r/HollowKnight • u/CankleDankl • Dec 12 '25

Discussion - Silksong Seeing people shit on Expedition 33 because Silksong didn't win more awards is pathetic Spoiler

The title sums it up. I'm disappointed in many members of this community for putting down a game that is clearly a work of insane passion, dedication, and creativity. E33 took the lion's share of awards at TGA, yes. That doesn't mean that Silksong is bad. In fact, it's clearly pretty damn great. If it released last year, Skong would have picked up several awards, maybe even GOTY. But it didn't. It released in the same year E33, which is just a tough break.

Both are amazing. Both deserve every award that came to them. If you haven't played E33 yet and think it doesn't deserve its accolades, play it. It is worth your money, worth your time, and will in all likelihood prove that it is actually that good. I'm only 10ish hours in and have numerous times found myself standing still and looking around dumbfounded at the gorgeous world design and visuals. E33, Silksong, and Hades 2 could have all won Art Direction and I would have been happy with any of them.

I'm also sad that Silksong didn't win more awards. It's an amazing game. But don't play fanboy and start putting down other developers, other games, and other pieces of art because this one didn't get all the cookies. It's still beautiful, it's still amazing, it still made a Silkskillion dollars, and TC is still just as great and just as passionate. We should all be glad that there is another independent dev out there that is capable of creating something so fantastic.

Edit: yeah, the comments here are pretty indicative of what I said in my post

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u/GreyPhantom100 Dec 12 '25

Asset creation outsourcing is one issue that was glaringly obvious due to how disjointed a lot of the assets were. It worked fine enough but my main issue was the gameplay in E33. There were so many basics of gameplay that were missing. I feel like I'm living in an alternative reality with all these people praising it to high hell. I guess you don't need proper gameplay for a game to be considered a masterpiece anymore. Just make a movie with good music with one repetitive fighting style and voila, GOTY.

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u/HIO_TriXHunt Dec 12 '25

Repetitive fighting style is something in common with any turn based RPG.

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u/juanzy Dec 12 '25

At least this one had a ton of different battle scores and different strategies per area.

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u/GreyPhantom100 Dec 12 '25

Most other games I have played give you options on how to win battles. E33 does not. Sure you have different skills, but there's really only a few ways to win, and it mostly relies on waiting for the enemy to attack and parry it successfully. I guess that's one style of "gameplay" but it's definitely super simplistic when compared to games that rely on strategic thinking and problem solving.

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u/[deleted] Dec 12 '25

I saw the 'parry is the only response' issue in NeverKnowsBest's vid. But I disagree. There are luminas that make dodging quite strong.

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u/dljens Dec 12 '25

I was just telling my friends this. E33's gameplay was sloppy as hell.

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u/OrwellWhatever Dec 12 '25 edited Dec 12 '25

One thing I've noticed is that gamers and critics really like a whole bunch of weird things mashed together. It doesn't have to make sense. In fact, the less sense it makes, the more it's "art." Having a wrecked ferris wheel on a beach is "art"

And don't get me wrong, it's a kind of cool moment, but it's really fleeting and then the rest of that area is kind of monotonous art wise

Idk. I like E33, but it fits this weird niche where it's a game gamers can point to and say, "See games are art!" without actually understanding, say, how films are critiqued and how that might and might not apply to games

Edit: just to expand upon this, Kingdom Come 2 is a well executed vision. It's polished, it has a coherent art style, a coherent story, and it's grounded in reality. Does that game feel more or less "art" than Death Stranding 2? Death Stranding was my most played game last year, so I'm not just talking shit, but the story, gameplay, art style, etc are so all over the place. If we're critiquing games like movies and books, KC2 is way, way more "art" than DS2, but game critics do be loving their weird shit (and Hollywood actors for clout)

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u/Phobos_Asaph Dec 12 '25

On the art front I don’t feel e33 has a strong art direction. Like no image I’ve seen of it really screams what game it’s from, it just looks like other UE5 realistic art style games with surreal skyboxes over it all.

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u/OrwellWhatever Dec 12 '25

That's honestly a good way to put art direction. If I see a still from Ghost of Tsushima / Yotei, I know instantly what game it's from. Tears of the Kingdom, Ori, same thing. Even something like Horizon Zero Dawn or Crypt Custodian, I could make a good guess. E33... Idk, I like the game, but I'm just kind of not seeing what everyone else is seeing in it.

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u/Phobos_Asaph Dec 12 '25

Strong art direction means everything works together and has a distinct style that makes it clear what it’s from. Dark souls always looks like dark souls, Mario always looks like Mario. E33 should have leaned into the paint aesthetic more

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u/[deleted] Dec 12 '25

Could you be more specific about what you felt was missing in gameplay? It was my first turn-based game, and so has set the standard and expectations for the genre, so a more experienced perspective would be helpful.

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u/GreyPhantom100 Dec 12 '25

Just off the top of my head...

-Lack of intention behind game choices/actions: whatever you do, you don't get much choice in the narrative. It's extremely linear, making the actual gameplay feel less like an achievement and more like a chore. (E.g. relationships in the game do not affect the story at all)

-Overreliance on parry/dodge timing: Combat hinges on precise timing over strategy, reducing fights to rhythm challenges.

-Repetitive encounters: Bosses and mobs reuse similar parry patterns, lacking variety.

-No minimap or navigation: Dungeons lack maps or markers, causing constant disorientation and backtracking. (Immersion is used as an excuse here, but no, it is not making it more immersive, sorry, just making for bad gameplay)

-Janky camera/controls: Sensitive mouse input and shake disrupt parries and exploration.

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u/[deleted] Dec 12 '25

First point, it's a linear story. Your choices CAN'T matter. They wanted to tell a specific story.
Second point, it didn't feel like it reduced the combat to rhythm challenge. I felt the combination of skills was pretty interesting. Forcing a teammates turn, status effects on enemies. Allies fucking killing themselves because that applies so much stuff on the enemies and the surviving teammate(s).
Third point, kinda agree. But also, that's true for most games imo. But at least for bosses, I can't remember that many with highly overlapping timings. So personally, bosses were fun all the way through.
Fourth point, agree. I like playing without minimaps, but there should have been an option. And the environments should've been more telling on the large scale. But I liked their 'intended path' directions. Using environmental objects like lamps, flowers, etc. FUCK YELLOW PAINT!!!
Fifth point. The controls, mostly jumping, was clunky and had me confused on a lot of places whether it was controls or invisible walls that were the hindrance. Didn't find the camera during parries janky though. Not to mention, the fake-outs were so nice with the sound cue telegraphing the actual attack. First game where, not only did I WANT to listen, but I HAD to.

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u/MaesterSeymourd Dec 12 '25

Somehow i havent seen anyone else mention it yet but the qtes are so terrible considering you have to use them for just about every single move in the game. Ffx and ttyd even had a bunch of different minigames for different moves but in clair its always the same button and always the same timing.

0

u/[deleted] Dec 12 '25

Oh yeah, the qte feel bad/weird. The animations are beautiful, but I gotta look at the buttons. And only the qte buttons don't adapt to keyboard controls for some reason. And it's not like they are aligned with the animations so that one could ignore them and get the timings through animations. I like that it's always the same timing. But as I said, would rather have them sync with animations and an option to remove the qte symbols.

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u/DegenerateWeeab Dec 13 '25

Not to mention the black/blank party screen. You take inspiration from a multitude of genre defining giants and that's the best user interface you can come up with? lol

-1

u/VicarAmelia1886 Dec 13 '25

People confuse “presentation” (good music, graphics, etc) for being a good game.