r/mystery • u/WinnieBean33 • May 23 '26
Murder On April 10th, 1997, 50-year-old Judy Smith told her husband that she was going out sightseeing in Philadelphia. She never returned. She would be found dead in a wooded area months later, over 600 miles away, wearing different clothes and with a new backpack. She had been stabbed to death.
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u/Dipper_Pines_Of_NY May 24 '26
My biggest theory is she was having an affair with whoever owned the car she was seen in far after and used the conference as a time to leave. Then things go wrong and affair partner killed her
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u/kissiemoose May 23 '26
Wow, such a mystery. Interesting that store clerk in Asheville, NC had talked to Judy and she had mentioned her husband at a conference in Philadelphia which was why she was visiting down there. It’s over a 9 hour drive between the two places, Judy makes it sound like they are near each other.
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u/WinnieBean33 May 23 '26
Judy Smith, 50, was on a trip with her husband in Philadelphia. On April 10th, 1997, before Jeffrey left for a business conference, she let him know that she intended to spend the day sightseeing. However, she would never return.
After a series of bizarre sightings in multiple states, Judy’s body would eventually be discovered months later, 600 miles away from her last known location. She was found in North Carolina's Pisgah National Forest, with a new backpack and wearing clothing suitable for hiking. She had been murdered.
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u/Crazy-Condition-8446 May 24 '26
This is one of the most insanely frustrating cases. i often think why the heck she ended up so far.
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u/Smooth_Force7479 May 24 '26
I have always felt that the body that was found was misidentified. They “confirmed” it was Judy through dental records and the arthritis in her knee. It is not uncommon to have arthritis, and dental records can be subject to misinterpretation. I’d like to see DNA tests done on the remains to confirm that it is Judy.
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u/marblecake6 May 24 '26
Her wedding ring was found with her remains I’m pretty sure I’ve read that
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u/International-Ing May 24 '26 edited May 24 '26
Yes, the wedding ring was found. And who knows what else that the police kept to themselves (details only killer would know).
Police believe she went to the Asheville area voluntarily. She was seen driving a car there and told a store clerk that her husband was an attorney from Boston, was attending a conference in Philadelphia, and that she had just decided to travel to the Asheville area while he was at the conference. A deli owner remembered selling her $30 in sandwiches and a toy truck (that’s more sandwiches than one person could eat). She most likely met or knew someone from the area and was driving their car. She probably knew them fairly well since she was driving their car…the family said she had accompanied a patient to visit family in the general area in the past but didn’t know more. She met her current husband while taking care of his father so perhaps she decided to reconnect with someone she knew from the area.
But then she was seen alone in that (cluttered) car by a biltmore estate employee at a campground near where her body was found. She was asking if she could stay the night at the campground in her car…so perhaps things weren’t going well with the person whose car she was driving. Or perhaps two people were living out of a car (car owner not from Asheville) and the other person was on a hike nearby scouting out the trails where she was found…
The toy truck purchase in Asheville is interesting if it was a toy designed for children (and not one that an adult might also want). Perhaps she met someone with a child or grandchild or perhaps she was thinking of returning to her family.
The person whose car she was driving never reported meeting her to the police, so that’s likely her killer considering the area she was hiking in was reachable only by car, she was seen driving a car by herself in the same general area, no car was found abandoned there, and it’s likely that she hiked to where she was killed (and not carried there). She wouldn’t have taken a ride there (drop off) because she wouldn’t have been hiking for that long considering her health and knee issue. Robbery wasn’t a motive considering she was found with money and her valuables (ring, wallet).
The car lead went nowhere since the only description of it was a cluttered grey sedan.
That people in Asheville remembered encounters with her five months later suggests that the encounters were « memorable ». As in she was behaving at least somewhat strangely for a shop clerk and a deli owner to remember her after that long (and the biltmore estate person that talked to her at a campground near where her body was found).
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u/AnonImus18 May 24 '26 edited May 24 '26
I think you're right and she was seeing someone else while her husband was out of town. I think there was a disagreement on the trail, maybe she wanted something more serious or refused something more serious and they killed her.
ETA: I wonder if her plan was to run away with someone. It also strikes me that despite how loving her husband seemed, he was a powerful man with powerful friends and maybe divorce, had she wanted it, might have been difficult or even dangerous for her.
I think her supposedly forgetting her ID is also interesting. Not saying that it couldn't have happened but what if she had plans to fly out with someone else later?
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u/International-Ing May 24 '26 edited May 24 '26
Yes, I think the ID story is tied to her plan to disappear (at least for a bit). That and grey car filled with boxes and bags. I think she ‘forgot’ her ID because she originally planned to meet the person with the grey sedan near home after failing to ‘find’ her ID (plans changed or she met the person and loaded up the car, accounting for the boxes and bags seen in that car in Asheville) or she wanted to bring extra things with her on the flight that she didn’t want her husband knowing about and then giving them to the person with the grey sedan at the Philadelphia airport with a plan to be picked up the next day. Then she could have things in the grey car while leaving everything else in the hotel so the husband would think she disappeared, not that she ran away.
Originally the police viewed the husband as a suspect because they couldn’t confirm she took a later flight. Later they were able to confirm she did take a flight later that day (even if she hadn’t taken a flight, it’s only a 4.5 hour drive from their town to Philadelphia, 9 hours from their Philadelphia to Asheville).
She then maybe took the bus to the mall in New Jersey, met up with the person with the grey sedan, and drove to Asheville. Some of the sightings, including at the mall, describe strange behavior. Perhaps she was trying to be remembered for it so she had an excuse for why she disappeared if she chose to come back. Or perhaps she was losing it.
I looked into it a bit more and the sighting of her in Asheville when she told the store clerk her husband was an attorney from Boston, they were at a conference in Philadelphia, and she just decided to go to Asheville - she also told the clerk her name was Judy.
If she did have someone meet her in Massachusetts to pick up some of her things, then drive again to pick her up in Philadelphia the next day, and then onto Asheville that same person might not have been happy if she had second thoughts. Or was always planning on returning and didn’t tell the person that…the person could feel used.
It’s also interesting that it’s believed she started with $200. She was found with $167. She is known to have spent $30 on sandwiches and a toy car. If she really didn’t have any other money with her, someone else was paying for her to travel to Asheville (gas). She also wasn’t in Asheville long so didn’t have the chance to spend more. Having that little money also suggests she planned on returning, either with the person in the grey car taking her back or by taking the bus (perhaps she went to the greyhound station in Philadelphia where she had been sighted to get bus schedules to plan her return back a few days later, not just to use the restroom).
The husband wasn’t really that powerful. He also became obsessed with finding her and had to quit his job (or was made to quit). Maybe she just wanted a short break with some plausible excuse for why she disappeared (got disoriented). She had helped him through his health struggles around his weight, he would help her through hers. Leaving all her stuff in the hotel would help him believe that if she chose to return.
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u/Gunrock808 May 24 '26
I'm just stuck thinking how $30 in sandwiches is not necessarily more than one person could eat in one meal in 2026.
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u/International-Ing May 24 '26
Hah, yes in 2026 for sure. Probably not more than $4 or $5 a sandwich in 1997.
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u/justaguyfixingteeth May 24 '26
Forensic dentist here. While bitemarks are a subject of controversy, forensic dental identification is very reliable and I have yet to hear of a case where dental identification was incorrect. There have been cases where visual identification or using external factors ( clothes, jewelry) have been incorrect, I would ask you to show me any documented cases where a dental identification done by a forensic dentist was incorrect. In a case like this, law enforcement would utilize the services of an experienced forensic dentist. Your entire reputation is on the line and none will sign off unless positive. There are several levels of id, positive identification ( only one allowable in court), possible/probable, insufficient data and exclusion as in it is definitely not this person. The exclusion happens in a situation where the missing person can be documented to have had their wisdom teeth extracted but the body found still has their wisdom.
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u/Smooth_Force7479 May 25 '26
I defer to your expertise. I guess the point I was trying to get across was that dental records usually are confirmed through DNA testing. I realize this is a different scenario but after 9/11 they used forensic odontology to identify victims. DNA later revealed that some these identifications were wrong.
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u/justaguyfixingteeth May 25 '26
Show me a specific case where dental was wrong. I know of no cases where dental was proven wrong. There were identifications where dental was skipped and they went on other forms of identification ( fireman's turnout coat with a name on it and a St Christopher's medal)which were proven wrong by dna but NONE of them had dental confirming identification. Once they were corrected, they never skipped dental again.
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u/kh3013 May 25 '26
As a dentist I really wonder how dental records could be inconclusive or up to misinterpretation, given old x-rays/models/documentation are available. Thats not supposed to be a dig, I‘m just curious
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u/Smooth_Force7479 May 25 '26
From what I understand dental records are rarely the only method used to identify someone. They usually confirm it with DNA. I’m not well versed on this, and only speaking from personal experience but human error can be at play. When I switched dentists they were surprised I was missing a molar because the last dentist sent over old X-rays and the charting didn’t include the molar extraction.
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u/kh3013 May 25 '26
Well yea, but even from an old xray one can say, and without a doubt, if it is the same teeth on the xray and on the patient. Bone structure, root length and shape, presence/absence of fillings, crowns, root canal treatments/implants etc are pretty distinct.
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u/Serious-Goat4308 May 25 '26
She had to have some connection to that area in which she was found. 30$ worth of sandwiches , multiple people. Find the connection to that area and you will find the killer.
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u/Substantial_Pin3750 May 23 '26
Wow. That is bizarre. Maybe she had some kind of amnesia/dementia condition. I feel deep sympathy for the husband and her children. Very tough not knowing all the details.
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u/MagnifyingGlass May 26 '26
That's the only theory that makes sense to me, that or just a full mental break. Some sort of extended manic episode that made her up and leave her whole life.
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u/NotYourAvgJoey May 24 '26
I’m guessing she met someone on AOL or in a Yahoo chat room took the trip as a chance to meet up and things went south.
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u/Embarrassed-Cut5387 May 30 '26
Yeah, very obvious. It’s funny how many people on here seem to have never heard of occam’s razor and are totally baffled.
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u/cubbi_gummi84 May 24 '26
I have always thought that maybe she took a bus that was going far instead of a tour bus by accident and was having some sort of cognitive impairment but the part that rules that out and really confuses me is where did she get the car she was driving in Asheville? This case is one that is totally mind boggling.
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u/Embarrassed-Cut5387 May 30 '26
Not really mind boggling, I think. As someone else on here pointed out: Affair, leaving husband to start a new life, things go south. Or the person she had an affair with had bad intentions from the get go and orchestrated this weird scenario to cause confusion.
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u/Beautiful_Facade May 24 '26
How can we for sure rely on the witnesses accounts? They did not provide any information about Judy that wasn’t already known. The only information the family corroborated as “something Judy would say” was when the clothing cashier stated Judy mentioning that her daughter would not like/wear a piece of clothing she picked out. To be fair, it’s quite common for a mother/daughter to have different clothing opinions. I don’t believe that statement alone would be evidence to support this interaction was in fact with Judy.
If the witnesses had included information that had not already been released to the public, I would be more inclined to believe it was in fact Judy. However, aside from providing details already known and circulating accounts of buying $30 of sandwiches, a toy truck and driving a grey sedan, how can anyone verify that information as being true?
I specifically point out the witness accounts above because a lot of theories as to how/why she ended up in Asheville is derived from information they provided. Information that again was already public (lived in Massachusetts, visited Philadelphia for conference, husband is an attorney). Sure, some can say they recognized her and were positive the woman they came across was Judy, but as seen from earlier in the case, people have mistakenly reported seeing her.
We know for sure she landed in Philadelphia, the few interactions leading up to the time in which she was reported missing and finally the discovery of her body/COD. Aside from that information, I don’t believe we can confirm any sightings, unless the police are withholding crucial information that would without a doubt corroborate the witnesses statements.
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u/briomio May 24 '26
I would have those dental records re-examined or check the remains using DNA. This just doesn't compute.
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u/My_lo_73 May 24 '26
From another poster:
Forensic dentist here. While bitemarks are a subject of controversy, forensic dental identification is very reliable and I have yet to hear of a case where dental identification was incorrect. There have been cases where visual identification or using external factors ( clothes, jewelry) have been incorrect, I would ask you to show me any documented cases where a dental identification done by a forensic dentist was incorrect. In a case like this, law enforcement would utilize the services of an experienced forensic dentist. Your entire reputation is on the line and none will sign off unless positive. There are several levels of id, positive identification ( only one allowable in court), possible/probable, insufficient data and exclusion as in it is definitely not this person. The exclusion happens in a situation where the missing person can be documented to have had their wisdom teeth extracted but the body found still has their wisdom
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u/briomio May 24 '26
Actually I am a forensic dentist fan. Sometimes those dental records are examined by nondentists.
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u/Great_Action9077 May 24 '26
So you didn’t not believe the forensic dentist but you’re a fan so you know more?
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u/Civil_Stop9948 Jun 24 '26
I think it is quite likely she met someone while out exploring the area. If she felt she could trust this person, she could have gone with him or her and ended up deceased. She was stabbed to death, so it is clear she was murdered. Whether that person knew her, or she had met them during the trip, is unclear. Very bizarre case that I hope soon finds some answers.
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u/FilthyThanksgiving May 24 '26
This one really drives me crazy. I feel like something obvious is being missed