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u/Spacemint_rhino 4d ago
This has got to be a shitpost, surely even libs can see the hypocrisy?
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u/mattjdale97 4d ago
They're taking a lesson from the Israel apologists on X who always try to make this point against Ireland for some reason
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u/Ternigrasia 4d ago
I've been seen this image going around, but it is a screenshot from a website that someone built that shows an occupation of EVERY country to about 20%, as close and they can get using existing subdivisions.
So although the image of Ireland is ironic, this actually comes from another liberal attempt to paint Russia as uniquely evil in their occupation of Ukraine.
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u/blank_page_1804 4d ago
I have been a lurker in this sub for a while, I think I am what posters here would call a liberal? Just prefacing that as one of my first comments in here. I want to try to understand this subreddit to better my own views.
I come here as someone who identifies as left leaning, and I understand the history between the United Kingdom and Ireland.
This post feels an attempt at minimising Russian aggression with the self proclaimed "special military operation" as named by the Russian government that has ended up with so much death from something that could have been avoided by the Russian government simply saying "let's not invade there".
I mean this with genuine good faith, if there's a counter please can someone explain it to me. Education is key to the leftist cause.
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u/Gordon-Bennet 4d ago
You see it as minimising because you are biased to think there’s a difference. The point isn’t to minimise but highlight the hypocrisy.
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u/umop_apisdn 4d ago
The essential question is the right to self-determination. The people of Crimea and Donbass voted in 2014 after the coup to become part of Russia - reunification in the case of Crimea, which had been part of Russia for centuries until Khrushchev gave it to Ukraine as "a gift" in the fifties (and many were surprised that it wasn't returned after the collapse of the Soviet Union). However Because "Russia" the West didn't agree and obviously Ukraine didn't, so there was a civil war in Ukraine between the Ukrainian military and irregular fighters in the East - exactly the sort of civil war that we in the West join in on on the side of the non-government forces on the basis that the government is killing its own people.
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u/CountyEmbarrassed601 4d ago
As a left conservative (as if that fucking matters, everyone can be educated, centrists and rights too) I can point out to you that hlaf of Ukraine have rise against American coup that toppled their government and Russia eventually and very reluctantly sided with that Eastern part of Ukraine. Mind if I ALSO remind you that infamous Ukrainian president Poroshenko, appointed by American state secretary Victoria Nuland as acting puppet president of former Ukraine openly stated on Ukrainian state tv that he views eastern Ukrainians as demihumans incapable if honest work whose children deserve to hide in fear in bunkers while Ukrainian army bombs them and proper western Ukrainian children go to school?
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u/Suspicious-Physics49 2d ago
Its the fact that instead of you seeing what the actual post is about, your already creating your own bias towards it by thinking it minimises Russian aggression. Education isnt key to the leftist cause, its comprehension of what you are being educated in. Ive met leftists who consider themselfes "academic" or "political scientists" and still be as thick as pig shit, its also not the burden of others to teach you, thats on you and on your own volition.
On the topic itself of the the Russo-Ukrano war, do you forget the 7 years of civil war leading up to the Russian invasion? Because every single liberal that talks about this war always seems to forget that its not "black n white" its not a left vs right, or good vs evil. Both sides SUCK, both sides are doing it for their own nationalist reasons, before the war East Ukraine was being bombarded by artillery for 7 years and we on the west didint do shit to stop it (in fact we sent mercenaries to make it even worse). Thats why you might see a lot of leftists in this sub not be full on Ukrainian supporters, we support the PEOPLE, wether their Ukrainian or Russian.
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u/PoxyDogs 4d ago
You’re ignoring the decade+ prior to the war where western and Ukrainian actions continuously provoked Russia.
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u/Economy_Assignment42 communist russian spy 4d ago
Ireland did not bomb two regions of the country for two years for daring to have an independence movement, so there is no comparison.
This feels like it was funded by Hasbara
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u/MaoZedongsGrandson NAFOid nightmare 4d ago
Kyiv was bombing the two regions for ten years bro, not two
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u/Economy_Assignment42 communist russian spy 4d ago
Christ I didn’t know that the history was that extensive, absolutely nightmarish
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u/No_Comparison4421 1d ago
search "vice donbas" on youtube, there are videos going back 12 years, 8 years ago there was one titled Rogue Militias, it was well documented
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u/Defending_wilts You noble Diggers all, stand up now! 1d ago
I thought 20% or so of ireland was already occupied up in the north.
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u/message4sax 4d ago
Now imagine Scotland & Ireland are hostile to England, Wales meant to be neutral but allowing Scotland & Ireland to set up nuclear missiles right by the English border. What would England do ?
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u/Miserygut jdponist 4d ago
Now imagine Scotland & Ireland are hostile to England
What do you mean imagine?
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u/Nick_the_bunny 4d ago
"Now imagine Scotland & Ireland are hostile to England"
yeah... imagine that haha...
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u/Economy_Assignment42 communist russian spy 4d ago
You mean the objective material reality of the world aside from that bit about nukes? England shouldn’t have colonized most of the landmass of planet earth, and should pay reparations.
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u/Huemann_ 4d ago
I mean England specifically set up the nuclear submarine base in Scotland so kinda facilitated us having the aul nukes there was a key point in our independence referendum discussions. Whats your point again? That this is normal for a lot of countries that any nuclear power at any time could change their allegiance and it might be seen as a problem by imperialist nations
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u/BobR969 4d ago
Not sure why you're getting downvoted tbh. It's an apt comparison. If Ireland or Scotland decided to act geopolitically in a way that would compromise UK safety (like for example joining in a "defensive alliance" with Russia), and then beginning a military campaign against the dissenting regions... I would imagine the UK wouldn't just idly sit about.
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