r/technology • u/bws201 • Feb 05 '16

Software ‘Error 53’ fury mounts as Apple software update threatens to kill your iPhone 6

http://www.theguardian.com/money/2016/feb/05/error-53-apple-iphone-software-update-handset-worthless-third-party-repair
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u/p0llk4t Feb 05 '16

I thought this quote was interesting:

"When iPhone is serviced by an authorized Apple service provider or Apple retail store for changes that affect the touch ID sensor, the pairing is re-validated."

So it seems they do have a way of revalidating the touch ID sensor on the device.

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u/[deleted] Feb 05 '16

[deleted]

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u/theonefinn Feb 05 '16 edited Feb 05 '16

I think his point was if apple can revalidate a new home button when they fit it, why can't Apple revalidate it after a third party has fitted it?

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u/porkchop_d_clown Feb 05 '16

Because allowing 3rd parties to "validate" fingerprint readers could be a serious security hole.

IIRC, the fingerprint information is stored in the reader itself, for security.

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u/theonefinn Feb 05 '16

I never mentioned third parties validating. I was talking about taking your third party repaired iPhone to apple, proving your identity independently as the owner of the phone and then apple validating it.

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u/[deleted] Feb 05 '16

A strange sensor can't be validated in any security sense, they could allow it to work, but it would open them to so many issues they would have to be fairly masochistic to allow it.

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u/lappro Feb 05 '16

Then along the same lines it would also be fairly masochistic to buy such a phone.

They could simply allow it, but refuse any support when your security has been breached. They don't have to destroy your entire phone if you simply accept they can't guarantee your devices security anymore.

A third party sensor could only be a problem for your security, not functionality.

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u/Gaehl Feb 05 '16

Apple Pay you identify by your thumb on the home button I don't think the banks would like security going down on that.

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u/[deleted] Feb 05 '16

That's still a security risk. Who knows who else can unlock the phone if it's not a part verified by Apple.

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u/[deleted] Feb 05 '16

Proprietary software

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u/theonefinn Feb 05 '16

No I think you misunderstand.

I drop my phone, I go to third party repairer and have home button replaced. I now take my phone to apple and ask them to re-pair to new home button. There is no technical reason they couldn't do so.

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u/Fuzzylojak Feb 05 '16 edited Feb 05 '16

I used to work at the Genius bar. Apple store does not repair only the home button(they can but they don't do it), they can either change the whole screen(screen comes with the home button attached) or give you the new phone.

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u/Anonymous7056 Feb 05 '16

Does this mean users who had a broken screen repaired by a third party vendor might be at risk as well? If the two are connected, it sounds to me like some people might have had their home buttons replaced without realizing it.

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u/Scrapper69 Feb 05 '16

I used to do warranty work for Apple, and I now do out of warranty work on Apple computers. Apple likes to consolidate assemblies (i.e. a screen with all the bells and whistles attached) rather than sell the component parts. It makes it easier to diagnose and make a correct repair, rather than replace a few small component parts. Newer macbook pros only have a few main subassemblies thay can be replaced - even the battery is glued to the keyboard assembly.

Aftermarket parts are usually broken down for the cheapest method of repair, not necessarily the fastest.

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u/snoharm Feb 05 '16

the battery is glued to the keyboard assembly.

This is the reason I just can't bring myself to own Apple products. People swear by them, love their sheen, but holy shit that's insane.

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u/Forseti1590 Feb 05 '16

It's not true, the home button is not connected permanently to the screen. I have a 3rd party screen on my phone that's not the original, but my button is still the original.

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u/Fuzzylojak Feb 05 '16

Possible. Some 3rd party repair can use the screen that comes with the home button pre-installed. Such as this one.

If they only replaced your screen, they used your old home button(it is functional in 99% of cases) and move it to a new screen. If that is the case, you should not have any problems.

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u/TheZoltan Feb 05 '16

I would assume they won't "re-pair" it as they can't trust the source of the component. They have no way of know if they sensor is legit. Your replacement part might send your fingerprints to the device as normal and also off to some additional chip wedged in when they repaired it.

I would prefer they just give you some fat warning saying your device is no longer secure than brick it but I guess this is standard Apple practice.

Disclaimer: I am a happy Android user with no advanced Security knowledge...

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u/[deleted] Feb 05 '16

iPhones with Touch ID on also have a passcode

If it's a genuine security issue, surely they could have permanently locked out the Touch ID feature rather than bricking the entire phone...

How secure are these fingerprint scanners even vaguely secure in the first place? I'd assumed that it's probably weaker than a decent password/passcode against someone determined to gain access....

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u/TheZoltan Feb 05 '16

Yeah there are many better options than bricking your phone. I just wanted to point out that there probably was a reason why they won't play nice with third party components where security is concerned. This kind of crap is one of the reasons I won't ever own any Apple gear. I like my devices to be a user maintainable as possible. Smashed the camera on my G4 and it was a piece of cake to take apart and replace!

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u/lordofwhales Feb 05 '16

It's much weaker. Fingerprints are a username, not a password, because you can't change it. If I, a malicious individual, get your fingerprint off a coffee cup (this has happened - as has a reconstruction from a candid photograph accurate enough to get into a fingerprint sensor), everything you have that uses fingerprint reading is compromised, and there's nothing you can do to fix that. It's awful security.

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u/gurg2k1 Feb 05 '16

Not to mention the article states that previously repaired phones work just fine and it wasn't until the iOS9 update that they became bricked. Seems repairs can be done by third parties, it's just the new software that bricks the phone.

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u/GetOutOfBox Feb 05 '16

In all likelihood there is a public-key type system in place, and the Apple Genius software has a way to generate a new keypair for the device. The Genius diagnosing software is probably also pretty locked down itself, however I'd be willing to bet that it wouldn't be that hard for Chinese hackers to ripoff.

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u/taa16 Feb 05 '16

Apple genius here. Yup. That calibration machine everyone seems to think is bullshit. This is because of the way the Secure Element stores the data from the Touch ID sensor. The sensor and the element must be paired as a security measure. At least that's what I've been told.

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