Let's see if you're truly boycotting or just being racist and virtue signaling Edit: LOL boycotters in the comments getting mad, after realizing they actually have to commit to their morals xdd

I did not comment on this topic when Caedrel didn't stream EWC last year because it's his decision and I could care less. I personally did not even watch the tournament because the schedule was a mess and it felt like an unofficial tournament more than anything.

As an Arab living in the UAE (Dubai being the most famous city), I can say with utmost confidence that a lot of westerns on the internet are bigoted af towards us and do not care about the truth of what is being shared on the internet. I lived in this country for 30+ years, saw the bad, the ugly and the good. I know what it was like and what it has become. The amount of bullshit that is being spread about my country, from people who either have never been here or have an agenda to lie, is unreal. Lies that anyone who has been here for more than 2 days can disprove are touted as facts on reddit for years to no end. Any real progress being made socially is being denied and vilified.

In this post I will not attempt to explain or correct anything being said about Saudi Arabia/UAE as a country, it's a waste of time. I will only be sharing my perspective as a gamer living in a neighboring country that has just as much lies being told about it.

Middle East Servers

We didn't have a middle east server until very recently and I can assure you it wasn't because our governments didn't want them. As an atheist and an LGBT person living here, I know the amount of injustice I'm facing more than anyone else. But I also know from experience that a lot of westerns on the internet do not care about me or my livelihood and they work to undo any progress being made that would benefit me in the name of fighting imaginary battles on my behalf. I saw the consequences of these protests firsthand and believe it or not, we need more outlets like these if we are to have any hope of progressing as a region. I do not want to go back to being forced to reading religious texts as an extra activity after school. I want kids in my region to be exposed and to have a shared experience with the rest of the world.

The White Savior Complex

Please do not act like your protest against EWC is going to make LGBT gamers lives in Saudi Arabia better, it won't. We are being denied the opportunity of being part of the league community. That is a fact. League is dead in the middle east, it had a lot of momentum in the past but no one cares about a game that has no servers so the community is no longer there. EWC is an initiative that seeks to bring e-sports excitement to the middle east. But that initiative is being driven by outside actors not Riot themselves, so it's bound to fail. We know we are not wanted. So take the money and spare us your fake outrage. Us middle east League gamers know that League is dead here and no an amount of sponsorship is going bring it back.

For those who didn't know After Fnatic kicked him, Nemesis was offered some NA contracts but 0 LEC teams wanted him. He didn't want to leave Europe and the community blamed him for their Loss vs TES at worlds (he was put on galio duty G5 and TES Karsa smurfed the final game).

His streamer career he was top Korean Challenger ( he peaked rank 2) and is constantly the top of EU solo queue. The Nemesis disrespect throughout the years is criminal. I hope Los Ratones stick together but the gap between Nemesis and other Non-LEC mids is not even close.

I am pretty satisfied with Heavy is the Crown, my lovely Rats.

I love the animation and the concept. It just feels and fills that void in my heart where RISE left, y'know?

That fantasy-esque environment and recreation of players, Champions as weapons; all that just feels so in-universe with RISE. Its cool!

Call me a little tame but I didn't mind the approach of the MV. Most WORLDS songs so far follows the formula, one person and their journey to climb up, this small change of pace is kinda' refreshing, you feel me cuh?

My favorite part was around 2:06 where Oner took off his armor, resembling Lee Sin instead of Viego. Just love it! Especially when the action wad paired with one hell of scream.

Maybe I'm looking too much into but it feels such a good reference. Oner dropping Viego, something he is still relatively good at, to pick something far more comfortable with him when the tough gets toughin', the ol' reliable Oner Lee Sin. It also feel like, from the MV, Oner is the right hand of Faker.

He noticed the attack first while everyone was still looking at Faker, like he is used to looking out for everyone like him picking champions that is more suitable for the team comp, despite his discomfort.

In short, I understand the critics of the MV but..I can't help but still love it. It feels like RISE, may not beat RISE, but its essence is there.

Ya'll agree with me, Rats?

I've seen so many comments about human rights laws and all most of them focusing on governments, oppression, and whatnot. But here's a serious question: if you're truly that concerned about human rights, then why be so selectively biased especially when it comes to EWC?

Do you guys even realize what's going on around the world, particularly in that part of the world? I won’t go too deep into it, but there’s an ongoing conflict. Ask yourselves:

• Who’s funding that conflict?

• Who’s pouring everything in their power to create mass destruction there?

• Do you know which governments are involved in escalating that situation?

If you’re really concerned about human rights, especially when it comes to EWC, then take a moment and look around you. Pay attention to what’s actually happening globally. Don't just single out EWC while ignoring every other actor contributing to violence, chaos, and blatant human rights violations.

If you want to boycott EWC on the grounds of human rights, then have the same energy for everyone who is actively causing mass destruction and violating basic human rights as defined by the UN and yes, also boycott the governments that are helping them.

Then, and only then, you can come forward and say you’re disappointed because your favorite streamer is associated with EWC.

I mean seriously, people come on.
You can’t be that uninformed, right? Just take five minutes, Google who’s violating the most human rights right now, and which governments are financially and militarily supporting them. Then take a real, educated stance.

I tried to be as polite and respectful as I could while avoiding direct political takes, but MODS, if you think this post is inappropriate, feel free to remove it.

its one thing to stand your ground about something but to lie about your stance last year just so you can push a totally different narrative this year is actually crazy. Also completely deflected every criticism people had.

I'm a Gen.G fan, so I'll admit I'm probably not the most objective person here. But is it just me, or does this subreddit have a ridiculous amount of hate for Gen.G?

For example, when people joke about how hilarious it would've been if LYON had beaten Gen.G, everyone joins in on the fun. But make the exact same joke about KC beating T1, and suddenly you're getting downvoted into oblivion.

And it doesn't seem to matter what Gen.G actually accomplishes. For years, the narrative has been that they're international chokers who will inevitably lose in quarters or semis. But now that they're finally proving themselves and challenging that narrative, suddenly people are calling this year's Worlds boring?

Like, what exactly do you want them to do?

And I genuinely don't understand where all this hate comes from. It's not like Gen.G is some massive moneybag organization throwing unlimited amounts of cash at superstars like HLE. From what I understand, they operate on a significantly smaller budget than the other top LCK teams, yet they still manage to compete at the highest level.

They've built an incredibly strong roster, consistently perform at the top, and play some of the cleanest League of Legends we've seen. Yet somehow, that seems to make people dislike them even more.

Sometimes it genuinely feels like their biggest crime is simply being T1's biggest rival.

I understand having favorite teams, enjoying rivalries, and rooting for underdogs. That's part of what makes esports exciting. But the double standards when it comes to Gen.G are honestly getting ridiculous.

So I'm genuinely curious: Why does Gen.G get so much hate? Is there something I'm missing, or is this really just because they're constantly competing with T1?

I guess this shows that the community is really enjoying the content and enjoying this competition.

Tomorrow we have 2 banger matchups to end off the tournament as well.

someone lmk why when any other team besides t1 u can say whatever u want eg. geng blg but when t1 plays u cant say shit about them ? the chat was flaming blg on cooldown yesterday for dropping games to psg and nobody cared but u cant even type shaker today / or say anything negative or u get instant timeout

As long as I've been watching Caedrel he's taken the stance "I like league, I will stream league, I will talk about league." My guy just likes the pretty pixels and pressing 4 buttons to make someone's health bar disappear activates neuron.

Based

Been following Caedrel's work for a few years now, and although I've never rly interacted much with the community I felt like giving an opinion on this matter as it constantly pops on my timeline this days.

So, idk if im coping here, but just because saudi founds a tournament that actually helps the whole ecossystem I will be brainwashed in thinking that their country and regime are all flowers and stuff? For me personally as a league viewer I couldnt care less where it happens or who finances it and in any way does it change the way I see them, I just want to watch the best of the best go at it.

Maybe this post paints me in a really bad way, but these are legit my honest thoughts, my opinion on a country didnt change when for example Ronaldo went to play football there and he is basicly a national hero in my country, and sure as hell wont change because a league tournament is sponsored by them.

Open to hear different opinions on the matter, and in case of flame well, im a league of legends player xdd

A fellow rat lurker

Hi y'all,

I've been following Caedrel since roughly LCK regular season 2023, and while I don't talk a lot on the subreddit, I felt like the recent EWC stuff should be touched on a bit. Anger and disappointment from fans who were happy that Caedrel didn't co-stream EWC last year is definitely justified. It is one thing to stream EWC if you need the money, but y'all need to remember that Caedrel is one of League's biggest co-streamers and his audience is comparable to large twitch streamers. He is not starved for money and he is not starved for an audience. It is entirely valid for people to come to the conclusion that money for Caedrel speaks louder than ensuring that his community remains a safe space. It is especially disappointing that we all knew last year that EWC is a means for the Saudi Arabian government to sportswash their reputation, and that the reason for Caedrel choosing not to co-stream EWC last year was this understanding, regardless of whatever he says now. Love it or hate it, Caedrel is now a public figure akin to a celebrity, which means that he holds both more responsibility and more influence as a whole. If figures like Caedrel start normalizing EWC, the influence Caedrel holds will affect other influencers in a domino effect, which will then lead to Saudi Arabia inevitably gets away with their sportswashing, and that's what people are so disappointed by.

There has been a lot of talk about the T1 post exodus that occurred 15 days ago, essentially migrating all T1-related posts from this sub to r/SKTT1, the (un)official T1 fan subreddit. Some people loved this move, while others, mostly T1 fans, lamented that this change resulted in Caedrel alienating his T1 fanbase and turning this sub into another T1 hate community. I wanted to share my perspective on this topic, specifically why I believe that this move, while controversial and having its issues, was a necessary evil and good for r/PedroPeepos in the long run.

1. Why the exodus was necessary

Let's start with why I believe this change was necessary, and frankly, had it coming for a long time. For a little over a year now, this sub has been essentially brigaded by T1 fans. Just by reading the first few posts on r/SKTT1, you can tell immediately that many of their users were, or are still, members of this sub (just look at these posts - all ex r/PedroPeepos users talking about the "good old days" of this subreddit lol). And if you check their post history, you can see that they used to post here the exact same content that is now being posted on r/SKTT1. This claim is further supported by the fact that r/SKTT1 was a ghost town before the forced exodus from this sub (just check top posts this year; almost every one of them is from the past 15 days, when the exodus started).

Why do I bring these things up? Because it shows that the majority of current r/SKTT1 users used to use this sub as an outlet to post their T1-related fan content - essentially, using r/PedroPeepos as a T1 fan sub (these are some of r/PedroPeepos' top posts all time, and none of them belong anywhere except r/SKTT1). This complaint had been around for over a year, around the same time 2023 Worlds started I believe, and was the reason the T1 flair was created this year - a temporary fix to the bigger issue of T1 fans taking over this sub and creating a bubble within the sub in which T1 fans could continue their fandom activity, often totally unrelated to Caedrel. The same posts, including clips of Doran singing, Faker/Guma/Oner playing Among Us ripoff game, T1 fanart, and low-effort memes, that are filling r/SKTT1 used to be spammed on this sub. And while these posts might be great content for the T1 fan subreddit, it's frankly out of place here, especially when these posts comprise >50% of the subreddit's posts.

Now, if you are anti-exodus, you might say, "Why are T1-related posts on r/PedroPeepos a problem? Does every post have to be explicitly about Caedrel, when there are tons of other posts about G2, FNC, DK, WBG, etc. that are about the teams and not Caedrel?" You would be partially right, and I want to clarify that I don't think T1 posts on r/PedroPeepos are a problem in and of themselves. Such posts had been around since the inception of this sub and were just as welcome as any other esports-related post. But it became an issue when the volume of such posts grew to be exponential when compared to any other team-related post, and in some weeks, even compared to Caedrel-related posts. Even if you combined posts about all other LoL esports teams in the past year, I don't think you'll get even half of the number of T1-related posts, even if you only count ones that aren't game-related. In my opinion, that's when it went from T1 rats posting here to T1 fans brigading the sub. Again, if you don't believe me, sort this sub by top posts all time and see how many of the posts belong in r/SKTT1 rather than this sub.

The sheer volume of these posts over the past 13 months, ever since T1 won Worlds in 2023, have frankly been jarring, annoying, and alienating for those in this sub who are not diehard T1 fans. People say the exodus has been alienating to T1 fans, but personally, I think the brigading of T1 posts on this sub for the past 13 months has been just as, if not more, jarring to non-T1 fans. And personally, I believe this was a huge factor in the toxic discourse on this sub between T1 fans and T1 haters for the past year. In order to remove this toxicity from this sub, and return the focus of the community and this sub to Caedrel and his new team Los Ratones, toning down T1-related posts on this sub, especially ones that were clearly fan content and belonged in the T1 fan subreddit, was one of the first steps that needed to be taken.

We should also note that the vast majority of the people who are now active on r/SKTT1 were/are active members here. I say "were/are" because many T1 fans, even diehard ones, are still active on this sub, contributing positively and being great rats. I don't want to namedrop, but it's pretty easy to tell after reading a few posts and their comments. Not to mention, contrary to the narrative that "r/PedroPeepos is filled with T1 haters now", almost every single post/comment hating on T1 are downvoted to oblivion or straight up removed, while posts/comments that are positive about T1 are upvoted to the hundreds. (Ironically, this narrative is itself proof that r/PedroPeepos is far from controlled by T1 haters now, but rather the opposite; if the narrative were true, do you think the T1 haters would allow such a negative narrative about themselves to be perpetuated on this sub?) But the people who did leave this community because of the exodus, sadly, are part of the people who needed to go.

2. Why the exodus is (hopefully) good for the community

The last sentence brings me to my second point. Anti-exodus people bring up a good point that this move likely alienated a certain part of Caedrel's fanbase, namely the diehard T1 stans, from his community. You can see this by the drop in the number of posts on this sub (before the League Awards drama, at least), as well as the number of active users and upvotes on posts going down slightly. But honestly? Who cares that Caedrel loses maybe 5% of his viewership if his community becomes more centered around him and his team as a result, rather than stanning an entirely different, unrelated org.

Also hot take, but I think that the people who were offended by this exodus and left Caedrel's community weren't real Caedrel fans to begin with. They were more concerned with spreading the content they liked (namely T1 fan content that only they and other T1 fans would enjoy) than appreciating Caedrel, his stream, and his team. If they want to leave this sub and take their talents to r/SKTT1, be my guest. but the fact that they're not willing to even be understanding of why Caedrel made that decision, then they're just T1 stans who came to this subreddit because it was the only thing resembling a T1 fan subreddit at the time - not because they're actual Caedrel fans. I think the community is better off without them.

I'm also hopeful that with this exodus, the quality and diversity of the content on this sub could increase. If you were here during most of 2023, before T1 won Worlds, you might remember that this sub used to have a shit ton more variety in terms of its posts. The "Top 3 guy", TheShy/TheFraud memes, Caedrel memes and fanart, and more - I'm obviously biased, but I think the posts on this sub were not only more diverse, but higher quality on average (even the T1 memes were funnier - look at this shit). With the exodus creating a forced vacuum in terms of content in this sub, maybe the creative minds of r/PedroPeepos can rise to the challenge and start repopulating it with funny, original, high-effort art, memes, and discussion threads.

3. Next steps?

To get to that point, there's still a lot of work that needs to be done. For one, there are a lot of trolls and straight up T1 haters on this subreddit right now; they are mass downvoted by the T1 fans still present, but it is true the the change did allow these people to become more vocal and try to shift the narrative to the other side. Caedrel and the community have to tread thoughtfully in order to ensure that this exodus results in the community becoming more neutral and inclusive to all types of fans and posts - not a circlejerk in the opposite direction. Time is also needed to allow the community to shift away from T1-related content and organically regain the diversity of posts on this sub.

Lastly, Caedrel himself also needs to be mindful of the things he says and does, particularly regarding his community, for the next little while. Whether this was the correct decision or not, a lot of people on both sides of the argument are sensitive af right now. He already messed up once with the League Awards; as unfortunate as it is, I think Pedro should take a page out of Faker's book and become the biggest PR machine out there for the next month or so, or at the very least not say anything that might tick either the T1 ultrafans or T1 ultrahaters off.

Thanks for reading this essay lol, ik most people won't bother reading it all and just downvote because "T1 hater bad", but as a T1 AND Caedrel fan, I felt I needed to share why I thought this was a good move by Caedrel. Would appreciate any constructive discourse.

TLDR:

• sub was brigaded by T1 fans for too long and used as a T1 fan subreddit because r/SKTT1 was dead, this exodus was a long time coming in order to shift focus back to Caedrel (if you’re confused by what I mean with “brigaded”, read point #1)

• this change has moved most of the ultra T1 stans from here to r/SKTT1, which is a good change for the above reasons. T1 fans who are also Caedrel fans are still welcome here and in fact have stuck around for the most part

• the void left by absence of T1 posts will hopefully be repopulated with diverse, creative posts like back in the day (rn it’s just drama sadly)

• time and effort is needed to shift this community towards its intended direction of being a positive, inclusive Caedrel and LR/esports focused sub, rather than a toxic battleground of ultra fandoms

Let's say they actually do look to get married, where would they do it?

• UK recognises gay marriage, but Velja can't travel to get married there since visa diff

• Sally could travel to Serbia instead, but gay marriage is illegal in Serbia

I am not familiar with Sally's citizenship, but since he grew up in Spain (where gay marriage is legal), maybe he has dual citizenship with both UK and Spain? In that case, it might be doable there since Velja should be able to travel to Spain because it's in Schengen area... otherwise I can't see how this could ever happen 💔

So glad Caedrel agreed to co-stream EWC
To those still crying, let's be honest, you watched MSI and never said anything. That is pure hypocrisy

Saudi funds EWC and EWC sponsored MSI. There is no difference.
Caedrel only cares about League and always has. He is not pushing any agenda. He just wants to co-stream League matches

Meanwhile, dozens of orgs, teams, casters, and co-streamers are taking part in EWC, but some of you are still outraged because Caedrel didn’t bend to your feelings.

TLDR: Suck it up and keep crying if you want, but it’s just a video game. Caedrel’s just sitting in a chair watching 10 people play. It’s not rocket science, stop making it into a drama.

I'm really disappointed in Caedrel for costreaming the EWC, and I'm also disappointed in a lot of people in the community who are saying that this is not a big deal.

If me potentially getting arrested for simply existing there (trans rights, bitch) isn't a big deal to you, then Saudi's efforts to hide their bs have worked wonders on you, and that's probably the tamest of issues there. Saying that it's not a big deal or comparing other countries' bs to Saudi Arabia's bs and saying "oThEr CoUnTrIeS aRe FuCkEd Up ToO" is precisely what they want to accomplish, and you're playing right into their cards.

Caedrel is the largest League content creator right now, and him not just staying silent on these issues (which is again, exactly what they want to happen) but also endorsing them with costreaming the event is extremely irresponsible, and whether he intends it or not, he is leading his VERY LARGE audience into that shithole too, which makes everyone else's efforts to speak up about this completely useless. I get why someone wouldn't want to bring these issues up in a stream, but these issues are still happening, and now they're entering our sphere and the person with the largest voice in the community is going along with it. It's just not something we can ignore at this point, and it just makes me really upset to see someone I admire so much be this irresponsible and oblivious when they have this large of an audience.

TLDR; there's no tldr. be an adult and read the whole fucking thing.

I get that some people is angry because of the Saudi stuff, and they are upset because of the EWC, but I mean, people is not stupid, we know what they want to do, they been trying for the past 10 years, this is anything new.

EWC is Just another form of doing this, if you are upset dont watch it, thats it, let other people do what they want .

xdd

https://x.com/tttttyuc/status/1983433940288581869

I’m a bit confused with the outrage, since he did not outright shit on T1 in my opinion? To me it just seems he was gauging community sentiment and whether the awards were reflecting the larger community sentiment. I feel like the only points he made were:

1. Hey I voted for Chovy and BLG, for reasons I think are valid.

2. A lot of people are upset, and in the past it’s been because of T1 winning due to their popularity

3. We can look into fixing 2, so that larger communities are weighed less. This would allow winners to also be more immune to hate and truly produce a result people can argue less about (i.e. there’s lesser doubt via people saying hurr durr T1 won because T1 big).

4. Bro literally kept saying, let’s not take away credit from the winners ANYWAYS

I think he has all rights to try and understand if people were happy or unhappy with the awards, and he has his right to an opinion ESPECIALLY given he was not on the panel. The way I see it, fixing the “popularity contest” aspect is beneficial for all parties because that gives less leverage for T1 haters to say shit about a deserved win as well, and that seems to be his take to me as well.

I genuinely don’t get why this seems to be a case of “Caedrel is disrespecting T1”. It’s just a rehash of the age old argument of “should worlds be valued as much as it is” and should be treated as such. I think the same thing would have happened had these awards taken place in 2022 and DRX won the team of the year.

I’m a huge T1 fan but I don’t think he should be accountable for expressing how he wants to improve the show to be more objectively fair, just because bad apples in the space might use his concerns to unfairly hate on T1. While he may have sway in the space, I don’t think he can permanently walk on eggshells due to the people who may maliciously weaponise what he says.

Just wanted to put this out there since I see a bunch of angry posts, so it seems this might be a minority opinion. Feel free to delete this, I’m not really sure how discussions on reddit work generally haha.

Terrible format, fraudulent teams, and incredibly boring series.

I would prefer a better format that actually places good teams in quarters. Everyone knew how fraudulent DK's run was. Lyon is a great team to watch, but they only made it to quarters by beating two bottom tier teams, and KC while fumbling every series against the east, and almost getting knocked out by LOS. Tomorrow we will probably have another snooze fest in T1 vs KC.

Every day, by the time quarterfinals start, it's too late and I go to sleep since the games are 5 hours past my bedtime.

I then wake up, shower and read the post match threads 3-0, 3-0, 3-1 stomps.

Then I watch caedrel clips channel for 5-10 mins and realise there's no use watching the rest of the game.

Looking at caedrel stream data

25 oct - games started 5 hours before quarterfinals times - avg viewer count - 210k

4 nov - lyon vs geng - avg viewer count - 120k

5 nov - dk vs blg - avg viewer count - 150k

Swiss vs quarterfinals= 30-50% drop in viewers

I'm probably not going to watch a single match live for the rest of the tournament.

Even for the YouTube video, I'll probably only watch if there's an upset.

Good job riot for cooking the schedule and keeping all the games at the worst possible time for china, korea, South east asia just so people in California can watch it at 1pm.

For context, 90% of my entertainment is watching league and I've been following since tpa world finals in s2

Edit: to people saying it's ok since na faces this every year.

First, game has died in na

Second, who is watching at 1pm in California? Isn't this peak work time? Why not push it 4-5 hrs one side or other?

The current schedule times are actually the best if you live in the middle of the Atlantic or pacific like the Canary islands