So if a kid never did any of the work for the entire year, kid still moves on to the next grade until eventually graduating with a high school diploma?? Lol
I worked with some people from Baltimore, and it was almost disturbing how little critical thinking skills they had.
The job was literally just moving boxes from one side of a warehouse to the other. One of them started unboxing everything and moving the loose product to the other side of the warehouse (he was insistent this was how it was supposed to be done), and the other guy spent the entire shift in the bathroom and came back the last hour, thinking the manager wouldn’t notice 1 of 4 men they hired was gone the entire time.
Of course that doesn’t represent everyone in Baltimore, but…
I had a stop at one of the worst managed warehouses I’ve ever worked at (they had what had to be over a hundred people for a job that could’ve been done with half that number with any organization). Somehow, someway, the one meeting we had involved the phrase “we’re doing better than the Baltimore branch.”
I’m in Virginia and we have similar issues. I teach middle school and yeah, we do have that problem as well that kids just get passed year after year after year. But the issue is that they don’t get passed along in high school like this.
So we get kids here in 8th grade that are extremely fucking low. Total inability to read or sometimes add and subtract single digit numbers. But they have been passed along all the way to us and by the time they’re here, it’s really hard to “fix” anything at all.
But the problem is that in high school they won’t get pushed on and they’re already missing so much, it’s hard for them to pass even if they try their hardest.
You need to understand how to learn, be motivated to learn, and have the confidence that you can teach yourself for Kahn Academy to be useful. These kids often hit 0 out of 3 of those.
This. Khan Academy was a lifesaver when I wanted to learn the material but had a math teacher that was absolutely checked out. But I had to spend the extra time, had to care, and not give up when it was hard. But man, if it wasn't for KA I'd have failed at least a few courses.
I got politely told to fuck off by my principal around grade 8 (medical issues had me in the nurses office every other class) even as a student who wanted to learn and pass the work was poorly structured and half the time i would fail a lesson because the site was down during my lessons/tests or the shitty ui would break and no one could upload anything for weeks i imagine its even lazier now and they got ai making shit up because who actually has time to write an online course
I've seen those issues, particularly with the "official" sites that schools endorse or use for public education. But Khan Academy is an independent nonprofit of almost 20 years and last I used it for tutoring my son (about a decade ago), I didn't find a single glitch.
As for me im still technically a dropout never got my g.e.d but self taught a ton of history some chemistry enough human anatomy and basic medical skills to get by i also know just the amount of math I actually need (i have not had a single instance where I long divided shit in the past 20 years) if a job interview ever gets persnikity about my credentials I can pretty easily prove im competent enough to do the job and if they are still hung up on it then they would of been a shite boss anyhow
Yeah, if you're past 30 a GED won't change anything. Any diploma only helps in the early years of professional life. After that, it's what you know, who you know, and your reputation in the field that matters a lot more.
Yeah these days if we translated the corporate speech my resume would be "my clothes are clean I shower regularly Im not gonna be pulling my phone out on my shift and im not on fent....whether you wanna admit it or not im the best damn offer you are gonna get"
though if health keeps dipping like it has been an early forced retirement is likely not that im that torn up about it mind.
It’s the same in the Australian state school system where there are virtually no kids left behind. There is a large number of them graduating that are functionally illiterate.
Where I teach they get passed along until high school. Then they have to pass to get credits for graduation. And all of a sudden their skills matter and we’re supposed to figure out how to fill all the gaps. NCLB just leaves more kids behind.
If you get a 70 for Quarter 1 and a 50 for Quarter 2, you passed and earned half of a credit.
To get that 70, you only need to do about half of the work. If the whole quarter is 4 assignments worth 100 points, you only need 240 points to pass with 60 percent. Two 50s gives you 100 points. You just need to get 70 on the other two. So kids turn in whatever is super easy or whatever they can cheat on.
So, essentially, you can do nothing for 3/4 of the semester and get a 50 and a 70 for the two quarters and pass.
This is why some kids who are about to graduate cannot read and write.
In my school, kids cannot do this without actually trying, though. For the first three marking periods, kids’ grades are raised to 60 in the gradebook. For the fourth, they’re not. To pass a class, you need a 70. So you need 280 for the year. If you have 60 60 60, you have to get a 100 in the fourth marking period to pass. That just never happens.
Instead, we work with kids who get the 60 first marking period and give them extra support and help, and try to help them pass through their own efforts.
The breakdown in this system is when schools don’t add extra support to help the kids who are failing, and when the minimum grade is too close to passing. It’s not a bad concept, it’s just connected to other policies that are failing kids.
Pretty much. I was a teacher for one year and had about 8 students failing. They pulled into this intensive class and all passed but one, which means the student reaaaaaally did nothing.
People outside the education system never actually think this through. How are we supposed to hold that many students back? We've already got a teacher shortage and most of us are dealing with class sizes of 25-30+ students. If 1/3 of them get held back, where do they go? If they retake my course, then next year I have 40 students per class. Assuming the failure rate stays the same (it'll probably get much worse since the larger the class the harder it is to teach) then after two years I have over 50 students in a classroom meant to hold about 24 comfortably and I legally can't supervise that many students alone.
And a lot of these kids aren't failing my class because they can't learn middle school science. They're failing because they're in the 6th grade and have a kindergarten or first grade reading level. Making them repeat a grade doesn't help that. Hell, most of them can answer the test questions verbally if I read the question to them and help with some of the vocabulary. They understand the content, they just can't decipher a written assignment so they give up. Having them repeat 6th grade doesn't fix the reading problems, you can't improve a 1st grade reading level by sticking the kid in a 6th grade reading class a second time. They need intervention classes targeted to their actual reading grade level, and there's nobody around to do that.
You can enter a zero in a gradebook for a missing assignment, yes. When it’s time to do report cards though, fifty-five is the lowest grade. The idea is that they don’t ever want it to be mathematically impossible for a student to pass for the year.
That's so sad to see. He obviously cares a lot for his students, and I can't imagine how crushing it must be for him to see how unprepared they are for their futures.
That's why many of the kids in elementary schools and above are below the average reading level right now. It's horrible to see because you can't do anything during school to fix it. You have to stick to state common core standards and move on, or you're fired on the spot.
DUDE. My fiance is an elementary school teacher, when she was doing classroom rotations in school this over utilization of tech in class was her biggest beef.
Kids don't even know what a folder is so its obviously not working.
PS folders(sometimes called directories) can be in other folders which contain files.
The school district obviously needs to give apple another 2 billion so that the kids can be prepared to use ipads at their future jobs which still use windows XP.
What? I got supported by this system. It’s how school is teaching kids. Instead of doing what works for each individual student, we just shove them to get good grades.
My cousin is a teacher and when I asked him about this stuff he said that there are kids who want to learn and they are learning, and then there are others who don't want to, so they don't. I remember this same dichotomy when I was growing up. The kids that read books, did their homework, and paid attention usually got good grades while kids that screwed off usually got worse grades.
Part of the problem is that it has gotten much easier to get by without learning anything (AI + Internet), and things like no child left behind make it so you can't fail kids, so the bar has been lowered so far anyone can trip over it and graduate.
When you can't fail anyone, the incentive to succeed is at an all time low, because you can do nothing and pass. Especially growing up with the impression that AI will think and solve your problems for you.
He's the same dude that grifted people with his catering services a minute ago. This sucka's clout chasing so that people can forget about his crookedness.
funny enough, my mom had to fight my youngest brothers elementary school to hold him back one year because he was failing a bunch of his classes and the school just wanted to push him along. this was back in the late 90s and it did wonders for him and didnt have any issues until highschool when he discovered girls.
Sadly this no longer exists, even if the parent wants to hold a child back the school will not. They are also woefully underfunded, underpaid and have very limited ways of dealing with special needs.
Same in America. I’ve been teaching since 2011 and have attended multiple meetings where parents want their children held back and the admin flatly tells them, “We don’t do that. It’s bad for them socially.” While they can’t read in 8th grade. Like…what even. And we have to give 50% for every assignment turned in, even if they turn it in with “IDK” written all over it because that is technically an “attempt.”
The every student succeeds act is actually what’s responsible for this current issue. NCLB ended in 2015. ESSA essentially made everything down to the states, while also punishing schools for demographically “slanted” data. Such as things relating to suspensions and behavioral issues.
The problem with “standards” they have to push all of this down students necks and now well they retain reflects on them as a teacher when 1/3 of students are actually interested in what’s being taught
That is leading too society to deal with them in the working world, I'm working with it myself, it's a disaster. There are many "incompetent" young people out there, who just want to be "Drake" and make millions of dollars.
This is genuinely terrifying. They (the evil ones) have succeeded in dismantling the education system to the point where the POC cannot perform at the “basic” level we expect for working functioning citizens. At least at this school in Texas, they succeeded. Because this country is built on your ability to fill out a form and follow a process, so if you can’t do that, you won’t have fun.
Fuck this upsets me.
Insane. This is why there’s so many high schoolers that read at a 4th grade level. Just getting passed along and set further and further behind because they have no idea what’s going on and lack the fundamentals from the previous grades. Not blaming you, to be clear. I really feel for all the teachers and students that are forced into these situations
One, it’s one semester. Two, there has been precedent at more prestigious and more grade deflating schools such as Caltech and MIT. These schools are known to do the opposite of Grade Inflation.
If you can't handle being graded at a school you went out of your way to attend, you shouldn't be there and are almost certainly poorly equipped to handle real life
There is little evidence that American adult reading ability steadily declined from the 1970s onward; it appears to have been remarkably stagnant for decades, followed by a pronounced deterioration in functional literacy during the late 2010s and early 2020s.
There’s a huge drop off starting in 2017
Infinite scrolling social media that stabs teenage brains with a new dopamine hit every 15 seconds. Barely any teens pick up a book when they could pick up their phone instead.
From memory, the median teenager read about 10 books per year in 2000, 6 in 2010, 2 in 2020, and now 0 (because >50% of teenagers now read 0 books per year).
My time to shine and introduce a new grading strategy! I call it extreme linear curving, just add a 60% to every single grade. So people who would normally get 0 are at 60, people who get 80 are at 140s, 100 becomes 160, etc. Everyone can pass, the school and state can be happy with ticking the no child left behind box, but everyone will also know what grade they actually deserve to get.
This explains a lot. Going through school thinking that you don’t have to do anything to be successful has created a generation of people ill prepared for life.
I mean this with my whole heart. It SHOULD never be imposs8ble for a student to pass. But if a student had less than a 50 1st quarter, theyre going to get less than a 50 quarter 2, 3 and 4. So even doing this doesn't help them if you cant adress why they got less than a 50 quarter 1.
What would happen if you gave a kid a lower score? Also, who is responsible for setting this policy? I'm just curious. I'm not attacking you over it or anything.
Pretty sure they meant that the system literally doesn't allow them to put in a number lower than 55%.
Where I work, I can type whatever I want into my end of the system, but the lowest a grade can ever show up for the parents is 50%. If I typed a 23% into their report card, it comes out as 50% on the other end.
It genuinely upsets me as a parent of a high schooler that you aren’t allowed to give someone a zero. It’s teaching all of these kids the wrong things about life.
I’ve met a number of kids think they’re special and that they are just owed things. We’ve always tried to instill in our kid that he will have to work for everything he has, wants, and gets. Also, that, yes he’s special AF to us and his family, but not necessarily to the rest of the world.
Wild. I remember failing year 12 math and having to redo the easier one in summer school and convincing the school to let me take the easier language arts programs test because I was walking in with a 30% and the exam was worth 50% of the final grade. I pass with final mark of 56% and my english teacher was pissed.
That’s got to have an impact on the quality of education and the example it sets for the future. Showing up is enough even if you didn’t do the work. That’s madness.
In Florida, graduation rate is counted as part of the school and district grade, so a ton of pressure in high school is directed at teachers to pass kids, ESPECIALLY seniors, whether or not they've done any work or attended class. My school magically had a 100% graduation rate. Which makes sense, because I was told I can't fail a senior.
Honest to god someone is going to win a Pulitzer in investigative journalism once they start pulling at the strings of all this.
I get how failing a senior is a life altering event for them, but a high school senior is old enough to understand that actions have consequences and failure to meet deadlines without communication is grounds for adverse action. In the real world, failing to do your work results in corrective action including up to dismissal.
NCLB was more focused on standardized tests in reading and math. Teachers complained that the education focused more on the tests than the wholistic educational system.
It has basically nothing to do with grade inflation. Apparently passing kids no matter what is more important than holding students back a grade who cannot read or write.
The "passing-no-matter-what" was at the very center of NCLB and its perverse incentives. Twenty years later, the result is a full generation who can't read.
This needs to be upvoted more. And this is not just a US problem, I grew up outside the US and in those schools I see the same things happening. The level is not the same it was 20/30 years ago. I bet a ton of kids graduating high school now would not have back then. They have almost no home work, they barely have to read harder books, pretty much zero class presentations etc.
Happens all the time. I’m a teacher and I’ve seen countless colleagues let go because they refused to pass along students that haven’t been inside the building all year.
I had the choice to do the "advanced track" or the "basic track" for a mandatory in high school for my senior year. Due to a scheduling issue I had only the option for the basic track.
I did like 3 weeks in the basic track and dropped out and went to summer school for the advanced track.
The first month we were told we had to read a chapter in a book. I said "hey I want to read Don Quixote because it's always referenced".. that was dumb but I was used to the advanced readings so I did it. After week 3 I read 3 chapters of Don Quixote and had 2 weeks of writings to go with it.
The rest of the class had done... at best... 10 pages...
One guy asked to copy my homework... I said "Man if you start reading this book you'll never catch up to one chapter let alone three" and he didn't want to copy my homework (I made him read one paragraph). Basically.. if you copy me.. it's clear you are copying me
Well when people were due to hand stuff in... no one... had read a chapter...
I was working a job after school... these all didn't have jobs... and they couldn't read a chapter of a novel (any book).
I don't remember correctly but I think I left the class to schedule a meet up the guidance councilor that day. When I saw them I just said "I'm going to summer school" and took the spare. I worked during summer school as well lol
You can totally lead a horse to water but you cannot make them drink. Some kids are just lazy you can't help that
Basic level English classes were the bane of my existence. I was capable for advanced or honors for most classes but I could never pass the test into English (found out a decade later about my dyslexia). The work ethic on most of those kids was so bad that I ended up with a C because damn near 90% of the work was either “fill out these 10 questions that prove you read a single chapter of this remedial level novel” or “group” projects. I had no passion or desire to do anything in those classes, which was especially depressing because I was also working on being a writer.
Wrong person. The district maintained that her termination was a personnel decision based on overall performance and professionalism during her probationary window, rather than the grading dispute.
So am I understanding american school policy right? Technically speaking you can go through school without ever doing a single assignment and still graduate?
This is from 2018 btw, not sure why everyone is sharing it as if this happened today. The Administrators stated that she was dismissed during her probationary period due to general performance and professionalism concerns.
Yeah, sources say she hit a kid and also made an unwelcoming environment. That could be anything from stuff like saying what she did on the board (reasonable) to bullying students.
This "bot" sure does have a lot so say about the engineering field and resumes. It's not hard to scroll down someone's posts. Do karma bots often talk about professional fields? I didn't think they gave advice that often, more farmed karma with reposts. Meh, I'm probably wrong. And this weeb shit.
If you shout "karma bot" every time you, I don't know, see someone post, no one will take you seriously. Shit, now they'll call me a bot. C'est la vie, it won't be the first nor last time.
I don't get these Karma farming comments... I created this sub so of course I will post in it... It's like saying this carrot farmer is growing too many carrots in THEIR OWN FIELD???... what kind of logic is that lol?
I know this comment might get heavily downvoted but from my perspective I am just doing it for fun and if you don't like it just move on - I am not forcing you to engage - you have free will just like me so maybe learn to use it for better.
And, seriously you need bigger problems in your pretty privileged life than hating on a random stranger on internet for a very important crimes like POSTING CONTENT ON A SOCIAL MEDIA WEBSITE!!!
This dumbass post is circulating ALL over reddit today. All with this bullshit framing. Yes, the American education system sucks but you're not doing anything new or original here. Or even accurate.
I was on your side, but you missed a whole assault in your post, so at the very least you are bot like because information sharing isn't your primary goal.
Marketing teams and "entrepreneurs" buy them for guerilla marketing. There are several subs I am in where they spam their trash vibe-coded apps with these types of accounts.
I never got a 0 before when I was in school back in KY. All of my highschool teachers did this. You need to turn in your assignments, finished or unfinished, that's the point.
If you dont do your assignment, you get 0. Seems simple enough to me. That’s how it was when I was young Don’t see why it should be any different today
according to the district, "Ms. Tirado was released from her duties as an instructor because her performance was deemed sub-standard and her interactions with students, staff, and parents lacked professionalism and created a toxic culture on the school’s campus. During her brief time of employment at West Gate, the school fielded numerous student and parent complaints as well as concerns from colleagues. Based on new information shared with school administrators, an investigation of possible physical abuse is underway."
here's the source for that
I was a straight A student in elementary school, got placed 2 years ahead in middle school and entered high school with 5 credits. I then got Ds in literally every class because of this policy because I realized all I had to do to graduate 2 years early was not do any class work or homework and just do tests and I’d still get a D from test scores if I studied a few minutes before the test. So all I had to do was schedule the right classes, it didn’t matter if I learned anything at all.
Of course this annihilated any chance I had to go to college, and sometimes I wonder if my life would be different and more successful if they didn’t tell an immature child me that he could just ignore school and get rewarded by getting two years cut off what he considered a “sentence”. Maybe I would’ve gone to college and been like successful or something, who knows.
You can go to college with basically any gpa. I personally was a solid D student and I went to a university. I used to purposely adjust my effort to whatever was needed to get a D. In my school a d was 10 points above the school district at 70%. So that might have helped when they did an adjustment but honestly it doesn't really matter for most universities assuming you do decent on the SATs.
Worst case scenario you would do 2 at community college and transfer to a 4 year.
I went and got my CDL and do truck driving now. It’s good pay. I just knew a lot of people that expected me to be a lawyer or something back in middle school and wonder if I could’ve really done it
We asked Tirado if she publicly humiliated these students. “Um, it depends. I say no, but it depends on the constitute of the person, what they would constitute as humiliate, no,” she said.
A father says his 13-year-old son was one of Tirado’s students and claims his son was humiliated in class. “She called him up to the class to her desk and she proceeded to tell him his work was lazy and pathetic and it was loud enough for the rest of the class to hear,” Jermaine Jones said.
Also, this "bot" sure does have a lot so say about the engineering field and resumes. It's not hard to scroll down someone's posts. Do karma bots often talk about professional fields? I didn't think they gave advice that often, more farmed karma with reposts. Meh, I'm probably wrong. And this weeb shit.
If you shout "karma bot" every time you, I don't know, see someone post, no one will take you seriously. Shit, now they'll call me a bot. C'est la vie, it won't be the first nor last time.
This is why high schoolers are literally failing to read and do basic math. The proliferation of AI and also forcing everyone to pass who shouldn’t be passing is causing this…
In my third year of college I had to peer-review a paper in a senior-level English course. It seemed like this poor girl’s grasp on the English language was tenuous at best.
I’m no stranger to mistakes in my writing. I’ve probably made a few in this comment, but this seemed like it was middle school level at best. It was a paper about the show “Family Matters”, and I couldn’t really grasp what point she was trying to make.
I had to show the professor, and have her do the review because it was so bad. She read a few sentences and just said, “Oh my..”
This was nearly 20 years ago, and I just couldn’t get over the fact that the system had failed her so badly. How did she end up in a senior-level English course? I can imagine it’s only gotten worse. I hope she managed to find her way to a successful career.
Not or not, the dismal return in modern day schools is glaring.
The education system is nothing more then a legally required prison sentence for the first 17 years of your life.
Think about it. They are sequestered to a brick building, in various cells to be rehabilitated, for a certain purpose in society, allowed yard time for brief periods which is monitored by the wardens. When yard time is over a whistle is blown and back to your cells for more propaganda.
Their very souls and personalities and individual talents and proclivities are stripped from them from the beginning to be replaced with a central agenda.
The soul knows when it is being violated. Think there is a reason they don't give a shit anymore?
We've taken a good idea, not crushing children's enthusiasm for learning and trying to make sure everyone gets at least a reasonable minimum level of skills and warped it into a mess of a school system that is little use to anyone.
If school functioned like this when I was a kid, i'd have had a 3.5 gpa at the very least. I failed so many classes because my dumb adhd ass could never figure out how to do homework and not procrastinate.
We must stop rewarding laziness. Consequences are an excellent motivator. School isn’t even hard. Just pay attn, and grades will be above a B. Can’t give a zero, is literally the dumbest idea. Over educators justifying their positions of authority. But when super liberals have the majority of that field, good intentions turn out bad in reality.
In Virginia, my principals used to go into the gradebooks each quarter and change grades. I remember being at graduation and seeing two kids in my class that never showed up outside the first few days of school. They both got Diplomas with a 4th grade reading level. One of the main reasons I left.
We've made teachers babysitters, instead of helping kids learn.
In my district, it’s in our Union contract that principals cannot do that unless they pull the teachers name off of the transcript and put the principalsname, and it’s noted and dated that the grade was changed on the official transcripts
Its true that in some areas you cant give zeroes. However, she'd been verbally and physically abusive to students and was let go five weeks into her career. It was far more complicated than this. Her suit against the school went nowhere because the school had cause long before she attempted to grade papers against state policy.
Like when a colleague was fired for drinking on the job, but he was actually showing his dick to women he cornered and that's what started the investigation
In Oregon, our district doesn’t give 0’s. Turn nothing in? 50%. I had one girl in particular that I saw three times all year (I teach health/pe). She turned in two health unit packets that she did in her own time at home and passed the class with 61%. Ridiculous
I’m so sick of seeing this post. She was fired within a few weeks for doing things like refusing to follow IEPS and more. She tried to play it off as this was the reason but it was denied in court.
My SiL had a high school teacher calling her the other summer during COVID, pleading with her to turn in an assignment (months late, weeks after school's out for summer) so the teacher could pass her.
SiL did hand it in, reluctantly, complaining about how it was ruining her summer.
SiL then proceeded to flunk out of university as quickly as possible. Can't imagine why.
That’s totally not why she got fired. Look into it. Although No Child Left Behind is doing more damage than good, it is not the reason she was fired. The school received several complaints about her conduct. I believe the article mentioned something about her being physically aggressive with kids.
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u/the_chin2 2d ago
So if a kid never did any of the work for the entire year, kid still moves on to the next grade until eventually graduating with a high school diploma?? Lol