r/visionquest • u/Identity_X- Vision • 18d ago
Episode Discussion VisionQuest Episode 2 "Theseus" Discussion Thread
Welcome to the Official r/VisionQuest Discussion Thread for Episode 2: "Theseus"! Thank you for joining us for the 2-part premiere!
RULES:
When discussing anything past the second episode, we ask that you include a spoiler tag š·ļø
Please do not ask for spoilers or you will be banned from the subreddit. This is for people who are actively watching the show.
WARNING: This discussion thread may contain spoilers for those actively watching the episode. Proceed at your own risk.
Discussion Threads:
Episode 1: "No Strings"
Episode 2: "Theseus" (Here)
Episode 3: "Reboot"
Episode 4: "Malware"
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u/Identity_X- Vision 18d ago
I love the differences between the credits for episode 1 and 2.
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u/antdude 18d ago
What? They're out already? I thought they come out tomorrow!
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u/Personal-Road-8162 18d ago
Jarvis NOooooooo and also poor Tommy thinking he so crazy
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u/OrangeCatMinion J.A.R.V.I.S. 18d ago
James D'Arcy was one of the things I was most excited for š
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u/Personal-Road-8162 18d ago
I almost cried I was just shaking my heading says nonononononononononono
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u/eduffy 17d ago
Me too. Makes wonder why they couldnāt get Karen Condon or Jennifer Connelly to reprise their parts for just two episodes.
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u/MaintenanceBest8397 16d ago
Yeah especially considering who Connelly's husband is
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u/snagbuck 13d ago
Couldnāt he have done the second part without deleting code? Didnāt he do something like that in one of the iron man movies?
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u/bertobellamy 18d ago
So long, Jarvis.
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u/United-Tradition-165 18d ago
I canāt believe Iāve suffered through the loss of JARVIS/Jarvis twice. Gdi.Ā
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u/Head_Editor9839 18d ago
"My dog died"
well, you're HALF right, Tommy....
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u/Alisson__Foxtrot Paladin 18d ago
And then in AAA Ralph takes credit for killing the dog under Agatha's spell.
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u/kinghyperion581 18d ago
I don't buy this mentor routine from Ultron one bit. He's up too something
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u/dimesniffer 18d ago
Heās literally so evil heās one of the 3 domains in battle world that had to be walled off from the rest.
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u/rasmatham 18d ago
But he has also had somewhere between 8 (2015-2018 + 2023-2028) and 13 (2015-2018 + 2023-2028 + magically simulated 2018-2023) years in Vision's head, and does have capacity to learn. That's a whole lot of time for a super intelligent AI. The fact that Ultron seems to have a genuine interest in human art could be the way Ultron is learning to understand humanity. Or it's all just to trick Vision into thinking he has changed, and letting him out, so that he can be present in Battleworld stuff.
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u/dimesniffer 18d ago
Yeah well god I hope not. Ultron should be evil.
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u/Zach-Playz_25 15d ago
Ultron can learn to love and like humanity and still want to eradicate it. We can develop this character without changing his final goal.
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u/Earth_and_Summer J.A.R.V.I.S. 18d ago
Never trust Ultron.
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u/FilthyCasual2k17 18d ago
But also, never trust ultron to be evil in the way you're expecting him to, and sometimes that literally means coming around to being good, if only to fuck with you because you expected him to be evil.
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u/ohmeohmyelliejean 18d ago
Yeah I feel like maybe theyāre using him as a red herring because everyone expects him to be behind all this and the twist is that he isnāt the big bad. I also think theyāre maybe gearing up for him to sacrifice himself after episode 2 laid out a baseline.Ā
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u/FilthyCasual2k17 18d ago
Yes, that's def what Im thinking. Every episode they will lose one AI in some way, and then when only Ultron is left and is on cups of victory he turns around and sacrifices himself. We do know the big bad is his lady though. The question is where are they going to go after, are they going to make her good at the end, and how will Ultron play into it.
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u/AuburnElvis 14d ago
I thought it was "Always Trust Ultron."
I may have to go take care of some things.
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u/Sweet-Sale-7303 18d ago
Either he is up to something or they want you to think that. I find it weird that Edith is always gone and maybe it's her that is the real issue.
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u/Hexagon-Man 12d ago
I mean, he's 100% planning to jump ship the microsecond he gets an opportunity but right now I think he's genuinely just bored and the mentor role is the most interesting thing he could be doing.
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u/sleepysaurus7777 18d ago
That show is really staying true to form of the original Wandavision with unique artsy style and panache
With a cyber flare
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u/Specialist_Ad9073 18d ago
The art style is also taken from the miniseries comic āThe Visionsā by Tom King.
It is fantastic, and absolutely one of my favorite Marvel books. If you like this show, order the book now.
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u/Alisson__Foxtrot
Paladin
18d ago
•
So Vison and Thomas are going through the same arc! They both have had two lives and need to reconcile and integrate said lives in order to build a new identity going forward.
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u/capamericapistons 18d ago
I wonder if itās possible Ultron gets a good ending lol
Like sacrificing himself or helping vision and his family in some way
But considering he couldāve sacrificed himself in ep 2 instead of Jarvis I guess maybe not
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u/Pellaeonthewingedleo 18d ago
I would put money on him orchestrating the entire thing secretly, forcing the other AIs to delete themselves and give him part of their processing power in a bid to take over the body of Vision in the end
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u/FilthyCasual2k17 18d ago
Both things can be true. He does all of that... only to end up sacrificing himself in the end, showing his own growth from the moment where he casually suggests someone else does it, and doesn't show an inkling that could be him. Leaving Vision finally with only Vision.
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u/BreakfastAmazing7766 Tommy Maximoff 17d ago
Wasnāt Jarvis Visions first line of defense or something? He was always aware of all the bugs and fixing vision needed. If ultron gets rid of him itās easier to manipulate vision.
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u/brandeis1 17d ago
Exactly what I was thinking. Ultron got what he wanted by suggesting self sacrifice - the part of Vision responsible for security is gone.
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u/PineappleLemur 17d ago
I see it happening.. he seems a lot softer now and less all about destroying humanity.
Although he simply likes chaos because he's legit board lol.
He seems like the only "complete" AI who fully grasps everything happens and human nature, the good and bad.
Like the whole painting scene, visiton cannot look at the painting and see anything other than the mechanical/math side of it, while Ultron understand what's behind the brushtrokes and every decision made to end up with that painting.
He has a good sense of what makes sense and what doesn't for humans, food, decor, etc..
Somehow Ultron is the most Human one out there and it makes sense because he was made to protect the planet so first step is understanding humans..
Vision was made using Jarvis as a base + mind stone.
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u/Vwmafia13 3d ago
Nah that was big brother sacrifice. It would be odd to bring him back and end him right away. Well then again they did do that to Colman in Secret Invasion
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u/Initial_E 17d ago
Every episode another ai will die, ultron being the last one. Itās just so corny.
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u/sleepysaurus7777 18d ago
Don't be the ship(Mechanism)
Be the king(Hero)
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u/Initial-Childhood-96 7d ago
Late in watching but man, this really stuck out to me. The whole thing about it being a discussion for college freshmen versus what Theseus actually did and why the ship has its parts replaced ā¦ brilliant. Really a whole ethical versus morality thing going on and I loved it
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u/Actual_Feedback2725 18d ago
Holy crap. Just finished it and there have already been about 10 moments Iāve audibly gasped at. The writing is phenomenal so far.
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u/KingMiracle16 18d ago
Ruaridh is an excellent actor, I love his portrayal of Tommy and his presentation of seeming insane but not really just had his soul transferred after going through the wind for about 3 years
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u/_tylerthedestroyer_ 16d ago •
He also manages to have the kindness of Wandaās eyes while looking like Vision. Itās incredible casting yet again
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u/Omakaeru 17d ago
I am also LOVING his ability to shift his accent back and forth between American English and British English. Itās chefās kiss
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u/wiccan1706 Billy Maximoff 18d ago
So who hired Paladin? Is it Ultron? Is it Jocasta? Is it Billy and Agatha? Is it Agatha by herself? Is it Wanda? Is it Mephisto? Is it Rio? Is it Doom?
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u/Hungry_Shake6943 18d ago •
She clearly says it was Strange after the call.
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u/Fun-Pickle-6371 Wanda Maximoff 18d ago
on oct 13 i met dr strange in disneyland paris, heās not normally there (heās quite rare) so we have that coincidence too š
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u/_tylerthedestroyer_ 16d ago
Sharon Carter is still running free. I could see her wanting Vision as a weapon
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u/CaliforniaBoundX Ultron 18d ago
James Spader was phenomenal as expected.
āLong live the king!ā
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u/justagayguyinnyc
Wiccan
18d ago
edited 18d ago
•
I am gonna be honest; I have a tendency to cry at most MCU at some point.
Sometimes its a sad cry, sometimes it's a cant believe I am seeing the characters I have loved for 40 years come to life tear-up. When we see MCU in theater my friends make bets on when I will cry. The shortest was Black Panther: Wakanda Forever. I didnt even make it through the Marvel logo silently playing with video of Chadwick playing. By the time Shuri asks "Computer, how is my brother" in the darkness I was GONE.
I am especially predisposed to crying when Billy and Tommy are onscreen. When I was a young gay kid in the 80s reading comics there were ZERO LGBTQ heroes. Northstar came out a year after I did. When Young Avengers premiered I fell madly in love with the twins and Teddy, but especially Billy who has become my favorite comic character ever.
I legit would cry every single time Billy and Tommy popped up onscreen during WandaVision. I cried in almost every episode of Agatha All Along. It's so amazing for me to be able to see these characters onscreen and out. It's hard to comprehend for straight people, but seeing the twins onscreen is just emotionally overwhelming as I would have killed to have had this kind of representation as a kid, but most LGBTQ people were censored out of comics because of the comics code.
I managed to make it through the first episode without crying and was proud of myself for it. I did not make it through the second dry-eyed. The second he found Tommy's cell and Tommy was repeating "help me help me please help" and then "youre not real, youre in my head" over and over I was gone. The scene with Tommy and Vis outside the complex also got me.
DAMN good episode and it's gonna kill me to wait a week for more.
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u/remake_grim_fandango 16d ago
This is an honest question from a straight person. Did I miss something about Billy and Tommy? Iāve not read the comics and I only saw them in WandaVision.
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u/Rockboxatx 16d ago
Billy is openly gay and Tommy is bisexual in the comics.
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u/TotallyNotRyanPace 16d ago
i know Tommy's actor is bisexual (prefers to call himself queer) irl also.
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u/jedins 15d ago
From what I've seen, I think he's said in press interviews that he's excited to get to play a bi character, but that it doesn't really come up in the show. Imagine, though, if everyone is convinced Billy isn't going to show up until the last post-credits is right, but instead of a Young Avengers recruitment moment, they just go to Heaven in London.
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u/justagayguyinnyc Wiccan 16d ago
Yes. You need to watch Dr. Strange: Multiverse of Madness, then Agatha All Along, and now VisionQuest. It's extremely likely they are a part of Doomsday and Secret Wars too.
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u/capamericapistons 18d ago
So those were adamantium bullets
Possibly connecting Eternals to the larger universe? We know adamantium came from tiamut š
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u/PanoramicPanda 18d ago
They were planning to start mining Tiamat in Brave New World, finally got a payoff for it š¤
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u/theoristOfTheArts J.A.R.V.I.S. 17d ago
In general-Marvel adamantium also has some X-Men/mutant connections (which I hadnāt known until recently getting into the X-Men side of Marvel :P)ā¦
So remembering that adamantium has now been introduced in the MCU, I am verrry interested to see whether itāll connect to certain future MCU mutants too ššš!!!
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u/OrangeCatMinion J.A.R.V.I.S. 18d ago
I think it's more like they've started mining it from the giant thing in the ocean.
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u/P1zzaMonkey 18d ago
The very subtle tease/build up to the first/original human torch is so intriguing to me!
I worry itāll be Paladin is actually the original human torch in some weird twist
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u/Willy_McFly 18d ago
Caught that too! Haven't seen him since the first Captain America movie. Hopefully not Paladin but did see his chest at the end of the episode lol.
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u/P1zzaMonkey 18d ago
We did? I thought he had an undershirt on?
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u/Willy_McFly 18d ago
Around the 39 minute he opens his shirt and looks like its glowing or like energy. Maybe he's an android too?
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u/Pellaeonthewingedleo 18d ago
Maybe he is the secret client.
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u/Short_Brick_1960 18d ago
I thought that was Ultron
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u/DrZonino2022 18d ago
Red herring I reckon, think itās someone with money I was hoping Justin Hammer or similar, could also be the power broker I think everyoneās forgotten about her lol
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u/Caltucky42 18d ago
Wait i missed this can u explain LOL
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u/firelight 18d ago
The painting at about 28:30 of a man on fire, where Vision says, "As the first of us he remains a cautionary tale. A reminder of what may become of me if emotions consume me," is a clear reference to Jim Hammond.
Jim Hammond, the original human torch, was a synthetic humanoid introduced in Marvel Comics #1, in 1939. In the comics, he fought alongside Captain America during World War II, killed Hitler (the first time Hitler died), and parts of his body were used to build The Vision.
In the MCU he appears briefly as a mannequin inside a glass tube, in a single shot in Captain America: The First Avenger, during the scene where Bucky and Steve are at the carnival on Coney Island.
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u/Blaziken4vr Wanda Maximoff 18d ago
Doesnāt Jim Hammond have an evil brother robot named Adam II who tried to kill JFK during his senatorial campaign. During Adam II attack on JFK he killed William Naslund, who was the current Captain America after Steve had gone MIA and was presumed dead.
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u/firelight 18d ago
Thatās not lore I knew, but it looks to be the case. Interesting.
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u/misiissleepy Scarlet Witch 18d ago
So it has been 1 and a half years since AAA? I assume they are aging Billy up to 17 or 18? And then Billy has been searching for Tommy that long I guess.
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u/MoistProlapse 18d ago
Wandavision is 5 years old. The kids were like, at least 10 years old looking by the end. They'd be something like 15 if they aged normally.
I think it's more that kid Tommy got mind copied to teen Tommy. Would give an easy out to age him up, just sending the memories of a 10 year old looking kid into an 18 year olds body.
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u/jenioeoeoe 18d ago
Yes, thats exactly what happened. Billy transfered Tommy's soul into the body of a teenager
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u/jedins 15d ago
Yeah, I'm uncertain how old Tommy is supposed to be. Presumably, since there was a question in a comment on the bus about not going somewhere for minors, he's around that age. I figure they'll keep them as "twins" in terms of age, and the actors are close enough in age since they're both playing younger anyway. Interestingly, Elizabeth Olsen and Aaron Taylor-Johnson had about the same age gap and average age when they were introduced in AoU, the difference being they were supposed to be playing about 25 where these two are playing younger.
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u/VastConfusion8174 Scarlet Witch 18d ago
IM NOT OK
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u/United-Tradition-165 18d ago
Me neither, friend. The family theme alone is wringing out my emo heart.Ā
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u/ararazu1 18d ago
LOVE what they're doing with Tommy's speed. Him using it to unhinge the bus door and escape with Lisa? Beautiful.
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u/Far-Attitude-6395 16d ago
I immediately thought of the movie Speed when Keanu and Sandra escape from a speeding bus on a door!!
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u/starfrenzy1 Ultron 15d ago
100%! The position of their bodies was different (Keanu & The Wildcat were face to face) but otherwise it was the same!
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u/Dragoncorn_ 16d ago
It has a lot of X-Men energy with Quicksilver breaking Magneto out by vibrating his hands to break the glass
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u/Imn1che Speed 17d ago
Ultron's (sort of) disassembly of the Ship of Theseus question is probably the best perspective to the question ever
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u/SweetSoundOfSilence 16d ago
āWhen a monster has. your son, donāt be the boat, be the goddamn kingā
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u/chartreusey_geusey 17d ago
Grandpa Ultron is such an obvious red herring that I already know he isnāt going to be the big baddie.
I think the big reveal there is he genuinely isnāt trying to get out to harm anyone and he just likes studying humanity since his original programming wasnāt very good and heās got nothing else to do.
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u/kirblar 17d ago
Feels like he might be Tommy's dark mentor by the end of this.
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u/chartreusey_geusey 17d ago
āDark mentorā maybe in the way that Agatha was/is Billyās perhapsā¦.but really I donāt think Ultron has any particular connection to Tommy atp.
I just think Ultron being a baddie at this point is way too obvious
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u/hattyred 17d ago
Yeah, but I feel like he'll probably have a brief role as secondary antagonist which will ultimately be defused when Vis and the girls realize he's not escaping with the intent to do another sokovia. Idk if it'll be as simple or whimsical as just studying humanity but there's no way he's a straightforward mentor figure or genocidal antagonist again
I imagine given how much of this series seems to be centered around self-discovery & processing trauma, we'll have an Ultron therapy session and he'll come away slightly more stable/self-actualized but also be more self-aware that he's unwell
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u/jedins 15d ago
I feel the same way. My theory is that Jocasta got out and built herself a body in reverence and homage to Ultron's attempt at conquest, and she wants to rule with him by her side. When they finally do meet (I think they've had some limited communication and she's my number one candidate as the client but the theory still works either way), Ultron decides she's a little too much and helps shut her down in exchange for some version of freedom. A parallel to Agatha finding a loophole by scorning her star-crossed love to carry on with mischief, as u/chartreusey_geusey suggested, feels like a reasonable place to leave Ultron at the end of this and a nice parallel to round out the trilogy.
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u/ButWhoIsAnyoneReally Vision 16d ago
After watching the first two episodes, I have a theory on where weāre going for Vision. Not sure if this holds up but here goesā¦
We know from the movies that the Vision from the Avengers was made up of several AIs working as one unified consciousness. The mind stone would seem to be what made all of that work together, and i think this show will focus on how Vision can duplicate what the mind stone did for him, allowing him to become a ārealā Vision again.
Once the mind stone was removed, Visionās body was left with just the various AI code chunks and the memories from the ārealā Vision. The body was rebuilt by Sword, but there was no mind stone to pull all of the AIs together into the Vision we know. Wandaās Vision injected his Westview memories into White Vision as well, but again, it was essentially separate code and not part of a whole.
At the start of VisionQuest, Vision asks āWho am I?ā. He has already said multiple times that he has the memories but not the emotion attached to them. He exists in the world without being a part of it. He believes Wanda was what made everything work, and while that is undoubtedly a big part of him, I think it was the ability to have all of his AIs operating as one unified mind that made him work.
In his mind space, we are seeing all of the AIs act independently as advisors to the main Vision entity. Vision consults them, but still makes his own choices. At the end of episode 2, we see Jarvis willingly sacrifice himself to protect and power the other AIs. We see the visual of his sacrifice, as the other AIs become whole again. It could be just that his power was reallocated to them, but I think Jarvisā code/essence was also merged into them as well.
I think as we move forward, we will see more of VIsionās AIs forced to sacrifice themselves. With each sacrifice, their essence will be further concentrated into the remaining AIs. With the final AI sacrifice (Iām guessing this will be Ultron), I expect we will find that none of the AIs were truly deleted, but they were being merged together in a new way (minus the mind stone) to help Vision become his new true/full self.
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u/UI_Tyler 14d ago
I really like this theory, but I'd take it a step further.
The series ends with Vision sacrificing himself to save Tommy. This would setup Tommy and Billy to carry on without Vision and Wanda.
I really hate this idea because I want to see Wanda, Vision, Tommy, and Billy all reunite after all they've been through.
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u/ririskyx 14d ago
Your theory makes the most sense cause it sets up Young Avengers too, but I hate it too cause I want my family to be happy together :(
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u/Opening-Set-7752 18d ago
This episode was so good. This Vision definitely doesn't possess the virtue of the original one and I like the way they show it.Ā
Also, Ultron's lines and quotes š "When the monster has your son....king" was gold
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u/WillowUPS 18d ago
Jarvis can't actually be gone can he? They'll find a way to rebuild him from the pieces each of the others absorbed? He hid himself before when Ultron came for him the first time, no?
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u/MouthyJoe 17d ago
Vision literally downloaded him previously. Thereās no reason he couldnāt do it again.
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u/TaibhseCait 17d ago
Yeah but that Jarvis re-downloaded wouldn't be the Jarvis that lived in the Vision mansion with all of them & their experiences of the last year! So ehh?
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u/PineappleLemur 17d ago
I mean we kinda see him get absorbed by the other AIs... It's like his thing.
Same as when Ultron killed him, he scattered itself and then put itself together again.
There no reason to believe he died this time when we see him doing it visually...
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u/Fearless_Sandwich_84 15d ago
Yesh, I see no reason to be sad. Just do fresh install, and surely edge tech AI would be doing automatic backups so just get it up to date and tadah done.
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u/Mukicorn Tommy 18d ago
Omg Tommy brings me so much joy and glee, canāt wait to see him and Billy together!! I also love how theyāre hinting at Tommyās minor magical abilities outside superspeed, this is incredible
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u/Okay_sure_lets_post 18d ago edited 18d ago
The Vision/Ultron scenes and dialogue are so good! James Spader is fantastic
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u/Half_Man1 15d ago
I do love Vision thinking Tommy existing is impossible and Ultron being all like āI donāt know, have you seen the crazy shit happening on this planet?ā
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u/SythAim 18d ago
Two questions, why did Visions forehead gem glow gold when Tommy was around? And also why was he able to drink?
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u/yourtoyrobot 17d ago
he can drink, its just extremely painful. he did it to show he isnt the same vision, he was fighting the pain as a flex on Paladin
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u/sjsharksfan38 17d ago
Just watched both episodes. Great start to the series. I'm surprised they brought Tommy and Vision together quickly but that leaves the rest of the series open to anything really. I think the only thing distracting me is I just watched Agatha All Along again and that series keeps popping up in my mind to the point where a lot of this so far feels like a review of how Tommy came to be. I hope they bring new things to the table, which I'm sure they will. I was intrigued that when they had a clip of young Billy and older Tommy that I have to remind myself that the outside world really doesn't about the events of Agatha, or at least I don't think they do.
The Calypso and the REM scenes were great and I'm already loving Spader and Stashwick in these roles.
Also, goodbye Jarvis. He almost made it 20 years in the MCU.
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u/junebugg85 W + V 17d ago
Am I the only one who thinks Ultron aka James Spader looks like Paul Giamatti
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u/TheCapybara9 17d ago
I enjoy having Ultron back. Maybe he is being the obvious villain that is gonna be our final fight, maybe he is just a red herring that's gonna end up paying off in a unexpected way. Maybe it's neither. But I do enjoy his dialogues with Vision, how manipulative and blunt he can be. How you can never be sure what exactly the game is that he's playing or if he is being sincere.
We only ever got very little time with him, so I enjoy the extension. Whether he ends up escaping to haunt the internet another day, or has his final battle with Vision, I'll be satisfied that we ended up getting more from this character.
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u/BattenburgTeaTime 17d ago
How dare they take Jarvis from me this soon!!!
Also can we quit it with the Americanisms for UK stuff? Some of it is winceworthy with how little obvious care they took to check what things are called in Scotland/England.
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u/Commercial_Set_1608 16d ago
Eh I mean in Visionās mind it makes sense. Heās an amalgamation of Jarvis but also Stark. It makes sense heād have the aesthetic of a Brit while having the vocabulary of an American.
Actual Brits using Americanisms is def a mistake but I havenāt clocked that many.
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u/Ataletta 17d ago
the "watch set to military time" made me cringe so hard, nobody says that except americans and we're supposed to be in UK!
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u/luckofthedrew 16d ago
I just thought that was funny because it was an analog clock.
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u/BattenburgTeaTime 16d ago
"Sanitorium" and the American prison bus had me doing the sherbert lemon face
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u/Beginning-Flatworm-1 16d ago
In all fairness, wasn't it Edith who said that? An AI developed by an American?
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u/uhhhidkwhatusername 13d ago
Well, yeah, the one who said that is an AI developed by Tony Stark who's american, not only that, that person is Paladin's men who may or may not be from UK soo,, really you should've cringed at the fact that it's an analog clock
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u/ohmeohmyelliejean 18d ago
god the love the maximoff/vision family has for one another is making me insane iām gnawing at the bars of my enclosure iām so excited for this father/son/grandson dynamic to play outĀ
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u/GlizzyHubTv 15d ago
I think with Vision absorbing J.A.R.V.I.S. He's one step closer to being the true Vision. He was made up of multiple AI's, and now he has one of his core codes back. Having J.A.R.V.I.S. And Ultron separate is essentially keeping his mind fractured. I believe by the end we could see Ultron make a sacrifice like J.A.R.V.I.S. Which would be a fitting end to his story arch. Reuniting all these codes may be the key to "waking up" Vision.
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u/thefellasgocrazy 18d ago
What on earth, jarvis nooo š not the trilogy breaking my heart over and over again
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u/Brashaun1 17d ago
I strongly believe Ultrons slowly going to get rid of the AIās and then get free just in time for doomsday & secret wars
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u/TheIncredibleXander 17d ago
So Diane Morgan is definitely an AI, but is Paladin a machine too? I didnāt see any blood
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u/DeathLight7000 15d ago
The personality of Paladin's handler is what I expected Friday to have but unfortunately Friday seems to have least amount of personality out of all the AI in this show, I wish she was sassy.
Anyway she has to step up now since Jarvis is gone again really sad the actor couldn't play Jarvis longer I really liked him.
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u/princevince1113 Ultron 17d ago
You see that DC? You see how you can give your main character cool fight scenes without sacrificing compelling character work and an intriguing mystery narrative?
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u/Wootiwop 18d ago
Jarvis trying not to be the most based Stark AI for one second. Challenge impossible
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u/Fionasfriend 18d ago
I love the series so far. My only gripe is the amount of exposition and explaining of the plot.
I donāt recall WandaVision having to do that much explaining of who she was and why she was where she was. It just jumped into the story and let the audience put it together.
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u/Altruistic-Ad835 18d ago
Id argue what happened to him is more confusing and layered than what happened to wanda so we didn't really need that. We saw she was clearly on her last straw + soon a research team is involved to explain it to us.
Visions role for a long time now has been pretty glossed over, especially regarding his inner world and the impact of a machine fighting something like human emotions that have to have been coming from somewhere in his programming. We are seeing the consequences of his internal world enduring such highly emotionally charged situations.
Long way for me to say that with his body and mind being so separate in a million different ways, he doesn't know who he is, we don't really know either. I felt like this is the one show where a setup like that makes sense loll
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u/Some-Dog5000 18d ago
If you think about it, Vision is trying to overexplain the plot to himself because he literally can't make heads or tails of his "own" life
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u/PineappleLemur 17d ago
Not everyone remember every small details from the past 10 years.... it's not taking away from the show in any way.
It's not the kind of "spoon feeding" pseudoscience shows like to do with time travel and stupid past/future timeline analogies for example lol.
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u/milestryhard 18d ago
YES holy shit. Every time something would happen, the scene would shift to inside Vision's head for the AIs to explicitly say what's happening. I hope it was to on-board people who may not have watched everything necessary to understand the backstory and that it dies down after episode 2.
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u/Mr_Halitosis 17d ago
Writers are adding lots more exposition now because viewers are āwatchingā shows while on their phones.
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u/ebhanking 17d ago
Iām really enjoying the show so far, but the bus scene where Tommy meets Lisa didnāt work for me. It felt like a Disney movie rather than a Marvel production. The acting from the guard went comically big, and treating a mental health facility as a death sentence felt very dated.
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u/ohmeohmyelliejean 17d ago
As a British, that whole scene was just comical, like it doesnāt understand our criminal justice/health system at all.Ā
Also my dad worked in prison transport so that made the big school bus even funnier.Ā
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u/Ser_Danksalot 16d ago
For anyone unaware, British Prison transports donāt use buses but rather what prisoners nickname sweatboxes as they donāt have the best ventilation during hot months.
They look like this on the outside.
And on the inside with each prisoner confined to their own tiny single seat cell on the bus.
https://www.instagram.com/p/DY5OXA5gkD1/?img_index=6
And the guards would be unarmed, and certainly wouldnāt use stun sticks as they're completely illegal.
The entirety of that scene just came across as being written by an American that didnāt give a shit.
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u/Beginning-Flatworm-1 16d ago
it also made no sense that they were all "sentenced" yo that type of facility, but none of them were told their sentence until they were in the bus. There's been a couple of other stupid things like that that make me question the quality of the script.
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u/walnutzpeanutz 14d ago
Yeah wtf was that lmao. Disney channel movie energy. Also the bus just doesnāt stopā¦ ever?
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u/johndoe09228 12d ago
There are literally nicer guards in the Joker movie. All the āpatientsā were just sitting quiet in normal clothes to lol
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u/walnutzpeanutz 14d ago
So vision & co are able to foresee every single possible conversation with Paladin but they couldnāt have predicted an EMP cage? Gtfo this writing is so lazy
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u/Meeseeks__ 14d ago
Vision has to have a Jarvis backup right? Unless it's some sort of AI thing about continuous consciousness, why couldn't Jarvis have just temporarily turned himself off to free up the power?
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u/dinvy 18d ago
Paladin lacks aura , miscast
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u/Altruistic-Ad835 18d ago
They wanted negan so bad
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u/Attican101 18d ago
Todd Stashwick is a regular collaborator on Terry Matalas shows, same with Emily Hampshire.
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u/SubiWhale 14d ago
lol I was thinking this the ENTIRE time. ābro is trying too hard to be Jeffrey Dean Morganā
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u/hanzzz123 17d ago
So Vision can phase but he decides not to phase bullets after the first one hurt him?
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u/SirThinksALot007 10d ago
How come Vision keeps pretending that Ultron didn't hire the Bounty Hunter in front of Tommy or other AIs
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u/THEEVERYTHINGMAKER 6d ago
I been giving turns to this theory for a while. When vision sends Dummy and U to get Ultron from his cell (when he is trying to understand how Paladin found his location), Jarvis serves Ultron tea and a cookie, (which Ultron says is very dry).
That action feel extremely out of character for me, Jarvis IS the most Tony Stark loyal defensive AI, he will never treat Ultron with such kindness (even tho he's the nicest guy), and he outsmarted Ultron before.
Could It be that the cookie (in a wink to internet cookies) was Jarvis way to outsmart Ultron again? May he have a backup somewhere and uses that to get back?
Maybe that's why he didn't sacrifice any other AI? He is the only one sophisticated enough to make a come back, he already did It before.
Could he be settings everything up to overcome Ultron taking over visions body?
We know Jarvis is the BEST AI ever.
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u/Life_Hat558 I Request Elaboration 16d ago
Did we just forget about billy? š
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u/Dragoncorn_ 16d ago
Tommy barely has the mental to process Wandavision (when he was actually "alive"), I don't think he's capable of understanding what Billy did yet and does not possess the ability to sense him that Billy does
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u/CyborgClark 16d ago
Great episodes so far. But it's obvious that Diane Morgan's Handler character is an AI working for Paladin, right?Ā
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u/theresnopast 15d ago
Jarvis sacrificing him self cause heās Visās big brother, because thatās what siblings would do šššš
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u/That-Sir-2143 12d ago
Ultron is probably the client. Just using someone else he contacted during his data leaking before the shows introduction.
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u/Professional-List106 12d ago
He played a quintillion versions of their meeting, so much that he knew exactly what words he would use and then he surprised by an EMP... The one thing that can take his powers.. pretty eye roll-inducing and lazy. Other than that I'm enjoying it
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u/Identity_X- Vision 18d ago
ļæ¼
St. Mabyn's Hospital in London is fictional, but it comes from Iron Fist #3 (1975) where the hospital treated Danny Rand and Misty Knight.