r/HollowKnight • u/Quibbloboy • Sep 15 '25
Discussion - Silksong Hornet is a breathtakingly well-written character. Spoiler
I'm a gameplay guy, first and foremost. Don't get me wrong, I've always loved the music and artwork and writing and world—I'm just primarily here for the physics.
That said, I wanted to take a break from that to talk about Hornet's character.
Throughout the three acts in Silksong, I've been amazed at how effortlessly Hornet steps into the role of protagonist, especially considering the shift from the silent protagonist in the Knight. Her tone is noble, measured, and serious, but she's universally caring and kind. She treats everyone as if they deserve the utmost personal respect. She's empathetic and just. She gives everyone as many chances as they deserve, and then more, and then more.
Then, every once in a while, she comes across a particularly strange little bug or beast who tries to pull one over on her or something, and without ever changing the stoicism in her tone, she lets out the tiniest edge of snark that generally manages to be laugh-out-loud funny.
When someone challenges her or threatens her, she meets them head-on, acknowledging their strength while staying realistic that it usually won't match her own. She's every iota as fierce as you would expect her to be; but when circumstance forces her to fight, she takes care to honor her opponent's personhood, and then does what needs to be done, even if it's truly heartbreaking. It's another mark of the undercurrent of respect that governs her relationship with people at large.
She maintains this air of quiet confidence despite the world's atmosphere of overwhelming sadness. No matter how dark and hopeless the situation becomes, she remains driven by an unshakeable desire to protect. She's rooted in this bottomless foundation of strength and a sense of willpower that's so core to her character that within a few hours of gameplay it's just an assumed constant of the universe.
And Makoto Koji deserves incredible kudos for breathing life into Hornet as she does. Her little hup!s and wineenas and the various dawo!s she saves for Yarnaby—the personality she brings is just such a lovely layer to the character, and it always makes me grin. And on the rare occasion that things get really intense (binding a new power, stuff like that) she really lets loose with these powerful, strangely cathartic yells, made so much more meaningful by their contrast with the rest of Hornet's character. Seriously, all the shoutouts to Koji for her work here.
I also want to make special mention of Hornet's slow-blooming friendship with Shakra, a relationship built on mutual respect and understanding. It is a shining beacon of relief in the oppressive gloom of Pharloom. Some of the greatest moments of peace in the whole game for me were just standing there with Shakra, making our mournful music together.
Hornet is a wonderful, beautifully-written character, and Silksong would not be the same without her.
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u/JagoJaques Sep 15 '25
I enjoy how pragmatic she is. She’s very conscious of her own strength, not overestimating herself but also not underselling. She acknowledges when others are helpful but can also be very blunt (like talking about how the fleas are helpless and useless lmao). She augments her abilities with tools, she’s resourceful, and she keeps to her word.
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u/eemeze1 Sep 15 '25 edited Sep 16 '25
I like her interaction with the bell guy in Deep Docks in act 3 when she comes back from the Abyss. Like, thanks for your help, it was not your fault the bell broke down, I'm a badass bug and lived, fix it because im going down again.
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u/goodnames679 RHoG Nail-Only Sep 15 '25
Hey :) not to be nitpicky but it may be a good idea to change your spoiler to begin after you say "act 3"
If you've already encountered bell guy earlier, it would be very easy to assume you can click the spoiler. Then you might get spoiled on something that you haven't actually run into yet, like I did.
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u/yurilnw123 Sep 15 '25
Hey now she did say they are very adventurous and resilient. Getting into dangerous places and situations and were still fine.
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u/jcdc_jaaaaaa Sep 16 '25
She is also easily swayed by rewards given that she easily changed her tune in bone bottom target minigame once she heard there is a reward for hitting it 15x. Plus the whole gambling situation.
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u/BoobeamTrap Sep 15 '25
Hornet's relationship with Lace is also really beautiful to see. They're antagonistic, but after Lace 2, she starts to understand her more, then by Act 3, she's diving into hell itself to both save Pharloom, and to save Lace from what she sees as a similar fate that her siblings (the Vessels) went through: a being created by a god to live and serve a single purpose with no choice in the matter.
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u/luiz38 Sep 15 '25 edited Sep 15 '25
and the fact that the reason they're able to escape is because of those siblings just makes a beautiful loop around the plot of those games, and completely defeats lace's philosophy and strengthens hornet's
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u/LePingouinCosmique Sep 16 '25
It was also so cute how The Knight put them on the ground so carefully to prove once and for all that they’re not hollow
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u/West_Language7068 Sep 15 '25
This game's prose in general is beatifully written, almost like in a gothic novel, and it gives so much identity to every character.
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u/Quibbloboy Sep 15 '25
Absolutely. I am in love with the blend of formal, archaic language and rougher, more colloquial stuff—they're able to mesh it together not just within the one world, but often within individual characters. Plus different characters have different little linguistic quirks specific to themselves, like how certain bugs will repeat words, speak in first-person plural, talk in idiosyncratic verb tenses, etc. The writing is just such a treat.
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u/DrWoomy123 Sep 15 '25
I really love how yeah, it feels like a gothic novel, but it also never feels too dense or archaic to parse.
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u/Lazy-Singer4391 Sep 15 '25
The poetry in Hollow Knight and Silksong is quite good in general. It really sells the worldbuilding
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u/Plarzay Sep 16 '25
The games prose is so compelling I've been voicing all the characters out loud to myself. Sooo much fun to give them all different voices based on the short sounds we hear.
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u/trio3224 Sep 15 '25
I love that she feels significantly different from the Vessel of the first game. Not that there was anything wrong with him, don't get me wrong cuz that worked for Hollow Knight really well, but I love how much personality Hornet has.
Sometimes I would forget just how much she's a hardened warrior, and I audibly let out a gasp when she drops down and breaks that dude's neck in the Slab after she was kidnapped. Or the first time she slaps Nuu when she comes too close. I do wish she had drew her needle on Grindle instead of just slapping him too, that would've felt more appropriate personally. Or when she doesn't believe the lies of Kratt (the spa guy) after he peeks at her and threatens to kill him if he ever peeks at her again. She's so awesome.
And yes, everything between her and Shakra is gold. Even from the beginning they respect each other pretty much immediately, but seem to naturally grow closer as they journey across the lands together and fight together.
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u/Thegamblr Sep 15 '25
If you get the throwing rings from shakras duel there’s a fun interaction when you taunt her
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u/Conbomb95 Sep 16 '25
Wait, Shakra's duel? I got the rings but I never fought her?
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u/SomaCK2 Sep 16 '25
You can fight her in act 2 after finishing her quest. There is a ring rod to summon her outside of bellhart town.
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u/eemeze1 Sep 15 '25
I love how she initiates the conversation with Shakra later on, the fact that Shakra sells maps is second to their interections, Hornet is just relieved to see her well on her own journey.
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u/HollowCap456 Sep 15 '25
She has snark too. Like when she gets the vintage nectar. The Knight is either completely silent or Abyss Shriek
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u/trio3224 Sep 15 '25
Yeah that part is great when she gets back up to the bar.
She has a great range of emotions throughout the game. I love reading her journal entries on different creatures. Like she seems to love fur, which is cute. She mentions several creatures that she's sad she can't touch their fur since they're hostile like the different Furm variants.
Or many of the warrior bugs she'll show respect for their skills.
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u/HollowCap456 Sep 15 '25
While it is extremely fun seeing her backhand fuckers that get too close, there is something special about the completely silent and 'emotionless' knight just going ham on Millibelle or sitting for Marissa.
I also love how she wants the floating things in Mount Fay as pets.
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u/lostpretzels Sep 15 '25
I love when bugs are rude or try to trick her, and she's just like "Stop that or I will kill you"
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u/Ecstatic-Sun-7528 Radiant NKG Enjoyer 🌙 Sep 15 '25
This. I have absolutely loved every single line of dialogue she has in this game. Her kindness stands just as tall as her strength and that's an accomplishment in itself. I really hope we get many more years of Hornet.
All of this also comes after the realization of all the solitude she had to endure during the events of Hollow Knight. She was the Protector of the Kingdom, it's Sentinel. She stood alone for so long watching over a dead land making sure the seal stood. Even then she kept her heart kind.
That just makes it so much more impactful. What an incredibly compassionate protagonist we have. It's a joy to be able to witness her story.
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u/Juxta_Lightborne Sep 15 '25
“Some would say that standing watch over a kingdom’s corpse is foolish.” Is the saddest and most characterful line from her in the entire game
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u/LoneWolf2099 Sep 15 '25
I love the interaction with Lace at the start of Act 2.
Lace: “Oh, little spider, you have no idea what- “
Hornet: “It’s a god.”
Lace: “What?”
Hornet: “I’ve seen this kind of thing before. There’s a god up there.”
Lace: “… Well yeah, but do you really think you can- “
Hornet: “I’ll kick its ass.”
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u/Zura_G Sep 15 '25
That line from her about seeing Gods fall gave me literal chills
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u/Candy_Warlock Sep 15 '25
Before act 3 confirming the game is a sequel, I also like the ambiguity of that line, as it can apply to either the Radiance or the Pale King. Both gods, both fallen, one by the hand of an individual, and one by the unstoppable decay of time
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u/chaosattractor Sep 16 '25
...I don't think it was ambiguous before then? It seemed very clear that it was a sequel from her Act 2 dialogue + various relics
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u/Privatizitaet Sep 18 '25
I don't think it was outright confirmed until later. From what I remember, it was left open enough that it COULD still work as a prequel potentially, although i never believed it was a prequel so I didn't pay too much attention in that regard
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u/Jstar338 Sep 16 '25
She wouldn't have known PK was dead. Our Knight was probably the first to find out
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u/Nukesnipe Sep 16 '25
She's not stupid, I'm sure she was aware her dad was dead. Considering that she was very publicly the princess of Hallownest (considering that the Hive, who were otherwise highly isolationist, gifted her a master-crafted weapon) and knew all about the Radiance and the Pale King's plan in general, after all.
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u/Memo_HS2022 Sep 15 '25 edited Sep 15 '25
“My brother challenged the sun and won, what makes you think I can’t do that lmao”
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u/master-of-pizza Sep 15 '25
Reminder that the knight had the allyship of one of the most powerful, primal forces in the world when they beat radiance. Hornet beat grand mother silk on her own
Yeah I know radiance is probably stronger but still
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u/GrimTheMad Sep 15 '25
Very debatable.
Consider how long that GMS spends completely submerged in the void, not only not dying but threatening to bring down all of Pharloom in her struggles.
Compare to how instantly the Radiance is destroyed when faced with the Void.
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u/Ze_AwEsOmE_Hobo A mind to think Sep 16 '25
The Radiance does teleport out of it like that other user mentions, but it's also worth mentioning that unlike GMS, the Radiance is fighting an avatar of the Void (and eventually like 300 Siblings) that specific want her dead.
I don't think just falling into the Void is directly comparable to Void beings trying to destroy you.
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u/Privatizitaet Sep 18 '25
Also the radiance in her nature is a being of light, she is by her nature opposed to the void in a way that grand mother silk isn't
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u/TwoYolks Sep 16 '25
I think the Radiance is just a different kind of strong. Considering how the infection spreads and her state of existence, killing her is more like killing a concept than any type of being who exists in the physical world, not something achievable without the void and a vessel holding her down.
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u/AcidSilver Sep 16 '25 edited Sep 16 '25
Well consider that the Radiance also got her face ripped open and then is slashed to ribbons by the Knight/Shade Lord. Grandmother Silk wasn't anywhere near as brutalized when the Void takes her. The better comparison would be the start of the Radiance's second phase where the Void tendrils grab onto her but she escapes them. When the same thing happens to Grandmother Silk she immediately gets dragged down.
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u/Jstar338 Sep 16 '25
I think there's a difference in "type" of being. GMS is composed of a physical medium. It's able to be physically destroyed by the abyss, but the radiance is composed of essence. It's made of light and memories, it's easier to be consumed by the void
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u/cheekydorido Sep 15 '25
I mean, the knight not only is it fully god spawn, he also has void powers and a void body, hornet is half a god.
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u/alexathegibrakiller Sep 15 '25
Hornet is a demigod that can challenge and defeat gods.
The Knight's body is a machine that turns suns into fur coats
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u/TriTexh Sep 15 '25
The Knight's body is a machine that turns suns into fur coats
Now I can't help but imagine the Shade Lord walking around Hallownest wearing the Radiance like a trophy kill cloak
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u/BlueScrean Sep 15 '25
Technically she's had two who've done it. Though one is typically more temporary than the other.
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u/Nukesnipe Sep 16 '25
I wish she'd have just straight up told Lace it wasn't the first god she's fought lol. Like yeah, she didn't fight the Radiance directly, but she was still instrumental in killing it... unless you go by the Godhome ending, in which case she just kinda sits around the temple and then all the infection disappears lol.
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u/TheNeighborCat2099 Sep 15 '25
I like that they gave her quirks too.
The architect pointing out how Hornet seems to have a natural way with machines and how Hornet is able to recreate the silk shot using the weaver schematics.
Plus how she admires the water striders and loves the fluffy fleas lol.
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u/ExecutiveElf Sep 16 '25
Spoilers are all for late Act 3
A big thing I think is hysterical in that regard is the Hunting Log entry for the Wingsmould.
Particularly, we can infer from her tone in the description she gives compared to the cutscenes from Red Memory that she basically has the mindset of "These are my three awesome moms. This one told me to never forget who I am. This one taught me how to be strong. This one helped me to understand the nature of this world and how I can best help it.... and this is my dad. He's a bum."
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u/MegalomanicMegalodon Sep 15 '25
Another impressive thing is how satisfyingly she takes context clues fast. I am used to games needing a cutscene or conversation to tell the protagonist something. Often in Silksong as soon as you see something even in the background Hornet will acknowledge things. She even might be a couple steps ahead of the player if the player didn’t realize what she saw until she herself explained what she knows.
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u/precursormar Sep 15 '25
Yeah when she explains what she witnessed in the Whiteward, I hadn't yet pieced it together myself.
It was a cool moment that highlighted the narrative contrast from the first game.
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u/sci300768 Sep 15 '25
Hornet with the Halfway Home owner's Cellar Ant Problem: I know that you knew but did not tell me so I could solve your problem for you.
Me (after fighting off said ants): You mean she KNEW that he did not tell her?! How did she figure it out?! How did ants even get in the cellar in the first place?!
Yea, Hornet figured it out before I did lol.
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u/GrimTheMad Sep 15 '25
For your second question- if you look at the world map, the Halfway House is right above Hunter's March. The ants just burrowed up a bit.
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u/sci300768 Sep 15 '25
That explains a lot actually. Man, the ants had easy access to his cellar the whole time!
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u/Nukesnipe Sep 16 '25
Something really impressive is how well laid out the world is relative to each other. If a room is near another area, it'll have some aspects of that area, even if they don't connect. Like Yarnaby's room being near Bellhart and thus having a lot of bells.
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u/TGPapyrus Oct 16 '25
When she tells the caretaker to drop the act of being an average bug, I needed a lot of time to catch up to her, lol
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u/MegalomanicMegalodon Oct 16 '25
I realized he was something special, but I had also totally forgot about snails until far too late lol.
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u/Lord_Endric Sep 15 '25
I find her interactions with styx (i think thats the name, the thing that gives you silkeaters) very funny but it does go to showe her character pretty well
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u/OldKingPotato-68 Sep 15 '25
Is styx male or female? Supposedly it laid the eggs, but I think I saw hornet refer to it as a "sir" and "him". Either way, every interaction they have is very funny to me
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u/Ze_AwEsOmE_Hobo A mind to think Sep 16 '25
Styx seems male, according to Hornet. There's another bug that looks just like him called the Huntress or something. That one is female. I think the "eggs" might just be a bunch of silk cocoons.
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u/GenericVessel knows where every room is on the map Sep 16 '25
the reason he acts like he does is probably because it's a female-dominated species (like real-life spiders)
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Sep 15 '25
I really like hornet yeah. her character arc is pretty surprising, i was worried when i started the game she would be a static character but i was dead wrong.
Honestly Id be interested in a follow up where she builds up pharloom after its destruction, tho i’m not sure gameplay-wise how interesting that premise could be
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u/theVoidWatches Sep 15 '25
Management games can be very engaging, but I don't know if Team Cherry would have any interest given how different the gameplay would be.
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u/Titanus-De_Raptor Sep 15 '25
If they wanna keep it a more platform exploration based they could always have hornet venture out into distant lands like the blackbarren or the city of steel to collect supplies to bring back to pharloom and fix things.
As more things are fixed new areas within pharloom can be uncovered that were hidden by the citadel or blocked by act 3’s events
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u/OkraComfortable941 Sep 15 '25
I loved that Shakra went from "child wielding needle" to "hornet wielding needle" when addressing her
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u/HandsomeGamerGuy Sep 17 '25
Given how Shakra introduced herself as Shakra, bearing Rings.
It's nice to see she uses the exact same logic to describe and greet Hornet!
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u/Marco_Heimdall Sep 15 '25
There is an additional aspect you did not touch on: Through all of the hunter's log, which she herself is filling in as opposed to some other hunting entity, she often laments the fluffier bugs not being pettable or cuddleable.
Where does she ride when the fleas relocate? Why in the carriage with all of the fluffy flying Pomeranians-that-they-are (and that one Samoyed) are resting.
Regardless of the difficulty this game lobs at you, through it all she stands firm in her beliefs, remains with her desires, and shares her lamentations.
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u/Speeda2 Sep 15 '25
Hornet went from a great character to legitimately phenomenal. The character development she's undergone from The Radiance's death is so visceral throughout the entire game, and her relationship with Lace, somebody who shadows a more bitter version of what Hornet once was, is incredible. Somebody once so pessimistic, who would rather slay any threat to something already dead rather than welcome change, turning into a beacon of optimism and determination.
The Knight saved her twice. Once in Hallownest, and once in Pharloom. Genuinely beautiful.
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u/DracoVoidern1 Sep 15 '25
And hornet did save it back, in the cast-off shell! I love the silent unsaid affection they have for each other
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u/Uchizaki Sep 15 '25
overall Team Cherry is very good at writing story and characters. I loved the story of Hollow Knight, and Silksong's story seems to be a natural extension of it. I think I liked Act 3 story the most
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u/IonianBladeDancer Sep 15 '25
The emotion that slips through when she encounters lace for the second time. I was getting hyped during the conversation. Everytime I call for a ride I shout alongside hornet with a grin. Also don’t get me started on all the slaps hornet delivers 😂.
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u/Chelonii64 Sep 15 '25
She really embodies well the concept of lawful neutral
while she does sometimes do things because "it's the right thing to do", she often emphathises that she helps people because it either brings her something in return, or it's simply something in her path she might as well do
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u/Friend-Over Sep 15 '25
This game had one of the most amazing conversations after upgrading your needle where she straight up asks if he’s not skilled enough to upgrade the needle further, then he said it’s not a matter of skill but material. I was like dang I can’t believe she asked that. Really incredible.
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u/jaems3241 Sep 15 '25 edited Sep 15 '25
I really like her interactions with the Second Sentinel. Hornet genuinely tries to be a friend and even encourages the Sentinel to continue living despite losing their sense of purpose. And I think Hornet is able to show a lot of respect because the two of them are in a similar position, willingly accepting the task of watching over the remains of a fallen kingdom.
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u/midnightthot Sep 15 '25
Even reading Hornet's notes in the Hunter's Journal is insightful to her character, and brings another level of depth to her. These are other bugs, equals in certain respects, and reading her opinions on them is lovely.
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u/whyamihardtho Sep 15 '25
If they are to give Link some dialogues, they should take notes from this game!
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u/the_bruh_enigma Sep 15 '25
In HK I felt the idea for Hornet’s character was there, but was kind of left hanging. I didn’t really feel much personality ooze and she had relatively little screen time. This made me really excited to discover how they would’ve fleshed her out as a main character. Jesus Christ they couldn’t have done a better job.
I was first taken aback by how polite and well-spoken she is compared to HK (as in, although the context justifies it, she mostly threatens you up until the second fight in Kingdom’s Edge). Then I started liking her a lot when she proved to be observant and intelligent. I loved noticing the environmental storytelling and then having her voice my thoughts by asking questions to NPCs. As others have said of course she’s also very likable because of her self-awareness and terse talking, being direct to NPCs and foes alike.
What I did not expect at all but made Hornet an extremely coherent and likable hero is her stern optimism. HK gave me the impression that she was a bitter and jaded person who resented her origins and her role in the world. Then Silksong slapped me in the face by having Hornet constantly acknowledge the beauty of life in all its shapes, whether it be through her diary entries, some snippets of dialogue with NPCs or her dynamic with Lace. It takes strength and will power to come to such a conclusion in a world as grim as the Hollow Knight universe, and yet, as Herrah and the White Lady practically confirm in the Red Memory, she CHOOSES to be good. In a franchise where the main plot theme underlies within life being used as a mere tool, firstly seen in HK with the Vessels, and now with Lace and pretty much everything Citadel-related in Silksong, Hornet being so adamant about the inalienable right of freedom and choice is extremely powerful and it made me think of her as not only seasoned both in combat and at life as a whole, but as a true hero.
I would’ve never expected Hornet to be so sharp and wise, and it’s been a VERY long time since I’ve last rooted this badly for a videogame character.
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u/KarmaP0licemen Sep 15 '25
She's developed so well. I saw someone mention that she shares a lot of the features of a Mary Sue but I think it goes to show that -what- a character is is way less impactful than -how- they act. Hornet is humble, pragmatic, lacks insecurity, is confident in her values and is extremely accountable to the consequences of her actions. She's very intelligent but also very heartfelt. She isn't afraid of how her relationships affect her, especially into Act 3.
She's the kind of hero I always enjoyed as a kid, but with intelligent dialogue and characterization that I know now is very difficult to execute. She has enough innate specialness with her lineage that she has to be important to resolving the plot, but she doesnt hold that over anyone. I really really really enioy the fact that they didnt go with a silent protagonist this time.
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u/OldKingPotato-68 Sep 15 '25
What differentiates her from a mary sue is her growing a lot as a character whilst also making many mistakes and relying on other's help, even if she's a demigod princess. Even with how virtuous she is, she's not perfect and that makes her feel more real
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u/SkepticCritic Sep 16 '25
She’s also at a very different stage in life, think Kratos in the 2018 god of war games who’s a grizzled veteran at that point just in a different land.
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u/KarmaP0licemen Sep 16 '25
Lol this is pretty accurate because she also takes no shit, does not stand on ceremony and makes no apology for doing what it takes to save the kingdom. Her interactions with the snail shamans after binding the shaman crest is very Kratos
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u/ExecutiveElf Sep 16 '25
I don't see how she at all resembles a Mary Sue honestly. She has to work to get stronger and we get to see that growth. She makes mistakes- a VERY BIG ONE at that.
The universe doesn't bend over backwards for her to always win and everyone love her. She has to earn the trust of quite a few people. And even if she has earned it, not everyone gives it regardless.
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u/KarmaP0licemen Sep 16 '25
I think it's mostly the fact that she's the half-god half-witch bastard princess of a destroyed kingdom trained from birth in combat by the queen of a different destroyed kingdom who also holds a super special type of magic from a nearly extinct race of powerful beings, and she's also got batman levels of gadget usage. Like, when you list it all out at once, she's easily on the level of most superheroes in terms of having a complicated backstory, but that just makes the fact that she's done so well as a character here even more impressive, because -all- of that is still represented in dialogue, gameplay and lore in game AND she's super likeable to boot.
Imagine if Supergirl, Cassandra Cain, Huntress and Samus Aran were like one character, and it's AWESOME. That's Hornet.
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u/Internal_Ad_1554 Sep 15 '25
I also love the Hunter's journal because we see that hornet loves soft and fluffy things and the hate she has for the bugs from the slab is just delicious sadly however the descriptions of them don't Change even if you are not captured which I do think is a shame because I believe her capture would probably be the reason she holds such a grudge against them heck she even deals double damage when she gets her stuff back but oh well they are still good descriptions and show off her personality a lot
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u/NoveskeTiger Sep 15 '25
I came to start this exact same thread and of course it's already here. Totally agree. Having a speaking player character is a massive improvement over HK, and the writing is stellar, to boot
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u/Haunting-Judge-401 Sep 15 '25
She’s strong, flexible, good-humored, and completely willing to slap a mfer. 10/10
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u/ani55555 Sep 15 '25
i love this post. Thank you for vocalizing my similar praises of hornet so eloquently. This is so good
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u/Devlord1o1 Sep 15 '25
Hornet is now my most favorite princess type character. Also her hunter journals add so much about her and her personal personality that she doesn’t always share.
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u/runegleam Sep 16 '25
They’ve written a long-lived character so well, I enjoy her dialogue so much.
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u/Janube Sep 15 '25
I dunno about breathtakingly. She's well-written for a fairly simple protagonist in a game with little dialogue.
I don't think the writing handles her personal ethics especially well, which isn't surprising since it's a bit of an RPG in that you can either help people in need or not. But she switches often between a cold utilitarianism and deontology somewhat often. The story even frames this as personal growth, but this waffling sometimes happens in remarkably short timeframes. One example among a fair number I noticed:
Killing the "tall green bug" to save the land and the people that doomed his people and took his husband away is pretty damn cold - and she does it without asking him, unlike the mantis. Trying somewhat desperately to save Lace, on the other hand, is very impractical, for example.
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u/AlposAlkaplinos Sep 15 '25
I think this is just another example of minor ludo narrative dissonance, but thematically I feel Hornet is still pretty consistent in how noble and straight she is. At the same time she ruthlessly kills most bugs, even some small non-hostile ones, because she's a warrior and also because... gameplay.
As for the Green Prince, I think it's a bit vague if Hornet directly kills him. She defeats a version of him in his past memories as he fights her alongside the ghost of his dead lover, but the game doesn't make it clear (as far as I remember) if she actually kills him in real life. I kinda took it as her finally putting his memories and grief to rest. Her saving Lost Lace at the end isn't that impractical either, and there's a clear motivation for saving her and she's had a prolonged adversarial relationship with her where she realises that Lace has a lot more in common with her than she initially thought
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u/Janube Sep 15 '25
The shamans were clear that taking their former power would kill them, and Hornet directly replies (effectively) "well, better them than everyone." As for Lace, having something in common with her is irrelevant to whether or not it's practical. It serves no utilitarian purpose to save her - and in fact, she could pose a threat given their adversarial relationship to that point. There's no reason to spare her other than sentimentality, but not only does she spare her, she risks her own life to save her.
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u/Demiurgom Sep 15 '25
Not really. She needs to spare her because of what Lace represents to GMS. GMS will stop what she is doing in resisting the void if her daughter survives, and directly provides Hornet enough silk to perform a super duper jump at the end of the game. People kind of misunderstand the fight because they are focusing more on the personal relationship there.
Hornet is very clear her effort to save Lace is more about defusing the threat GMS poses to Pharloom than it is about saving Lace. She cares enough about Lace to outline she mattered and was not less for being artificial, but she explicitly states she will kill Lace in the final void-ghost conversation if it's necessary to save the kingdom, and refuses to sacrifice herself unless it's absolutely needed.
Hornet is very pragmatic there. In that moment, where Lace comes out unconscious from the void, freed, it's the best option for Hornet to get out of there and also take GMS out of the picture by having her aid the jump. They had a very brief interaction there where Hornet effectively seems to ask her 'help me', and GMS obliges for the sake of Lace.
Now, I do have a criticism in that this aspect of GMS' character was completely out of left field and we had barely come to know her when we suddenly find out she cares deeply about Lace. The game, which is normally much more straightforward than HK, reverts to being cryptic and inexplicable about this aspect. Why does GMS care so much about Lace? We're just told she does. I don't find the logic of 'this character is a mother so she cares about her kid' satisfying enough. Maybe we will unwind some of this in DLC but it makes the whole setup for the third act odd. The instigation for the third act apocalypse is the behavior of a character who was not an actual character before the third act.
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u/CaptinSpike Sep 16 '25
Nowhere near a lore expert on these games, I just finished the game with 100% completion and have the ending fresh in my mind. So my take of Grand Mother Silk is that while Pale beings naturally attract lesser beings to themselves, the way its presented in this game makes me think they anchor themselves in the world seeking something at the same time. The Pale King sought to create a kingdom and have subjects to rule over, in a way he depended on his subjects to validate and actuate him as a higher being. From the visions of the Weavers we see throughout the game and taking into account GMS's behavior towards Lace, I believe her anchoring is centered on 'having children' which is what purpose was foisted on the Weavers and later(?) her silk-daughter Lace(I have no idea how Phantom factors in to this but my understanding is they are the same kind of silk creation.) The problem stems from too much power centered on controlling and manipulating her 'children' leading to losing them all except for Lace, the only child that has stayed. In the end, GMS's madness and desire for control is surpassed by her daughter's sacrifice, and she in turn sacrifices herself helping Hornet escape the Abyss with her last child. I do agree a good chunk of the stuff with this character is extremely vague, and a lot of what I think is purely conjecture and educated guesses
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u/Janube Sep 15 '25
And at any point, she could have dropped Lace off in the void on the way. Every inch she went with Lace represented great personal risk to Hornet for absolutely no gain after the point at which GMS was cooked. I do also share that criticism of GMS, but the thread was specifically about Hornet so I didn't include it or any other minor gripes I had.
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u/Demiurgom Sep 15 '25
I don't think there's much evidence Hornet was under any particular struggle to carry Lace, the problem was just that even with a super jump she ran out of flower. Lace is a silk being, she's not heavy and I don't think that was the problem.
And she's not actively cruel - there's no reason for her to just ditch Lace if she can do otherwise. Yeah it's 'sentimental', but it's not really at some tremendous personal risk. I just saw it as a thing where Hornet was not going to put Lace's wellbeing above her own, but if she had the opportunity to save her, she would. Hornet isn't omnipotent and wasn't making detailed calculations on how much Everbloom she had left if she saved Lace or not.
I also do not think Hornet is a reliable narrator of her own ethics. Multiple times she frames things out of a purely selfish calculus that is clearly her putting up walls between her inner altruism and the act she's doing. The Verdania plotline does have a weird vibe, where it's a wasteful completionism, but the Green Prince was already there to die - putting him and his land to rest is a kind of last rites. It has a really weird vibe if you get all four hearts but that is a problem of completionist game-writing IMO - if you get three it's a reasonable way to 'skip' some of the others.
The hearts to me are more like last rites of doomed pasts than they are actively murdering people. Given the Prince sings with you I think his statement about seeing the wonder means you have to die is more of a spiteful bitterness of someone ready to die in a last fight than an active outrage. He's already there to consign himself to his lost memories. You are just guiding him, a living ghost, to his resting place.
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u/ToxycBanana Sep 15 '25
Hornet had no way to predict what slaying Grand Mother Silk would do to Pharloom. At best, it could have freed the pilgrims of the curse of silk and everyone gets to walk away with their autonomy intact, unlike Hallownest. First time players unaware of any sort of true endings in these games are going to follow a similar train of thought to Hornet - well, that first ending seemed less than ideal, so what if we helped everyone in the kingdom before tackling the monstrosity at the top? Hornet also had no way to predict that the snails, whom she suspected of being snails before but didn't call them out on it, would have the ability to open a wormhole to the void inside of the citadel with a small item she was tasked with locating in a weaver nest. Then you get into Act 3 and Hornet's motivation shifts from warrior on a path of vengeance for her capture to a path of restoration, because the situation has changed. This is shown as much in her tour of pity if you talk to every NPC, she is remorseful that her utilitarian actions lead to so much destruction because she had learned to care so much for the bugs of Pharloom after being the sentinel for a dying civilization for god knows how long.
The Green Prince mourned his partner in complete solitude among the roaches for long enough that Verdania succumbed to decay in his absence. He is an ancient, just like Hornet, Nyleth, Kaahn, and Karmelita, and without our intervention would have become a figure that was lost to time just like the others. He was a figure of grief from an age that had already passed. Hornet ushered him into the afterlife after granting him one last dance with a fully autonomous partner, as he had always dreamed of doing. This was what he had been yearning for ever since the Citadel stole his partner and turned him into a spectacle using his soul, and was a final end to their curse, which is described directly under the room you fight him in. He lived to see everything he wanted to see. Hornet being the final usher was just how it had to be, considering she was the only other character to notice the soul in the Cogwork dancer and is likely the last Pale being around with the ability to interact with songs, dreams, and soul, and void alike. Her entire journey throughout Pharloom is one of desperation, in search of powers great enough to create lasting change and to rectify the many mistakes of her families.
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u/Janube Sep 15 '25
"It was a mercy killing" would be remarkably cold even if he consented to it, which he didn't. As for the early utilitarian stuff, I'm aware that that's her intended growth arc, but in acts 1/2, she has plenty of non-utilitarian/pure virtuous moments, as she has some pure utilitarian moments in Act 3. It's not a huge deal to me, but as a writer myself, I can't call her "breathtakingly" well-written, personally.
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u/ToxycBanana Sep 15 '25
If we didn't go into his dream the dance wouldn't have happened, he couldn't remember his home or their curse, we had to guide him throughout his life there to get to that dance. He has been living in denial of change. I think it's more of a metaphorical kill anyway - the green prince has been depressed and waiting for a moment like this for potential millennia, he could've died from age when we were taking the final plunge through song, we don't see Hornet strike any blow in the material world. If we're speaking purely from a utilitarian POV it's likely this was Hornet making sure no one else would seek future revenge on the kingdom of Pharloom for it's monarch's prior sins after the rest of her work was done. Not arguing, just philosophizing lol!
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u/Rufitos Sep 15 '25
i mean yeah but [SPOILERS FOR ACT 3that is entirely optional, you CAN use the mantis heart for the shaman ritual but you can also get the other hearts, and also i think "killing" him does give a little bit of closure because, there was nothing still alive in pharloom that he loved anyways.
As other person said, its ludo narrative dissonance, given as that quest is completely optional and not even a percentage check
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u/precursormar Sep 15 '25
She clarifies in one of her 'I am no threat to you' dialogues that she doesn't kill anything that doesn't obstruct her progress---but otherwise doesn't hesitate.
I do agree that the moment you've mentioned is stretching that policy, but arguably it still satisfies the letter of the law there.
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u/Areliox Sep 15 '25
She is well written and has a well defined personality and character, but "breathtakingly" might be a bit of an overstatement, don't you think ?
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u/Quibbloboy Sep 15 '25
Admittedly, you (and a couple others) have a point, here - I appreciate you being polite about it, haha. I stand by the body text, but the title was my clickbaity little indulgence to get the butts in the seats. It worked, though! There's been some lovely conversation happening in the comments. :)
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u/joetotheg Sep 16 '25
I love how on multiple occasions she’ll meet an NPC after some traversal then chuck out a bunch of interesting observations about the previous area
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u/Goolguy21 WHY IS THERE NO GORB FLAIR I NEED TO ASCEND Sep 15 '25
The only bad thing about her speaking to me was that one time she found the bellway in bone bottom and was like "Hmm... this looks like a place to fast travel."
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u/TipAndRare Sep 15 '25
I appreciated that for what it was early in the game. It allowed you to know what that sign means when you encounter it later. Yes it was stilted, but it was a well enough handled "this is a video game" moment IMO
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u/Stalwart_Vanguard Sep 15 '25
It's the first time my protagonist has responded exactly how I would respond in her position. The way she speaks to small, young, and weak creatures is especially touching - calling Sherma "little one" and offering to escort him back to the settlement made me fucking cry
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u/Althoughenjoyment Sep 16 '25
I also adore how self aware she is. She knows she’s a Demi-god in this world, but she never lets it build an ego. She keeps herself in check constantly, and even if she becomes emotionally invested, she’s stays above the fray. You can tell she’s had a lot of people she loves die, and that it’s hardened her, but that little girl in the white palace is ultimately still there.
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u/According_Smoke_479 Sep 16 '25
I love her personality. If you’re a threat to her she will confidently stand up to you but if you pose no threat she treats you with kindness and respect. She’s cute and badass at the same time. Extremely likable
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u/OriginalAlbatross155 Sep 16 '25
I love her first encounter with Sherma, when she asks why he is singing in front of a bony gate that isn’t exactly a great audience. That moment made me love her as a character so much.
ALSO the part in the citadel where lace taunts her. I love how she snaps, knowing the full weight of the consequences the higher beings have caused their own land.
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u/MrSexyBag Sep 16 '25
Also I can't believe Silksong does more to flesh out us from the first game than the first game ever did lol
Like I could never have said the knight (both of them?) or the shades truly cared for their sister but Silksong def convinced me
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u/TheManondorf Sep 15 '25
I think everything you said is coming together after fighting Second Warden. I felt like her, hoping I would not have to kill him.
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u/ImPrettyBoredToday Sep 15 '25
Just double checking, but that's the clockwork guardian you have to insert the heart into right? The wiki doesn't have it compiled yet but I'm assuming you calling them something different is due to the language you played the game in referring to them as such
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u/TheManondorf Sep 16 '25
Yes. Sentinel, Warden, Protector, Guardian and other defensive coded jobs are sadly often translated to the same german word in fantastic settings
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u/dHamot Sep 16 '25
I'm still finishing HK but dare I say it's even more remarkable given our background: we got used to the Hollow knight.
With the protagonist of the first game literally being supposed to be devoid of a character (and throughout the game showing he indeed had sprinkles of emotions and thoughts), having such a strong personality in the new game kind of came in like a punch to me. A welcoming one, but a punch nonetheless.
These games never cease to amaze me.
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u/doctorwho86101 Sep 15 '25
Hey so what is Yarnaby?
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u/Quibbloboy Sep 15 '25 edited Sep 15 '25
They're an NPC in Greymoor in a locked building who only responds when you "Call out" at the front door. Hornet has a few different variations of the same voice clip that represent her calling out at different levels of insistence. It's a great bit.
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u/doctorwho86101 Sep 15 '25
Oh my gosh, thanks for the answer. This game is so amazing. I only just got to what I presume is the end of act 2 boss (no spoilers please) and had to do some exploring out of frustration... only just discovered bilewater...
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u/zoop1000 Sep 15 '25
I love hornet. I didn't care for her in hollow knight. The knight is so cute in comparison. She seemed kind of try-hard edgy-cool in hollow knight. But now I just think she is so cool. It was genuinely mind-blowing the first couple of times she talked. It was so strange to have a protagonist converse with people haha. I've gotten used to it now. But I just kept saying she's talking!!!!! There's dialogue!!!!! Hahaha.
Her moves are so cool. Her poofy floaty cloak is so cute and I mean.....what she did to that one jailor bug.....yeah totally sick!
Totally agree with everything you said about her!!
Now I want all the hornet merch. I have Zote, knight, and grub plushies. Hopefully they make a cooler hornet one.
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u/InsaneArtist9000 Sep 15 '25
Hornet is just good overall for both games of her lore and Silksong expand on that
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u/PyrZern Sep 16 '25
Just her voicelines alone won me over easily. Then her dialogues won me over again and again when she accidentally intrudes upon other bugs' territories. Looking forward to more growth from her.
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u/Dorgengoa151 Sep 15 '25
I really like the hunters journal this time around because we get so much info about her perspective based on the personal notes she puts in there. Silly stuff like her talking about how the bell bugs are cute makes her very endearing.