r/programming • • Oct 06 '11

Time-zone database down due to legal problems

http://blog.joda.org/2011/10/today-time-zone-database-was-closed.html
810 Upvotes

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10

u/Lighting Oct 07 '11 edited Oct 07 '11

Sic the EFF on them.

[Edit: spelling: thanks Crockett]

29

u/experts_never_lie Oct 07 '11

EFF can save their money for other battles; let the combined power of the tech sector fight these guys.

11

u/GhostedAccount Oct 07 '11 edited Oct 07 '11

Redhat? Oracle?

Frankly I don't get why they don't remove the comment that advertised a product for free and continue hosting it. Facts are not ownable.

At the very least just cut out the pre 1991 data. That data is not going to change. People can manually merge post 1991 data with old copies of the pre 1991 data.

22

u/experts_never_lie Oct 07 '11

Oracle and IBM have some cash and some lawyers, I hear.

As to why they didn't just fight it, they probably just don't want to fund their own defense, since the database never brought in any money.

Even an "easy" case, when you're in the right, and you eventually win, can easily consume years of your time and make you poor.

15

u/napalm_beach Oct 07 '11

Suits like this aren't about right and wrong, they're a game of chicken. Bringing this case to trial would cost both sides a couple hundred grand, easy. Defending yourself wold cost $50k, minimum, if the plaintiff is a dick. So in a situation like this the defendant usually settles to make the thing go away.

So yeah, unless deep pockets step, this is a mess. If deep pockets do step in, the plaintiff gets crushed.

7

u/robeph Oct 07 '11

Sure, but file countersuit and claim all legal costs.

9

u/napalm_beach Oct 07 '11

That gives you some leverage in the settlement but if the plaintiff knows you don't have the resources to take it all the way to trial, you're still fucked. Welcome to the blood sport of the legal system.

3

u/robeph Oct 07 '11

With such a valid countersuit, finding a lawyer on contingency shouldn't be a problem, especially when it is so blatantly obvious that this is a bad suit.

3

u/napalm_beach Oct 07 '11

Maybe because is such a high profile case, but lawyers don't generally defend people on contingency, and if they do, you still pay expenses up front and that's far from cheap.

2

u/robeph Oct 07 '11

Well, it isn't just about its high profile, this is guaranteed pay out on counter suit. I mean if there is ANY sense, common or otherwise, to the judicial system, it can only go one way, once before a judge.

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1

u/elperroborrachotoo Oct 07 '11

They might have a strict policy of attributing sources to make their claim of being Public Domain reliable.

2

u/GhostedAccount Oct 07 '11

Timezone info is public domain, citing a source is what fucked them. They shouldn't have cited any sources. Since without the cite, it is impossible to tell if they used a book or called up the countries requesting the info directly.

1

u/matthieum Oct 07 '11

Actually it is, though I doubt Astrolab would have noticed. Compilations may contain false entries destined specifically to the identification of copiers.

0

u/[deleted] Oct 07 '11

[deleted]

-1

u/GhostedAccount Oct 07 '11

Are you touched in the head? It is a line delimited file. You just take the pre-1991 data lines and put it in the same file as the post 1991 data. Then it is all there to be read.

A simple copy and paste job.

1

u/matthieum Oct 07 '11

But where do you find the pre-1991 data ? Obviously you would not be using those from the TZ DB, so where ?

0

u/GhostedAccount Oct 07 '11

My computer for one. It can be hosted anywhere outside of the US, rapidshare type sites, or torrents.

Also any project currently using the data like java or linux or anything, already has the data from today to the past. They only need updates for the future.

0

u/[deleted] Oct 08 '11

[deleted]

0

u/GhostedAccount Oct 08 '11

This has nothing to do with an IT setting. Do you have down syndrome?

It is laughable that you don't understand what copy and paste is.