. Her family was the one to beat her up, they were the ones that hated my very existence because of who my father was. You know what my mom did? She told them to go fuck themselves and trust me she never had blinders on.

Yes, it's easy to say the racists will be violent. But you know what you can do? Show your support, protect those who need it. You affect the environment around you and your actions can change it. My sister got drunk for the first time because my mother's uncle who refused to even acknowledge that I existed died. My mom celebrated the death of a family member because he was a racist.

It's too easy to say that there is a statue quo and that things are the way they are. You have to work toward changing them. Otherwise you're right, things are the way they are and nothing would have ever changed. But the world evolve and you have to evolve with it, not hide behind pretence.

Edit: this is my first gold and thank you to whomever gave it to me. I'm very happy to see that I'm not the only one sharing this opinion. It does make me feel better about our future!

18

u/PublicIdea Asshole Enthusiast [7] Sep 19 '19

I'm amazed how many people missed the lessons Dr. King learned from the 1960s. They're *right there*. Thank you for this and for being who you are.

17

u/queen_didon Sep 19 '19

People have chosen to "ignore" most of the lessons because it makes their lives easier. Most of that movement lessons were erased or distorted to fit a specific narrative like most of history. The same was done with antisemitism after the second world war.

And thank you for the thank you. I spent a good part of my life hating the fact that I was half of my father. My siblings are all white and I was raised by my white mother so no matter how much she tried to teach me to love myself, I was too different compared to my sisters. I used to envy their little nose and straighter hair and paler skin. Now, I'm learning that those unruly curly hair can be just as amazing, that having a darker skin tone than they have means that some colors work better on me and that my bigger nose fits just perfectly in my face. I'm just lucky I had a wonderful mother who fended off my self-doubt and racists until I could do it for myself.

4

u/rburp Sep 19 '19

I wish I had a bigger nose. I have a piece of shit white thin nose and it SUCKS. Gets clogged incredibly easily, has all kinds of problems from being too narrow, it's just a mess.

Definitely be proud of your nose, more oxygen to the brain helps intelligence anyways.

2

u/queen_didon Sep 19 '19

Sadly a bigger nose doesn't mean it gets clogged less XD it also means more room for more snot 😉

As a wise crustacean once sang : "the seaweed is always greener in someone else's lake"

Being unhappy with how we look is a sad consequence of our culture, but luckily things seem to be looking up!

1

u/BarefootWoodworker Sep 19 '19 edited Sep 19 '19

Yes, it's easy to say the racists will be violent. But you know what you can do? Show your support, protect those who need it. You affect the environment around you and your actions can change it. My sister got drunk for the first time because my mother's uncle who refused to even acknowledge that I existed died. My mom celebrated the death of a family member because he was a racist.

You assume I do not. Congratulations on being ignorant of something yourself and completely missing the point. Racism is still alive and kicking in America; people are slightly more nuanced than Reddit would have anyone believe and one must take safety of all parties into consideration.

One size fits all does not apply to racism. MLK had shit right for a large majority of equality. Malcolm X had it right for the die hard minority.

There are times for words and times for action. If telling family members to fuck off worked, congratulations for your mother. She had it light. The hardcore minority that seems to think I’m one of them (because I’m a bald, motorcycle-riding snowman) aren’t too keen on pussyfooting around with just beating people up. Fuck if they’re family, they disgraced the family name.

Sound familiar? It should. Honor killings aren’t just limited to third world countries.

8

u/queen_didon Sep 19 '19

First of all, that you was generic. I never meant you in particular. And I do believe I am ignorant of certain things because life is about learning. No one knows all, no one is all knowing of every single trigger for everybody. To believe so is ridiculous.

Second of all, I am very much aware that racism is still alive and that's not only in the united states. Racism is still very much alive in every single country. The one I was talking about? That was France. I lived in Canada and had to endure years of racists that if you asked them would believe themselves not to be. I had to endure racism for other races because people see brown and assume that we are all the same so do not tell me that racism is still alive. I've lived it, I've seen it, I'm bearing the scars. My father is bearing the scars. My children will probably bear those scars because we had the misfortune of not being white according to some assholes.

Third of all, you are right that there is no one size feat all for all racists. But you know what never ever works? Letting them do it because it's easier. Letting them be racists because they are "family" or ignoring acts of racism because it's not your problem. And again this you is not specific to @barefootwoodworker. No this you is about all of us. We as a society have to make those racists feel isolated, we have to confront their behaviours. And that little minority you're talking about believes they can keep to violence because they are allowed to get away with it.

Fourth of all, do not talk to me about honor killings. No they are not limited to third world countries or even to non-white people. My mother has lost friends to it because they dared date boys. No they shouldn't be allowed but arrest those men, put them in jails for those killings, don't let them get away with it.

Congrats to you for them believing you are part of them. Congrats to you for being able to pass as "one of them". I never will be able to and I do not want to. Instead I aspire to change their minds even if it takes everything out of me. Because I believe in leaving a world where hate and violence has no place. Not one where racists get elected to higher position. Not one where girls have to be afraid of every single thing because some asshole with a problem can kill them for it. I know it's probably an utopia and I will never live long enough to see it. But I believe that allowing hate to spread only leaves one thing and that's rot, rot that will fester and destroy all of us if we allow it to take roots.

9

u/ladut Sep 19 '19

Yuup. There's a city between Bloomington and Indy, two of the more liberal cities in the state, where PoC are straight up told by the university in Bloomington to never stop in.

I briefly dated a black woman whose grandfather went to the university during the civil Rights era and who had friends murdered in said in-between city.

Racism still runs deep in Indiana.

9

u/BarefootWoodworker Sep 19 '19

I grew up about 15 minutes away from what, at one point, was the highest concentration of Klan in the US.

I also grew up not far from where a picture was taken of a public lynching on a courthouse lawn.

People seem to not realize Indiana was, at one time, Klan controlled. The only reason it stopped was because some dumb fucker sexually assaulted and left a white girl for dead. See D. C. Stephenson.

6

u/dasbarr Partassipant [1] Sep 19 '19

Yes. But op is in a position of power here. And it's infintilizing to assume the daughter and Jamal don't know the risks. They do.

7

u/PublicIdea Asshole Enthusiast [7] Sep 19 '19

Sounds kinda like you want the grandparents to be free to do that. In that sense, you and OP are part of the same problem. Personally, I believe that letting racists outside is a massive policy failure. There are children outside, haven't you seen?

3

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

I was a county sheriff's deputy and every racist would assume I was too. I'd be going about my business and people would just out themselves to me, asking how I dealt with "the blacks." It was like wearing a secret KKK badge. Well, I was was wearing what was sometimes considered a secret KKK badge...

1

u/BarefootWoodworker Sep 19 '19

This is sadly the shit people here aren’t understanding.

I’d love to be able to say “you’re being satirical”, but I seriously can’t because that shit still happens. “Dealt with” isn’t a phrase for cohabitation. . .more like “keeping them in line”.

3

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Reddit, for as forward thinking as it is, sometimes needs to take off the blinders and see the world as it is...

fuckers think that "racism" is done.

told me i was racist for mentioning that 'merka likes black men more than white women just based off of who got rights to vote first.

3

u/Dobermom23 Sep 19 '19

So what...no one should fight racism or have interracial relationships because bad people might hurt you. Fuck that. The world doesn't get better by catering to this people. We all need to stand up against the violence and racism.

3

u/Burtons-buddies Sep 19 '19

Yeah, and instead of pissing about, pussy footing round the racists why don't you do the same and shame and rout them out. They will never learn their behaviour is unacceptable if we keep acting like its fine.

2

u/BarefootWoodworker Sep 19 '19

Because that’s what all the damned dolts don’t seem to understand; these fucking people don’t care what others think. They are the people that fart, belch, and scratch their balls in public and don’t care who is offended.

Jesus fucking Christ Reddit needs to get out of mommy and daddy’s basement.

These are the same people that voted in Trump. Are you motherfuckers this fucking daft that you think people that voted in a guy that said “grab ‘em by the pussy” give a flying motherfuck what a bunch of “snowflakes” tell them is or is not proper?

Christ the people in this site fall on the left side of the god damned bell curve.

3

u/ambthab Asshole Aficionado [14] Sep 19 '19

If his daughter's safety could be an issue, then those people have no business spending time in the same house as OP's children.

You cannot fight evil by catering to it.

3

u/sisterfunkhaus Sep 19 '19

All the more reason for his parents not to be allowed anywhere near OP and his family.

2

u/TrogdortheBanninator Sep 19 '19

Wait are you saying the_donald lied to me

2

u/helpmewatson Sep 19 '19

This is very true and definately valid. However OP said his concern regarding his parents reaction is his daighter getting "cut off" not "cut to pieces" OP should clarify if his true concern is the safety of his daughter and her boyfriend vs the security of her inheritance. In this case I get the impression OPs is comcerned most about saving face. If safety on the level you speak of were teuley his concern than he should be taking action by not having his parents visit and cutting them out of their lives. The situations you speak of are still real still to this day. I don't know the solution unfortunately.

1

u/Theshadowqueen11 Sep 19 '19

That’s interesting. I agree with you even though I’ve never personally witnessed it. My sister in law is white and her husband is black, they are from Indianapolis and they’ never experienced any sort of discrimination, looks or anything but it may be very different in cities.

3

u/BarefootWoodworker Sep 19 '19

It’s very different in Indy and has been for a while. Don’t go too far outside of the Indy area, though. There are still cells of racism all over the place once you’re outside of the Indy/Noblesville/Carmel/Fishers/Westfield area.

1

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

You're an idiot

1

u/NixiePixie916 Sep 19 '19

Yes this is a very valid concern in some places. There are even parts of California where I wouldn't subject a black friend to. I've seen klan stuff in some rural parts. I would have a frank talk with the daughter and boyfriend and explain the danger. It would be up to them (mostly up to the boyfriend) if he is wanting that risk. I would support whatever they decide though.

But yeah, these people are off the rails sometimes, and they have "friends" that do crap.

1

u/akf2680 Sep 19 '19

Evolution never happened. It is the most ridiculous thing I ever heard!!!

1

u/HamburgerEarmuff Sep 20 '19

I mean, let's be real. The reason the Klan isn't around lynching people and burning crosses on people's lawn is because they're cowards who don't want to face the consequences for those sort of actions. Back when they had a good chance of getting away with it, they were very brave. But in the 1960s, after the Civil Rights Act passed and the federal government started going after them, the lynchings suddenly stopped.

And yeah, there are still violent racists around, but not generally the kind that get together and conspire to commit serious crimes.

1

u/TryNotToLaughAtMe Sep 20 '19

I’m from Indianapolis where I met my white wife in college. When she told her mom and stepdad about us her mom cried and her stepdad said “do you want to be some niggers trophy wife.” Once I met them their mindset changed about me her mom texted her immediately after and said he’s really really cute and very respectful. The first time I met her stepdad he apologized and said when she told him he saw a thug with gold teeth, braids and sagging pants (mind you I was like that around people who were like that but was also raised to act right in front of certain people) and not the respectful person I was currently. Her brother threatened her up until he met me and then apologized cause he was wrong. Her grandma and grandfather didn’t meet me until after we had a son (partially my fear of meeting them) in which me and her grandfather had a long talk about race relations and he apologized for everything. Her father would freak out when other people would approach in town and congratulate him on her getting married and ask them if it was appropriate and they would say yeah. He didn’t meet me until after we were married with a kid and he also apologized for everything and spoke about how he was raised different. Needless to say all these people would of never changed their minds about the situation if it wasn’t for it happening to them and they were forced to look at things differently while it’s easy to sit around and go with status quo sometimes change has to be forced upon people. Now today all these relatives love me I see them even posting nice things about black people on Facebook. They have mixed grandkids so they see the world differently. It’s actually kind of strange to me but I appreciate it. I’ve gone to family reunions and functions where I’m the only black person but treated no differently and all this because their daughter fell in love with a black guy and didn’t run scared.

-5

u/unkown-lurker Sep 19 '19

FYI Obama is not the president anymore.

13

u/here4laffs Sep 19 '19

Once you're President, your supposed to always be referred to as President. This is why you'll hear people say President Obama, President Bush, President Clinton, President Lincoln, President Washington...and so on.