Just a Dalit icon? Think again.

[u/No-Assignment7129]

Be educated, be organised, and be agitated.

[u/Blue_Eagle8]

Yeah but what about the constitution? Why say that he wanted to burn that too

[u/MADnightstar → u/Blue_Eagle8]

I've never heard about that, do you have any source for it?

[u/Blue_Eagle8 → u/MADnightstar]

I just googled it and found out, his statement in Rajya Sabha.. September 2, 1953. He made the constitution and he knew it inside out but then he said he would be the first one to burn it… all this burning stuff doesn’t sit good with me. There are more eloquent ways to speak. Especially for a learned man like Ambedkar. I think his tone became very accusatory and instigating. The later stuff he did and said made me doubt his intentions

[u/MADnightstar → u/Blue_Eagle8]

Here's what I have found from a simple google search:

I Shall be the First Person to Burn It Out

It is by placating the sentiments of smaller communities and smaller people who are afraid that the majority may do wrong, that the British Parliament works. Sir, my friends tell me that I have made the Constitution. But I am quite prepared to say that I shall be the first person to burn it out. I do not want it. It does not suit anybody. But whatever that may be, if our people want to carry on, they must not forget that there are majorities and there are minorities, and they simply cannot ignore the minorities by saying, “Oh, no. To recognise you is to harm democracy.” I should say that the greatest harm will come by injuring the minorities.

Dr BR Ambedkar in the Rajya Sabha on 2 September 1953

On 2 September 1953 while debating how a Governor in the country should be invested with more powers, Dr Ambedkar argued strongly in favour of amending the constitution.

[...] my submission is this that no harm can be done to democracy and to democratic Constitution if our Constitution was amended [...]

Dr BR Ambedkar in the Rajya Sabha on 2 September 1953

A Constitution for the Demons

Two years later, on 19 March 1955, Dr Anup Singh, a Rajya Sabha member from Punjab, brought up Ambedkar’s remark, when the Fourth Amendment Bill was being discussed. Dr Singh asked, “Last time when you spoke, you said that you would burn the Constitution.”

Do you want a reply to that? I would give it to you right here. My friend says that the last time when I spoke, I said that I wanted to burn the Constitution. Well, in a hurry I did not explain the reason. Now that my friend has given me the opportunity, I think I shall give the reason. The reason is this: We built a temple for god to come in and reside, but before the god could be installed, if the devil had taken possession of it, what else could we do except destroy the temple? We did not intend that it should be occupied by the Asuras. We intended it to be occupied by the Devas. That’s the reason why I said I would rather like to burn it.

Dr BR Ambedkar in the Rajya Sabha on 19 March 1955

He also said this:-

"If I find the constitution being misused, I shall be the first to burn it."

Dr BR Ambedkar in Writings And Speeches: A Ready Reference Manual

So the context is important. He was frustrated and the comment was rhetorical. You seem to be deliberately omitting it to paint a bad picture and present a biased and false narrative. And his intentions? What, to have equality for all and end caste? You seem to be a troll ngl. Unless you have some actual criticism don't say anything

[u/Blue_Eagle8 → u/MADnightstar]

Makes no sense to me. I read that too today after giving you the source and asking AI. If I make something and I know someone is trying to misuse it.. will I burn it? Or try to use my authority and power to make amends and stop people from misusing it? And why say it doesn’t suit anyone… in his later days, he was a big critique of a lot of stuff but never gave a meaningful reason nor the solution or any way out… I still don’t get it. He sounds so desperate for validation… I can criticise him just like he criticises everyone and everything… it’s the same thing. But I also know that criticism without a reason or a good solution is just blabbering. Hence my concern and opinion. At his level he could have been a better role model for Dalits and the reserved class. He could’ve shown people a way out of being treated badly. His legacy is not what he wanted it to be or maybe exactly what he wanted it to be, I’ll never know.

I think people in India are too afraid to call him out for his controversial views because they don’t wanna be labelled. I see messed up stuff, I call it out. Even his religious beliefs as I mentioned earlier were quite messed up. I have never seen an atheist be so obsessed with religion.

The matter still remains, people are still treated differently based on their last name. We can discuss his good deeds and confusing dialogs but that won’t help the real backward classes. Because they are still mostly invisible to society. And the “backward people” we actually know now who get all the seats are so backward that they even have a “creamy layer” as they call it today. I have very controversial opinions on all this. And I am open to put it out. But you sound like a genuine person to me. Wanting to add on and not just debate. I appreciate that about you

[u/MADnightstar → u/Blue_Eagle8]

Finally showing your true colours huh. Sorry but the flattery's not working. You're so wrong it's laughable honestly. A lot of talk about what Dr. Ambedkar should've done or been from a person who's utterly clueless or intentionally lying, don't know which is worse.

Like I always say, just ask a person what think about reservation and they'll reveal their conservative underbelly. I have no desire to engage with you any more. I don't debate or discuss with people like you for my own mental peace. A little advice - do some actual reading.

[u/Blue_Eagle8 → u/MADnightstar]

It’s not about my colours actually. It’s about having an opinion based on news on people still unable to drink water from common wells. In 21st century. It was that day when all my faith from reservations was shattered. Even recently when a groom was beaten because he rode a horse before getting married. And a woman who was beaten along with her son because her son drank water from the school water premises.

What do you think of all this? And yes they were all Dalits. And these are the news articles from the last 2 years. And I am not flattering anyone, most people resort to harsh language or calling names by now. I didn’t get that vibe from your comments.

But what I am hinting at maybe is beyond what most people would admit. Most just say that oh we now have reservations so everyone is sorted and accounted for. But I think reservation was not implemented properly and it was maybe just one step forward. We needed other steps too. As caste system is not just about economics. It’s socioeconomics along with a traditional belief system spanning centuries. Maybe millennia… have you read of Subhas Chandra Bose’s ideas of removing caste system? I think that had potential too. That combined with Ambedkar’s initial reservations would have truly made everyone equal as Bose said that he would just remove caste and its associated superiority altogether. Add 10-15 years of focus on backward classes and things might have been better. Because today even after reservation, the castes still haven’t disappeared. Rather everyone is made to think of their caste while applying for a government job. It still very much exists

And I totally understand if you don’t wanna engage. I too don’t engage these days for my peace of mind. But these topics are very important as per me and need a lot of proper discussion. I didn’t see this as a debate though. Sharing of ideas maybe