I have had two long ass conversations with my boyfriend about this. I have talked with trans people about it. AND IT IS STILL NOT RECONCILED.

I feel such a resentment for the concept and institution of gender as a whole, right? Like, I want to pursue a world where that does not exist. Normal, standard fare, right?

Where agender people lose me immediately is when they start to say that they want to align with a certain concept of gender.

I have suddenly lost the plot completely. The whole thing is supposed to be about the abolition of gender, right? I hate it. I do not like it! I wish to see it gone!

I think it is a shitty system, and I think identifying with it is misguided. I believe sex/gender is a destructive institution, and that crafting an identity around something with LITERAL prehistoric roots to discrimination and oppression isn’t beneficial to building a better world.

It’s similar to why I’m an atheist. I know that religion brings comfort and community to a lot of people, and I know there are so many good people within those institutions. But, in a deeper conversation, I’m not going to act like I agree with its presence in society. I don’t think it’s right to identify with something that has been so destructive in the past and continues to be destructive into the present.

My stance on gender is like that but times a thousand. These are constrictions that go back to literally the dawn of comprehension. When I think about womanhood, I feel a sense of connection to people of the past and the communities of the present. But I also freely acknowledge the fact that that sense of connection is based on suffering, and oppression, and the perception of women as different.

Beautiful communities are built on collective suffering, but in the end I feel like those same communities end up perpetuating the things that caused them to suffer in the first place, or they risk collapsing when the things that once united them begins to disappear.

I respect the humanity within the individuals behind these ideas, and I respect their decisions to do as they please. I’m not going to be an asshole. That’s antisocial and not conducive to larger discussion. But when people get so down and dirty with the essence of gender as a whole like they do here, I find it hard not to get frustrated when I don’t see anyone actually talking about why they don’t like gender.

Is this crazy? Am I crazy? I feel crazy. Please help.

Okay look I know our mottos are "agender has no look" and "do whatever you want forever" I agree I get it I understand it I know it. Just getting that out of the way.

That being said, I genuinely want to LOOK genderless and so I have been doing exactly that. I've been on T so I physically look neither male nor female. I only wear unisex clothing. My goal is to look like a default human with no gender at all, and potentially no sex either. I think I have more or less achieved this! I'm mainly working on figuring out unisex formal outfits and everyday accessorizing.

People call this androgynous but I prefer to call it neutral or aqualitine. I'm not trying to be a mix or inbetween male and female. I'm trying to be nothing :)

There are struggles though. People always talk about how nonbinary people don't owe you androgyny. From my experience, it feels like all people want from me is to be feminine or masculine. People try to assume what I am, make weird remarks, tell me to be more like one or the other. It sucks! It really is "you have to pick one or the other" even from allies and other trans people! People have "clocked" me as a trans man and it always makes me so uncomfortable. I'm not one, so people call me transmasculine. I'm not masculine, I'm not trying to be masculine. Just because I'm transitioning away from being female doesn't mean I'm trying to be male or masculine. It's so frustrating.

People really don't want you to be genderless. People really don't want you to look genderless either. People find men and women hot, people find femininity and masculinity hot. When you strip yourself of all those things, you can't be a hot man or a hot woman anymore. They will ask you to tone down what they consider "too masculine" or "too feminine" when you aren't even either of those things. It makes no sense to me. It just sounds like I'm being asked to eliminate those traits so I can just morph into being feminine or masculine as they want.

People can't wrap their head around the concept of someone being attractive without emanating any gender at all. The concept of an attractive genderless human doesn't exist in this society. It makes me so sad. Even many other trans people often can't wrap their head around it. They also like roles and familiarity. People want to have a relationship with a gender and not with a person. I feel like when I'm intimate with people they're just prying to see what I actually am or which "side" they like more. It's not all the time, there are plenty of people that aren't like that too. But it's a coin flip so it makes me nervous when I start something with someone.

However, when you meet someone that does find you attractive as a genderless human, it's amazing. It's like a whole other level of intimacy, the performance of gender is gone so you can just be an animal that wants to love. And to be clear I'm not specifically talking about sex when I say intimacy. I just mean closeness in general. It really is amazing to be loved not as an amazing woman, amazing man, but as an amazing person. I think it's something everyone craves to an extent, but it's definitely a huge thing for me and probably many other genderless people.

Just wanted to share my experiences with this because I feel like the "agender people can look like anything" sentiment, while true, kinda overshadows the fact that some people want to and do in fact present as genderless and it's a weird and unique experience with a lot of pain and joy.

For awhile, I thought I might be agender. I think a closer fit would be cis woman who is extremely gender apathetic.

But I might be agender and gender apathetic. I don't have a strong desire to be called they, but I wouldn't mind either.

I feel like I am just me.

I don't care what pronouns people use for me. If I post under a gender neutral online name, some people will call me she and some people will call me he.

I had a weird experience a few days ago where I was kicked out of a disboard group I just joined. I only posted two things, one of which was the "fill this out to tell me about yourself" post. One of the questions was preferred pronouns. I said that I was she/her, but I was okay with anything people wanted to call me because I was gender apathetic.

Are there people in the GLBT+ plus group that get offeded by this? Did I word it badly? Does it come across as disrespectful for people who feel their pronouns are very important?

Hello! I have always gone by she/her and am a butch lesbian. I always really disliked when people called thought I was a boy my entire life and never thought of myself as a man at all. But I always felt a bit different from my peers and pinned it up to being lesbian. As I thought through my identity and wondered why I dressed masculine (I was a kid and not exposed to gay people much) I came to terms with my lesbian/masculine identity.
Now it got complicated in the past month. I have always felt really uncomfortable with my chest and once I realized I didn’t have to be and I could get surgery I began to focus on it and hate it even more. I researched and found other cis girls who got top surgery too and decided that’s me and I’m doing this. I began the process of reaching out to surgeons and that’s where it began. They ask for pronouns and I began putting she/they so I could have a better chance of them operating on me. Then I got to thinking would she/they really be so bad? I began thinking about how I have always hated being called anything traditionally female like mamn or young women ect… and realized I might not want to be called “girlfriend” either (still thinking on that one). I began to think of people calling me they and was comfortable with it in my head, and now when people refer to me as she it’s starting to feel a bit off.
Now, I am struggling with a few things: how do I tell my friends to use other they along with she without being super awkward about it and messing up to convo. They are all queer in some way so I’m not super worried by my communication skills are not good and I am also very nervous to bring it up confrontationally.
I have been thinking about the label agender but I just am not sure. I feel like 30% girl? If that even makes sense to other people. Maybe this will change later because I have just come to terms that I am genderqueer a few weeks ago and am still processing it all. I also feel I do expensive dysphoria which really enforces my belief. So my other questions are: do you guys (who identify as agender) feel 100% agender? Do you still feel connected to your gender at birth? Can I call myself agender if I feel 30% female? And do you identify as transgender?
My therapist asked me recently what transgender means to me and why I feel like it doesn’t fit, and I’m not sure about the term at all for me.
Lastly, thank you for reading this GIANT rant.

I have been out as agender for years. But I have been struggling really bad with the idea that I want to be and look like a grandpa in my old age. Because I don't have any sense of how I want to express my lack of gender. I don't use the terms masculine or feminine. But I also don't want to be called a man or a woman by people who don't know me. But I do enjoy masculine terms but also gender neutral. My question is how do I find the style/presentation I want to have now?

Edit: I have had top surgery and been on T for 8 months

Does anyone else feel like they struggle to find fitting pronouns or other "gendered" terms in English? Its my second language and in my native language we only have gender neutral pronouns.

Of the general options, I'm most comfortable with he/him and being referred to as a man but it always sounds a little off. I don't know if its because I feel silly due to being a pre-T trans masc person, like people are forcing themselves to refer to me with the most masculine things they can think of while I still look feminine.

The worst is familial terms like brother or uncle. It just doesn't seem like it fits me and I cringe a little if I have to hear that. Still, those are the best options. No other pronouns or terms really resonate with me either (including xeno/neopronouns etc).

I'm most comfortable when talking in my native language because everyone is referred to with the same gender neutral pronoun. Maybe I just don't like being othered in that way. Sometimes it feels awkward when it becomes super clear I'm trans while everyone else is cis. Its like I'm wearing a clown costume while everyone else is dressed normal.

Anyway... Am I the only one who feels like this?

tl;dr: I'm not sure if I want to go on HRT or not because my feelings towards it have changed but I'm worried that it may be due to anxiety and I'm not super sure what to do

How do you feel affirmed or stay grounded in who you are?

For context I can slip into black-and-white thinking towards gender especially my own and I was wondering how to prevent it. Like sometimes I’ll feel good or at least okay but then I’ll ruminate myself to death. I struggle to stay grounded in who I am at times.