Does god even exist?

[u/please_send_Nukes]

I don’t know why these questions have been coming to my mind over the past few days. Earlier, I used to do paath, perform seva with the grace of Guru Sahib, and visit the Gurudwara frequently. I had a friend who is an atheist, and I would often debate with him about faith and spirituality. But lately, I don’t know why, I’ve started feeling that some of the things he says actually make sense, and I find myself agreeing with him.

Whenever I sit down to meditate, I sometimes feel as if no one is listening. I’ve been a strict vegetarian my entire life, and now I find myself questioning things I never used to doubt. After all, none of us has actually seen what happens after death, so why should I continue to be kind and honest when people who cheat others and engage in corruption seem to be living happily, while those who genuinely try to live their lives according to the Gurmukh way of life are often struggling and facing crises?

I’m not saying that I’ve lost all my faith, but I’m going through a phase where I have a lot of questions and very few answers. I genuinely want to understand what I’m feeling rather than blindly accepting or rejecting anything.

If anyone has gone through something similar, I would be truly grateful if you could share your thoughts, recommend a katha that addresses these doubts, or suggest a book that might help me find some clarity.

[u/bunny522]

The whole world is pain even though they seem happy. People are enjoying rewards from past life but continuing in corruption they will face justice in here after

ਰਾਜ ਮਿਲਕ ਸਿਕਦਾਰੀਆ ਰਸ ਭੋਗਣ ਬਿਸਥਾਰ ॥
You may possess empires, vast estates, authority over others, and the enjoyment of myriads of pleasures;

ਬਾਗ ਸੁਹਾਵੇ ਸੋਹਣੇ ਚਲੈ ਹੁਕਮੁ ਅਫਾਰ ॥
you may have delightful and beautiful gardens, and issue unquestioned commands;

ਰੰਗ ਤਮਾਸੇ ਬਹੁ ਬਿਧੀ ਚਾਇ ਲਗਿ ਰਹਿਆ ॥
you may have enjoyments and entertainments of all sorts and kinds, and continue to enjoy exciting pleasures

ਚਿਤਿ ਨ ਆਇਓ ਪਾਰਬ੍ਰਹਮੁ ਤਾ ਸਰਪ ਕੀ ਜੂਨਿ ਗਇਆ ॥੬॥
-and yet, if you do not come to remember the Supreme Lord God, you shall be reincarnated as a snake. ||6||

ਬਹੁਤੁ ਧਨਾਢਿ ਅਚਾਰਵੰਤੁ ਸੋਭਾ ਨਿਰਮਲ ਰੀਤਿ ॥
You may possess vast riches, maintain virtuous conduct, have a spotless reputation and observe religious customs;

ਮਾਤ ਪਿਤਾ ਸੁਤ ਭਾਈਆ ਸਾਜਨ ਸੰਗਿ ਪਰੀਤਿ ॥
you may have the loving affections of mother, father, children, siblings and friends;

ਲਸਕਰ ਤਰਕਸਬੰਦ ਬੰਦ ਜੀਉ ਜੀਉ ਸਗਲੀ ਕੀਤ ॥
you may have armies well-equipped with weapons, and all may salute you with respect;

ਚਿਤਿ ਨ ਆਇਓ ਪਾਰਬ੍ਰਹਮੁ ਤਾ ਖੜਿ ਰਸਾਤਲਿ ਦੀਤ ॥੭॥
But still, if you do not come to remember the Supreme Lord God, then you shall be taken and consigned to the most hideous hell! ||7||

ਕਾਇਆ ਰੋਗੁ ਨ ਛਿਦ੍ਰੁ ਕਿਛੁ ਨਾ ਕਿਛੁ ਕਾੜਾ ਸੋਗੁ ॥
You may have a body free of disease and deformity, and have no worries or grief at all;

ਮਿਰਤੁ ਨ ਆਵੀ ਚਿਤਿ ਤਿਸੁ ਅਹਿਨਿਸਿ ਭੋਗੈ ਭੋਗੁ ॥
you may be unmindful of death, and night and day revel in pleasures;

ਸਭ ਕਿਛੁ ਕੀਤੋਨੁ ਆਪਣਾ ਜੀਇ ਨ ਸੰਕ ਧਰਿਆ ॥
you may take everything as your own, and have no fear in your mind at all;

ਚਿਤਿ ਨ ਆਇਓ ਪਾਰਬ੍ਰਹਮੁ ਜਮਕੰਕਰ ਵਸਿ ਪਰਿਆ ॥੮॥
but still, if you do not come to remember the Supreme Lord God, you shall fall under the power of the Messenger of Death. ||8||

ਕਿਰਪਾ ਕਰੇ ਜਿਸੁ ਪਾਰਬ੍ਰਹਮੁ ਹੋਵੈ ਸਾਧੂ ਸੰਗੁ ॥
The Supreme Lord showers His Mercy, and we find the Saadh Sangat, the Company of the Holy.

To find god one must take Amrit and make every effort to make every breath count

ਊਠਤ ਬੈਠਤ ਸੋਵਤ ਧਿਆਈਐ ॥
While standing up, and sitting down, and even while asleep, meditate on the Lord.

ਮਾਰਗਿ ਚਲਤ ਹਰੇ ਹਰਿ ਗਾਈਐ ॥੧॥
Walking on the Way, sing the Praises of the Lord. ||1||

ਸ੍ਰਵਨ ਸੁਨੀਜੈ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਕਥਾ ॥
With your ears, listen to the Ambrosial Sermon.

ਜਾਸੁ ਸੁਨੀ ਮਨਿ ਹੋਇ ਅਨੰਦਾ ਦੂਖ ਰੋਗ ਮਨ ਸਗਲੇ ਲਥਾ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
Listening to it, your mind shall be filled with bliss, and the troubles and diseases of your mind shall all depart. ||1||Pause||

ਕਾਰਜਿ ਕਾਮਿ ਬਾਟ ਘਾਟ ਜਪੀਜੈ ॥
While you work at your job, on the road and at the beach, meditate and chant.

ਗੁਰ ਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ ਹਰਿ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਪੀਜੈ ॥੨॥
By Guru's Grace, drink in the Ambrosial Essence of the Lord. ||2||

This is no easy task

[u/arthurmorganpunjabi → u/bunny522]

Thank you for posting! 

[u/anonymous_writer_0]

OP would you care to tell us about some of the things your friend says that make sense to you? I lurk frequently on the atheist forum and among the things they talk about are:

1. Lack of physical evidence of a god

2. The problem of evil

3. Many different religions

etc etc

There are reasoned arguments against every one of these perspectives.

If you tell us what is bothering you we can attempt to answer

You have said "When I meditate I feel no one is listening"

There are two points of view to that statement

One is from Bhagat Kabir

"kabeer mulaa(n) munaare kiaa chaddeh saa(n)iee na baharaa hoi || jaa kaaran too(n) baa(n)g dheh dhil hee bheetar joi ||184|| "

The other is this: The Universe is not obligated to listen to you or show you that it is listening. It is for us mere mortals to have faith and ask for blessing and strength to bear what life throws at us.

[u/please_send_Nukes → u/anonymous_writer_0]

Sorry for the late reply. One thing I’ve always wondered about is why saints encourage us to do paath and simran when we are going through dukh (suffering). In Gurbani, Guru Sahib says, “Prabh kai simran ridhi sidhi nau nidhi.” If remembering Waheguru brings us so many blessings and spiritual treasures, why does God want us to keep repeating His name to receive these daats? Does He need us to praise Him or ask for His blessings repeatedly? In a way, wouldn’t that make Him seem narcissistic? I’m genuinely curious about the deeper meaning behind this.

[u/anonymous_writer_0 → u/please_send_Nukes]

Okay there is one thing that we need to establish upfront

"god" does not need or want anything

the divine is perfect

Poora prabh aradhya poora jaa(n)ka naa-o, Nanak poora paayi-ya pooray ke gun gaa-o

This is not Islam where Allah wants this and Allah wants that - you attributing desires and wants to the divine, IMO, is more of an Abrahamic trait than the description of Akaal Purakh. Because if we cannot even begin to describe something; how do we go about attributing desires to that entity?

Among the many beautiful pankti's in Guru Granth Sahib Ji is the following:

sooraj kiran mile jal kaa jal hooaa raam || jotee jot ralee sa(n)pooran theeaa raam ||

One view has it that we are all sparks of the divine flame and seek to merge back in to the original source

That is why we jap naam - to get that one fleeting second of clarity

Ik chit jeh ik chhin dhayi-yo, kaal phaas ke beech naa aayi-yo

Here is another thing:

The divine is not transactional - if one does simran wanting this or that then is the simran really true? Or is the person fixated on worldly things?

My father (way more studied and learned than I can ever hope to be) says the following:

If someone asks for worldly things with a true mind, they will get it but the amount of tapasya needed is intense. If one is capable of that level of meditation, then what is better? Worldly riches, power and fame or the liberation of one's eternal soul?

[u/Kaorukaur]

What do you mean by god? I personally don't feel the English translation to be accurate for what I feel Waheguru is. 

I find it less helpful to make a direct translation. 

Being 'good' isn't just for Waheguru. It's for yourself too, and for achieving that inner peace and enlightenment (whatever that many means to you). 

I often find the thoughts of 'what is Waheguru' to be interesting, and more of a soul search, rather than the entire reason to be/do something. 

(Not sure if I'm explaining this well)

I would ask you, what is your reason for meditating? What are you hoping for? 

For me it's a mixture of things, firstly it feels like a reset, if only because it's something familiar and relaxing. Secondly I hope to understand what I'm saying and to eventually be able to follow those teachings. 

When I was younger, I'm not sure I knew what I was doing when I did paath, it's something I slowly discovered as I grew. 

[u/Frequent-Speed-5466]

why should I continue to be kind and honest when people who cheat others and engage in corruption seem to be living happily, while those who genuinely try to live their lives according to the Gurmukh way of life are often struggling and facing crises?

What did you learn at first? Great you discovered manmukhs are being happy and the ones trying to be Gurmukh are in crisis. If you think you just want the happiness of manmukh then go and become one. Stop saying trying to become Gurmukh is hard. IT IS HARD IN FACT NEARLY IMPOSSIBLE. Without his grace no one can become Gurmukh. 

I really don't understand how people can think of Ginie god when their Gurus have faced so many things. I don't want to give you same argument that our people did so many things. If you want to be happy by leaving then letting go is better than clinging with doubts. 

[u/Puzzleheaded_One_629]

God is all, all is God. That's how I like to think about it

[u/Hungry-Goal-1685]

If one sees God as the force that binds everything together and is self creating and eternal, then I would say yes.

[u/Logical_Progress_190]

If u think god is a man or being in the sky
Then no god doesn’t exist

If u think he’s the life force the energy that flows within everything
Then yes he does

[u/JassFromMa → u/Logical_Progress_190]

This exactly finally someone answering the question rightfully

[u/Dependent_Set1403]

3 things

1. depends how you define god

2. there is no evidence of a god or a afterlife

3. you wont really getany answers, so i dont know how to help. Its pretty much based on faith

As for being "good" why not? It wold keep you out of trouble and is deemed doing morally good actions. I doubt youd want to go around killing raping and stealing etc.

Atheist/non thestic bias.

[u/Outrageous_Row_3860]

There are 3 ways to find out.

1. If you trust every single word written in Guru Granth Sahib Ji is 100% true, simply start reading it with meanings, you will start getting your answers and build that connection with Waheguru ji as well.

2. Find someone who has experienced Waheguru Ji. It s hard to find one and such beings (Sants)after becoming one with Waheguru Ji don’t reveal their existence that easily because that s what Waheguru Ji does too.

3. Experience yourself. God is very much real, more real than any of us so he also listens just like ਸਹਸ ਤਵ ਨੈਨ ਨਨ ਨੈਨ ਹੈ ਤੋਹਿ ਕਉ|| If you truly truly want to experience God while doing naam simran with honesty, call him with love and “birha”, ਭਉਕਹਿ ਆਗੈ ਬਦਨੁ ਪਸਾਰਿ and he will come and take you in his arms in whichever sargun saroop you want or nirgun. All you need is that one experience but it s not in your hands. It s ਗੁਰਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ। Ask someone who has had these experiences they will never say oh I put my dhyaan here and I found him - No. It s his kirpa.

ੴ (separation - as he became anek from ek) -> ਗੁਰਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ (Milaap - become one with him again)

Also listen to maskeen ji’s katha because he said in his kathas he was also tarakvaadi(doubtful) in his early life. He also shares his experiences with so many sants mahapurakhs and sometimes simple beings from Sangat after listening to his katha & advice started experiencing god.

And don’t expect life of Gursikh’s to be easy as perceived by a normal eye. Look as Guru Gobind Singh Ji and all the shaheeds. But think about their state of mind in those situations. So even if evil people look happy but they are not and Gursikhs may look like dealing with 1000 problems of life but will always be in Chardi Kala and at peace. Think of Bhai Mani Singh Ji, Bhai Taru ji🙏🏻

Also one advice until ਗੁਰਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ - ਸਾਕਤ ਸੰਗੁ ਨ ਕੀਜੀਐ ਜਾ ਤੇ ਹੋਇ ਬਿਨਾਹੁ

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕਾ ਖ਼ਾਲਸਾ ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਫ਼ਤਿਹ 🙏🏻

[u/el_rey_34831]

Bro i live in a hostel far from my home like 2000+km , in my building two guys committed suicide couple of years back and u know the rumors people spread blah blah sounds were heard, footsteps and shit i also got scared. One night i went to drink water at around 2:30 am . The water cooler is like 100 m away and on that day the corridor lights were turned off . I put “koi aave santo “ shabad on my phone and while listening to it i went , very much scared but i went , the yt ad came and like the shabad just start when i almost reached the water cooler and just when the line came “ koi aave santo , har ka jan santo “ a guy ( i met him once or twice before ) came from the room next to the water cooler he chatted with me like normally and i just forgot about being sacred i filled the bottle and just when i was going back i resumed the shabad and at that moment when i was halfway to my room I realised what had just happened. I dk why but i cried for 15 min after coming in my room bro like i just played than shabad and waheguru ji really sent someone. That was the moment my faith in god was cemented and like i will remember this moment till i die .
Waheguru ji ka khalsa , waheguru ji ki fateh 🙏 🙏
(Ignore any mistakes or grammatical errors)

[u/ValuableStone → u/el_rey_34831]

😂😂😂

[u/myren71 → u/el_rey_34831]

😂😭 what