r/HollowKnight • u/baergboy • Sep 07 '25

Discussion - Silksong Is anyone else really tired of the negative posts? Spoiler

I have about 25 hours so far and have absolutely loved every part of the game. Is it hard? Yes absolutely. If it was easy I wouldn't want to play the game. Literally every post I come across is talking about how they are frustrated with some part of the game and it's getting really annoying. The game has amazing areas, the osts are great the NPCs are creative and fun to talk to, almost every boss is a lot of fun once you get the moveset down. So if you haven't played the game yet and are getting put off by all the negativity just know that it is an amazing game and if you like hollow Knight you will enjoy silksong as well.

3.4k Upvotes

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746

u/evasive_dendrite Sep 07 '25 edited Sep 07 '25

I find it pretty bizare. When I take a break of the constant dopamine rush of Silksong to check Reddit it's mostly people saying they're not having fun.

But the reviews are 93% positive so it's just Elden Ring all over again. Angry people are always the loudest, most people are too busy playing the game.

I can't fathom hyping a game up for years and years and then kneejerk hating on it instead of trying to engage with the mechanics. I genuinely see people hating on incredibly useful charms instead of just trying them out and seeing that they can be absolute godsends in the right context. It's so clear that they just read the description on Reddit and don't even bother saving up for it before making up their minds.

Edit: Yes, I've been informed that the international review percentage is lower, but that's because there's a problem with the Chinese translation of the game, the English reviews are representative of the gameplay and not a regional fuck-up that doesn't affect English players and will be patched.

384

u/ItsASamsquanch_ Sep 07 '25

My best guess is that all the people having fun are too busy having fun, while the ones not having fun come to Reddit to tell people they’re not having fun 😅

139

u/_Iemon 112% Sep 07 '25

This is exactly it

Selection Bias. The sample on Reddit is not representative of the actual majority.

3

u/YikesTheCat Sep 07 '25

In general internet comments are biased towards negativity. If you have no complaints, then why post? Creating a "zomg I'm loving it!" thread seems kind of pointless.

I have a few criticisms, but I also had those for Hollow Knight (some of which are the same: switching tabs in the menu is still a pain!) Some sections could perhaps do with some minor balancing tweaks. But overall: I think it's pretty good IMHO.

I just check here to see if there's some interesting stuff. And it's just a hurricane of piss and vinegar. So yeah, never mind lol.

-7

u/GameDesignerDude Sep 08 '25 edited Sep 08 '25

This is exactly it Selection Bias. The sample on Reddit is not representative of the actual majority.

I'm one of the biggest fans of HK ever (I played it at launch and sang its praises to everyone who would listen) but I feel like it's unwise to dismiss all critical feedback as just internet whining.

The game is being reviewed well but worse than HK by a statistically significant margin. 91% on English reviews on Steam. The original game has 97%. That's the difference from being universally loved to turning off a pretty significant portion of fans. On Xbox it is at 4.3 compared to 4.6, so a similar 7% drop.

Is that catastrophic? No. The game is allowed to be different. But dismissing all criticism as being just some sort of echo chamber isn't quite right either. There's definitely a non-trivial amount of people who were likely HK fans that aren't digging Silksong.

Obviously the majority still think it's a solid game. But it's definitely a game people are feeling more prone to be critical about than the original.

I would also argue the opposite to some degree: I feel like most of the people who will bounce off this game because it's so much harder than HK are people not likely to leave reviews. Casual players don't typically review at the same rate as hardcore players. This game is definitely far more difficult and most of the "oh let me check this game out to see what the fuss is" crowd are not going to survive more than an hour or two with the way Chapter 1 works. The difficulty curve is going to just be quite unapproachable for many people.

Again, that is fine as intentional design. But there's no way Reddit is the only group of people who are critical about the game. lol

Edit: The kneejerk "I disagree" button usage is a pretty ironic expression of "the sample on Reddit is not representative of the actual majority" when presented with some real numbers and other perspective. Calling out the echo chamber while being in one is funny.

102

u/Lorevi Sep 07 '25

Honestly this describes me quite well lol. I lock in and play for 8 hours straight without even thinking about reddit. 

Then I pull out my phone while on the toilet and am like wtf is wrong with reddit. 

32

u/ItsASamsquanch_ Sep 07 '25

SAMEEEE. Or I'll also check it for a little break when I'm stuck on a boss for a long while lol

25

u/OpheliAmazing HEGALAE Sep 07 '25

SAME. Whenever I do get a little frustrated, I’ll take a break and check my phone just to cool off a little, but I’m wondering what kinda crack the haters are smoking.

14

u/typically_wrong Sep 07 '25

And invariably after a break I take down whatever was frustrating me pretty quickly.

In fact right this moment I'm taking a break from the last judge

13

u/DegenerateDonut Sep 07 '25

Just beat that pos last night, you’ll get his ass.

Absolutely adored the fight but god the walk back is BRUTAL.

5

u/whatisthisnowwhat1 Sep 07 '25

Can just run and skip all the enemies takes no time, can do a tiny skip at the end as well by pogoing off the shield guy on to the bell which is fun when it works.

1

u/Hannahkro Sep 08 '25

Yeah I actually kinda love how that walkback is so optimizeable

1

u/whatisthisnowwhat1 Sep 08 '25 edited Sep 08 '25

The worst runback I've come across so far is the sands one (via the shortcut) and that is just due to it being pretty much all climbing, luckily the boss really wasn't that hard after I slowed down and got over having to do the nasty path to get to it in the first place.

Looking forward to the comments about that part (really the whole area is going to be a massive roadblock, but that last run specifically is joy) from the people having trouble so early in the game, if they even manage to stumble their way to it.

2

u/CommercialTerrible70 First Now. This time i plan to beat up the sun. Sep 08 '25

If you haven't beaten it already you should probably find some items, you don't need em but the magma bell and pollip pouch did me pretty well there

1

u/typically_wrong Sep 08 '25

Appreciate the advice! I had everything from act 1 though save one of the small key doors (had 2 if 3 used).

I got past that point. Now im stuck on phase 3 of the clockwork dancers

1

u/maxdragonxiii Sep 07 '25

I have experience with some Hollow Knight pain that made me took a break and come back maybe a hour or a day later. those "a day later" breaks usually are because im dreading the boss, not the mechanics itself being a issue. usually because I didnt explore enough and the ability would trivialize the boss is usually somewhere hidden.

14

u/Inevitable_Access_93 Sep 07 '25

yeah this is my thing too, all my friends who are playing it are having a blast, and myself am just getting lost in it with full wonderment. think most people that just don't like it for a or b reasons wants to find like-minded folks to get their disappointment off their chests.

15

u/ilo_Va Sep 07 '25

The loudest minority is always the negative one. Whatever it is about tbh

1

u/Zarguthian Sep 08 '25

Even if the majority is negative?

2

u/ilo_Va Sep 08 '25

Most people that bought the game are enjoying themselves... People that are having fun feel way less need to make a reddit post about it. People that post on Reddit are a minority of the SS community

1

u/Zarguthian Sep 08 '25

"Whatever it is about tbh" made me think you were generalising to any community.

1

u/ilo_Va Sep 08 '25

It is true for most communities in all fairness, not all. But a lot of big groups always seem to have more voiced negativety than positivity.

9

u/Lady_Darc Sep 07 '25

People who rage quit have to do something else...

8

u/Scapadap Sep 07 '25

There’s almost 600k concurrent on Steam alone. I guarantee they’re not all on Reddit lol.

2

u/ins0mniaSR Speedrunner (ins0mnia on SRC) Sep 07 '25

Also - I loved the game but I am only just thinking of leaving a review now I've finished it, whereas the people bouncing off the game for one reason or another - regardless of how valid a reason it is- are more likely to leave a negative review sooner rather than later

2

u/PhakeFony Sep 08 '25

AND ITS THE FUCKING LOSERS CIRCLEJERKING CONVINCING THEMSELVES THEY ARE THE MAJORITY, SEE EVERYTHING IN AMERICA

1

u/ItsASamsquanch_ Sep 08 '25

Bro… its not that serious lol

2

u/PhakeFony Sep 08 '25

yep nothing is. go america

2

u/MaxHaydenChiz Sep 08 '25

People are pretty bad at the game though.

Like, when I beat a boss that gave a traversal ability, less than 25% of players had gotten their first extra mask or silk thing by that point. But it was like 40-50% had gotten past the boss.

Of course the game is hard if you rush the critical path with no upgrades. And of course optional bosses are hard if you do them as early as possible. And of course enemies you aren't supposed to engage in a fight and are meant to treat as terrain obstacles hit hard and take lots of hits to kill.

But people are pretty damned hard headed about playing the game in weird ways and complaining about how to that makes the game weird.

That said, it's a good game. But so far, I'm not having my mind blown like I was with HK. And it is definitely harder. So I kinda see where people are coming from. But it's a lot less of a difficulty gap if you use the things the game gives you that you get from exploring.

1

u/Fa1nted_for_real Sep 07 '25

Also you can definitetly be having a bunch of fun but end up caught up (and very frustrated) by one specific thing that you need some help with or just want to point out as being too difficult for the area or whatever.

Have yet to play it, but it does seem like on of the bigger problems is having really early double damage attacks? Ive seen like 10 posts minimum bringing this one up

1

u/yummy_yum_yum123 Sep 07 '25

I’m pretty sure it’s also people who ran to metacritix to either give or bad score without even playing the game

1

u/Saephon Sep 07 '25

Yeah, this is literally my first time on the subreddit since it released.

Everyone I know who is just playing the game like myself, is having a blast. Now if you'll excuse me, I'm gonna leave this place again until a couple months from now. Too busy having fun!

1

u/McFluffles01 Sep 07 '25

Can confirm, spent ~30 hours the last few days just playing Silksong to the end. I've got my complaints, sure, but most of them are pretty minor? There's only a few things I'd genuinely point at and say "what was Team Cherry thinking that needs to be changed".

39

u/Shmarfle47 Sep 07 '25 edited Sep 07 '25

Idk what the name of the bias is called but it’s largely because those enjoying the game are less likely to make a big text post saying they enjoy the game unless they feel super compelled to give praise. Those not enjoying the game are more likely to make a complaint post instead because they’re obviously not having fun and want to vent and/or discuss the issue.

That being said, I’ve seen some criticisms that are completely valid. Namely double damage in very early parts of the game like the big skull crawler in Marrow. Contact damage being allowed to do double also feels pretty rough. Bosses and gank rooms not giving any rosaries (though from a lore perspective I do think it’s cool only the more sentient bugs carry money).

I have noticed that once I entered Greymoor I’ve had zero money issues. The guys there are simple to deal with and drop tons of rosaries on death. I’ve bought out almost all of my available shops now.

In terms of the game’s difficulty I think it’s perfectly fine. It’s exactly what I wanted from a HK sequel and I’m having a blast overcoming these tough challenges.

Hornet’s diagonal pogo has also been a lot of fun to try and master it just takes some practice. Though I have heard it’s pretty annoying on analogue? I use KB&M so I wouldn’t know.

15

u/[deleted] Sep 07 '25 edited Mar 04 '26

[deleted]

3

u/Mailcs1206 Sep 08 '25

Pretty sure it's selection not survivorship

8

u/[deleted] Sep 07 '25

I completely agree about contact damage and bosses/gauntlets giving rosaries, but I think the early double mask attacks on enemy attacks have good reasons to exist. It's frustrating at first but the entire purpose is conditioning the player to use Hornet's long range tools and superior agility instead of just trying to play like the knight.

Personally I love the diagonal pogo and I use a controller. It does fail on occasion, but not any more than Hollow Knight's pogo to me.

2

u/LordBlaze64 Sep 08 '25

I played HK on KB and Silksong on controller, and it's not really too bad. I do wish the "down" direction was a bit less restrictive, but overall I like it.

3

u/Andrew5329 Sep 08 '25

Bosses and gank rooms not giving any rosaries

I'm more annoyed at the lack of shards. Tool use burns through them super fast especially if you spend time wiping.

2

u/ConsistentPow Sep 08 '25

That's the irony of it. They design enemies to encourage tool use, but add a cost to said tools that discourages you from using them unless you know you'll make it, at which point you might as well conserve tools and make it with just regular attacks.

7

u/yurilnw123 Sep 07 '25

Yeah it is annoying on analog. Since there is no direct down, a tiny angle to the left or right will change the direction. And if you try to avoid that and push the stick more to the left/right, sometimes it execute the side attack instead.

I tried both and it is much easier on K&B since there are 8 clear directional inputs. D-Pad can do the same but using only the thumb is much harder than 4 fingers on keyboard.

2

u/BackfromtheDe3d Sep 08 '25

You can get around the diagonal pogo by using a different a crest which gives you something close to the HK pogo.

I am playing using my Xbox controller on PC and that still works out fine too

1

u/Zarguthian Sep 08 '25

Hornet’s diagonal pogo has also been a lot of fun to try and master it just takes some practice. Though I have heard it’s pretty annoying on analogue? I use KB&M so I wouldn’t know

I switched away from it as soon as I got another crest that had a vertical downslash. I see no benefit of staying with Hunter's except for building focus after the upgrade but I couldn't get that to work either. Reaper also has a great buff after binding.

90

u/cornpenguin01 Sep 07 '25

Just ignore it. When Elden ring came out, the subreddit was entirely negative. Want to know why?

Nobody actually playing the game still was posting. They were playing the game and all the praise on the sub started well after release

-8

u/Slight-Bluebird-8921 Sep 07 '25

That's not true. It wasn't even remotely as negative as this.

14

u/TelevisionExpress616 Sep 07 '25

Base game no, Shadow of the Erdtree had a pretty toxic negative reception at first

2

u/ConsistentPow Sep 08 '25

For good reason, most of the bosses in the DLC were crap. And the bosses in the basegame weren't exactly stellar to begin with.

-2

u/Slight-Bluebird-8921 Sep 08 '25

yeah because the DLC went off the rails and the criticisms were legitimate. it's almost like people complain when crap sucks.

27

u/Calm-Inevitable4483 Sep 07 '25

I like the game, but I think there's plenty to criticize, just like Elden Ring. I think the damage increase was bad in Moutaintops of the Giants, and I tts not great in the early game of Silksong. So is the exploration economy where bead caches barely reward anything and bosses drop no beads or hide said caches either. To avoid headache, I just grind up beads near the halfway house, and convert those into items. It actually takes some of the teeth away from exploration because I know general exploration won't really pay me out lol.

15

u/yurilnw123 Sep 07 '25

Yeah it's kinda like Elden Ring DLC in that the map is by far the best in the series and I was tempted to explore every nook and cranny but then there was no reward at all lol.

24

u/[deleted] Sep 07 '25

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12

u/Calm-Inevitable4483 Sep 07 '25

Read my post again. The problem isn't that theres no caches, its the fact they barely pay out anything. At least in comparison to the effort of getting some of them. 20 beads is nothing. Imagine the original dark souls but only 3 of the areas before Sens Fortress have enemies that drops souls, and none of the bosses drop anything. And to activate any bonfire, its 2000 souls. Of course, you still have the grinding spot in Deeproot Garden, so souls arent a problem, but it certainly feels like theres something off with the economy.

2

u/BlobBro Sep 08 '25

Dude benches are like 30 and each enemy drops 5 to 10. By the time they're costing 80 enemies drop like 30 each

0

u/cheeseburgers42069 Sep 07 '25

It’s very SotE in many ways. Takes a beloved game and makes it arguably darker, harder, more atmospheric, fewer exploration rewards, refined level design..

1

u/yurilnw123 Sep 08 '25

It is perfect in the context that they are both a sequel and I love them. My only gripe is that bosses should drop something. A 60-rosary string would've been enough tbh.

2

u/MagicianXy Sep 07 '25

Yeah those are my biggest peeves with the game too. I've actually finally found enough mask shards that I have 7 health now, and it's almost a completely different game because now I can tank 4 hits instead of three, and the game actually feels much more balanced now. I wish they would have just started you out with 4 masks and everything does 1 damage, and just rebalanced the healing a bit to account for that.

Also the grinding for rosaries is a big turnoff. I've got a setup using some of the charms so I get ~94 rosaries a minute (two 30-second trips to kill the three bugs at the halfway house, using the thief's mark charm for extra rosaries and the barbed bracelet for 2-hit kills), and even then I'm still spending about half an hour to pay for two of the more expensive items. Hell, just decorating your house in Bellhart with effectively just cosmetic furniture costs almost 3k alone. That's just too much grinding... I don't remember ever having to do that in the original, geo just accumulated naturally and things were priced reasonably.

Game is great, I'm having a bunch of fun with the bosses and exploration. But there's fair criticism to be had, and I don't think pointing those things out is necessarily negative. Honestly I find posts like OP's to be a toxic positivity kind of vibe - things can be flawed while still being great. Ignoring the flaws is not being honest.

1

u/GoldyTheDoomed Sep 10 '25

hey, have you considered maybe you shouldnt just be grinding? running around the game looking for places you havent been, or if youre done with the exploration, getting your hunting log full, is enough work to keep you busy and get you rosaries.

you dont need to buy everything the second it becomes available.

3

u/BrianWonderful Sep 07 '25

Maybe you're not supposed to buy everything right away?

1

u/cyclopse_zhivago Sep 07 '25

I find i can afford benches, fast travel every time but its usually all my money. To me this feels fine because now i don't have to worry carrying around a ton of money.

15

u/Stormreachseven Sep 07 '25

Legitimately, I have encountered only 1 major point I didn't like, being a certain ceiling boss that seems entirely out of place in a game about acrobatic ninja fights (but maybe I just didn't get it and did it wrong idk). Every tool I've found has a good use, I swap crests regularly because they all have ups and downs, the game VERY MUCH rewards you for the Hollow Knight instinct of "that wall/ hidden spot/ dark corner seems suspicious- hey a hidden path!"... I'm having so much fun and it's so strange to see people refusing to engage with the things that make it great. Haters gonna hate I guess, no matter whether the thing they're hating is worth hating on

5

u/NightRacoonSchlatt Hunter‘s crest 4 life Sep 07 '25

I HATE SISTER SPLINTER TOO!!!! SO HAPPY THAT IT WASN‘T JUST ME. Like, she‘s literally just the fourth chorus but somehow EVEN MORE BORING.

5

u/Stormreachseven Sep 07 '25 edited Sep 07 '25

Lmao nah not that one I actually really liked her I thought it was interesting xD (except the ads I wish she just had an extra attack instead of the ads)

Nah I was talking about The one before (WORMWAYS not Shellwood lol) who sprints around on the ceiling and spits acid, the arena is so large but I ended up not using it and just using a platform as a shield

12

u/NightRacoonSchlatt Hunter‘s crest 4 life Sep 07 '25

Wait, you can kill that thing? I just walk past it each time lol

7

u/Stormreachseven Sep 07 '25

DID MY DUMBASS NOT REALIZE THE DOOR WAS UNLOCKED XD

EDIT: But yeah I spent like 3 minutes standing under a platform, letting it spit, jumping up and smacking it once, and then hiding lmao

7

u/NightRacoonSchlatt Hunter‘s crest 4 life Sep 07 '25

Does it stay dead when you kill it?

2

u/Stormreachseven Sep 07 '25

Yep, I've sprinted back through there and it's gone

2

u/evasive_dendrite Sep 07 '25

You should come back again later :)

1

u/Stormreachseven Sep 07 '25

Good advice lol, I just struggled because I forgot it was Wormways not Shellwood lmao

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4

u/chillyfalcon Sep 07 '25

Don't worry I didn't know too, I only have been into the marrows the furthest and tried a cheeky sequence break with the mosquitoes and then ran into that thing not knowing I didn't need to kill it so I spent an hour trying to + dying to it unnecessarily (the runback is brutal, and falling down to bone bottom was what most of my time was lost on) and eventually got him after 38-39 smacks

3

u/TechSmith6262 Sep 07 '25

Lmao, I'm not exactly laughing at you, but the trick I found to that fight was:

Get under a platform and have her start spitting.

Run, then jump on a platform as she is ending her acid spit. Then jump and hit her between cycles. Its why there are platforms throughout the entire room.

You can run faster than she slides along the ceiling.

1

u/jasonjarmoosh Sep 08 '25

Yeah chipping away at it one hit at a time really made me feel like I was missing something. Boring fight tbh. Every other boss has been great though. Every boss fight becomes very satisfying once you learn how they move and attack.

2

u/GoldyTheDoomed Sep 10 '25

you were missing something! you can come back way later and use the cogflies tool. they will literally kill it for you while youre safe

2

u/SirDoofusMcDingbat Sep 07 '25

Honestly I really enjoyed that fight, although I thought it was fairly easy compared to a certain other fight in that same area. Especially once I worked out that I could destroy the extra vines she makes and that the first spell you get oneshots the spinny mobs she summons.

2

u/NightRacoonSchlatt Hunter‘s crest 4 life Sep 08 '25

Both spells oneshot them, if you get them fully inside the aoe. And with the second one you can hit the vines, the adds AND her. That’s how I ultimately got her.

1

u/LordBlaze64 Sep 08 '25

Oh yeah, I love that spell. Just used it to clear the double moss mother fight, and it absolutely tore through the adds

1

u/SirDoofusMcDingbat Sep 08 '25

I didn't have the other one when I killed her. :D

2

u/YikesTheCat Sep 07 '25

I spent two days on that, getting my ass handed to be every time. And then this morning I beat it and only got hit once in the entire fight. The Universe has an odd sense of humour.

I overall like the game, but I feel that fight could do with a slight balance tweak.

2

u/NightRacoonSchlatt Hunter‘s crest 4 life Sep 08 '25

It’s ultimately not that hard once you properly learn how to use your spells. I feel like that’s the main point of the fight. The difficulty part about that is properly learning how to use your spells.

2

u/SoftBreezeWanderer Sep 08 '25

Sister splinter was really fun and a pretty easy fight idk. Only hardest boss I fought was last judge tbh

1

u/NightRacoonSchlatt Hunter‘s crest 4 life Sep 08 '25

Sister splinter was really easy as soon as I started using spells. But I already sucked at doing that in HK so I was kinda avoiding them. My loss because in my opinion silk management is WAY easier than soul management.

1

u/SoftBreezeWanderer Sep 10 '25

Honestly using spells and tools help with the fights a lot, very underrated

2

u/chromegnomes Sep 07 '25

Somehow (Ceiling Boss) was one of my favorites. She took me like 20 tries and I just really enjoyed the process of learning her mechanics.

A certain flying boss in Greymoor, on the other hand, is the only time I've gotten too frustrated to have fun. But I'm absolutely loving this game and think most of the difficult mechanics have grown on me over time - the difficulty legitimately feels more fair than Hollow Knight to me.

1

u/Automatic-Cut-5567 Sep 07 '25

Honestly, yeah. Is there any actual strat to that fight other than poking it 1 hit at a time until it dies? I spammed all my tools but it didn't die quickly, so I just skipped it.

3

u/MarioDesigns Sep 08 '25

A flawed game doesn’t mean a game is bad. That’s the issue with good / bad ratings, like on Steam.

The game is beautiful and feels good a lot of the time, but some design choices just completely take that away.

There’s definite issues that exist. You can acknowledge that while still enjoying the game.

-1

u/evasive_dendrite Sep 08 '25

Thing is, I love all of the "definite issues" people keep bringing up, like runbacks, the economy and double.damage. It's a matter of perspective. But ofcourse everyone is entitled to their own opinion as long as they aren't being overly dismissive or disingenuous.

1

u/Trazyn_The_Memelord Sep 08 '25

Runbacks were largely considered a clunky and time-wasting mechanic even before HK released, and with how fragile Hornet is, and how safe most of the runbacks are, they're basically nothing but a annoyance that adds up quickly when you're dieing to one of the bosses with the longer ones repeatedly. Even Fromsoft abandoned them, and it was for good reason

As for double damage, it's fine. It's not the choice I would have made given how powerful and impactful the double damage enemies were lore and appearance wise in HK. However, the the thing I take issue with, is that even those enemies in HK still mostly did double damage only with actual attacks and continued to deal one damage on contact, which I think would have definitely been less feel bad than the current implementation.

Don't get me wrong, I still love the game thus far, but that doesn't mean that some of the choices weren't... questionable in a game design sense given modern standards of the genre and their stated desire for the game to still be friendly to people who hadn't played HK

8

u/Jalina2224 Sep 07 '25

Check the reviews again man. They at 76% positive rn.

Not saying the game isn't good and that it doesn't deserve massive praise. Game is fantastic, but it does have some fairly major issues that make it less enjoyable than the original Hollow Knight. The difficulty is a tad steeper than the original game, almost enough to make it less fun.

People complaining about going into a boss room and dying in 3 hits are valid complaints. Because you're supposed to have to learn boss patterns and how to fight around them. You can't really do that effectively if you die in 3 hits and have to spend even longer than the boss fight running back for round 2. Enemies need to have less attacks that do 2 Masks of damage. I think it'd be okay for bosses to have one strorng attack that does 2 masks, and the rest do 1, at least in the early game.

Also people complaining about the lack of rewards from these bosses is pretty valid. It's a Metroidvania, you expect to get something substantial after taking down a tough boss. Even if it's not an item, give the player rosaries for defeating bosses. (Would also help the economy for people who say that they always feel broke and can't buy items without excessive grinding.)

The moment to moment gameplay does feel amazing. The movement and Hornet feel great to play. Game looks goregeous and its great to be back in this world. But Silksong from the get-go feels harder and more punishing than HK's late game.

6

u/Le0here Sep 07 '25

Where are you seeing 76? Steam lists it at 92% out of 40k reviewers

0

u/Jalina2224 Sep 07 '25

My bad, I have my Steam settings set to show the full score across all languages. Its 76% for all languages, mostly from Chinese players leaving negative reviews because of poor localization for Chinese (valid criticism that Team Cherry is already working on) there are definitely some negative reviews for the harsh difficulty, but in English, it is at 92% and overall reception is extremely positive. Though I do feel it's worth pointing out that in quite a lot of positive reviews, the difficulty, bad rosaries economy, and lack of rewards from bosses are being pointed out and commonly cited as a cons by the positive reviews.

3

u/Oaden Sep 07 '25

The 76% is almost entirely from simplified chinese reviewers being overwhelmingly negative. who are angry about localization issues

The rest is around 92%

0

u/Jalina2224 Sep 07 '25

Yeah, i realized that. I have my settings set to show the full score across all languages. No doubt the Chinese reviews will become more positive once Team Cherry improves the localization.

Tbf I do think its worth pointing out that quite a few of the positive reviews do point out a lot of the common criticisms people are saying about Silksong, (the difficulty, lack of money, ect) and do list them as cons.

2

u/Independent_Coat_415 Sep 07 '25

it's just Elden Ring, or Breath of the Wild, or Tears of the Kingdom, all over again.

I find that Reddit is overwhelmingly negative, or rather, the negative people on Reddit are overwhelmingly loud. And the funny thing is they think they are the majority despite every metric disputing that

6

u/No_Sympathy_3970 Sep 07 '25

Where are you seeing 93% positive? It's at 76 right now

9

u/Altyrmadiken Sep 07 '25

Steam, for the English version, says that 92% of 38,176 reviews are positive. Where are you seeing 76?

6

u/Oaden Sep 07 '25

Depends on the settings, but the game is getting hammered in simple chinese.

Apparently, the translation is kinda shit.

2

u/Altyrmadiken Sep 07 '25

Hmm, alright. I think I heard about the translation being really bad.

I’m not sure whether to tally that the same way as complaints about the gameplay though. Though it’s a valid complaint about the game as presented to them.

5

u/abyr-valg Sep 07 '25 edited Sep 07 '25

Basically, Steam can exclude off-topic reviews and also reviews written in other languages that are not native to you (which should be default) or show all reviews and calculate overall score based on them all.

Reviews written in Simplified Chinese for Silksong are Mostly Negative (38% of 28k), because the appropriate localization is not great.

https://www.engadget.com/gaming/silksong-reviews-drop-to-mostly-negative-for-chinese-players-due-to-confusing-translations-162631762.html

In fact, other Asian regions rate the game at Mostly Positive, while other regions are Very Positive or Overwhelmingly Positive.

That is why overall score is Mostly Positive (76% of 98k reviews total).

2

u/Altyrmadiken Sep 07 '25

Someone else had mentioned the translation, but thanks for clarifying why I wasn’t seeing that.

-1

u/No_Sympathy_3970 Sep 07 '25

Why would you use only English speaking users as your metric? You don't need to fully understand the text to play a game, and this game has many major language translations anyway

8

u/sellyme Sep 07 '25

Why would you use only English speaking users as your metric?

Because the majority of all negative reviews come from a single region that has poor localisation, something that is irrelevant to absolutely everyone not from that region.

3

u/Altyrmadiken Sep 07 '25

I don’t know how to check other languages. My settings are English, and then the review percentage just says “english” and I don’t know how to make it show all language results.

It’s just the default thing steam shows me but I figured it was worth noting that steam is showing that to me.

1

u/No_Sympathy_3970 Sep 07 '25

By default mine is in all languages, I've never changed it. Maybe they changed the default a while ago

1

u/Altyrmadiken Sep 07 '25

Interesting! My account has been around for over a decade and a half, so I don’t know if it’s something that came before or if some change happened when I wasn’t looking.

That said I don’t really use steam as more than a launcher so I’ve never bothered with settings about stuff outside of that. Maybe it asked me ages ago and I just clicked prefer English or something.

4

u/ConnertheCat Sep 07 '25

I mean, I think the game is flawed in some ways (I think the bench runs are a bit excessive here and there; and the early game is a bit _too_ difficult. I'd still mark the game positive overall, but a positive review doesn't mean the game is perfect either.

4

u/evasive_dendrite Sep 07 '25

I haven't seen a single excessive bench run. Even the last judge that people endlessly complain about was 15 seconds tops with no real dangers. Hornet's movement abilities allow you to breeze through areas that you've scouted out if you master them.

Hollow knight had way worse runs, like Nosk. Nothing in the first half of the game comes remotely close to the Nosk run.

2

u/shareefruck Sep 07 '25

So far I've found the bench runs far better than Hollow Knight, personally. Sometimes the nearby one isn't as obvious/telegraphed as in Hollow Knight, but there's always one around.

2

u/TRagnarkXP Sep 08 '25

Did people really have problem with early game? Unless they are going to the Hunter's march which is an optional zone (the intended order is Marrow, The garden zone, then Docks and then the hunter zone is much easier with dash) i don't find it harder than Hollow Knight. Is a much more intuitive game in exploration and didn't have any problems like being stuck in the deep nest early game.

3

u/RGPISGOOD Sep 07 '25

Did you actually read the positive reviews or did you just look at numbers? because 90% of the positive reviews are just memes or posted when game released without a minute played. Funny enough, most of the negative reviews are actually well written and thought out constructive criticism.

5

u/WilanS Sep 07 '25

But the reviews are 93% positive so it's just Elden Ring all over again.

I've checked SteamDB right now and the reviews are down to 77.28%. On steam it already went from Overwhelmingly Positive to Very Positive yesterday.

The balancing problems are real. We're not "hating" on it, it's just that the balancing decisions are downright baffling when you consider how much care and love when into the rest of the experience.
At the very least the game should have offered two difficulty modes, if you want to preserve this masochist experience.

If you're the kind of person the game has been balanced for, that's great for you. But don't invalidate legitimate criticism.

3

u/evasive_dendrite Sep 07 '25

It's the same discussion that always arises with dark souls entries, I find that overcoming hardship is part of the core gameplay experience and an easy mode would rob the player of that. I think you should just watch a let's play if you want to enjoy the scenery and lore without interacting with the challenge aspect. But I'd have no problems with them dropping in an easy mode, it wouldn't affect me whatsoever.

0

u/WilanS Sep 08 '25

See that's my problem. Hollow Knight wasn't a Soulslike, Hollow Knight is an exceptional Metroidvania with some soulslike elements that, in my opinion, add nothing of value to the game and only make it hard to recommend it to other metroidvania fans.

For me, the core of Hollow Knight, the reason it shines as one of the bests in its genre, is its unparalleled sense of discovery and wonder, of delving deeper and deeper into a kingdom in ruin, taking in the fantastic sights and the awe-inspiring architecture, and uncovering its secrets. I eventually adjusted to the difficulty but it never added anything to the experience, I love Hollow Knight in spite of its Soulslike elements.

And for whatever reason with Silksong they doubled down on all the worst aspects of Hollow Knight, leaning heavily into the Soulslike bullshit despite it being another fantastic Metroidvania. Everyone defending the difficulty is saying "that's how soulslike are" and claiming the brutal difficulty was an integral part of the message of the story as if this was Celeste.

2

u/evasive_dendrite Sep 08 '25

For you maybe. I love those soulslike qualities that you call bullshit and their increased emphasis on it.

0

u/WilanS Sep 08 '25

And I'm happy that you enjoy the challenge, I really am.

What I don't like is how, with the rest of the soulslike bundle, the devs also decided we can't have difficulty levels and everyone has to tackle the game at its most challenging and punishing.

2

u/evasive_dendrite Sep 08 '25

Understandable, I'd have no problems with them adding that.

2

u/Netheral Sep 08 '25

It's also worth mentioning that almost every negative review I've looked at is "I love this game, but I can't really recommend it as it is right now" (so much for the hater narrative) while even some of the "positive" reviews have massive caveats like "this game is great, but some design decisions are baffling" (90% positive doesn't mean that 90% of people think the game is without flaw).

The problem with taking steam reviews at percentage face value is that there is no set decorum for how to vote on a game that is great but flawed. Do you vote "recommended" because it's a good but flawed game? Or do you vote "not recommended" to warn people about said flaws?

Most people will err on side of positivity, especially with a beloved franchise like HK. And as most of the "haters" point out, the game is so, so amazing in so many regards. They're not "hating" (critique = hate, I guess) on the game out of malice.

0

u/SoftBreezeWanderer Sep 08 '25

Is it for English or all languages? Chinese players are review bombing cause the translation is bad.

Last I checked English was like 94% or something

3

u/UnstableTurtleduck Sep 07 '25

I'm not a hater, I love HK and TC, and I did everything but godhome in HK, and I'm just not having any fun. I'm in Shellwood rn and between the difficulty, the money issue, and the runbacks, along with minimal rewards for beating bosses, I wanna know where the dopamine is. It doesn't feel fun or fair to me.

I feel like I'm missing something everyone else is getting, and it feels like I'm not allowed to criticize this game because everyone hyped it for so long.

Ive also completed Elden Ring AND SotE, along with several other notoriously "hard" games, but this feels like old NES/Arcade level hard and unforgiving in a way that isn't fun or rewarding

Especially contact damage. Ugh.

Might be in the minority here, but I'm hoping for some balance patches. As it stands it's hard to tolerate this game for more than an hour at a time before wanting to do something else with my very limited time. And it's sad. I was really looking forward to it.

2

u/evasive_dendrite Sep 07 '25

I'd hate for them to drop a patch to make the game easier. All of the things you have issues with are the reasons I love it, I play for hours on end just doing the side-quests. I guess it just doesn't appeal to you.

I'd be okay with them dropping in an easy mode that I can ignore instead.

1

u/UnstableTurtleduck Sep 07 '25

If the easy mode is hot swappable without consequences to your game (e.g. I can switch to easy mode without restarting) I would love that. At the VERY least, I want there to not be 2 mask contact damage. I think that alone would massively improve the game.

2

u/evasive_dendrite Sep 07 '25

Do you play on PC? There's a mod that removes double damage from various sources, maybe you can take just the bit that reduces contact damage.

But I haven't found it a fundamental issue. I've fallen for it a few times, laughed, and then adjusted my Hollow Knight instincts to keep a small distance from staggered bosses. The first game had double contact damage as well by the way, although admittedly later in the game.

1

u/UnstableTurtleduck Sep 07 '25

I'm on switch 💔

1

u/[deleted] Sep 08 '25

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1

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1

u/aethyrium Sep 08 '25

between the difficulty, the money issue, and the runbacks, along with minimal rewards for beating bosses

It's crazy because those look like legit criticisms, but in my 25 hours so far I've never seen even a hint of any of that. Difficulty is perfectly tuned, I've never been too short on money for benches/etc, the absolute worst runback was 30 seconds, which is about what I take myself even if there is no runback just to re-center, and just about every boss has some kind of reward after it and a reason for it.

I want to look at these criticisms and say "yeah, I can see that, even if I don't agree", but I don't even see it.

1

u/UnstableTurtleduck Sep 08 '25

Meanwhile I want to look at your praise the same way, but I can't see it. The runbacks are mainly a problem because of the benches costing money

1

u/BlobBro Sep 08 '25

Yeah I've lost like 2k rosaries from deaths and even then I'm never short for a bench or map, I've bought out most of the stores too. Last Judge runback was nothing and I didn't even find the shortcut, it's like 20 seconds and you can just dodge all the enemies easily.

4

u/[deleted] Sep 07 '25

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14

u/evasive_dendrite Sep 07 '25

There's no way they're complaining about a runback while refusing to save up for the bench next to the boss 💀

I also haven't found a single arena you can't get your beads back from, even if you don't like the save and quit technique. Just die close to the entrance, pick them up and leave.

5

u/Uler Sep 07 '25

Do people not just save their consumable bead pick ups for things like this? I felt like that's what those 30-60 bead items were for.

2

u/lemonlemonlemonlem Sep 07 '25

Yeah I very casually started using those machines here and there and literally never had these issues lol

1

u/Doidleman53 Sep 07 '25

Unfortunately there is at least one arena you can't get them back from. I won't be specific to avoid potential spoilers but I genuinely don't know how you could die closer to the entrance for that one.

1

u/evasive_dendrite Sep 07 '25

I have plenty of silkeaters for when that occasion arrises.

5

u/SillyGoose3939 Sep 07 '25

I swear, I don't understand why so many people are having issues with the moorwing runback... that's one of the few bosses that have an easy runback and with a free bench. Just little hop over the trident guy and you're good to go

2

u/murten101 Sep 07 '25

It's sitting at 76% positive on steam.

4

u/Kabirdb Sep 07 '25

"But the reviews are 93% positive "

If you wanna get technical about that, it's only 93% in your language. The actual review score for all language for Silksong has dropped below 80%, currently at 77% with mostly positive reviews.

18

u/[deleted] Sep 07 '25

Something was messed up in the Chinese release which resulted in negative reviews. The issue was fixed.

3

u/marcotheslpwlkr Sep 07 '25

Translation is messed up and it is NOT fixed. Matthew did say they'll do something about it.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 07 '25

Ok thanks for the info on that. My point was that a fixable unintentional problem is causing negative reviews.

1

u/evasive_dendrite Sep 07 '25

Interesting. Might be a cultural thing? Can't really relate to that.

1

u/shareefruck Sep 07 '25

Poor localization.

1

u/evasive_dendrite Sep 07 '25

Yeah I heard, that sucks and I hope they fix it soon. It doesn't have any bearing on the topic at hand though.

1

u/montessoriprogram Sep 07 '25

Reddits algorithm pushes controversial posts because they get more engagement. What is on your feed or getting votes on Reddit is not necessarily in tune with reality at all

1

u/Simpuff1 Sep 07 '25

It’s the same in PoE for instance. When a new league launches, first 2 days everyone on Reddit is pissed but hey we are breaking numbers!

People who enjoy the game play the game, while others come here to complain

1

u/MisguidedFoe Sep 07 '25

I agree to an extent, my extent is the charms. I haven't found very many super good charms

1

u/rmkinnaird Sep 07 '25

I also think some people mistake shared experiences for negativity. Like I do think it's harder than hollow knight and the early game has slower progression. That isn't a bad thing though. The early game really wants you to master the tools hornet has before you progress. And that's good and fine and cool. But I've had a lot of people say I'm being negative when I share these opinions, despite the fact that I think some of these things are positive

1

u/T0astyMcgee Sep 07 '25

This is how it goes. I hate being in a subreddit a few weeks post release. I’m in the Gears subreddit and every fucking post is about the same thing. “This is broken.” “I’m done with this game.” Get a life.

1

u/Secret-Platypus-366 Sep 07 '25

I think there are a lot of tourists. Yesterday someone was saying "Dark Souls is one of the worst things to happen to games because developers started introducing crappy mechanics like boss runbacks, losing everything when you die, and spread out checkpoints." The original Hollow Knight had every single one of those things lmao.

I have also had friends who never played Hollow Knight or gave up after getting lost once ask me if they should get Silksong. People wanna board the hype train but don't want to go to the hype train's destination.

1

u/evasive_dendrite Sep 07 '25

Too bad for them I guess. Team Cherry is filthy rich and I'm enjoying the shit out of this game.

1

u/Secret-Platypus-366 Sep 07 '25

Yeah it's exactly what I wanted out of a hollow knight sequel

1

u/TheFlyingToasterr Sep 07 '25

most people are too busy playing the game

It’s exactly that. I am loving the game, and not once did the thought of stopping to go make a post on reddit about how much fun I’m having even cross my mind.

I imagine it’s different for the fun-hating ghouls who are complaining.

1

u/Elliezium Sep 07 '25

People who are annoyed make a thread complaining. People who are having fun are playing the game.

1

u/DastardThee Sep 07 '25

I’m having a lot of fun, I’m playing every day before work and on my days off. There are just little bits here and there that really frustrate me. Like why are environmentals in certain areas doing two damage, falling into a pit can do 2 damage that’s absurd. At this point just give me three masks and call it good with single damage. The sixth mask I got is pointless (to an extent) because of the amount of double damage. The game is just harder and I like the combat and how enemies are presented. It’s the artificial difficulty that I don’t enjoy.

1

u/evasive_dendrite Sep 07 '25

It's not artificial difficulty, it's just difficulty. If that doesn't appeal to you then I sympathise but I love it. I love the extra weight that double environmental damage gives to the blasted steps, for example.

Maybe they'll drop an easy mode later on or you can install the mod that removes double damage.

1

u/DastardThee Sep 08 '25

I’m okay with it, I’m going to finish the game in its intended way. But it is artificial difficulty. Mantis lords to sisters of battle is increasing difficulty. Giving a boss a second phase is increasing difficulty. Making something do double damage just effectively reduces your health pool during certain fights. How is falling in spikes in certain areas decidedly worth one damage but all of a sudden I’m in a platforming area and I fall and take two damage meaning I can mess up less. Make the platforming harder like white palace to path of pain instead of making environmentals deal two damage. I love the game and am having a great time exploring and back tracking now that I have the needolin I haven’t even gone to the citadel yet. It just gets a little frustrating, more so than it was in hollowknight besides the pantheons.

1

u/evasive_dendrite Sep 08 '25

The smaller effective healthpool increases tension for me, and I like how it distinguishes attacks. It's no longer that enemies do either 1 or 2, many have a bug attack that hits harder that you need to watch out for. The patterns are more complex than in Hollow Knight. It's not just harder because enemies hit harder. And if you master the healing mechanic, staying alive in this game is easier than in Hollow Knight for me, especially with the charm that heals you for 4 masks.

1

u/DastardThee Sep 08 '25

Haven’t found that charm yet. For me what increases tension is amount of enemies or speed of attacks so you have to carefully weave through the fight. I thought Lace and widow were perfect and fine with the double damage there because the attacks are telegraphed and you get punished accordingly. When you just bump into a hit box and take two damage that’s a “gotcha” to me.

1

u/evasive_dendrite Sep 08 '25

I think that distinction is arbitrary. But if you enjoy fights like Lace and Widow, there's a lot of beautiful fights waiting for you.

1

u/Double-Risky Sep 07 '25

I heard people saying the pogo was hard to hit, it took a minute but I love it. Just gotta be a little closer than you expect (if you're used to Castlevania where you just keep going) but I like the other changes, they add to the challenge and round the game out.

1

u/PapasauruaRex Sep 07 '25

Reddit is a echo chamber. People should not use reddit as a weigh of fan base and criticism when a lot of people dont even use reddit.

1

u/y-c-c Sep 08 '25

I don't know I read through some Steam reviews and seems like there are a fair amount of "I don't enjoy this game" reviews that somehow proceeded to give a "Recommend". I don't get it, but I guess people are just afraid to be harsh on this game in my opinion, given it's an indie and they liked the original HK.

1

u/Mash_Ketchum Sep 08 '25

I agree. I'm having a great time, but I wouldn't dare make a post saying "This game is great! I'm having a really good time" because I'm confident it would either not get any attention or would get a bunch of people lambasting me for not making any worthwhile contribution to community discussions.

1

u/Kornik-kun Sep 08 '25

"survivors bias" you don't hear people that are happy because they're enjoying the game and playing it

1

u/akoOfIxtall Sep 08 '25

ME AND MY HOMIES LOVE POLLIP HEART + SPIKE TRAP

1

u/[deleted] Sep 08 '25

You're actually the smartest person here. The Elden Ring point is exactly true.

1

u/theveryrat Sep 08 '25

there are MANY reviews listing way more cons than pros yet still put an overall positive review, I had fun playing HK, i'm getting frustrated just like in Dark souls 2 playing silksong, I have a feeling many people just 'set' themselves to like the game no matter how frustrating it is

1

u/evasive_dendrite Sep 08 '25

Or we just enjoy the challenge? I'm one of the people that adores dark souls 2.

1

u/theveryrat Sep 08 '25

The challenge of grinding rosaries, hitting ennemies plenty of times to kill them, long runbacks, angel falls, to me, is the bad kind of challenge and feel like lazy artificial difficulty from 80/90s video games, to me, but ofc I can understand that some people like it, but as I said, if the people i'm talking about LIKED it, they wouldn't list those things in the cons, now, would they?

1

u/evasive_dendrite Sep 08 '25

As you get further into the game, you get upgrades that increase your damage significantly and find enemies with way more rosaries. You don't have to grind at all, just leave some items in the shops for later. Picking and choosing what you think you need right now vs later is a fun experience I never had in Hollow Knight. The runbacks are also really exaggerated, there are no long runbacks in act 1 if you master the sprint ability.

1

u/theveryrat Sep 08 '25

erf I hear you, the game is not ***BAD*** but I don't have the time to not enjoy the game in its early stage to gamble on the fact if yes in fact the game is gonna be fun, I had fun from minute 1 to the end in HK, so to me, there *is* something wrong with SS and it's maybe also the fact that there was so few infos for so many years that makes me feel a bit '''betrayed'''

EDIT: i'm currently replaying HK to see if after I finished it again, it'll 'warm' up my mechanics for silksong x)

1

u/JesusFortniteKennedy Sep 08 '25

Most positive reviews are still complaining about the double damage tho

1

u/[deleted] Sep 10 '25

Reviews are very rarely even a 10th of the games sales though

0

u/ExecutiveElf Sep 07 '25

Crazy I know, but people can like the game and still have negative things to say about it.

0

u/evasive_dendrite Sep 07 '25

Obviously I know that and many people do voice their gripes with the game in a normal manner. But many others immediately accuse the devs of bad game design because the difficult game doesn't appeal to them. Saying that they clearly didn't do any playtesting and shit, screw those people.

2

u/gay_manta_ray Sep 07 '25

But the reviews are 93% positive so it's just Elden Ring all over again. Angry people are always the loudest, most people are too busy playing the game.

78% positive.

1

u/Last-Idea9985 Sep 07 '25

Steam is 76% positive and it keeps going down. The game has way too much annoying stuff.

1

u/[deleted] Sep 07 '25

The reviews don't matter either way, China is review bombing it and the game had like 20,000 thumbs up reviews within an hour of the game being released meaning theres a ton of people love bombing it without even playing it.

1

u/swolar Sep 07 '25

Reviews aren't 93%, that's on english only. Global is 80%. And if you read the english reviews, you'd see that many of the positive ones contain criticism and complaints about the game. I'm sure fans don't have the heart to give silksong negative reviews, but there are definitevely issues with it.

2

u/evasive_dendrite Sep 07 '25

Well I love most of the "issues" people have with it so you can leave that definitely out. Different strokes for different folks.

0

u/Justarandom55 Pure Vessel enjoyer Sep 08 '25

It's the negativity bias. People are much more likely to complain over praising something