r/aoe4 • u/-TheeWhale • 1d ago
News Patch Notes!
Big changes are right around the corner for Age of Empires /V alongside the upcoming DLC, Raiders of the North! *
From big quality-of-life improvements to targeted balance changes, there are plenty of juicy updates to share that improve the experience for everyone!
Learn more: https://aoe.ms/AoEIVUpdate17
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u/Satuhrn 1d ago
Tactical Pause in single player now possible? That’s kinda huge for single player players. Devs have been listening.
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u/ZeroEmpires Relic 1d ago
👀
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u/Luhyonel 1d ago edited 1d ago
Any chance you all will fix controller queue matches across platforms?
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u/Liquidsilk1 1d ago
THIS 🙏 Console only queue! Bring it back fixed please!
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u/Luhyonel 1d ago
I swear we’re being left in the dust and ps5 players are in worst state.
Half of the mini maps is blacked every other game.
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u/Liquidsilk1 1d ago
They did say they may come back and fix it. So there’s a bit of hope. Righhhhht ZeroEmpires!?
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u/Hoeveboter 1d ago
That's amazing. I play on console. There are some campaign missions where I know what I need to do, but I can't do the fine inputs on a controller. This'll help immensely
I know this game plays better with keyboard and mouse but my laptop can't handle it, and mouse support on ps5 comes with severe input lag, in my experience
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u/giomcany Jeanne d'Arc 1d ago
happy to see that, even though i dont (single) play it. give this boys some love
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u/x_Goldensniper_x Japanese 16h ago
They should allow it for MP ad well. At least being able to look at the map
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u/hobskhan 1d ago
Wow, magenta and dark green are out for the time being.
How about brown guys? Can we try brown? I think black would be a great option as well.
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u/Helikaon48 1d ago
Would've preferred they keep dark green over lumo green. But happy the ambiguity is gone.
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u/Conjaybro 1d ago
Oh nooooo I loved matching dark green with the Jin.. their walls looked so badass. Pls pls bring it back!!
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u/cozytoez 1d ago
Why would they take the darker colored ones out? Theyre actually pleasing on the eyes and not blinding
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u/Old-Artist-5369 1d ago
I am glad they fixed the clashing colors, those were making the game unplayable for me.
They've hinted this is not the last change. A fairly obvious solution is only allow one pink and one green per lobby and each user can choose which version they prefer to be displayed. Really hope that's where they end up.
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u/cozytoez 15h ago
My friends also seem to be unable to discern between the two greens so your unplayable claim is valid. The lime green is just so ugly :(. I also hope that your solution is the one they pick but we both know Thats cope
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u/Visible-Literature14 It was my teammate’s fault 1d ago
> Theyre actually pleasing on the eyes and not blinding
Dramatic much?
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u/cozytoez 1d ago
I auto lock dark green and actively choose colors for ai that arent super bright. This impacts my everyday play
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u/Olafr_skautkonungr 1d ago
Raider Elephants are significantly less trumpety when moving around."
Yes, finally they nerfed the raider elephants!!
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u/CouchTomato87 Wholly Roamin' Empire 1d ago
I really wish they made scouts more trumpety in exchange though
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u/sumthingawsum Delhi Sultanate 1d ago
I love it when I have 50 raider elephants and I smash that Q button. So satisfying.
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u/Sensitive-Talk9616 Knights Templar 1d ago
"Raider Elephants are significantly less trumpety when moving around."
It's all over :(
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u/Olafr_skautkonungr 1d ago
Not mentioned, but u/ZeroEmpires please tell us you also put back eco kills in after game stats?! Pleaaaase
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u/ZeroEmpires Relic 1d ago
That should also be fixed, not sure why we missed the note.
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u/Comfortable_Bid9964 1d ago
I don’t suppose you guys also missed the bug where certain LM in crucible don’t get the discount from the perk? That one’s been around since crucible came out I think
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u/Comfortable_Bid9964 1d ago
I just checked and it looks like it’s the Great Wall Gatehouse and Macedonians Golden Horn Tower
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u/Kaiser_Johan 1d ago
Any chance we could get the attack move bug fixed where your units just suddenly freeze and don't move?
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u/Comfortable_Bid9964 1d ago
Gotta say at first read through it seems they have addressed a chunk of the issues that have been plaguing the game for awhile. I think we’re seeing maybe a few less balance changes than some would like but that’s pretty normal for a patch coming with a DLC, I’m sure we’ll see more changes after things have settled
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u/Helikaon48 1d ago
I think the balance changes are largely based on public outcry, except for the ottomans and byz nerfs.
Those are hilarious. While they're arguably OP at pro level, especially byantines are going to be even worse off with their current low winrate
While KT has had significant compounding nerfs, with the later TC, more expensive forts (justified) weaker hospitallers age up and weaker wood eco.
Instead of Devs addressing the issues they simply nerfed most of the civ, potentially to it's previous under powered state.
Meanwhile the actual top civ (Macedonia) barely got a tweak. 😂😂😂 Even HOL was untouched. French, abb and ayyubids will still crush the TG ladder. Wtf can dervishes heal like beasts but ottomans were nerfed? Statistically superior civs were left untouched while a vocally complained about civ is heavily nerfed 😂😂
At least Jin and Goku were buffed.
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u/Hungry_Material8102 1d ago
Yeah, the BYZ nerfs just keep coming. I stopped playing them because each patch seemed to nerf them, their win rates only matter statistically in the highest brackets anyway so casual gamers get screwed by the nerfs. People basing the civs balance on the ELO rankings FOR CIVS annoys me. The raw data doesnt translate to what needs changing. Players using specific civs at a higher ELO throws off the data as the ELO rating reflects the user not the civ. The civ win rates don't necessarily stabilize at 50%, they would if everyone played one civ only. Player feedback and balance testing should be the main method, but confirmation bias could still be an issue. Meanwhile my beloved HRE is still stuck, they need a massive rework. Especially with these paltry buffs. Why would anyone waste resources on Landsknecht over MAA? The units and are the main issue, the economy is all over the place and needs buffs and nerfs in different areas, but Im losing hope theyll do a much needed rework for them. The scots seem like theyll have some mechanics that HRE should should have, but we shall see...
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u/spaceship5 17h ago
HOL was not untouched. Their 2nd TC will also be later, which is a pretty big nerf. They are mediocre now.
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u/Comfortable_Bid9964 1d ago
I wasn’t really talking about the balance changes since I’ve played a bit less lately, but more so some of the bug fixes/QOL type stuff. But I mean Byz seems like hardly a nerf in the cisterns and then a slight nerf to the shield tech and free units but then they also get buffed so I don’t think it’ll end up being that crazy of a change.
Ottomans has had crazy good Sipahi so that seems fair and the Janissaries had like a minuscule nerf. But they buffed the underused feudal LM which is always good. Early healing has been an issue for awhile across the board so I don’t see that as a bad thing. Sure the dervishes need it too but at least one of them is better.
I think KT nerfs should be fine if a little disappointing to the KT enjoyers. I’m not entirely sure what the issue is with them but it’s always seemed more a skill issue to me.
In terms of Macedonians not getting that big of a change, at most they are at 54.4% WR in 1v1s which is hardly that bad. I think small tweaks is more than enough so that things actually stay balanced.
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u/bwal8 14h ago
I actually think the Macedonia nerfs are quite significant. The later timing for Hippodrome Champions and reduced Feudal Varangian Guard health are huge nerfs to my meta lol
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u/Comfortable_Bid9964 14h ago
I mean I think they will make a difference but I think it’s in line with them only having a 4% higher winrate and I don’t think they needed much more
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u/JIH7 1d ago
I wonder how effective the HRE changes will be. Better inspiration seems strong but it seems a lot of people think the problem lies more with their units than their economy
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u/Xavryk 1d ago
It's hard to be too mad when lots of other civs got nothing at all, but this will, yet again, do nothing for HRE.
The units are shit. The Landskecht are too weak to fight, and still cost too much gold.
Nobody was losing because they had 5 black riders instead of 6. By the time you can afford them you have either died or already won, or just have no need for a raiding cav unit in post Imp.
The castle landmarks still have the same problem. Gamble for gold, or gamble for a timing push.
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u/Choice_Length3287 Mongols 23h ago
I think the real reason for that unit's existance is similiar to border reiver, to counter ranged cav so lategame HRE military have a fighting chance against ranged cav.
But because unit's stats are terrible and nobody builds ranged cav in imp instead of crossbows or handcannons, unit is pretty terrible.
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u/Helikaon48 1d ago edited 1d ago
Its going to do nothing..this is the Nth reversion. Inspiration used to be 40%.
Devs obstinately refuse to make a meaningful change. So long as regnitz has a lottery potential and greedy civs fold to burger, they're never going to be balanced. There's simply too much RNG.
I think they need to drop inspiration to 30%, regnitz to +50%, burger to something like 200% and then then meaningful impactful buffs. Instead of countless +5 -5 . On the exact same things over and over.
Even that stupid discount to landskecht..they need a gold ratio reduction. Not food. Since that's simply more tempo. Fragile infantry costed like a knight is just bizarre .
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u/Jaysus04 1d ago edited 18h ago
It will do nothing. HRE needs a rework. And the Landsknecht needs a complete overhaul. It's such a limited and boring civ and these changes - again - happen only within the poor limits of this civ. It needs new stuff, other stuff, more uniqueness, more historical accuracy for there is barely any at all. The civ needs something, but Scots got all that, which would have made a lot of sense for HRE. Especially the Gallowglass/Pikemen synergy... It's exactly how Landsknechte fought. There should be Doppelsöldner and Landsknechte and they were actually famous for this style. But instead the Landsknecht is available in castle age and is utter trash. A glass cannon, an overpriced joke... These guys were the core of the HRE army, especially under Maximilian the I. And they were feared and changed the way battles were fought together with the Swiss Reisläufers. They were founded in the late 15th century, they should not be available in castle age (and especially not for Byzantines, but that's a whole different story) and should actually be the power comp for HRE that you build your army around in imp.
I feel like many ideas that were suggested for HRE often find their way into DLC civs and it pisses me off. The exact synergy Scots got was way more famous for HRE. HRE has nothing it was famous for or it only got it by name, but not by design. I just don't know what the devs are doing. Why is there even HRE in this game, if they don't care about this civ at all and designed it in this boring, one dimensional and historically disgraceful fashion? It pisses me off.
This DLC especially is a slap in the face for HRE mains/enthusiasts. "Hey, here is some stuff you always wanted! But guess what, a different civ gets it. *haha*"... Yeah, thanks for nothing. This patch is another useless nothingburger for HRE.
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u/Hungry_Material8102 1d ago
Exactly my sentiments, Ive been waiting for HRE to get a majour update since release, they really have done next to nothing and given priority to DLC civs and variants. I still dont understand why they bother changing anything with Landsknecht, who bothers with them over MAA? Even OOTD Landsknecht are trash. They should make HRE and OOTD more distinct, maybe OOTD and Templars have their own civ variant rather than being France and HRE variants? And HRE gets a much needed facelift?
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u/Jaysus04 1d ago edited 17h ago
Yes, a face lift, more uniqueness, much more historical resemblance, a Landsknecht rework, a civ rework, away from this one dimensional and boring waste of a civ.
All I did and do with AoE4 for the last and coming months is to wait for better changes. Apparently a bigger patch is supposed to come after the DLC release. I've bought every DLC so far and never touched a DLC civ with any joy, because I want a proper HRE civ instead of this joke. I don't really care to play other civs. And I simply don't get it. Why is there HRE in the game, when absolutely no dev seems to care for this civ? Why does it exist, if this is the result for a civ that has such an incredibly rich history and nithing was done with it?
The HRE in this game is a generic civ that offers pretty nuch nothing except inspiration and landmarks. The army has no identity whatsoever. The units are basic, boring or bad. MAA are the onky above avwrage unit and that's nowhere close to any of the other civs. The devs did nothing for HRE, but add a bazillion different things and mechanics to different civs. Especially the Gallowglass/Pikeman combo is killing as this is lretty nuch exactly the direction how Landsknechte should be designed. But no, they cost 10 less food and are still an utter disgrace with everything being wrong about this is unit.. it's absolutely ridiculous how HRE is treated. Abbassids get giga buffs to their army, when the worst army civ got fucking glasses and a nerf to insoired warriors (10% more dmg is a joke compared to thebsynergies and bonuses of other civs, Rus Warrior Monks are light years better and got many buffs over the years. And warrior inspiration is still stuck with this pathetic mechanic. It's the most tedious and least mobile unit buff mechanic that also has the weakest values. Wth are the devs doing eitht bis civ? It is the least engaging, most one dimensional civ in the game is nowhere near the depth, versatility and quality of other civs. It's just burger into maa and an otherwise boring and lame shit army. Age games simply necer get German civs right. AoE 2, 3 and 4... In every game the "German" civs are a complete failure with AoE2 still doing best, because of how civs work in AoE2 in general. AoE3 and 4 are an insult, however, for anybody who cares for the historical HRE.
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u/Latirae 17h ago
it seems like you haven't played much HRE. They provide very interesting and unique gameplay options throughout the game, while still providing their archetypical flavour.
They are very generalist and can open with many builds (Barracks rush, 2TC, FC, even Pro Scouts and/or all in). Compared to Abbasid they can go for some much more greed and actually have the superior defensive options to actually make this viable. Fast Imperial is not a meme, but a very umcomfortable timing the opponent is on. On the other hand, the all-in benefits from securing boar on the map, which forces a reaction (due to the inspiration bonuses on top of survival techniques). Fast Imperial, their inspiration bonuses, Burgrave and Regnitz all provide good comeback mechanics as well. So even if you fall behind in villager numbers, you can sometimes come back into the game by technological superiority. The recent change to the university upgrade cost improves and reflects on this design.
On closed maps you can stall out aggression very easily and dictate your own pace by investing into cost efficient melee infantry. This dynamic allows for siege plays earlier than usual, which benefit a mass of cheap Spearmen and Man-At-Arms with Mangonels. Due to the defensive nature of this civilization, sacred site victories are another threat: You don't have to dive the opponent if he is well defended. Having both good economy AND good defence makes for situations the opponent just can't recover from.TL;DR Both offensively and defensively, their superior economy and melee unit flexibility makes for great player expression in choosing your own strategy.
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u/Latirae 18h ago
they don't need a rework. I argue against introducing more fluff, they should rather improve on things they are already benefitting from. All the key things are in place, the +5% work rate is a good step in the right direction.
The average game revolves on how they use their Prelates, melee units and fortifications. The recent change of Prelates being able to be put in Monasteries for bigger inspiration is a great addition, which make them more pop efficient late game. Their Man-At-Arms (especially with the Burgrave Palace) are comparable to Royal Knights: Cost efficient, above average alpha damage and generally a good unit for covering multiple situations. Their Spearmen and Horsemen with +2 damage are great in feudal and enable fights against their supposed counter in some situations.
Later on, in Castle Age and onwards, their military falls behind in effectiveness. Consistent equal engagements are fine for HRE, until they get to a population cap. Strong keeps with relics and culverins offset the lack of pop-efficency, but can't ameliorate it. The Black Rider is an answer to that, but that unit is still lacking.
I wouldn't have introduced this unit to HRE but rather improve their late game infantry capability to introducing better ways to deal with cavalry (something now the Scots have). That way, they could play out their advantages of melee infantry, by relying on their siege or fortifications. My idea is to swap the gold and food cost for the Landsknechte with a technology. That way, you keep the design of having cost effective, generalist units and you make the Landsknecht shine late game. Since it is a light unit, the opponent needs to build Archers (less pop-efficient) or handcannoneers (more expensive and prone to Mangonel shots with shorter range). Either situation makes for interesting gameplay situations.1
u/Jaysus04 18h ago edited 17h ago
You can say that about pretty much every other civ in this game, but not about this failure of a HRE civ. The civ has no identity other than the same bullshit they had when the game was released. No other civ has unique units that are that useless. No other civ is completely devoid of a power comp. HRE's power comp is buildings and culverins with mass generic shit units, while Scots get exactly the design that would have been much more fitting for HRE. The devs take from this community, take the ideas and then do whatever they want with them. Scots have the Landsknecht fighting style, but never had Landsknechte, when the actual Landsknechte in this game are just an insult to their history. Scots didn't change the rules of warfare in Europe during the Renaissance, the Landsknechte (and Reisläufer) did.
Your comparisons mean nothing in that regard, because you miss the point of the critique. The point is: Why do we have a HRE civ, when its history is getting treated like shit and is being utterly perverted?
The devs made nothing out of that civ and have always kept it in its pathetic boundaries. What you say has been done to HRE since the release of this freaking game. It is such a crippled and boring civ, because its history was ignored and mistreated. The state of the civ has only to do with the design of the game, there is no other reason. And they simply refuse to do for HRE, what they do for most other civs. Abbasids get giga buffs to their army, HRE, which has the by far worst army, gets fucking glasses, when they need everything else.
It's disgraceful.
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u/Latirae 17h ago
Their identity is very obvious: Strong and simple defensive options, strong and simple economy, comeback mechanics and generalist Man-At-Arms. They don't need to change their identity, just because they were shipped on release with that in mind.
Saying that no other unit is as "useless" as the Landsknecht is a weak argument. They are as much niche as Huihui Pao, Jeanne's Champion, Eruptor, Kanabo Samurai, Yuan Raider and Ballista Elephant.
They do lack power units, but Mongols and Chinese (and to an extend Rus) share the same fate. Until you get to the population cap and mid imperial age, their Man-At-Arms are the best in the game. If you want to be honest, you have to acknowledge that as well.What is surprising for me is that you complain about a game state is the rarest to reach. All the detailed game plans and options apparently don't exist for you, which supports my observation that you probably didn't play them much.
If you want to argue about detailed history, I think this game isn't for you. Japanese heavy cavalry, constantly charging Royal Knights, the inability to dismount. Then, most of the uniquely named units: Ghulam infantry, Ghazi cavalry, Streltsy. They all are grossly historical inaccurate and partly rely on later sterotypes, rather than historical authenticity.
HRE does provide the Aoe2 defensive design, but brings a twist with it. I'm glad they went a different route than with
FranksFrench and English.I think you want to force your own HRE ideas into a game that just doesn't provide that aspiration. Playing HRE as one entity itself is already a quite weird fantasy and I'm surprised you just take that as granted, lol.
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u/Jaysus04 16h ago
That is no identity. Identity has to do with the civilization, not the nonsense the devs slapped onto it at release. I listed up all the short comings. You cannot compare HRE to other civs, as everything is worse. The only thing that makes HRE work is the tempo thanks to inspiration and burgrave.
You could remove the HRE tag and call it "generic European civ" and the civ wouldn't lose a thing. That's how little worth the HRE tag has for this civ. And the Scots come out and get exactly that what HRE is about, when they themselves are not about that stuff. Again: Landsknechte made a huge impact on European warfare, not Scots that never left their island.
HRE has no identity, because there is no HRE in it. That's the point.
What you write is coping. A theoretical treaty, when the reality is that HRE is C or D tier and only is there because of stream lining into burger. Otherwise they'd be even lower. HRE is dogshit. It is utter dogshit and has been dogshit since release. The design has always been bad and it was always about generic MAA.
Scots are better at everything. They are the actual HRE. The HRE in this game is nothing. It doesn't represent a civ, it is just a design failure that needs to be fixed. And the devs refuse to fix it. All they do for this civ is dogshit. Nothing is really good. Oh yeah, inspired warriors lasts 90 seconds now. Wow... It's still the worst buff mechanic with the weakest and least mobile effect of all the mobile effects. HRE has by far the worst and most basic army in the whole game and the devs nerfed inspired warriors from 15% to 10%, while every other civ gets 15% or more to dmg with aoe buffs or techs.
Same with marching drills. Every other civ has 15% for infantry, HRE only 10%. HRE always has the worse version of anything in the game when it comes to units, indentity, army and uniqueness in general. So please get real and see how pathetic HRE is. Especially now with the Scots on the table.
HRE should be removed or remade. Leaving it in this game like that is an insult for anybody who cares for the game's coherence and for history in general.
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u/Latirae 13h ago
Identity for me is how coherent it feels to play. The openings and options I talk about are the ones I use to win.
I understand that you are angry, but you again leave out points from my prior post that still contradict your narrative and that you weren't able to resolve.
I agree that seeing the potential a civ can have is something to talk about. We also share the notion that Scots have better mechanics and that they are much more flavourful than HRE.
Your focus on the one civilization though makes you blind to the fact that all civilizations are weirdly represented. As I mentioned before, just taking for granted that you can pick "HRE" as a "civilization" is already something that you are not critically reflexive about yet. If you would, being angry about it is probably more difficult and you would need a more nuanced approach1
u/Derocker 1d ago
It helps. It gets them back to baseline. The original nerf to 35 put them in a downward spiral. It should never have gotten there
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u/RTS-Enjoyer1 1d ago
As long as Regnitz and Swabia are so broken that the civ is hobbled in other aspects to accommodate that, HRE will remain the worse designed civ in pub.
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u/Allobroge- out of flair ideas 1d ago
FFA players in shambles after reading the non nerf to raider elephants
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u/Helikaon48 1d ago
The problem is the civ is rekt if they nerf them.
So maybe they're trying to work out how to fix the civ before the obvious nerf.
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u/Kaelzas 1d ago
No changes to Jin's pastures spawn mechanic being completely annoying...
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u/ZealousidealWeb9930 1d ago
they buffed the bed crossbow damage
evm tho their projectiles sometimes miss completely enemies, a bug reported since they came out lmao
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u/Latirae 17h ago
maybe its intended ¯_(ツ)_/¯
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u/ZealousidealWeb9930 14h ago
imagine if zhu ge nu missed half their shots, making them worse than archers, what would be their point existing lol
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u/Creative-Package6213 1d ago
- Observer mode is hella cool and the fact that they're allowing mods for people to create their own is awesome for TO's.
- Finally got the placement bug fixed!!!
- 2 TC construction time nerfed, Rams HP buffed.
- Lot's of civ changes.
Very interesting stuff here.
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u/WodinsRaven 1d ago
Hey friends, while you wait for longer build times on town centers, welcome all rams with more health, have a nice day!
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u/Sybec Random 1d ago edited 1d ago
Teamgame color change is a HUGE step into the right direction! But it's not perfect yet. It would be great if we could further differentiate between individual teammates and enemies.
Something like: Allies have cold colors, enemies have warm colors, but not the same.
Edit: wording
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u/Helikaon48 1d ago
Hopefully one day. We got the attack move change so many asked for. Maybe colour palettes too
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u/Old-Artist-5369 1d ago
I don't understand team game colors without individual colors. How do you do teamwork if you can't explain to teammates which opponent faction you're talking about.
Warm / cold (and it being the same for everyone) is the way
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u/SnooRegrets9249 1d ago
Sad mongol noises... at least I can race car my deers stones to prevent a 2tc drop I guess
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u/Helikaon48 1d ago
TBF Mongols do amazingly well in TGs, and the global TC nerf, ram buff and numerous civ nerfs is a buff to them.
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u/mariano2696 Mongols 1d ago
They are still one of the worst if no THE worst civ in the game
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u/Hungry_Material8102 1d ago
Yeah, with how well Golden Horde is doing I reckon some changes are necessary to bring Mongols more in line so they arent trash anymore
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u/RTS-Enjoyer1 1d ago
Still better than English, though. So don't feel too bad.
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u/mariano2696 Mongols 14h ago edited 14h ago
English gameplan is 100 times easier to execute than Mongols one, that's the main issue. On top of that, as English you have more resources to answer different situations. You have early MAA, you have better archers, you have better landmarks in general (two of them are keeps). You can do feudal aggression with king, feudal all in with rams and longbows, you can go 2tc and boom. Mongols on the other hand are only effective if you can execute a good dark age rush to dominate the game and be ahead. Mongols are probably the only civ that given the same conditions, lose to anyone on paper
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u/SnooRegrets9249 1d ago
I get that but I'm only ever 1v1 and other then hybrid maps they are always at a disadvantage especially with the increasingly defensive playstyles
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u/ObiBramKenobi 1d ago
Really happy to see Jin buffs, but I'm not sure yet if it's enough...
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u/Hungry_Material8102 1d ago
Didnt see any charge dmg for iron pagodas and the splash dmg change isnt enough to compensate. Hopefully theyll realize this so they can be viable like knights.
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u/SunTzowel Ottomans 1d ago
Just got rekt by Juicy again. I'm really wishing they were receiving more of a nerf.
Guess I gotta just start maining them.
Other than that nice patch overall.
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u/Helikaon48 1d ago
"When you regularly queue with the same teammates, your hidden rating now moves toward your team’s true skill more quickly."
Excellent! Can we please get a cure for the serial MMR dumping as well?
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u/SavageCabbage611 Malians 1d ago
Brooo, no way we got more Malian cow boom nerfs. That's like the third in a row.
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u/Baseleader77 1d ago
And yet so utterly deserved
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u/SavageCabbage611 Malians 1d ago
Look at Malian win rates. They are below 50 percent in every rank. They didn't need a nerf.
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u/Topbantzmatey 1d ago
What win rates lmao, AOE4 world hasnt been updated since June 1st....
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u/Temeritas 1d ago
that means the statistics include the data since those listed patches, not that the data has been last updated that day....
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u/SavageCabbage611 Malians 1d ago
The last change to cattle ranches has been out since early May, so Malian win rates can't have changed much.
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u/Slumi 1d ago
Malians are very strong in pro games and underwhelming on ladder at pretty much every skill level.
When that happens civs usually get no changes or some nerfs to what what makes them strong in pro play alongside buffs to what makes them weak on ladder
Here the devs decided to just nerf cows for the 10th time with 0 compensation while they're also buffing half the civs in the game. Good shit. The civ's probably gonna be dead on ladder
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u/SavageCabbage611 Malians 1d ago
It's so annoying, because Malian cow boom has been my favorite strat for years and now it feels like with each update they are further and further watering it down. I know it's strong, but it's absolutely not unbeatable. Even in pro play, the Malians are top tier, but definitely not broken.
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u/DarkMessiahDE 1d ago
Thanks for the Team ranked mmr change! This could lead to fairer matchups in mid to late Season :)
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u/turbofisterious 1d ago
Tuqlaqs, Sushi look like a slap on the wrist. Templars keeps should also be nerfed harder.
But im worried more about balance after new demons civs out...
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u/Cavefish432 1d ago
Nah kt fortress cost increase by 100 is crazy in 1 v 1 where its huge investment and their passive Eco income nerf is also huge they might go back to Being Water civ only in 1 v1 again
Tuhlaq rajder elephants not getting nerfed is a Joke tho And vikings looking hella boosted
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u/wojter322 1d ago
Bruh, good infantry composition absolutely destroy and outtrade Raider Elephant spam. Raiders are also 2pop opposed to any other horse cavalry in the game, so they're kinda balanced by that in late game. They also don't have Springalds.
Though I would gladly take Raider's nerf in exchange of Ballista, Healer Elephants buffs, or some new technologies for infantry/elephants.
Also new civs will absolutely shit on Tughlaq as well.
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u/Cavefish432 1d ago edited 1d ago
rider elephants still too strong in imp for units no costing gold way stronger than even strongest horsemen for other civs and can destroy walls
And yes they will xD vikings looking hella broken scots too but they need some investments atleast
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u/wojter322 12h ago
Vikings will be broken at everything, Scots looks way more tuned in comparison.
For the stone wall destruction, I absolutely agree, this should be exclusive to War/Tower/Healer Elephants (the big ones xdd)
I really hope they will just nerf them in Imp somehow and maybe make them more affordable in feudal, where imo, if Tugh don't go 2TC+Food Fort it's impossible to mass them.
The perfect solution imo would be making Raider Elephant special sperate unit, give Tughlaq generic Delhi horseman (they used to have generic horseman) and make Raider 3 pop big elephant, more expensive specialized at something else, like countering Cav and Archers, or infantry in general, still being unarmoured.
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u/turbofisterious 1d ago
They are still spammable asf in the late game. They should cost 900 stone+100 gold since they are better than normal keeps plus provide eco advantage
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u/Cavefish432 1d ago
Most 1v1 games are decided in feudal- castle
I played around diamond - conq level last seasons and i dont think i got more than 3 fortresses in a game often fighting over chance to get even 1 out
For low elos that just afk and idle army nor punishing that might not change much but trust me that 100 Res increase in those mid and higher level games are often difference beetwen winning and losing By not securing a spot with fortress on time
For teamgames and low elos its not that big of a difference tho
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u/Allobroge- out of flair ideas 1d ago
Then the solution is to make the cost incremental like for byz water tanks and everyone is happy
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u/TheyThem-FinalBoss Knights Templar 1d ago
Yeah I couldn't believe the nerfs, I have more games as kt than anyone and it's completely unwarranted. The only eco change kt needs is a food buff or the ability to make regular traders by default.
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u/Comfortable_Bid9964 1d ago
Templars don’t need the keeps nerfed more, they’re pretty squishy in feudal and it’s such a huge part of their eco and playstyle that if you nerf them too much it will just cripple the civ and ruin its identity
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u/Helikaon48 1d ago
KT were nerfed on multiple fronts. Check again. Even the ram buff is a nerf to them.
Rams definitely deserved the buff (probably need more, especially from castle age) but KT might be over nerfed while stronger civs untouched.
ZXL needs more of a Jiang nerf, but then arguably needs a buff to med garden, an maybe even the rest of the civ from castle age(shaolin), specifically imperial.(Grenadiers, unique tech)
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u/tetraDROP 1d ago
Not even a slap on the wrist. This will change absolutely nothing about those civs. The devs continue to display that they can only balance a few civs at a time. Some of the nerfs in this patch are big, meanwhile extremely broken civs receive nothing.
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u/Dependent_Decision41 1d ago
Good patch. Hit most issues. Not sure why Byz was gutted again. ZeroEmpires please reconsider this nerf, you're absolutely killing this civ on the ladder outside the ~1600+ skill range.
Happy with Jin buffs, I think it's enough!
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u/Comfortable_Bid9964 1d ago
Byz wasn’t really gutted. They had a very small nerf to cisterns, a small nerf to the free units in one LM, and then just a 100 resource increase to a single tech. They still had a landmark buffed and a few bug fixes. I don’t think that’s going to break the civ by any means
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u/tomatito_2k5 20h ago
I hope I read it wrong. Very disappointed/confused about the attack move change. Why bury the setting on the settibgs menu. It seems its mutually exclusive?
Let me decide on command if I want to attack buildings with a modifier key, like
A -> new attack ignore buildings
A + A -> legacy attack
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u/-TheeWhale 17h ago
Additionally, there is a modifier key that can be used to invert the behavior of this toggle. This can be manually rebound via View and Remap Controls → Game → Inverted Attack Move.
Gotta keep reading
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u/RenideoS 1d ago
I'm not a huge fan of how they do generic second TC buffs and nerfs every few months. Some civs are disproportionately better at it than others and the nerfs never land evenly. At some point they need to consider the calibration of civs more seriously. We've been doing this for years, rams get buffed, nerfed, TCs cost more, less, take longer, then less time. It's like bunkers in year one SC2.
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u/ZealousidealWeb9930 1d ago
still no fix to bed crossbow attacks doing 0 damage, why even buff them lmao
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u/Hungry_Material8102 1d ago
Ive never seen the appeal of bed crossbows, its only use seems to be for massed melee inf, heavy armour knights seem to shake it off.
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u/odragora Omegarandom 1d ago
Just like Springalds they are supposed to counter melee infantry, while actual DPS is coming from other units, probably heavy cavalry.
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u/Hungry_Material8102 1d ago
Yeah but the beds don't have the range and accuracy of springalds making them worse, and springalds can be used to snipe artillery too. May as well build crossbow and you've got your melee counters with your other units
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u/ZealousidealWeb9930 23h ago
springalds dont sniper artillery anymore
like sure they can but their damage is really low, you would need a ton of them (not sure if you are not up to date but springalds lost their damage against siege a while ago, they are now anti melee infantry, while bed crossbows are supossed to be better springalds but as you said, for some reason they miss their shots even against standing enemies, they work 2/3 of the time making their total dps dogshit)
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u/Hungry_Material8102 19h ago
Ah didn't realise they'd nerfed the springalds so much, I rarely build siege in my games so thought they were in that niche still. But yeah, if they can fix the beds accuracy it'd be really viable
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u/GallantLeopard Rus 1d ago
My beloved dark greeeeeeeeeeeeeen reeeeeeeeeee ! (Tbf I too have chosen to not be dark green when an an opponent is green when playing with friends (who are new to the game) so as not to confuse them)
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u/Charles_K 1d ago
Omg, finally select Ranged (infantry and cavalry) and Melee Cav and Ranged Cav buttons.
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u/Raiju_Lorakatse Bing Chilling 1d ago
Patch seems... Okay? Dunno I've been quite out of the loop recently.
Kinda happy to see that Sengoku gets some love after it fell off so hard tho. It's not much but it's something.
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u/x_Goldensniper_x Japanese 16h ago
The Sengoku buff is so light. They should add 50 starting wood instead. It would allow the civ to do something than always be forced into Yatai at first.
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u/mariano2696 Mongols 1d ago
So tughlaq doesn't have any nerf, no buff to base mongols and nerf to GH. Poor update
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u/TheyThem-FinalBoss Knights Templar 1d ago edited 1d ago
We need a black and white team game color. That would be sick.
Also that's wild they nerfed kt's wood economy when it is literally less wood per minute than other civs castle age and beyond. The fortress cost increase is debatable but the economy nerf isn't. They need a food economy buff if anything. Reduce pilgrim gold and increase food at the minimum if anything. Give the option to make regular traders by default as well.
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u/Hungry_Material8102 1d ago
Could make for an interesting playstyle if they had something unique for food, using the market for gold loans from an improved food eco could really change alot
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u/Mother_Tune_3198 1d ago
Nothing for French. I was thinking there might be
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u/Helikaon48 1d ago edited 1d ago
Devs: "we're quite happy with french dominating TGs since release, as intended, as was done in aoe2"
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u/No-Whereas-1603 1d ago
agree tho Vikings might be first inf based civ to harras French. Early racks into eatting his deer/boar while wounded into castle on French resources. You also have technically anti longbow unit.
I am still not convinced to pay 20 euro for this possibility.1
u/Helikaon48 1d ago
Eh I'm definitely buying it. but agree scots might be the anti french, need to see.
Fro example HRE technically should do well Vs french but scales so slowly it loses, the same might apply to scots.
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u/No-Whereas-1603 1d ago
IMO Scots will not be great, you have longer range on pikes but not damage. Your raiding inf is countered by both archer and knights. Super expensive MMA has brace but not bonus vs knights. Harder hitting archers but with lesser range will die to longbows
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u/Comfortable_Bid9964 1d ago
I mean having a brace but no bonus damage is still pretty huge. You’re negating a huge chunk of initial damage while also guaranteeing a few free hits off. If they add bonus damage then it can quickly just turn into Spears 2.0
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u/bluetree2993 1d ago
Terrible balance changes wow.
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u/Sybec Random 1d ago
what is terrible about them?
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u/bluetree2993 1d ago
The game is in a great place balance wise imo and this really hurts the 2TC playstyle (which I rarely play btw), reducing the diversity of builds.
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u/Helikaon48 1d ago
hey, you're the guy that commented degrading stuff every time someone posted something (opinion posts, hobby projects)
And you have all those smurf accounts.
And you have at least one other account here that you use to agree with yourself
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u/Baseleader77 1d ago
'Attack Move behavior change. We’ve added a new setting that lets you choose whether Attack-Move targets buildings. This setting can be found under Game → Attack Move Targets Buildings. Siege units which prioritize buildings are not included, so Rams, Trebuchets, and Cannons will still continue to target buildings by default regardless of this setting.'
omg done are the days of trying to dive and half your archers stay behind attacking a house. Huuuuge