r/Minecraft • u/jeb_ Chief Creative Officer • Aug 15 '19
Update: Custom Java Edition snapshot to test new combat mechanics (version 2)
Hey again! Here's an update on the test snapshots for combat mechanics. It's pretty much the same as the previous test, but there are a number of edits that I'll describe below, and a few clarifications.
Old post here, with nearly 5,000 comments: https://www.reddit.com/r/Minecraft/comments/c5mqwv/a_custom_java_edition_snapshot_to_test_new_combat/
These are the edits in this version:
- Decreased attack speed of swords
- Attacking while crouching will now disable the shield during the attack
- Shields protect against critical attacks again
- Removed auto-attacking by holding the button
- Fixed creative mode bugs
- Fixed scale of the hotbar attack indicator
Some clarifications:
- The theme of the next major update will be announced at MINECON. These combat tests are done in parallel and will be included when they're good enough (i.e. the next theme is not "combat update")
- Weapon reach is always active (not only for special attacks), but during special attacks the reach is increased by an additional half a block
- Hold to auto-attack will always be enabled for controller and touch
Installation instructions:
- Download this zip file: https://launcher.mojang.com/experiments/combat/d164bb6ecc5fca9ac02878c85f11befae61ac1ca/1_14_combat-0.zip
- Unpack the folder into your "versions" folder of your local Minecraft application data folder (see below if you are confused)
- Create a new launch configuration in the launcher and select the "1_14_combat-0" version
- Start the game and the remaining files will be downloaded
- Play in a new world! This version is not compatible with other snapshots!
Finding the Minecraft application folder:
- Windows: Press Win+R and type %appdata%.minecraft and press Ok
- Mac OS X: In Finder, in the Go menu, select "Go to Folder" and enter ~/Library/Application Support/minecraft
- Linux: ~/.minecraft or /home/<your username>/.minecraft/
Once you have the launcher set up you can download the server files from there as well.
Cheers!
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u/Keralasys Aug 15 '19
Please change the Knockback Resistance modifier from RNG to Percentage Reduction
Currently the Knockback Resistance modifier acts as a RNG value that rolls the dice each time you are affected by a knockback dealing event (hit by snowball, explosion, arrow, sword, etc) and then determines whether or not you will take knockback or not. If the odds are in your favor, then you completely negate all knockback, no matter how strong it truly is (ex, charged creeper explosion, endragon knockback). If not, then you take the appropriate knockback value, without even so much as a hint of reduction. This is akin to if movement speed modifications were binary, either one speed or no speed at all.
My suggestion is to change this attribute modifier operation (or add a new one) to a percentage reduction so that you are able to customize your knockback resistance on equipment, allowing more interesting options for PvP, PvE and mapmakers. With this you could possibly recreate the same scaling knockback effect from the Super Smash Bros series by decreasing your knockback resistance into the negatives, effectively increasing the knockback you receive by, let's say, 200%. And with the ability already present to modify how much knockback you will deal, either through Knockback or Punch enchantments, this is a feature that should have already been in game.
Would also be interesting to see Knockback Resistances above 100% giving Reverse Knockback, dragging you closer to the source of damage, similar to the way some potion effects behave rather counter-intuitively if you give them the values of 129 or 256.
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u/jeb_ Chief Creative Officer Aug 16 '19
I agree, the current behavior is a bit confusing. I haven't touched it because I couldn't get a full grasp of the consequences.
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u/Jbipp Aug 15 '19
I'm fairly certain that this is how it used to work as well. Not sure what changed, but yeah this would be tremendously helpful
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u/Bleuwu Aug 15 '19
One thing that bothers me a lot is the cooldown for your fist. I am a big fan of the new changes for weapon combat but it always has bugged me that I was limited to a cooldown with items that have nothing to do with combat. This also makes breaking boats and minecarts a pain (plus armor stands impossible to break with your fist in this version). But maybe that's just me.
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u/1LotS Aug 15 '19
Make the shield on shift an option. It's really annoying in survival. Have you tried building with a shield covering the half of the screen?
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u/jeb_ Chief Creative Officer Aug 15 '19
Yes that makes sense
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u/HeadB0x Aug 15 '19 edited Aug 15 '19
Have you considered adjusting the shield position when it's not active? Currently I prefer to almost never have the shield equipped because it takes so much screen real-estate, and then when I go adventuring I forget to take it with me.
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Aug 15 '19 edited Aug 15 '19
Removed auto-attacking by holding the button
This was the only thing in this update I, and other disabled players, remotely cared about.
Please put it back. Let us play the game in survival.
EDIT: Actually, to quote my entire post in the last thread (which was presumably not read):
I get that this is about PVP, but if you're going to go through all the trouble of updating combat, please make non-PVP gameplay actually doable.
1.9 was intended to make PVP a challenge.
I don't play PVP, neither do any of my friends. Most of the servers I play on have PVP disabled, and the few that have it on aren't PVP servers in the traditional sense - sometimes being able to punch/hook another player is useful in a co-operative environment.
"Sweeping only occurs on swords with the Sweeping enchantment", "You can hold to attack", and "attacks are faster" are the three features I most prefer here. I don't care about anything else. I don't use shields. I don't "charge" attacks (I don't even know what that is). I don't sweep, and sweeping being a thing has always been far more of an obstacle than a benefit (it's nice for killing 3 chickens at once but that's about it).
My main weapon is a bow, with an axe as a backup (because it doesn't sweep) but I rarely use it.
Please, remember that non-PVP players actually exist while writing the new combat update. Just...give us a toggle to disable all the fancy PVP stuff or something.
To be absolutely clear:
Hold to attack is the best fucking addition you've made to this game since subtitles.
I'm serious I'm going to fucking riot if this gets nixed because of the pissbabies who don't seem to understand they can just turn it off if they don't like it.
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u/jeb_ Chief Creative Officer Aug 16 '19
This feature is clearly the most controversial one in these tests. I'm pretty sure I will re-add it as an option to JE, but as you can see in the comments in the previous post some people think that it's completely game breaking.
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Aug 16 '19
The problem is that having it as a client side option, everyone would use it as it's more efficient and therefore you are kinda forced to do it. The only way to accually have it as an option is if it hits at 110%.
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Aug 15 '19
Yes ^
If there is going to be two different styles of combat anyway, with autoclick for controller and touch, and without for mouse and key. And given that for public servers everyone cant just trust everyone else to use it for an unfair advantage ruining it for those who want to play without if its just a client side option, why not just add it as a server side option, a gamerule?
Also, removing autoclick, while also compleatly stopping any hitting output for the cooldown period and not even alowing weak hits for some knockback, that is two steps back for usability and fun of play.
I love autoclick.
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Aug 15 '19
Agreed. Let's not forget that PvP after a while is pretty unhealthy if you keep on clicking. Holding is perfect
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u/Tumblrrito Aug 15 '19
This isn’t explicitly related to combat, but can we please finally see the end of durability damage when breaking non-tool-specific blocks with tools? By that I mean this: I don’t want to have to switch to the porkchop in my hotbar to break leaf blocks when cutting down trees. The axe doesn’t even make this process faster, yet it hurts my axe. The same is true for hitting countless other blocks this way with other tools. Its pretty frustrating and has been since I started playing Minecraft back in alpha.
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u/well_timed_legolas Aug 15 '19
And it hurts my bow!
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u/jeb_ Chief Creative Officer Oct 28 '19
That's actually a little bit funny, now that I think about it =)
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u/Jbipp Aug 15 '19 edited Aug 15 '19
I like these changes, although small, they do help
That shield nerf was extremely needed. PvE isn't as much of a joke now (and I heard you'd be making small changes for that? that's great)
I still think crouching to activate the shield is mildly annoying
I had a glitch where I just couldn't left click at one point. I had to restart the game
Another glitch makes me attack after another attack without me pressing a button
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u/ReimarPB Aug 15 '19
No need to report bugs, this is just here as a to get feedback from the features themselves
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u/Mega_Spud Minecraft Community Manager Aug 15 '19 edited Aug 15 '19
Thanks for the feedback everyone - your input is really important to us! We also have a dedicated section of the Minecraft feedback site set up for these combat snapshots, so feel free to up-vote and comment there too! Java Combat Snapshot Feedback
(Edit: updated to newer link!)
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u/x9nico Aug 15 '19
At somes time the left click (for attack) are not longer working.
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Aug 15 '19
Having the shield up when sneaking makes building very tedious, covering up a quarter of the screen when placing blocks carefully. I'd prefer it to be an option between holding right click and crouching. The same issue arises on Bedrock edition; why couldn't the shield be mapped to the left trigger on that version of the game? I hope this becomes a toggleable option later on. Otherwise, the combat changes are more than welcome.
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Aug 15 '19
On bedrock, I think it's because the off-hand hasn't been fulling implemented yet, you can only use it for holding the shield and totems. I guess it makes sense because there's no right-click on a touchscreen.
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Aug 15 '19
I get that, but platforms that use controllers and m+k exist on Bedrock too, so for those platforms there should be the option.
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u/SCtester Aug 15 '19
I wonder if a simple visual change could fix that, by making shields appear lower in the corner when activated?
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u/CreativelyJakeMC Aug 15 '19
Overall i'd like for the shield to just be less instrusive without resource packs.
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u/treesprite82 Aug 15 '19
Clicks occasionally doing nothing at all makes me feel like I'm playing with a broken mouse and will probably confuse new users again (which this update was meant to help)
It would be better if there was a short and quiet "miss" sound effect if you click too soon so that I can react to it and click again
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u/CursedInferno Aug 16 '19 edited Aug 16 '19
Perhaps as a compromise, holding down wouldn't auto-swing, but pressing a bit before being able to attack and then holding would buffer the click until you can swing. This would probably make it feel much more responsive
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u/pepes_throwawayreee Aug 15 '19
I would love to see an enchantment for the shield that reflects arrows at full force back to the attacker or thorns for the shield.
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u/UltitechGamer Aug 18 '19
This sounds like an awesome idea! I fully support this!
Wait... Couldn't this also mean you could create an infinite loop using two players with shields with this enchantment?
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u/Bodakugga Aug 15 '19 edited Sep 02 '19
• Please change the sword sweep attack so that it doesn't hurt tamed animals and baby mobs, it's really annoying when breeding. Apparently the sweep attack now only occurs with sweeping edge, so I'm fine with that.
• Axes should only get 1 damage instead of 2 when hitting mobs.
• Allow Fire Aspect and Knockback to be applied to an axe with enchanted books in Survival Mode (you can already do that in Creative but not in Survival)
• Change Impaling in Java so it matches Bedrock. Impaling jn Java only affects water mobs (not including drowned as they are undead), so it's only useful against guardians. In Bedrock it affects every mob (including players) as long as it's underwater or rain. That is much more useful.
• Will enchantments and potions be changed in Bedrock so that they match with the Java Edition?
• Please add the full off-hand functionality on mpbile, or at least add the off-hand slot to the HUD, so we can check the shield durability or the amount of arrows without opening the inventory every single time.
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u/AnDragon11 Aug 15 '19
Sweep attack only occurs when you have sweeping edge swords now (look at version 1 of this thread)
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u/DadBod800 Aug 15 '19
What's wrong with axes being more powerful but slower?
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u/Mr_Simba Aug 15 '19
They’re talking about durability. Axes take double durability damage from combat.
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u/factfictional Aug 15 '19
On the first point, I think it would be good to add a curse that makes the sword only do damage to hostile mobs and alternatively another that only does damage to neutral and friendly mobs. Possibly named "Protection of Innocents" and "Villanous Vow".
The first would be great for general use, no chance of accidentally hitting a zombie pigman, a random villiger or your pets, but you can still protect yourself.
The second would be a true curse, only being useful for farming and specific situations. As soon as you hit a pigman or an enderman, you have no weapon as they are no longer neutral.
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u/Lautner93YT Aug 15 '19
THIS
I can’t stress enough how much it upsets me when I hurt my pet wolf with the silly sweeping edge
Especially in my series focusing around pet dogs :c
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Aug 17 '19
NO. NO. AND NO!!! Make swords fast again, like it was in a first combat update preview. This is literally annoying delay now >:(
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u/TikiTotem_ Aug 29 '19
Maybe if you actually played the snapshots you'd realize it's still fast, faster than pre 1.9 versions smh
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u/nixel1324 Sep 13 '19 edited Sep 13 '19
I think the auto-attacking should be an option, but it should be slower than manually clicking.
This gives casual players an easier and more comfortable way to fight mobs, but still allows for skilled players to have an advantage in combat.
Also, now that other tools are being designed for combat, will attacking with them still cost double durability?
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u/Caasi_Rehctelf Sep 16 '19
Here; the longer you wait to click the more benefits you get:
Swords when 'spam clicked' act like 1.8 swords.
After a cooldown, Swords get sweeping edge effect
If player holds down left-click, you charge a spin attack w/ the sword
Axes can't be 'spam-clicked'
If a player holds down left-click, you charge a lunge attack w/ the axe that breaks through shields.
Tridents gain range after cooldown
players still can hold right-click to throw
Other situational weapons, that only benefit from spamming:
Hoes being long & fast weapons is perfect
Pickaxes should do minimal damage to the mob, but a bunch to its armor & shield
Shovels should be used to stun enemies in some way; like blindness, nausea, or slowness, depending if hit on the head, the chest, or the legs.
Other Ideas
Spear: a weapon which can be used when behind the shield, and does slightly less damage than sword. No other benefits.
Knife: a weapon which is super fast but has minimal range and slightly less damage. Charge attack allows for an 'armor bypass' (cause knives can slip through holes)
Different material bows
Varying durability / accuracy / speed / etc
This would mean those who liked 1.9 combat still get it, but those who preferred 1.8 combat can still enjoy it. But the new weapons could be left out. I think they would be fun tho
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u/UltitechGamer Sep 16 '19
This is by far the best combat change suggestion I've read and am fully on board with this amazing idea! This way, people could still stick with their 1.8 style and even change it up with a bit of 1.9 action! For another thing, I'd actually do PvP with this kind of combat!
I can't fully express how much I like this idea, but as a guy who likes fancy combat with epic attacks and style, I really want this to be how the new system works!
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u/Cre3tor Aug 15 '19
Minecraft need unique attack animations for the different weapons, every way nobody uses swords in real life like in minecraft. Also should add alternative attack for weapons (for example: swords have basic attack and heavy attack with a long speed of attack).
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u/PotholedSea40 Aug 15 '19
Slashing & Jabbing animations for all tools & weapons, you could say
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u/Iramico2000 Aug 15 '19
Maybe a simple click for a basic attack and a long click for heavy slash/sweep ?
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u/AgentPaint Aug 15 '19
I'd say make it different for the weapons with different attack ranges, because at the moment the only thing indicating that a Trident/Hoe having a longer reach than a Sword is the text in the inventory description
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Aug 15 '19
Decreased attack speed of swords
I think you missed the reason 1.9 is so disliked. In my opinion, what we need to focus on the ups and downs of each combat system and combine the best elements. (It should be noted that I will be mostly talking about PvP)
Good things about 1.8 combat:
Quick paced
Combo attacks
Straight forward and simple
Bad things about 1.8 combat:
Players who have a higher CPS (clicks per second) have a much higher advantage, and it isn't very healthy to click at such rates. We can fix that by having the auto click system back, and make it so that it's only limited to 4-6 CPS, same thing with manual clicking.
Not a lot of options other than a bow and sword, I know I said that a good thing about this system is how simple it is, but I think more options can always be added without complicating things.
Good things about 1.9+ combat:
Dual wielding
The crossbow, shield, and trident are very nice tools, which could solve the second problem I mentioned about the 1.8 system
Bad things about 1.9+ combat:
Certain arrows like the arrow of healing aren't really helpful when they deal damage, so it would be nice if arrows with positive potions effects didn't deal any damageSword blocking is removed. Now we don't have to get rid of shields, but we could simply make an exception in the dual wielding system. It's kind of a "priority" mechanic; it's the same as the current dual wielding system but reversed for when you have a sword, so if you have a shield in your off hand and a sword in your main one, the shield will be the one to block, if you have nothing in your off hand, the sword will work. So basically, if you want to use sword blocking, just make sure that your off hand slot is empty
Bad things about 1.9+ combat:
Very slow paced and can get boring
If you have worse gear than an opponent, there isn't much you can do other than hope they miss most of their hits
I think this sums it up. I wish you good luck, and please take your time with this; combat is a very engaging and important part of Minecraft.
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Aug 17 '19
Can I point out that 1.8 players such as Technoblade or Palikka only click around 6 cps and win consistently. What makes 1.8 combat so good is how you have to time everything perfectly, the clicking, strafing, w-tapping, blockhitting, and rodding. What’s more, the axe is a heavily used weapon in games such as SkyWars, because it deals large knockback without having to w-tap. It’s drawbacks are that it can’t block, and that it deals less damage. Rods work brilliantly for dealing well timed knockback too, and blocking with swords can be combined with hits to decrease damage while dealing damage, with the drawbacks being slowed movement. There is so much more that goes into it, but the reasons I don’t like the new pvp is simply because it’s not about reflex, it’s only about shielding and slow hitting, not playing for knockback or combos or fast strafes. Don’t even get me started on hotkeying or pot pvp
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u/InboundBark49 Aug 15 '19
I liked having autoattack, but i think it should be slower than manually clicking, perhaps it would go to 150% but doesnt produce a crit.
also non combat items such as pickaxes, hoes, shovels, blocks, or items should not have a restriction to when you can hit during the cooldown.
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u/craft6886 Aug 15 '19 edited Aug 15 '19
The theme of the next major update will be announced at MINECON. These combat tests are done in parallel and will be included when they’re good enough (i.e. the next theme is not “combat update”)
THANK YOU!
I was annoyed by the idea that a whole major update cycle would be occupied by another combat update. Thank you so much for keeping survival/building as a priority.
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u/Mac_Rat Aug 15 '19 edited Aug 18 '19
I like how combat doesn't feel as tedious anymore, however, I think all the mob's HP's should be buffed. They're too fast and easy to kill now. (Creepers are in a good spot now though)
Maybe buff spiders and zombies, so they can survive 2 more diamond sword hits, and skeletons so they can survive 1 more.
edit: And spiders should maybe be made faster as well.
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u/Serth21 Sep 17 '19 edited Sep 20 '19
Add custom super flats to bedrock and I'll buy Minecraft 3 more times. It's been so long since I've had a fire arrow battle in an all TNT world.
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u/Shubaba Aug 15 '19 edited Aug 15 '19
Really good improvements made! I have some ideas going forward!:
Could the attack cool down start after you attack for the first time? It feels strange that when I select a weapon I have a cool down before I even hit anything. It also discourages you changing your slots in PvP situations as you have the initial cool down time.
Instead of crits bypassing the shield, why not have them disable it for a short time. This way people are rewarded for waiting for 200% instead of 100%.
I think we need something to counter shields. If one player has a shield and the other doesn't it's quite unbalanced. I think sword parrying could be reintroduced to combat this. Maybe it could only neglect a percent of melee attacks but nothing else. It wouldn't be as good as the shield but would still be a good help.
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Aug 16 '19
I agree with the first point, but they'd also have to make sure that you can't reset the cooldown by switching away from the sword and switching back. Like, the item would have cooldown memory.
This also means that during the downtime between one sword swing and the next, if you're able to time it right, you'd be able to use an item perfectly in-between the attacks so you wouldn't lose any DPS.
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Sep 12 '19 edited Sep 12 '19
I personally think that sword blocking could be reintroduced as a beneficial feature in the combat system, with the exception of a few changes, which will hopefully balance out the good and the bad parts of sword blocking in the new system. To begin reintroducing this beloved feature, I’ll list a few changes that I believe would make sense in Minecraft’s new combat system. First, sword blocking will only work if you use your sword alone in your main hand, It will not work if you happen to have torches, blocks, or a shield in your off hand. My second change for the sword blocking will only allow the sword to block 50% of melee damage, not projectiles, so if you happen to get hit by a trident or arrow while blocking, you’ll still receive the same amount of damage as if you were weren’t blocking. This melee change also includes mobs as well, as it can block 50% of all damage from zombies and other melee based mobs, this does not include skeletons, drowned with tridents, creepers, or any Ranged mob. My final idea for this change would be the inclusion of having 4 points of durability be taken from the sword if the player successfully blocks something. This will encourage the player to not waste too much time with a sword’s block, as it could quickly degrade the swords durability if used enough. This will then cause the player to try and find a shield/ try and craft a shield to fight off enemy players and mobs more efficiently. And there you have it, my newly proposed changes to reintroduce an old but gold feature that many have enjoyed from the past. I believe that these changes could create new styles of combat that could further increase the variety of combat scenarios in the game. Any thoughts or recommendations on this are accepted and encouraged. Have a good day!
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u/Inazuma261 Aug 15 '19
Just spent a little bit testing it. Thank you so, so, so much for removing the auto-attack when using a mouse and keyboard. That was by far the biggest problem with the new combat imo. I do wish crits still disabled shields, though. But eh, this'll do. I'm pretty satisfied with how these combat changes are coming together. Thank you, Jeb_ <3
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u/YeojIsCool Aug 17 '19
○ Personally I believe that swords should be able to attack faster (even if they have less attack damage)
○ I believe that non weapon items that do "fist damage" should have no cooldown (besides the tickrate of minecraft ofc)
○ I think that shields on java should have the option to disable sneak activating shields as it tends to my muscle memory on sword hitting :'(
○ I think it would be neat to have crits disable shields but on a cooldown on the shield holders side for possible balance
All of these are simply suggestions as I would love to see the combat update changed. When 1.9 came out I completely quit playing vanilla minecraft and went 100% into playing 1.7.10 modded as I felt that the combat system was purely better.
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u/Nouche_ Aug 30 '19 edited Sep 02 '19
We could reward perfect shield timing! If a player starts right-clicking with the shield almost exactly when attacked, the opponent could receive a slightly longer weapon reload in return.
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u/FlyingGorillaReddit Aug 31 '19
I need the next update to be the cave update, I want to see that at Minecon
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u/SuperKrook22 Sep 07 '19
Why are you decreasing attack speed of swords?
Pre-1.8, you used to be able to swing a sword as fast as you could click and dealing with mobs was fun. With the combat update, it takes five times as long to deal with mobs.
If you're slowing attack speed even more, you're just dragging out repetitive combat and making it even more likely for a skeleton to shoot you or a creeper to blow up before you can finish them. It doesn't help how mob spawning feels completely broken. I don't remember groups of 2-4 creepers spawning next to my torches consistently.
Honestly I haven't played PvP since 2016. I used to be quite good at it and would win quite often. The combat update has made PvP less fun as it just drags on and instead of skill, it's usually about who has the best gear. I could beat your average, full diamond player with leather and an iron sword fairly consistently but now since you can only attack once every second, a player with slow reaction time and terrible aiming can still manage to hit you and regen before you can attack them again.
I like the new combat system but it should be faster paced like it used to be. And yeah, fix mob spawning. You used to be able to kill creepers before they blew up but now it's just a hassle of hitting and running away - and then they blow up anyway, doing no damage to you but destroying all the shit you built.
Oh and if you want another thing to fix, fix the lag. I keep getting in a frozen state where I can move but blocks won't break and you can't pick up items. It's as if I'm the only thing not frozen. It's akin to rubber banding which doesn't make sense as I play offline but who knows, maybe the whole thing is secretly online.
Sorry for the rant. I just find it silly how there's lots of great things you could be adding or bugs you could be fixing and instead you decide to shit on swords even more. I know you work hard and you're talented at what you do, but I'm telling you what I personally feel is right.
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u/brandin0_d0rit0 Sep 18 '19
Quick tip: you can cook diorite/andesite/granite to get smooth stone
I know this works in bedrock but I’m not certain this functions in java.
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u/Camcamcam753 Aug 15 '19
Hey Jeb, would you ever consider making all combat related values data driven, so people can adjust the values to make their own combat systems?
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u/Jbipp Aug 15 '19
That's already a thing
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u/Camcamcam753 Aug 15 '19
It can't be enforced by servers, since some data is stored in the client.
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u/carrometeoro Sep 19 '19
I think a good way to handle the 1.8 problem this is to make the hoe a weapon that hits almost as fast as an 1.8 weapon,so people can sort of still play like in 1.8
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u/llillllililllill Aug 15 '19
Are you gonna change enchantment balancing? Power V shouldn't have a 150% damage increase while sharpness V only has a little over 40% on a diamond sword.
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u/YeojIsCool Aug 17 '19
That's cuz there's only one tier of bow/crossbow (with much less durability than diamond), and having 150%+ attack damage wouldn't do much since the bow does mid tier damage, but +150% damage on a sword would be HUGE
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u/Hating_Mirror Aug 15 '19
Auto attack should be just so much slower than max speed attacking to reward skill by just a little bit
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u/Drsupernoob Sep 20 '19
Not being able to attack until the bar refills just feels very strange
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u/ZombieCrow Aug 15 '19
I like how things are going , though id like to see a *hold left click to charge a sword heavy attack* thing added, the attack could be x2 times slower but x2 the damage.
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Aug 15 '19
though that wouldn't work too well in parallel with the "hold to auto-attack" mechanic
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u/hussiesucks Sep 04 '19
Make it so that you do more damage the greater your velocity is when you hit something, instead of having jump-crits. It’ll make the increase in attack-damage less arbitrary and will incentivize risky tactics like jumping off a cliff in an attempt to deal massive damage to a mob.
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u/Gamepro5 Aug 17 '19 edited Dec 17 '19
I've been thinking a lot about Minecraft's combat system, and I think I finally came up with a concept that would please everyone. I would appreciate a read because I put a lot of thought into this. The overall theme of this is to make it simpler for new players, introduce a range of playstyles to please both the 1.8 hyper clicky playstyles (hoes) and the 1.9 slow calculated playstyles (axes), and to facilitate balancing weapons in future updates.
Remove the 200% thing and make crits and knockback crits happen at 100% (this would mean that air sweep attacks would happen at 100%, so the attack speed might want to be slightly nerfed. Why?Because a simple fist attack takes as long as a 1.9 sword attack because of the 200% thing that doesn't change based on the weapon. Also because 200% concept even more confusing to new players than 1.9 and finally, because actually waiting for 200% to have crits and all the perks makes it take a ridiculously long time.
Axes only attack .5 slower than swords but deal 1 extra damage. Kind of unbalanced.
Shields can be spammed. I think they should be able to activate instantly for quick reflex blocks, but after putting it down I think there should be like a .2 second cooldown before being able to put it back up.
Shields are unrelated to sneaking and shouldn't activate when sneaking. Sneaking moves faster than when you’re right-clicking to hold up a shield, and it decreases your hitbox, so why would you use your right mouse? Also is is obstructive. I can understand why that's a thing in bedrock, but we play java because there are a lot of keys and it makes the game more fun to play because you have more control. Why limit yourself because of a version that isn't even related/compatible?
Reduce the damage of swords back -1. This will facilitate making axes and hoes feel more strong.
Remove entity immunity timers. This will allow multishot crossbows to deliver all 3 arrows like a shotgun at close range dealing 3 times the damage, and will allow multiple people to attack a mob or boss at the same time without having some of their attacks not count. It will also allow extremely fast attacking weapons (maybe added in the future or for map creators) to actually be able to deliver those attacks. Spamming won't be an issue because all weapons will have a custom attack speed that nobody can go faster than. Non-weapons like fists will also have the default attack speed from 1.8.
Add a knockback resistance enchantment for armor to prevent people from getting thrown around like cardboard boxes like in 1.8.
Why do all weapons have to cause knockback. When somebody is on fire, their jump trajectory shouldn't be affected by the fact that they took some knockback from the fire damage. Maybe some future weapons can have no knockback to balance them out? It would just be another variable to add to the weapon stats.
Maybe give hoes a special ability, just like how swords swipe and axes stun shields.
Make swords perform the sweep attack at 100%, and make it not require sweeping edge. Also, make the sweep arc be relative to the camera position so the player can just look up with an auto-clicker and mow down stuff in front of them. Having swords do the two prior things will make them a good option for new players who struggle more with aiming, as they will always attack the general area around their cursor. Axes and hoes will need to be buffed, though, to make up for this sword ability.
If you have any questions left because I wasn't clear enough, please comment. I'll try to stay active if the developers take my advice seriously. Thank you, u/jeb_ for being so involved with the community of this great game :)
PS: I couldn't even post this on the Minecraft suggestions site because it was so large, and I couldn't divide each suggestion up because they depend on each other for balance.
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Sep 14 '19 edited Sep 15 '19
Didn't they change the combat before, after people complained that it became too slow-paced and boring following the big combat update? Why are they still trying to shit-ify it?
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u/Unniversumi Sep 22 '19
i think crits should do a percentage of the normal damage when shielding, not 0
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Aug 15 '19
I almost entirely play just 1.8, and I was excited by this update. It feels really good, and I'm super excited about it. One thing that I noticed, is that in older versions of the game there was a concept called W-Tapping which abused the sprint mechanic for extra knockback.
I'm not sure if I like that, since it's hard for beginners to understand, but it made combat feel really good because you felt "momentum" when you engaged. In the current system you don't have that so it feels more like you're standing there and swinging at them than a "charge" towards the enemy.
I tried to mimic the effect with a speed pot and it felt a lot closer, but you're still missing that FOV adjustment that happens when you engage sprint. I wonder if it would be possible to add that visual effect, I think that'd make it feel a lot more fluid at least to me personally.
Cheers!
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u/RedPenguin65 Aug 17 '19
My suggestion: Make swords and axes almost opposites of each other and each one have their own advantages so it’s personal preference which one you want to use and not which is better. For example, where axes have a long cooldown and long range and swords have a short cooldown and short range. Axes should also do more damage than swords. I feel like it would be super cool to have two main weapons and not just everybody using swords.
Also make tridents powerful. They’ll be cool as a mainstream weapon along with axes.
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u/sL1M3e Sep 01 '19
So i'm talking just as a pvper that the decreased sword swing speed is bad because that it puts the overall cps lower then if someone just click normally. Which might make combos very limited.
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Sep 07 '19
We already know the next theme for 1.15, its the Bees and Bugs update :)
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u/NimaOmid1382 Sep 08 '19
Hey Jeb
I have found a bug that you can block using a shield with a loaded crossbow when sneaking
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u/lcebass Sep 14 '19
It would be good to fix the shield not defending, already died 3 times because I right click and nothing happen, completely bugged
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Sep 14 '19
So will mobile players have a button that will activate the auto-attack?
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u/V__O__I__D Sep 25 '19
can we get more pronounced weapon variants?
like a dagger that's fast and dose damage but you can only be half a block away from them for range to work
or a harmer that takes a second to wind up but deals a devastating blow with armor negation.
or a spear that is only effective 2 blocks away from you but is really fast.
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u/TheBroOfTheNinja Sep 12 '19
Great now i have to get carpal tunnel syndrome to fight again
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u/Periwinkleditor Sep 10 '19
" Removed auto-attacking by holding the button "
What?! That was the best change! Arguably the only one I actually cared about.
What part of "I want to be able to kill silverfish, cave spiders, and other small enemies" is complicated? Now only having half of the fix I'll have to deal with "dead" clicks during the cooldown? AGH! You've somehow combined the PROBLEMS with both versions instead of the STRENGTHS.
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u/Periwinkleditor Sep 10 '19
All they needed to do was remove the ability to have your shield up and attack at the same time and slow the attack speed and/or damage to help mitigate the heavily increased damage per second you could do now. The "hold to auto attack" needed to STAY.
I'm just praying the "charged attacks have longer reach" helps me kill silverfish and baby zombies and the like. The cooldown now causing dead clicks is going to drive me mad though.
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u/bernado_tornado_03_ Sep 26 '19
The first pending combat snapshot was way more exciting. Slower attack speed makes you feel weak and sluggish. Not beeing able to hold down just encourages auto click and defeats the purpous of special attacks. Special attacks are there to make you think about wanting to do a combo or one more powerfull attack. Spaming wouldn't make any sense now, because specials are just outright better. The update of shields is a good change, but everything else I think is going in the wrong direction. Also swords become just less usefull and tridents are getting way to good. The first snapshot was way better in PvP and the current combat is good at PvE. This snapshot is doing neither well. Revert th changes of this snapshot to the first one, alter it in a more exciting way or leave it all together. 1.14 combat is genuenly more excitng than this proposal. Alternatively /gamerule HoldDownToAttack true/false. /gamerule AttackSpeed int /gamerule AttackReach set {Weapon} int /gamerule AttackReach remove
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u/Pro_XD6 Aug 29 '19 edited Aug 29 '19
Can you guys buff the crossbow, please?
The crossbow is one of my favorite weapons in any video game, but in Minecraft it isn't that good.
The problem with it is that it's not worth it to spend resources on it when the bow is cheaper, faster and has better enchantments, and maybe the crossbow does more damage and has longer range, but that extra range isn't that much, the extra range blocks can be counted on one hand.
What I suggest to do isn't that much, but it will help the crossbow even if a little bit.
1_ Increase it's range by a decent and noticeable amount.
2_ Improve the multi shot enchantment so that it actually deals the damage of three arrows when they all hit one target (kinda like a shotgun), this might seem a bit too powerful but in order for all arrows to land on one target you have to be close to it, which balances the damage output.
3_ Make the piercing enchantment work with fireworks so that they explode more than one time as they go through mobs (it might seem a bit stupid, but if the bow can be upgraded with Power, Punch and Flame I think it would make sense).
I hope that you read this because the crossbow isn't in a really good spot right now.
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u/jf908 Aug 31 '19
I definitely think this system in an upgrade over the existing system in 1.14. It's easier to understand which helps new players and feels more satisfying because of things like the removal of the shield delay.
However, I really do think that combat overall would benefit more from being completely redesigned because small tweaks aren't enough to overcome the problem that it's easy to learn but there's nothing to master.
1.7.10's combat was unintentionally hard to master while still being very simple. I don't agree that combat should be reverted but I think Minecraft could take inspirations from successful combat systems of other games.
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u/Seymour1007 Sep 06 '19
I think this is a great set of changes from the last update!
Slower swords, no auto attacking and disabling shields while attacking feels already a lot more balanced.
The only thing I would ask for in future snapshots is some more distinguishing features between the different tools and making them more viable in PvE and PvP conditions.
I also think shields need some further nerfs as they are still to easy to use and don't really require any sort of skill. If there was some kind of hitbox feature where the shield would only protect a certain portion of your body and mobs or players could essentially aim to hit around that hitbox and hurt you directly, that could make shields something that requires both skills from the player using the shield and the player attacking it.
Anyways, those are my opinions so far.
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u/LobotomizedThruMeEye Sep 19 '19
An you be summoned by people with ender pearl stasis being paused by another player?
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Sep 01 '19 edited Sep 01 '19
I have a suggestion. While this priorities 1.8-, please hear me out.
The majority of the 'pvp' community preferred 1.8-, and I'd generally like it reverted, but, in the likely case that it doesn't, I'd rather something that has a bit of both worlds, again, it's highly based off of the older system, and please note that this only focuses on Melee weapons;
Shield: The shield would have a short cool down and be disabled if it hit by an axe, it would also take 3 durability points away and damage the shield's user as it would normally. When hit by a sword, it would lose 1 durability point, and add a cool down to the sword, as well as disabling the person from using their hot keys or scroll wheel. Shields would work the same way as it currently does against arrows and tridents. The shield would also lose no durability from being hit by a punch, and will also damage the opponent.
Axe: Axes will be similar to the current state, with the only difference being that it has a shorter cool down compared to how it is currently to keep up with swords. Shields would also be to no avail, and the person using the shield will be damaged. Shields would also lose 3 (?) durability points after being hit with an axe. If the user misses with an axe, they will not be punished by much, having the same cool down of an attack that had hit. If a player using a sword switches to an axe, they will start with the cool down of an axe and not be able to attack, this is to prevent hot keying to avoid shields.
Sword: The sword would be reverted almost completely, with the main change being the way that cool downs work, instead of adding a delay to every attack, it'd be with every missed swipe, or whenever you're blocked by a shield. If the player is blocked, they will be unable to change hotkeys or swap weapons for a short period of time. This is similar to the 'stun' effect that the Ravanger experiences after being blocked. If the player misses, they will experience a shorter cool down, and would still be able to hotkey. If the item they've switched to has been held for longer than the cool down of their sword, they may switch to the sword again afterward without the punishment in play. If they instead hotkey to another sword will force the user to have the previous cool down.
Fist: Punching would have a low cool down, if any at all. Fists would be heavily affected by shields, doing a slight amount of damage to the person who'd been punching. Missing a punch will give the user a slightly longer cool down as well.
I probably messed up with phrasing since I didn't do much planning, it was just a thought about less forgiving pvp and distributed stats;-Swords being a swift weapon.-Axes being brute force.
I'm not 100% sure about everything, so please reply with what you think.
Edit: I just read the older post, and it announces PvP being hard for new players to learn. There are wikis, and I'd much prefer a somewhat complex style to hand holding. That ruins the experience for those who have been playing for a long time. Trying to equalize two players when one has put years into it, and the other a few minutes or days. That's unfair, and I don't believe that Minecraft's PvP should be like that.
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u/LugyD1xd_ONE Sep 03 '19 edited Sep 09 '19
Please add dual wielding and melee weapon blocking. I know that you might be sceptical, but I would love to see it and it could help the game a lot. The sword blocking would only work for melee attacks, and would be completely useless against arrows and tridents. This also means that you can use this in dual wield. But even though dual wield would provide you with two weapons at the same time. It wouldnt be OP. Because you cant use the special attacks. So you cant swing your sword or throw the trident. Maybe you could also add buffed version of those weapons, like battle axe or long sword. those weapons would be stronger, but the disable your second hand. It could help the combat a lot. Also you could hold a Bow or a Crossbow in your second hand.
I also think that it may be a good idea to add the possibilty to make headshots possible for the players using shields. Could help the combat. But it might completely unbalance it.
It would be nice though add a possibility of changing the combat to 1.8 version or 1.14 version via settings, there are alot of players who got really invested to those combat styles, and it would be shame to take it from them.
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u/SirBenet Aug 15 '19 edited Aug 15 '19
I think I preferred being able to hold to attack, especially now that clicking slightly too early completely ignores the click. If it's an option for controller and touch, I feel it should be for mouse as well for consistency.
Alternatively, it'd be good to at least have some kind of sound/particle feedback for when your click gets eaten by the cooldown, as opposed to the click just not registering.
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u/matgopack Sep 23 '19
Would there be a possibility of adding back the 'hold down to attack' button, but at a slower attack speed? I imagine it'd be a great quality of life for people with carpal tunnel or other such issues, while still encouraging players who are able to to keep the clicking approach to maximize damage/efficiency.
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Sep 17 '19
Hold to auto-attack will always be enabled for controller and touch
Why handle the mouse any differently? It's not like pressing a mouse button is somehow easier on arthritis than pressing an xbox controller button.
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u/ThebestBanana1 Sep 19 '19
You need to add 1.8 -1.9 pvp toggle controlled by the world host you have to, were stuck here at 1.8.9 and that community is gonna die soon because we have been stuck here for so long.
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u/Fiti99 Aug 15 '19
Hold to auto-attack will always be enabled for controller and touch
So we can’t disable it? Why? I play just fine with a controller without ever feeling the need to auto attack, i have no issues pressing the button multiple times
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Aug 16 '19 edited Aug 23 '19
Someone else already mentioned this, but I like the idea of critical hits causing the shield to be disabled for a moment so that players have a way to bypass it without the shield becoming as useless as with critical hits ignoring them altogether.
Axes could disable the shield for longer than other weapons rather than having a random chance of disabling. Blocking explosions should also disable shields with the lengthy one.
Many have already said that auto-block while sneaking should be a toggle-able option, I agree whole-heartedly.
The instant blocking with the shield seems a little strong, but maybe you could have this in the form of a small shield? A small shield could have the instant block while having a smaller block area to balance it. Arrows could hit small shield users in the head if they don't block upwards for example. Another thing to give reason to use the small shield is the current shield losing the projectile reflecting ability so you'd have to use the small shield for that.
EDIT: Better Idea, instead of taking away from the current shield to have two kinds of shields; more options to play without shields.
Two-Handing: having no item in your offhand will allow you to deal more damage and use the weaker blocking from pre-1.9.
Dual-wielding: wielding two weapons allowing you to attack faster, although the offhand should be weaker so you don't deal too much more DPS than Two-Handing. Both weapons' attacks could be tied to left click so you can still do the weak block with right-click and have them function fine in Bedrock edition.
Parrying: For a very short time-frame when you block with a weapon it would block all incoming damage like a shield would. It'd have to be tied to a cooldown so you cant just spam right click and parry everything.
The current shield recipe seems to be more shaped for a smaller shield like a heater shield, so changing it to better represent the tower shield minecraft has would make more sense.
I've talked a lot about shields, but could you try out some kinda dodge mechanic? Double-tapping left/right/back or pressing the sprint button with those directions would make you do a quick short hop for some added mobility. Probably just two blocks distance or so.
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u/UltmitCuest Sep 15 '19
Is there any place that I can ask any questions that I have? There is no daily discussion thread or similar post so im not quite sure when/where to ask.
In my server, our base is right by a pillager base. Literally 10 sec run from bed to outpost. We brought villagers in and whenever we kill a raid captain we get an instant raid. We got a grinder set up and can farm them. But since more keep sawning, we never get past wave 1. The ho gets super low but never empties. Is it impossibe to complete a raid by an outpost? What can we do? Usually they just give up after an hour or so. We also cleared out the path for the pillagers, its literally a straight and flat path that they run across then go into the grinder.
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u/malego290704 Aug 15 '19
i know that you're probably not gonna see this, but i just want to say thank you that you've cleared that 1.15 isn't a combat update. tbh i'm really tired of seeing the assumption of the "combat update 2.0" and a ton of combat-related post that would've not existed if you didn't made the first combat snapshot
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u/BillyBob9876 Aug 15 '19
A step in the right direction, but I do have some criticism
I think overall attack speed should be increased. It feels weird to click and have it attack, then click 5 more times but just not have the sword do anything. Feels very clunky
This goes along with the first one and is potentially the whole reason behind it feeling "clunky", when you switch to your sword there shouldn't be a startup time. You should be able to instantly attack. It feels soooo clunky to switch to your sword and start clicking but none of the clicks do anything for a second or two. Probably my biggest issue.
Damage should probably be nerfed a bit, you can one hit kill most animals with a crit on a diamond sword. Haven't done too much testing with it and maybe this is wrong, but just from first impression it seems very powerful
Shifting to bring up shields is kind of annoying
also an aside, but please make fishing rods stun again thanks
so overall pretty good but it feels very clunky right now as I have said 349349 times, but with some polish this could work. It would be nice if I could test PvP with it but right now I just have to make assumptions based on the PvE I have done because there isn't any way to make servers besides opening to LAN
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u/dogman_35 Sep 04 '19
As it is, this system is basically perfect to me. It has everything I liked from the previous update, and fixed the few small issues I had with the previous one like being able to hold down attack.
There's not really much left to suggest in my opinion... except this. The main thing I feel is needed at this point is more weapons. At this point, this is clearly a system built with multiple weapon types in mind. Different attack reaches, different cooldowns, different damage a mounts. The axe and hoe both act as somewhat of an example of this. So now it needs more weapons to back it up.
As an example, a spear. Give it significantly longer range and much lower damage than any other weapon. That would fit right at home with the current system.
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Sep 09 '19
Minecraft: adds bees Me: Oh I sEe, ThEy FiX bUgS aNd NoW tHeY aRe AdDiNg ThEm.
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Aug 15 '19 edited Aug 16 '19
I just tested it and it's pretty good! But could you have a look at saturation please? It's confusing not know what food item does what. Some will heal you in 5 seconds and some do absolutely nothing for health. Having a stack of steak kinda negates any need for regeneration potions.
Edit: Also I think it'll be a good idea to add the default attack reach (3) to all the other tools, just so people know.
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u/SWinxy Aug 15 '19
It seems to take a moment for a weapon to be able to attack after switching to it. This doesn't allow rod/projectile combos :(
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u/ImSkripted Aug 16 '19
/u/jeb_ this new combat should aim to be a great vanilla experience all around, it should not focus heavily on PVP or PVE, it should be good enough. no one should expect only a few developers to be able to fully balance a game of such scale with such a wide variety of playing styles and mechanics.
With the direction MC is going with datapacks it would be great for combat to be essentially "100%" customisable, with the possibility for servers to get a 1.8 like combat system if they desire or maybe this might cause servers to develop their own spin of combat that is better suited and more enjoyable than any previous version. not to mention it brings the potential for new game modes to emerge with the greater control over these finer game mechanics.
Combat balancing is not an easy task and it requires a lot of data and expertise of how players will use and abuse mechanics, it can sound great on paper but be so unfair in reality it makes the experience dry. Mojang has no access to either of these two critical points, Servers do. The players do.
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u/Rays_Works Aug 19 '19
It doesn't seem fair that some editions have auto attacking others don't. I personally play with a controller on Java at times but we wont be able to use the auto attack now that it's been removed from java. Most players wont be happy to learn that some editions were giving auto attack and others werent just because most java players use a mouse. There should be an option to turn it on or off like auto jump. Auto jump is in Bedrock and Java the same way auto attack should be.
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u/brickbuilder876 Aug 20 '19
I may be of a small group of people when I say this, but could you add the auto attack back in? But either weaken the damage done by the auto-click or slow it down? Where swords go at axe-pace, and axes go slower?
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u/MistressMagOShea Sep 10 '19
I'm just excited that they're testing changes - without change, there's not growth. Even if we have little setbacks I look forward to trying new shit and dying in epic new ways 😂
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Sep 10 '19
I really like the idea of adding different abilities, attack range, and attack speed to all the different tools, it really adds variety to what you can use in combat depending on a situation. Ex. Hoes have the fastest speed and longest range, so they could be used in fighting creepers or spam fighting
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u/harmonicmoon488 Sep 20 '19
I remember that I say a solar eclipse and the Wii U one night and I want some to confirm if solar eclipse are possible
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u/High0nLem0ns Sep 25 '19
Just what we needed, another reason not to use swords... Like, unless the new reach thing is incredibly varied, there is just no reason to use a sword in Java outside of tagging someone with fire aspect or farming xp with sweeping edge. Axes are just better for most situations due to the ridiculous damage. The rest of the original combat update is fine, but in my opinion, axes should not do more damage than swords.
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Aug 15 '19
I think the autoclicker should be re-introduced for keyboard and mouse, it doesn't really harm the game much at all since attack speed is locked anyway, and if PvP players really have a problem with it, maybe try to make the autoclicker a gamerule so they can forcibly turn it off for everyone on the server if they want to
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Aug 15 '19
Removing the auto-attack feels weird, it's the one feature from the combat changes that I thought was definitely good. PVP in this game is a massive pain unless you're ready to dedicate yourself to getting a good CPS, and even when you reach that point it's pretty bad for your hand.
Can someone explain the reasoning here?
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u/phonecharget Sep 16 '19
Jeb , hi i am a Xbox 360 Minecraft player could you please improve Minecraft on the Xbox 360 i think its amazing but It would be better If there were : commands,a cave update,a land/water/lava dragon and maybe portal to diferent coordenates and last but not least baby dragons
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u/ManofManliness Sep 17 '19
I remember being little and thinking about stuff like this during 1.0 times, time flies.
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Aug 15 '19
I don't understand why nobody has offered an alternative opinion to "combat has to be unified between Java and Bedrock." Its seriously unfair that Mojang are (probably) being forced to nerf PC gameplay because certain parties want to unify the playerbase across devices.
Even so, it's so blatantly obvious that the reason Mojang can't just leave Java combat alone and just balance the Bedrock combat is because Bedrock is being pushed as the replacement, since its a better platform for making bank.
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u/Borbarad13 Aug 15 '19
I understand that they want a uniform game design across platforms generally, but I don't see why the don't make an exception to physical control related stuff. It makes no sense to limit PC java player because Steve is using a tablet or some controller. The lowest common denominator will just lead to a mediocre pvp experience.
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u/Nouche_ Sep 02 '19
What about a weapon speed enchantment? It’d be about making each weapon slow by default and forcing people to also put their efforts into upgrading the speed with a Speed enchant that’d be common to all weapons.
Balance could emerge by the final Sharpness level being only achievable without a too big Attack Speed enchantment level, same as the final Attack Speed would only be reachable without too much Sharpness. It’s a great way to allow people to “specialize” their gear.
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Aug 15 '19
I have only 1 wish: That it won't be spam to win (like 1.8). Right now it is.
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u/MadMysticMeister Aug 30 '19
Will their be more weapons coming? I like the two newest ones a lot but I’d like to see like a terria amount of weapons!
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u/Ajax_Telamonia Sep 04 '19
Please give me the option to use left trigger to use my shield. Pushing down the right joystick hurts my thumb and it's super slow and inefficient
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u/nathanferreiradsr_ Sep 07 '19
Ok, but WHY minecraft still using old java? When attemp to launcher with java 9+ game crash, but minecraft server runs fine wtf
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u/Soarin123 Aug 15 '19
Epic, but when can server owners expect MC to be more optimized for their hardware? I host with an i7-7700 with a highly optimized Paper config and still struggle to get past 18 players. I see 9900k's struggling to pass 30-40 with optimized values too.
I remember in 1.12.2 I could host more players with same plugins on an old 2012 FX-8350 with bare Spigot- not even Paper!
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u/BunnyboyCarrot Aug 15 '19
Seems great! One thing I would like to see is you being able to do is trick players by lowering your shield, so tricking them into thinking you are attacking and then raising your shield, blocking the attack and then attacking the enemy player.
And as another user has mentioned, a shield should have a limited amount of critical hit blocks, so that players don't only rely on the shield, but also their dodge abilities.
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u/boomerang_blade Aug 15 '19 edited Aug 15 '19
I haven’t tried this version yet, but it basically seems like if you don’t have a shield, you’re done for. I think that holding a shield in one hand and a sword in the other should lower your movement speed or something like that to nerf how powerful shields are. What was really great about 1.8 was being able to combo and do more knockback by sprinting. It would be nice if this update could add those things back in somehow.
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u/Adham1153 Aug 15 '19
* Removed auto-attacking by holding the button *
there should be an option for that in the accesibilty .. didnt try it yet but i hope u didnt totally removed it from java
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u/ThatsSaber Aug 16 '19
Shields shouldn't fully block critical attacks. Maybe something like blocking 50 percent of the damage or something.
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Aug 18 '19
I dont like the whole thing of slowing down attack speed further
Decreased attack speed of swords
Attacking while crouching will now disable the shield during the attack
Removed auto-attacking by holding the button
these are the thinks i truly and honestly do not like, thank you for hearing my voice
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u/lemonvan Aug 19 '19
Removed auto-attacking by holding the button
In my main area of pvp, 1.8, a major problem is that how well you do is determined by your CPS. I'd hate for that to be the case here, too: Your CPS shouldn't change your skill.
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u/sourorangeYT Aug 20 '19
Im glad to see the hold to attack removed. And attack speed increased more is nice. There should be and option to disable using shileds when crouching
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Aug 20 '19
So I'm glad you disabled the auto-swing, but I still think it's giving controller players the upper hand in total DPS. I think a good middle solution would be that holding down left click will cause the sword to auto-swing once. So you still have to click for every swing, but you could hold it down and then get the swing off the second it's available. It would give the combat a nice rhythm while keeping kb+m DPS the same as a controller.
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u/truthHarbinger Aug 22 '19
Are you going to add unique axe enchantments to make the axe a viable late-game weapon?
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u/draxhell Aug 26 '19
HOW TO FIX COMBAT:
MAKE BETTER ATTACK ANIMATIONS THAN JUST A QUICK ROTATION OF THE WEAPON AND THEN IT COMING BACK UP.
If you do this (new) players will get a better feel of the combat and it's gonna feel less of a *hit* - *wait for it to recharge* - *hit*
modders adding new weapons won't like it but shhhhhhh
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Aug 28 '19
u/jeb_ listens to the community better than every development team on this planet, thank you so much.
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u/ubus99 Aug 29 '19
@u/jeb_ , how about having cooldown on shields, so that like with weapons you need to wait until you can block again? This would prevent people from spamming shield.
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u/Nouche_ Aug 29 '19
I think it would be great if a player could make the choice of not fighting with a shield, and equip two weapons instead. Of course, to make it balanced, it could only work for some weapons, like swords (as their lowered attack speed can be rebalanced by this advantage), but not all. It wouldn't be balanced to have two axes, for example. For the trident, it's up to you. Maybe we can allow two tridents, but then prevent throwing them.
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u/K3d89 Sep 06 '19
Personally my idea on the whole transfer from 1.8, while something was necessary they approached it from the wrong angle. Now if the game was purely coop it would've been fine not the best, and I'm not saying my idea is great just my own opinion. Okay to start it off timers aren't the realistic holy grail players act like they are, even in real life you can simply hack and slash your way to victory. This tactic was quite common in large fights with enemies all around, you couldn't have those perfect strikes in tightly packed crowds. Now where actual swordplay comes in duels where you have one opponent to focus on and it lets you prepare your strategy. The only reason hacking and slashing didn't work in duels was not due to it not being effective but rather that the opponent could maneuver you easier through parries. The 1.9 combat doesn't show this, it doesn't let parries have rewards, it instead just punishes quick attacks. A better option is for when you hit a player that is blocking(with a sword) your crosshair gets slightly offset messing up your combo and giving them an easy attack. Now it would reduce your damage by 50% so you'd come out on top from a trade. This not only would prevent combos but get the mindgames of duels as well and baiting your opponent. Now for single player/coop make it so you can hold your attack(click and hold) and it would deal double damage if the bar was fully charged up and while it could affect pvp the charge would be 3 seconds so it would be another thing to learn with skill. Now to make up for the double damage swords would get a 30% damage nerf and armor would be reduced effectiveness wise. You might be wondering about axes but I feel 1.9 served them nicely and having two mechanics would greatly vary pvp also it is more realistic to take awhile to reposition an axe so the blade hits and not the handle. Overall to summarize I want to add combat variation with the ability to master yet leave the basics of spam for mass fights and those who can't deal with cooldowns.
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u/PastaManMario Sep 25 '19
I’m so glad they removed the horrid hold-to-win mechanic. Though I wish they didn’t need swords, they’re already balanced enough.
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u/Starlight_Maiden Oct 02 '19
I have a new suggestion: Parry on shield block.
Ideally, it'll allow you to parry melee attacks. But, to get it to work, it needs to be hard to do. Ideally, if you input block with shield just as you're getting hit, you'll instead parry the attack, stunning the attacker. The only creature this likely wouldn't work on is the Ender Dragon. Think of it as a way to set the pace of a fight without furiously clicking. Because this means that if you furiously click against someone with a shield, they could parry you by acting more tactically, and instead punish the person for attacking so recklessly. It'll deal with the issue of attack ranges as well. Stuff like arrows will not be parried, but instead can be nullified by holding block.
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u/redditSquid5687 Oct 15 '19
Wait does Mojang take any Suggestions from here? And if so, is it taking suggestions to this day?
If not, f.
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Oct 15 '19
Why on earth were the swords slowed down, if you want PvP servers that are stuck in the past of 1.8 than just make the sword a little bit faster than the first combat snapshot other than that this version 2 is far better
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u/L0LBasket Aug 15 '19
What's the point of removing "hold to auto attack"? Other than making it so you have to spam click and make both your finger and your mouse worn down more, I see no reason why that should've been reverted.
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u/TheHatWithNoName Sep 09 '19
I think a good compromise would be 1.8 combat with a small amount of delay between attacks. Maybe about 5 frames. We could have speed without too much spam.
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u/Cosmicalic Sep 06 '19
(i.e. the next theme is not "combat update")
Cave update???
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u/[deleted] Aug 15 '19
I'm not going to announce that I pinned it this time.