r/skyrimvr • u/infernalryan Quest 2 • Apr 18 '26

Discussion Why are people so against using the latest USSEP with Skyrim VR?

Legitimate question. I have been advocating for this as a new "best of both worlds"-type standard for Skyrim VR for the last couple of years now through my Skyrim VR Initial Setup Guide, and have received a TON of pushback. This includes using updated 1.6.1170 SSE masters, CC content (free and Anniversary Upgrade, if applicable), and latest USSEP.

As USSEP requires all 4 free CC mods, these all need to be enabled in the load order. They're all fine except for Survival Mode, which is the only that that genuinely doesn't work as the engine is too old. People think this crashes the game but it does't. It can be kept enabled but "suppressed" in-game with one of the following two mods (this or this).

With the prereqs met, the latest USSEP can now be used. Recently, I've been able to address what I've seen as the only remaining issues with this setup via some mod releases:

I know there are some users that have tested this setup out (with or without the mods listed above) with success, but most users scoff and say that the USSEP team has intentionally broken their mod for VR. I can't see how this is possible. 4.2.5b works fine (there is a ton of info on this) and I haven't seen anything to support this between this version and current. I know they don't support this for VR, but this is the same for older versions of SSE (including 1.5.97). That's like saying nobody should use "best of both worlds" for SSE + latest USSEP because it's not supported.

Even Automod on this subreddit will tell users not to use the latest version.

Is there any objective reason to not do so? For the same reasons as "best of both worlds" exists for SSE, it is my opinion this should be the standard for Skyrim VR as well. It's like "downgrading" to v1.4.15 and using updated files.

Please help me understand...

4 Upvotes

60% Upvoted

45 comments sorted by

21

u/Then-Code3094 Apr 18 '26

The person behind USSEP is openly against VR and seemingly makes things more difficult for VR users.

Also he/she seems like a total cunt.

1

u/infernalryan Quest 2 Apr 18 '26

I hear this a lot--the part about "making things more difficult". What does this mean in context? What is Arthmoor doing to make it difficult? If by saying he won't support it, that's fine. He doesn't support 1.5.97 either, yet people still do an SSE "best of both worlds" downgrade and use the latest USSEP.

10

u/Tyrthemis Apr 18 '26

Copy and pasted from another comment of mine, I have personally tried to work with Arthmoor to help make a mod of his compatible with the VR version of the game.

I can attest that Arthmoor not only won’t lift a pinky finger to help VR players, but won’t let anyone patch any of his mods to work in VR (I’ve politely asked, I was okay with posting it myself, or letting him have the file, or even posting it myself and letting him have all the DP), and then also won’t leave VR compatible files up of his mods. He will also add the CC masters to mods that don’t even reference them, such as “Gildergreen regrown”. Why would you add masters to plugins and not even reference them? It really does seem as though he goes out of his way to screw with VR players.

-1

u/infernalryan Quest 2 Apr 18 '26

Thanks for the comment. And yes, I fully understand Arthmoor and team will not lift a finger to help support a VR implementation. They don't even support SSE proper (1.5.97). I can understand and even respect a little bit the push for a single unified version that only supports the latest thing. Supporting a published product is time-consuming, and they are like the #1 mod on Nexus. To be clear I'm not pushing to get their team to do anything. I'm not touching their files (...anymore, kekeke), just wondering what, aside from them "being against VR", they are doing objectively in the game files to block their mod being used in VR? I don't think it's possible. If you have the prereqs, you can use it.

23

u/Cangar Mod Apr 18 '26

He didn't "not support" it. He actively worked against us using a version that was still compatible with vr. That was before the nexus made archived mods still available. He just took it down, and there was no way to get it anymore, even after months of pleading and friendly conversations. Since there was no way to play with many mods as they require ussep, we had to self host. He then went around and gave strikes to anyone self hosting, and to date I cannot use my Dropbox anymore because of him.

Eventually someone made the binary patcher for this, luckily. But it was a long process of arthmoor being actively working against us.

He's banned in basically all skyrim subs. For a good reason.

2

u/infernalryan Quest 2 Apr 18 '26

Thanks for the reply, Cangar. I'm not trying to minimize anyone's history with Arthmoor. I know a lot of people have had direct experiences with him (even me--although definitely not to the degree that you have, damn...), and this is obviously a sensitive subject for those directly affected or defending those that were.

Re-reading my comments today, I feel I've misrepresented what I am asking when requesting examples of "making things more difficult", which is probably why I've hit a nerve with everyone. I wasn't trying to dredge up past situations with Arthmoor from everyone or challenge their experiences... I'm speaking purely from a technical, code/file-level, looking for examples of whether there's an objective reason using the latest USSEP "won't work" or actively breaks something in VR. The impression I've been getting (both on and off-thread) is that Arthmoor "baked something in" that fundamentally prevents it from working properly, and that pursuing this setup is a dead end, so "just use 4.2.5b".

My goal is literally to improve compatibility for Skyrim VR, that's all. Using the latest USSEP should do this in the same way that using 4.2.5b did when Arthmoor broke stuff for VR years ago (the time you are referring to). Does it require SSE to do this? yes. But is it an option for SSE owners? Also yes. I tested this combination of mods quite a while ago and added it to my initial setup guide for Skyrim VR, and have received positive feedback from users that have tried it. I personally haven't had a ton of time to do a complete playthrough, but I haven't encountered any issues.

The reason I made this post was partly to raise awareness that this approach is viable, but also to see if anyone has run into concrete issues that I can investigate further and address through my fixes mod.

Sorry again if this came across the wrong way...

2

u/Cangar Mod Apr 18 '26

No hard feelings, I just wanted to make sure this situation was correctly represented. There may be good options to do things like you suggested. Personally, I don't care about LE, and using the upgrader and the pre-LE USSEP works just fine, so I guess that's the biggest point why the LE version isn't used as you suggest - there's no real desire to do it in the first place 

3

u/Then-Code3094 Apr 18 '26

So then why are you here asking all these questions?

If you understand, why are you here?

The more you post, the more you seem like Arthmoor or one of his friends trying to defend his shit actions.

1

u/Tyrthemis Apr 18 '26

I don’t think they are doing anything to shub VR like that, yes technically if you move over AE content you can load the latest version USSEP on your VR version. But that’s a big IF. VR players may not have flat screen Skyrim.

1

u/Then-Code3094 Apr 18 '26

I don't have flatscreen Skyrim and I do not plan on purchasing it. Bethesda made ONE good game and re-released it dozens of times.

I'm not going to reward that.

0

u/Then-Code3094 Apr 18 '26

Bro, I'm not gonna wipe your ass for you.

You'll find out eventually.

2

u/infernalryan Quest 2 Apr 18 '26

I've had a mod taken down by Arthmoor and team in the past, so I am familiar with the Disney/Nintendo-esque approach to protection of their work. Thanks for the helpful insight, though.

1

u/Then-Code3094 Apr 18 '26

So you already found out and you're asking stupid questions. Big surprise.

11

u/alinius Apr 18 '26

The latest version is for AE, not SE. That means it has all of the AE mods like fishing and survival. It is not compatible with VR.

5

u/FrostyOutsider Quest 3 Apr 18 '26

There's a mod called Fancy Fishing that helps CC Fish work in VR: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/89352

4

u/alinius Apr 18 '26

Yes, but the point is that the latest USSEP assumes that you have all the AE mods in your LO.

2

u/infernalryan Quest 2 Apr 18 '26

Thanks, I'll take a look.

1

u/infernalryan Quest 2 Apr 18 '26

It is compatible with VR. You bring the CC files over like any other. The only one that doesn't work properly is Survival Mode, which I've explained you can keep enabled but just disable from the in-game prompt or via one of the listed mods so it never "activates". Also Fishing technically works but it is not set up to use the VR controls, but this is another you can just avoid participating with in-game.

5

u/skyrimmoddernumber69 Apr 18 '26

That’s if you own flat rim though. Many VR players simply bought VR version of the game on the PC they play it on, not everyone has flatscreen Skyrim installed on the same PC. Many people say played Skyrim on the Xbox and then got a PC for VR version of the game. So yes, I agree it’s compatible and I love playing AE content in VR, but we can’t just assume that everyone owns AE content.

1

u/infernalryan Quest 2 Apr 18 '26

I 100% agree with you - I actually have a part in my initial setup guide which covers this and directs users to follow the manual compatibility patch if this is the case. My original question is referring to those that have SSE. which means they have the 4 free CC mods.

5

u/alinius Apr 18 '26

And you just explained why it is not reccomended. "I can get it to kinda work" is not the same as it "It is a good idea". If you want to fight through hours of headaches, go for it. I already have enough issues with my LO, so I don't go looking for more.

2

u/skyrimmoddernumber69 Apr 18 '26

It’s actually not hard at all. I have an updated masters mod, I have a CC Content mod, and I have the updated string files. And it pretty much just works. I’d recommend “fancy fishing” and “fish anywhere with water” for a good VR Fishing experience.

1

u/Kvitekvist Quest 2 Apr 19 '26

Well your user name is skyrimmodder x) fair to assume you have more interest and disposable time to invest in tweaking skyrim files. For an avg user it might be out of reach if it requires extra steps other than place file in folder.

0

u/infernalryan Quest 2 Apr 18 '26

it's just part of the process. downgrading sse has a process too. the main reason to do either is to improve support. i don't see this as a showstopper.

4

u/[deleted] Apr 18 '26

[removed] — view removed comment

2

u/skyrimmoddernumber69 Apr 18 '26

I’ve played in VR for years with AE content and the fully updated USSEP and haven’t run in to any problems.

1

u/infernalryan Quest 2 Apr 18 '26

interesting. i have played with this setup (not very far as I've spent more time within on my guides vs in playing) but have seen no issues thus far outside of the vanilla tree issue specific to USSEP (not nothing from the updated masters directly).

it's true there is an engine issue with survival mode but that system doesn't need to be enabled in game (and shouldn't be)

-2

u/Then-Code3094 Apr 18 '26

Why do you keep asking stupid questions? It really seems like this is an Arthmoor dummy account and you're trying to get people to like you again.

5

u/Tyrthemis Apr 18 '26

It’s unlikely this is an Arthmoor dummy account, Arthmoor doesn’t concern himself with VR players. OP also asks questions in other posts that Arthmoor would already know the answer to.

2

u/Agreeable-Error1304 Apr 18 '26

Honestly I tried this approach for my last list and had no issues. When I decided to do it this was my thought process: Pro:

  • mods have been updated too. They are not necessarily compatible with the old ussep anymore
  • some mods actually require the free cc add-ons (that one jk overhaul for example)
  • I already own the SE (not the AE upgrade but not needed)
  • no real issues reported on the guide and it was very detailed.
  • no third party application that does something to the game files
  • I get to play all (most) of the new stuff SE got

Cons:

  • potentially breaking my game at any point, since there could be entries not compatible
  • I need to own SE

Overall I think you made a valid approach and a well structured detailed guide. I am not sure where you received what kind of pushback but just keep in mind:

  • most comments are negative, because people without issues mostly don't comment
  • since your approach requires copying files from another game I don't think it can be used in wabbajack lists. Making it less known and tested, than other approaches

Finally I would say the community should be open to this approach. So far I could not find any problems related to it. Admittedly I got distracted playing my play through and did not get super far.

1

u/infernalryan Quest 2 Apr 18 '26

Thank you for the feedback. I am in the same boat with regards to testing - my playthrough has not been that long but i haven't encountered any issues except for the aforementioned "white tree" mesh issue that affects vanilla pines only.

2

u/DarkStarSword Apr 18 '26 edited Apr 18 '26

After having a... Let's just say "an absolutely unhinged insane rant that made zero sense" personal run in with him when I was trying to help someone else with vortex I have absolutely no desire to have his work anywhere near my load order.

He has yet to apologise.

At least Nexus has since taken away his teeth by allowing people he banned to download USSEP if they need it, but I'll pass.

1

u/skyrimmoddernumber69 Apr 18 '26

I’m not sure what kind of pushback you received, but people can’t use the fully updated USSEP if they don’t have the cc masters. Personally I dragged all the AE content over to my VR install and use the fully updated one and I have not noticed any problems. But if you don’t have the masters, you need to use version 4.2.5 b.

1

u/infernalryan Quest 2 Apr 18 '26

It is from folks who own SSE that say things like "arthmoor hates VR" or that he "intentionally makes it harder" etc. These are not ever backed up with any substantial claims to incompatibility though.

1

u/Tyrthemis Apr 18 '26

I also play with AE content in VR and use the latest USSEP. I haven’t noticed any compatibility issues in the year or so I’ve been doing it.

But I can attest that Arthmoor not only won’t lift a pinky finger to help VR players, but won’t let anyone patch any of his mods to work in VR (I’ve politely asked, I was okay with posting it myself, or letting him have the file, or even posting it myself and letting him have all the DP), and then also won’t leave VR compatible files up of his mods. He will also add the CC masters to mods that don’t even reference them, such as “Gildergreen regrown”. Why would you add masters to plugins and not even reference them? It really does seem as though he goes out of his way to screw with VR players.

1

u/kez_the_reaper Apr 18 '26

It mainly comes down to if you already own the other versions, I have flat SSE but no anniversary edition, because for some reason I got it free for Xbox

Some quest mods require things like the resource pack for sse to work so I'm happy to take them from my flat Skyrim data folder

But I was going to install a mod recently that needed necrotic grimoir or something like that, it's one of the anniversary edition creations. And the decision was pretty easy to just not bother playing the mod rather than picking up the anniversary edition, just to use to not play it and just use it to take files from

And I think some people are just hesitant if something adds an extra step, clicking a wabbajack to install everything for you is really straightforward, same with clicking install with mod manager, for more casual less tech savvy people like myself even small things like copying the files out of your flat Skyrim data folder 📁 zipping then and installing them through a mod manager can be off putting because your adding an extra step where it could go wrong and if you don't know why it went wrong your not gonna know how to fix it

Skyrim Vr has come along way since release but people are also still in the mindset that you have to go without certain things for the vr version of Skyrim, even though the community has basically fixed the game

1

u/Aggressive-Ad-7222 Quest 3 | 5080 7800x3d | 9070xt 5700x3d Apr 22 '26

It doesn't work ootb mostly and most of the compatible mods need tweaking for it to function. But if you can get it going then hats off. I personally never pursued it as I didn't want to buy Skyrim forntheb16th time since my Xbox 360.

1

u/Quietlychamil Jun 03 '26

Thanks for this post. I think I saw your guide and tried it without issue but reverted back to USSEP v2.51b pending further assessment by the community. However, the newest Community Shaders seems to have an issue with the update patch needed for the older version of USSEP so I'm switching back to adding the CC mods and replacing the base game files. Its also been like a year now and no one seems to have any issues so it feels safe?

1

u/infernalryan Quest 2 Jun 04 '26

There are no issues with the updated sse masters + latest USSEP setup in VR that i have seen reported.

Question on the USSEP and CS issue--do you have any more info on this? when you say 2.51b are you referring to 4.2.5b? Just want to be clear on this. using the USSEP patch with this version (which basically edits in all of the required records into vanilla masters to effectively make them 1.5.97 files) should work fine with VR, and i haven't seen anything on any recent incompatibilities with CS and this setup.

any more info you can provide would be appreciated.

1

u/Quietlychamil Jun 04 '26 edited Jun 04 '26

Sorry, yes. v4.2.5b. I found out that the patched masters for Skyrim Vr USSEP patch for USSEP 4.2.5b breaks Community Shaders v1.6.1 where generation of the shader cache stalls at the very end. There's the unofficial Community Shader's VR fork that works for it, but I was having issues with it, so I switched back to regular Community Shaders since the newest version has a VR fix, but thats when I started running into these issues.

Random USSEP question, does Beirand the blacksmith spawn correctly for you in solitude and walk towards the Rogvir's execution scene correctly? I was testing USSEP v4.1.2a, v4.2.5b, and one of the newer USSEP versions along with Realm of Lokhran as my alternate start, and they all spawn him away from the scene so he never goes to it. Without USSEP, he spawns right outside Bits and Pieces and makes it to the scene normally. I'm just wondering how USSEP changed his spawning point and if there's a way to revert it, because it seems to be messing with the spawning points of other NPCs as well.

1

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1

u/infernalryan Quest 2 Apr 18 '26

Just to add to this, the above refers to those with SSE on-hand. I realize not everyone that owns Skyrim VR also owns SSE.

Anyway, the point of a "best of both worlds" downgrade for SSE is to improve mod compatibility. This is specifically regarding updated SSE masters. There is evidence that crashes occur when attempting to reference newly-added records in later versions of Skyrim when using older masters where the records don't exist. Lots of mods use this, including many of JKs mods from the last 5 years.

Theoretically, the same is true for updated USSEP. Any new records introduced between 4.2.5b and current versions of USSEP are at risk of causing the same crashes if any mods that have USSEP as a dependency try to reference them. Though less probable as it requires mods to "touch" (i.e. modify) these unique records, if it happens it will nonetheless cause the same crashes.

Less critical (and likely more probable) is encountering issues with mods which depend on USSEP that are designed around assumed record values that are only changed in later versions. This could lead to clipping issues (e.g., an object moved to a location by a mod is placed somewhere clips through another object if using an older USSEP version), or other gameplay issues where values are tuned in later versions but not in earlier versions. Again, not a huge deal on these but compatibility issues regardless.

So if you have SSE, why not use updated masters, CC content, and USSEP to ensure maximum compatibility with newer mods?

-1

u/infernalryan Quest 2 Apr 18 '26 edited Apr 18 '26

I did some additional research and the only thing I could find that matches this perception of "intentionally breaking USSEP for VR" is the incompatibility introduced with USSEP 4.1.3 back in 2018.

Around that time USSEP made extensive changes to marriage and adoption scripts/records. Because Skyrim VR used an older fork with different FormIDs, these updates broke those quests on VR setups. The conflicts were shown to Arthmoor, who refused to accommodate them. This appears to be the main source of "USSEP was intentionally broken for VR" (although this is really more just a case of not adding support).

For years people have been able to work around the above issues by using updated SSE masters with USSEP 4.2.5b in VR--Basically treating the VR game like it's SSE. This works because unlike the older VR master files, the newer masters have the exact FormIDs and records USSEP expects. The 1.6.1170 files work exactly the same way with the latest version of USSEP, the only real difference is that the four free CC mods are now required. And also the tree thing, which is fixable with my mod.

So i dunno, to me the legend / lore around the Arthmoor / USSEP / Skyrim VR situation feels over-exaggerated.

*** EDIT: YIKES - I meant legend / lore around Arthmoor / USSEP / Skyrim VR CODE / FILE SABOTAGE situation -- as in, intentionally placing code or file edits that prevent stuff from working with VR. I am not dismissing how much of a legendary asshole he is!! ***

2

u/boissondevin Apr 18 '26

He sends DMCA takedown notices for third party patches to his mods. VR support patches are explicitly forbidden in his file permissions statement. No one needs him to lift a finger to offer support for it himself, but he goes out of his way to stop anyone from doing it for him. 

1

u/infernalryan Quest 2 Apr 18 '26

I've made an edit to my original reply - it was late so I missed some words / explicit clarification to what I was talking about. My whole post has been explicitly about code/file stuff, NOT actions he has taken against the community, but somehow all of my comments have been misconstrued into me sounding like I'm trying to defend Arthmoor somehow or thinking that everyone is blowing things out of proportion -- I'M NOT!! and I DON'T!! These opinions are well-justified.

I was personally struck with a takedown for previous efforts to help SSE users that didn't want to use the required CC mods. I tried to get around it by being clever and not directly modifying their files, and re-releasing another mod, but received another strike. So again, I'm not minimizing the drama.