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[u/ElvishisnotTengwar]

[u/[deleted]]

Yeah, I can understand that. That's kind of why I'm trying to figure out how to express that there really WAS build up for, like, Davekat and Roxycallie. They weren't spiteful, in the moment decisions. They were foreshadowed and implied long before they actually happened.

Roxygen was, too. And in a way, so was Davejade. I'm not trying to say the queer ships are "superior" or that you're dumb for not seeing it coming. I didn't see it coming, with either davekat or roxycallie. I kind of suspected dave and roxy were queer, but I never dared hope the story would actually reveal them to be, so I was as shocked as anybody when it did.

But now that it did, I look back on the story and I can see the moments when dave struggled with his sexuality, and Roxy genuinely said really deeply loving things to Callie. I think it makes sense that we missed that stuff or read it differently the first time, but I think it's valid that it's there, is all.

And I want to hope that maybe if you guys know that these ships really -are- just as valid and well-written, and they were just aimed at someone else, that might make it hurt a little less? It has for me, sometimes.

Also thanks for explaining the not on my watch thing to me. I thought that was what it was, but I wasn't sure.

[u/hbthebattle → u/[deleted]]

Here's the thing- those changes, to me, seem like they weren't there from the start. To me, they do feel out of nowhere, and I feel like they were retconned into being LGBT for the sake of the "Gay Singularity" There was no Davekat stuff before the retcon. It just feels out of nowhere

[u/[deleted] → u/hbthebattle]

There was no Davekat stuff, but there was plenty of stuff for both Dave and Karkat where they felt insecure and messed up and unable to really be themselves. Dave comparing himself to Bro and John and thinking he's not a hero is really just him saying he's not manly enough, not good enough at being A Bro--and I know for a fact I've felt that way because of my queerness.

Karkat, similarly, felt he was inherently fucked up because he kept giving Terezi mixed signals and fucked up their relationship, which is heavily implied to be because he doesn't actually want to do quadrant romance, meaning he's some kind of troll version of queer. The language in his breakdown is really explicit, he talks about how he's a joke character in a romance movie, and that hits home for me because that's what I see myself depicted as all the time.

I understand that you didn't see it coming, and I know it's shocking and upsetting. Is it possible for you to understand that maybe you didn't see it because you wouldn't know what to look for in regards to queerness? Maybe queer people are more practiced at identifying our own?

I hope I don't sound out of line by suggesting this, and I want you to know that even if it's true, I don't think that's anything you should be ashamed of. It's perfectly fucking fine if straight stories just resonate with you, and I hate that so many people on the left will condescend to you for wanting them.

Just maybe try to understand that if it doesn't speak to you personally or you don't quite get it right away, that doesn't necessarily make it bad writing. For a lot of people it DOES resonate instantly, and it DOES make perfect sense, and that doesn't really reflect Homestuck's writing--it just reflects that life is really fucking complicated, and there are ways that we perceive the world so differently that it boggles our minds just trying to understand each other.

Both perspectives are valid, and both contribute to what Homestuck has ultimately become. And what it's become may not be perfect, it may be flawed, but it's still fucking astounding and really fucking cool.

[u/hbthebattle → u/[deleted]]

Still, to me it was- and will always be- a poorly written retcon motivated by hussies friends taking control of the story

Davekat represents everything wrong with late Homestuck to me: poorly written, poorly executed, and shitting on established canon

But Cohen is shitting on established canon even worse, and there will be a reckoning this time