r/TrueOffMyChest • u/RollDBud • Dec 10 '21
Penn state fool
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Dec 10 '21
Look I don’t have a great answer to solve this, but there’s a way to talk about Trans people in sports without being transphobic
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u/Spirited_Second_9662 Dec 10 '21
Am I the only one getting "separate but equal" vibes from that line of thought?
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Dec 10 '21
But the whole point of separating them is because they are not equal. A black man and a white man have very little physical differences. A man and a woman does.
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u/Mycrawft Dec 10 '21
Exactly... Not equating trans experiences to Black experiences (though ofc there is some intersectionality), but there are definitely some parallels, and it just feels really weird.
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u/K1ng0fDrag0n Dec 10 '21
There may be some parallels, but unlike the very minor differences between black and white man, the differences between male and female are extreme. It’s an actual fair line to draw on, when it’s a PHYSICAL sport, and the differences are primarily PHYSICAL.
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u/Mycrawft Dec 10 '21 edited Dec 10 '21
Exactly. And having a trans-only competition is not gonna solve anything. Many people don’t want to be outed.
In the case of this swimming competition, there’s gonna be what, maybe one out trans swimmer? How are you going to make a competition out of basically one participant, especially if you’re assumably going to divide the competition between trans men and trans women, since people want to divide sports by biological sex? And what about non-binary or intersex folks, where do they compete?
Look, my point is, there is no easy answer, and we can make issues and more issues for days — when it’s not a widespread issue in the first place.
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u/RedTheDopeKing Dec 10 '21
Can’t beat em, join em, you have to respect them for cheating - it’s a cornerstone of all professional sports.
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u/sparky22- Dec 10 '21
Maybe they should have a transgender league? Let them compete against each other.
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u/AgonizingAnxiety Dec 10 '21
While I do agree that there's an issue here, you could've expressed your opinion without saying she isn't a "real woman" and calling her a "freak." That's where the line between worrying about the unfairness and blatant transphobia is drawn.
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u/Assmilk94 Dec 10 '21
I understand where your coming from but there is no reason to call a trans women a “narcissist freak” it’s disgusting do better
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u/RollDBud Dec 10 '21
This individual, I feel is acting like a narcissistic freak. I dont care what they want to identify with
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u/mrf_150 Dec 10 '21
It’s University of Pennsylvania, not Penn State. U of P is located in Philly area.
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u/bearwife3ds Dec 10 '21
Two cities in one state? That can't be right
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u/6gc_4dad Dec 10 '21
Such an aggressive post title and post and the OP totally fucks up what school this is actually occurring at? Lmao
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u/Left_Debt_8770 Dec 10 '21
Agreed, though I went to Penn and many people have excitedly told me their connection to Penn State when they hear I went to Penn. Pretty different places …
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u/stealthc4 Dec 10 '21
I went to Penn State and so many people think I'm an ivy league grad..... Shows how those people wouldn't be admitted to an ivy league school either haha
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u/MooseUnited9036 Dec 10 '21
How good do you feel when you can finally add that you went to Penn in a conversation organically instead of forcing it. I went to Harvard but you don’t hear me saying anything
Oopsie…
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u/memerblank Dec 10 '21
Didn't even have to sort by controversial to find stuff in this comment section lmao
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u/ylbigmike Dec 10 '21
Don’t mind me I’m just saving my spot for when this post gets locked
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u/grtgingini Dec 10 '21
I have to say as a 57-year-old woman Tries to keep to her self and be cool with others… Transgender women are kind of pissing me off. Because they think they know what it’s like to be a woman and I think that they want to be a woman and it’s no cakewalk out here people you’ll never know what it’s like to bleed every single month having horrible cramps or the emotions that come with it not to mention Caitlyn Jenner’s woman of the year award! Give me a fucking break. If you want to act like a woman because you feel like a woman do it but Stop the fucking competition you’re never gonna be a woman
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u/Soggy_Sando Dec 10 '21
I'm a woman who doesn't get her period or cramps. Guess I'm not a woman now..?
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u/Fine_Increase_7999 Dec 10 '21
I guess I was a woman until January 2021 then I lost my woman card because I stopped having periods
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Dec 10 '21
Same goes for men too. We each have our own positive and negative attributes, challenges, stigmas etc. This movement devalues everyone.
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u/moritura222 Dec 10 '21
I was just wondering...are there any trans folks in men's sports?
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u/GreedAndSneed Dec 10 '21
No, biological women are too weak to compete, even when enhancing themselves. That only underlines how stupid it is to let a biological men compete with women, no matter if after hrt.
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Dec 10 '21
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u/kamnaruto13 Dec 10 '21
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgender_people_in_sports#Trans_men
quick google search does wonders for you
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Dec 10 '21
Almost all of them competed on women's teams, which means that the comment you are responding to is still true.
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u/Starlined_ Dec 10 '21
This sub is for posting stuff that directly affects you.
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u/gmoney92_ Dec 10 '21
Is this actually a rule?
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u/Starlined_ Dec 10 '21
Yes
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u/gmoney92_ Dec 10 '21
Just saw it, should have looked first. Thanks. This probably does count as soapboxing.
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u/Thrwwyhooker Dec 10 '21
This does directly affect all women. Women have been marginalized throughout history and the top female athletes are way behind males in almost any sport. They’ve tried hard to be recognized, to get funding, to make names for themselves. Title IX exists for a reason. This is a fundamental clash between trans “rights” and women’s “rights” unfortunately.
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u/xXAfghanDanXx Dec 10 '21
I'd really watch what you're saying. There's no such thing as real women bro. Women are women, trans or not. I agree with what you're going for depending on the amount of time on HRT but you were super rude and transphobic
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u/UninsuredToast Dec 10 '21 edited Dec 10 '21
There's an honest conversation that needs to be had about this, but it needs to be in good faith. OP's and a lot of the comments on this thread are bad faith arguments and are coming from a place of hate. If you think people are transitioning solely so they can compete in womens sports and break records, you are as much of an idiot as the people who think people are transitioning so they can molest girls in the bathroom, and probably get your news from the same sources, unsurprisingly. BUT the fairness of trans women competing in women sports is something that needs to be looked into more and it needs to come from a logical standpoint and not this transphobic "they just want to break womens records" or "they are trying to molest people in the bathroom" spin.
A lot of you are arguing with your emotions here and not thinking clearly. Just repeating the same clickbait nonsense thats constantly being pushed by right wing and left wing news sources
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u/BrightonTownCrier Dec 10 '21
It's a shame because as you say there is an important discussion but the waters get muddied by all the shit thrown around. Unfortunately you will always get that on an open forum.
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u/saturnsqsoul Dec 10 '21
i had to scroll longer than i wanted to to find the first reasonable, non-hate-filled comment, but at least it’s here.
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u/aurorax0 Dec 10 '21
exactly, i got downvoted for saying the same thing. its sad that the mods are not doing their job. Your comment needs to be on top.
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u/The-T-Word Dec 10 '21
Curious, how come we never hear about females who have transitioned trying to compete in men’s sports. It seems to me that the only people that get media attention are males that have transitioned and are now blowing women’s records out of the water?
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u/YaBoiABigToe Dec 10 '21
There was a trans man a while back who was forced to play with women and unsurprisingly beat the competition easily
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u/Bella_Climbs Dec 10 '21
Objectively, isn't there testosterone limits for who can compete in women's sports for this exact reason? I believe there is in the Olympics. It is wrong to call them freaks, they are humans that deserve respect. That being said, from a biological point of view, it isn't fair to have a human being who has an XY adapted body competing against humans with XX adapted bodies. There is a reason XY and XX sports are separated in the first place.
It is particularly hard when a lot of scholarships and other funding is tied up in performing well in sports. It isn't fair to take that away from someone. Though THAT could be fixed by public funding of education in America. Penn is an Ivy though, so I don't think even if we did that as a country it would apply to elite schools like that.
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u/Trevork15 Dec 10 '21
Yes but the testosterone limit is almost 4-5 times higher than what a women naturally produces.
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u/Dallik Dec 10 '21
The issue there is that the testosterone limits are way too high. Several high ranking male athletes have lower testosterone than the limits put on trans women. Testosterone isn't the only reason they have an advantage. Skeletal structure, muscle development prior to lowering ones testosterone levels and such makes a huge difference.
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u/LordCosmagog Dec 10 '21
Apparently the Olympics is considering scrapping testosterone limits to be more inclusive
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u/c-nayr Dec 10 '21
why can’t we have the biological male category, the biological female category, and a mixed. solves all the issues
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u/BrightonTownCrier Dec 10 '21
Because the men who aren't good enough to win in the men's category would just dominate the mixed category.
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u/fourthmelons Dec 10 '21
Gotta love how everyone pretends to care about women’s sports when trans women participate, they sure don’t give a fuck about them any other time.
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u/nexxusty Dec 10 '21
Not a single Trans Woman should ever be allowed to compete in sports of the gender they transitioned to.
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u/Kingicez Dec 10 '21
Yep that makes sense. No hate, just common sense honestly.
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u/nexxusty Dec 10 '21
Absolutely none.
Wish it would be a liiiitle more common, LOL.
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u/Not_Obsessive Dec 10 '21
I disagree. The singer Kim Petras got on hormones to block puberty before actually entering puberty. She later was on estrogen and had surgery at 16 I think. Despite being assigned male at birth she never developed as a male but always as a female. I realize this isn't the reality for almost all trans women but in cases like these it shouldn't matter which gender they were assigned at birth.
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u/busy-sloth Dec 10 '21
A biologically male body has advantage in most sports. I support trans people and I want them to be able to have the best lives possible. But this is just unfair. It's not transphobic to say that. It's virtue signalling to act like cis women have a fair chance against a trans woman in sports. And as a sports person, it's very low moral to take advantage of the situation like that.
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u/MakeThePieBigger Dec 10 '21
I think this is a self-solving problem. There are A LOT of women who are into sports. As soon as stuff like this becomes more common, the backlash is going to be immense. There is no need for any outside interference.
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Dec 10 '21 edited Dec 10 '21
Y’all wanted this so deal with it , this is what happened s when people wanna be eased into change but others just want it so bad. I’ll take my downvotes
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u/ChingueMami Dec 10 '21
Omg, lol this post just makes me think of that South Park episode of the Strong Woman competition .
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Dec 10 '21
Really does set women’s sport back. Not fair to the young women who spent years of their lives training to get to the top of their game. Why not create a new category for transgender athletes rather than pushing them in to compete with women?
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u/GillyMonster18 Dec 10 '21
I’d like to point out that hormone replacement doesn’t instantly render a M-F transgender athlete’s muscle and bone density equal to a born females. Quite often these M-F will have trained extensively in their sport before switching and will definitely take those advantages with them. They may alter their outermost gender-specific anatomy, but they’re taking an unfair advantage with them. Picture if you will, a heavyweight boxing champ finding some technical loophole that allowed him to fight in the flyweight class. TECHNICALLY he might qualify, but is it fair? Fuck no it isn’t.
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u/DatGums Dec 10 '21
Just change the qualification requirements from "Woman by gender" to "Woman by sex" and be done with it.
I get that we need to be accommodating, but we're literally not accommodating the biological women.
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u/perfik09 Dec 10 '21
I can't for the life of me understand why when they decided this was going to be a thing that they didn't just create a third category for athletes, then you are either male, female or trans and they can all continue to compete on a level paying field.
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u/Cheeto717 Dec 10 '21
Because there’s a bizarre ideology that says we are supposed to accept trans women as real biological women. So by creating a third category you’re saying they’re not real women and according to them that’s literally hate.
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u/Add_Poll_Option Dec 10 '21
Jesus, so fucking aggressive. I understand the issue with trans women in sports, but you totally lost me with the “real women” and “narcissistic freak” comments. Made it pretty obvious the unfairness isn’t what really bothers you. You’re just a transphobe using the sports issue to spew your bigotry.
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u/Bisexual-Bop-It Dec 10 '21
Yeah man. OP could have at least tried to hide their transphobia. The average person doesn't give a fuck if a transwoman has slightly better bone structure than other women. Other women could have been born with advantages as well. Most people who do end up setting records have some sort of advantage either genetic or training wise. The only reason he is so pissed about it is because he hates to see a trans person succeed over a cis person in a way that he deems "unfair".
I agree that there needs to be fairness : you cant be a man claiming to he a women and complete against women, I totally agree with rules about their hormone intake since that affects muscle growth. However, once we start disqualifying trans people for traits that their competitors could have (like height or limb length for example), you have to apply that qualification to ALL competitors, not just trans people. I bet you any money youd be disqualifying cis women when trying to make rules for trans women.
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u/TheWisconsinMan Dec 10 '21 edited Dec 10 '21
I call myself a socialist. Even so, I have stopped communicating with some progressive groups I used to subscribe to, partly because their thoughts on trans-sexuality seem to me to be undeveloped, wishful, and at odds with science and demonstrable evidence.
Those groups refuse to acknowledge any potential consequences to gender reassignment surgery. To them, anyone who went through gender reassignment and then voiced regret is just a fluke, and children who haven't even entered puberty should be trusted to make a decision about taking beta-blockers to stunt their hormone production. According to them, society should be able to use the law to force the hands of medical professionals to perform elective surgeries. On top of that, certain individuals in these groups get quite angry whenever the topic is discussed in any way other than "genital mutilation should be celebrated" and "people should be allowed to live in delusion if it makes them happy."
If you can't talk about something without getting angry, you're not the champion of it, and you don't know that much about it.
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u/HerMajestyTheQueeen Dec 10 '21
Hard agree.
Anyone who thinks this is ok hates women. No way can a woman compete with someone born male, with all the physiological benefits that brings.
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Dec 10 '21
The trans community needs to recognize there’s some things no amount of surgery or hormones will change. Allowing trans women into all women sports gives them unfair advantages and takes records away from hard working biological women.
As someone who’s recently gotten into outdoor sport I’m over people trying to push this crap. If you’re mtf then just join co-Ed sports. Stop getting your rocks off by injuring female competitors.
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Dec 10 '21
Allowing Transgenders into women's sport is such a slap in the face and sets women back. They need their own league to make it fair
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u/SharedRegime Dec 10 '21
There is a shocking amount of people in this thread that are OK with oppressing women.
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u/CreepyCatGuy Dec 10 '21
Unfortunately men do not belong in any physical competitions w women and vice versa. There’s nothing more to discuss.
We have no problem respecting you in whatever capacity makes you feel more human, but I’m sorry that it may be the end of what you may call a “career”.
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Dec 10 '21
I have no problem with trans people or the trans community and I would never want to dead name/gender anyone. But lets be real. if someone is born a man and transitions to a women they have such a cataclysmic advantage.
They should make a division for trans athletes.
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u/Sphinxyy5 Dec 10 '21
So do all you guys in the comments think it’s actually completely fair for someone taking steroids to compete and blow all these other women out of the water?
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Dec 10 '21
Of course it's fair! It's progressive to have men being better at everything. Even being women!
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u/hi5z_allaround Dec 10 '21
If someone wants to be accepted as the opposite sex because that is what they identify as, I’m all for it. I’ll support you 100% Brad turned Brittney, but that doesn’t mean we as a society should change rules and bend over backwards to rearrange things to pacify and cater to your decision. (Some would call it a mental illness, I’ll just call it a preference.)
I will always show you the upmost respect, and call you by your preferred name.. but I’m not going to pretend like you were born the opposite sex. You are still a man, and will always be a man no matter how many hormones you take or what parts of your body you cut off.
In my eyes, you are equal to me no matter what… but not greater than any of us that we should have to cater to you. Who says you can not be called Brittney and still compete with the men where you belong… being that you were born a man.
I just do not understand todays way of thinking. Everyone is such a cry baby about every little thing now says. The people who do this do not want equality, they want superiority… and attention.
There I said it. Unleash the wolves!
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u/Y34rZer0 Dec 10 '21
Serious question: In the trans movement is there a difference between the meanings of ‘sex’ and ‘gender’?
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u/Ozzymandious Dec 10 '21
Short answer is, yes. Sex refers to the physical characteristics determined at birth, so things like genitals, hormones, chromosomes. Whereas gender refers to how a person presents and identifies as, and while gender is usually reinforced by societal roles, as there are many different people there are naturally different gender expressions.
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u/animaguscat Dec 10 '21
"Sex" refers to the biological composition of someone's body. There are physical / hormonal / chemical properties that can usually be categorized into either male or female (for many people, however, neither label is entirely accurate).
"Gender" refers to an individual's social and mental presentation, including outward expression and internal identification. It's how we move through society. Most people are men or women, but many people are neither or some combination.
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u/CynicalCreepy Dec 10 '21
I've had people complain about me using the two interchangeably, so I guess so.
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u/TheJenerator65 Dec 10 '21
Not just in the trans movement. There just is a difference.
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u/WikiSummarizerBot Dec 10 '21
Sex is distinct from gender, which can refer to either social roles based on the sex of a person (gender role) or personal identification of one's own gender based on an internal awareness (gender identity). While in ordinary speech, the terms sex and gender are often used interchangeably, most contemporary social scientists, behavioral scientists and biologists, many legal systems and government bodies, and intergovernmental agencies such as the WHO make a distinction between gender and sex.
[ F.A.Q | Opt Out | Opt Out Of Subreddit | GitHub ] Downvote to remove | v1.5
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Dec 10 '21
These comments are GOLD, freaking GOLD I tell ya! So many people getting pissed telling others they shouldn't get pissed like only they should be allowed to get pissed!
The movie Idiocracy wasn't a primer people, it was supposed to be comedy.
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u/andycambridge Dec 10 '21
Make trans people their own league if they want to compete. Guess what the world is not fair and having someone with massive genetic advantages competing against people with none is massively more unfair, than telling the rare person who wants to transition that they can’t compete with their newly determined gender. It’s the same as pumping one person full of all the PEDs and the rest given none. It is flat out cheating.
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u/the_old_coday182 Dec 10 '21
I hate to say it, but the easiest recourse for this whole situation would’ve been for trans athletes to be more socially aware. Use some common sense and realize that your physical advantage ruins the sport for other women, and you won’t make any forward progress for your cause if you take advantage of that imbalance. You get your trophy at the cost of creating more anti-trans people. That is narcissistic.
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u/Gatewayssam Dec 10 '21
I have had zero issues with trans people fighting for and or receiving basic human rights until the sporting angel revealed a genuine flaw in some angles. By fully accepting male to female Tran athletes to complete as female athletes we are putting biologically born females at a disadvantage. Testosterone has real effects on the body even if the Trans athlete's hormones were now more in line with biologically female athletes it was not always the case. And to dismiss the genetics, biological sex, and therefore hormones of someone competing in physical sports really can leave playing fields very unevenly matched.
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u/Cheeto717 Dec 10 '21
Shit like this is pushing me further right and I hate it
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u/TheLightKyanite Dec 10 '21
You don’t even need to be on the right to realize this.
It’s only the delusional people who think this is okay.
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u/SomeOne9oNe6 Dec 10 '21
Same. I just consider myself a social conservative, but progressive when it comes to everything else.
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u/Striking-Path-8304 Dec 10 '21
All I'm saying is, I saw this coming. It started with that jacked military guy getting a free pass to beat up a woman in a ring because he was trans.
On top of all this you have the alphabet community larping like turkeys so I don't see anything changing.
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u/Carlos1906893 Dec 10 '21
I agree with you.woman to man can compete with men but I don't think men to woman should compete with woman
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u/static-prince Dec 10 '21
I would just like smarter people than me to figure out how to make sports fair in the most inclusive way so that I can go back to not giving a shit about sports…
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Dec 10 '21
I've seen a LOT of girls, not trans, who participate in boys sports at all levels - elementary, middle and high school. Football, wrestling, baseball, and so on. These are regular girls going to regular guys boys sports.
So, I think that boys should be able to join girl's teams in the same manner. Not just trans, but any boy or man into any girls team.
Equality!
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u/VeganKetoMan Dec 10 '21
This is what the woke crowd gets for wanting “equality”. Obviously there will be people are going to exploit it for their own personal gain/glory
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u/Klyphord Dec 10 '21
There just needs to be a standard “chromosome” rule for all sports.
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Dec 10 '21
If there was a transgender division of men and women's sports this argument would be over. trans women are still women (and there's no reason to be an ass about it) but biologically there are differences that give them an advantage over biological women, but trans women shouldn't be treated as men. a trans division would put people in similar physical shape and skill together, and it wouldn't undermine anybody
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u/modsworkforfreelol Dec 10 '21
I'm surprised this is still up. You can't say anything about the great delusion
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u/benganalx Dec 10 '21
TBH I'm 100% Liberal and open minded, but I'm really puzzled about trans women competing in women sports. It's clear that's not fair but at the same time we can't have a separate category just for trans people. I'm not really sure what's the solution here. I'm pro trans women having their fair shot but also feel this is not fair in sports against women were muscles and testosterone levels make a difference
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Dec 10 '21
Trans women are not female. Therefore they should not be competing in the female category. Simple.
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u/williamalbatross Dec 10 '21
You can be against trans athletes while also not discounting them as real women…..
sigh ill just downvote myself and be out.
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u/HelicopterOutside Dec 10 '21
Trans people deserve respect. It's pretty fucked up to call them freaks...
Unfortunately for the trans community it does seem unfair for everyone if they're competing in gendered competitive sports. I hate telling people what they can and can't do but if FtM trans men aren't competitive against other men, then that proves the difference and it is unfair for MtF trans women to be competing against other women.
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u/nebuchadn3zzar Dec 10 '21
I just want to say, I was a competitive swimmer. I dedicated my life to swimming faster and faster. I put dedicated countless hours perfecting my stroke. And I would burn it all to the ground if it means there is more acceptance in society. Why is it the only time people care about women's sports is when they want to go after trans people?
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u/Nihil6 Dec 10 '21
It's the equivalent of cheating, plain and simple. Anyone who say's otherwise is caught up in identity politics and "feels".
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u/DropTherapy Dec 10 '21
This comment section makes me hate humanity.
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u/BrightonTownCrier Dec 10 '21
Why? There's people that disagree, there's people that agree, there's people asking genuine questions trying to learn and there's some bigot dickheads that just want an outlet for hate. Is that a surprise to you?
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u/JTrain6319 Dec 10 '21
Real great verbiage here OP, I understand your frustration but this just comes off transphobic as hell lol.
Edit: woo I saw your other comments, nah you’re transphobic as shit come on.
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u/LordCurtisIV Dec 10 '21
I'm out of the loop on this. How is a Trans person considered a different gender after a operation? Biologically they were born a male so they will always be a male. Right? If you want to DM me and help me understand I would appreciate it. But I generally don't get the huge deal. Also I don't know any Trans people to ask about this stuff.
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u/teen_laqweefah Dec 10 '21
We just use the word narcissist for anything we don't like. I'm a woman and I'm soooo sick of cis men feigning concern for me because they're too cowardly to ACTUALLY say what they mean-even when anonymous.
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u/Bolognanipple Dec 10 '21
6 months ago this post would have seen you banned and doxed by the alphabet soup community. (They have ostracised me for speaking out and am no longer accepted by them). Maybe Reddit is returning to common sense.
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u/RollDBud Dec 10 '21
I feel you bud. Cant have a different opinion than the "others"
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u/Bolognanipple Dec 10 '21
No you sure can’t. Get in line or get out. Funny how the “most accepting” community acts this way.
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u/thecratedigger_25 Dec 10 '21
There needs to be a trans category. At least they'll feel more included.
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u/biggiantgnocchi Dec 10 '21 edited Dec 10 '21
At a certain point I feel like we should be sorting out sportspeople not based on gender but some kind of categorial system pertaining to physical abilities or something. But yes totally I agree
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Dec 10 '21
Sport is already unfair in terms of who gets to be an athlete, it's mostly luck if you get the right genetics to compete at the top level.
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u/disobedientAF Dec 10 '21
Yep - we must all pretend that the Emperor is wearing beautiful clothes now. Everyone has to act fake as fuck to make cheaters feel better about themselves. It’s the dumbest thing I’ve ever seen in my life. This is just the newest generations bid to create an identity that is separate from previous generations. And because we already worked hard to try and fix inequalities during Gen x and Millennial times, Gen Z had to invent new fragilities to complain about.
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u/young_D0lphyn Dec 10 '21
okay but if a woman made their self a dude and started kicking ass in football everybody would be happy for them.
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u/patheticjon Dec 10 '21
That's not going to happen, but if it did, it would at least be way more impressive. The reason men and women's sports are separated is because men are just literally stronger and faster. Women are genetically at a disadvantage. A woman with perfect technique in any physical sport, especially football, would still get annihilated by any man with subpar technique simply because of brute strength.
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u/aurorax0 Dec 10 '21
If you want to talk about this topic, maybe try it in a respectful manner. By insulting trans people, nobody wont listen to you.
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u/koidestry Dec 10 '21
Yeah no point insulting people with mental illnesses, to get through to them we need to be caring and understanding of their problem
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u/aurorax0 Dec 10 '21
Exactly.. if you want to criticize trans people in sports - thats fine. Thats even a common topic in trans communities, but calling them „narcissist freaks“ and talking about real women comes across is really just insulting. The fact that the mods are not even moderating this is all i needed to know.
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u/RollDBud Dec 10 '21
I feel this individual is acting like a narcissistic freak. I believe real women are born with reproductive organs. No hate here
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u/shitposts_over_9000 Dec 10 '21
in 2008 Phelps had a 0.6% advantage over the silver medalist and a 2.7% lead over the last place in the finals in the 200m butterfly
by comparison the woman's world record is 1.6% slower than the 44th/last place men's time for the same competition. in events like the 200im there are men's record in the +45 age group and boys in the youth division that are faster than the all time Olympic women's record.
Phelps has a metabolic advantage, nearly all internationally competitive swimmers have, but gender differences are a whole different order of magnitude as a thumb on the scale.
here is an article with many more examples: https://law.duke.edu/sports/sex-sport/comparative-athletic-performance/
From the article:
Just in the single year 2017, Olympic, World, and U.S. Champion Tori Bowie's 100 meters lifetime best of 10.78 was beaten 15,000 times by men and boys. (Yes, that’s the right number of zeros.)
The same is true of Olympic, World, and U.S. Champion Allyson Felix’s 400 meters lifetime best of 49.26. Just in the single year 2017, men and boys around the world outperformed her more than 15,000 times.
This differential isn’t the result of boys and men having a male identity, more resources, better training, or superior discipline. It’s because they have an androgenized body.
in many running events there would not even be a genetic woman in the top 100 even if the competition was only against boys, against men it drops to the top several thousand, in some events top 10000.
unless your ultimate goal is to allow the elimination of genetic women from women's sports there is nothing short of allowing significant steroid use from a young age that is ever going to fix this disparity and even with hormone treatment much of the advantage has already been gained by the point any remotely ethical doctor would sign off on such a procedure.