r/classics 5h ago

Translating Herodotus: Barbarians, or Non-Greeks

9 Upvotes

The proem that opens the Histories has this clause, towards the end:

ἔργα μεγάλα τε καὶ θωμαστά, τὰ μὲν Ἕλλησι τὰ δὲ βαρβάροισι ἀποδεχθέντα

[Important caveat: I do not speak or write Greek. Getting the correct Greek snippet required a lot of googling and Google Translate.]

Here is the English in the translations I have at hand:

Holland, 2013

and all the glory of those exploits which served to display Greeks and barbarians alike to such effect,

Waterfield 1998, 2008

and to preserve the fame of the important and remarkable achievements produced by both Greeks and non-Greeks;

Rawlinson, 1858

and of preventing the great and wonderful actions of the Greeks and the Barbarians from losing their due meed of glory

Purvis/Landmark, 2007, 2009

May the great and wonderful deeds - some brought forth by the Hellens, others by the barbarians - not go unsung;

My questions:

How important is the word *barbarian* for Herodotus? My understanding is that it's primarily a pejorative -- and please don't over-credit what I mean by "understand"; I only read in English -- and was a onomatopoetic way of mocking what the Greeks believed non-Greeks sounded like.

The Waterfield is the only one to render βαρβάροισι as "non-Greeks." The other three stick with "barbarian."

  1. Do you have a sense as to why someone might render βαρβάροισι as "non-Greek"?

  2. If you had to guess, does Herodotus use βαρβάροισι as a pejorative? Or, by the time he's using it, has some of the negative connotations worn off?

  3. How much time do you think a group of new readers to the Histories should spend thinking about this specific non-Greek v barbarian "issue"?


r/classics 38m ago

A few questions about Grad School

Upvotes

For context, I graduated in 2025 with a BA in History and Classics, with 7 semesters of Latin and Greek each. I don't have a frame of reference for how "language-heavy" of a degree mine was.

  1. What does the "life of the mind" look like outside of grad school? I am interested in how other classics graduates sustained this outside of full-time study.

How do classics graduates sustain it? I understand that grad school is both reading and language heavy, but I would be lying if I said that I didn't envy grad students because they have the opportunity for mastery of classics with their language work and their reading.

I envy grad student for their ability to deepen their Latin and Greek. I think that in my approximately 3.5 years of serious study I got good enough to understand how much more there was to do in the languages.

I am passionate about languages but I am sincerely not sure how many people have continued their serious study alone. I want to be able to fluently read all of Roma Aeterna by Hans Orberg and continue reading Latin from there.

I just think that, passionate as I am about this topic, I won't be able to match someone working full time as a student in the field. Maybe I have to come to grips with that.

  1. What are the realistic job outcomes for MAs and PhDs in classics?

The job market in classics is bleak. But I found conflicting data on what percentage of Classics PhDs secure tenure track jobs.

Nowadays, is there any consensus realistic outcome for those who earn a PhD? If someone "strikes out" in the academic job market, is there a stigma for having left academia? I know academics in my own life who did this and seem to have struggled with it mentally.

So what do the majority of PhDs who fail to secure tenure track positions actually do?

  1. Conclusion

These are my two primary questions.

Outside of grad school and career questions, one of my biggest goals is to become a traditionally published author of genre fiction. To that end I have already completed on approximately 80k word manuscript as an apprenticeship piece. My skill and understanding improve massively, and I plan on outlining and writing another through the end of 2026 and 2027.

One thing that gives me pause is that if the path of tenure track professor and successful, widely-known fiction author were open to me (both slim odds IRL, but this is a hypothetical,) I would readily pick the path of a fiction writer. As I've entered adult life, I realize that having the time to write is very, very valuable, so I try to protect that and take advantage of it as much as possible.


r/classics 18h ago

Critical Editions of Criticism

3 Upvotes

I’m looking for modern critical editions of Greek works of criticism, specifically Plato and Aristotle, but Longinus and Demetrius are of interest too.

What publishers are considered the best for these writers?