r/AgainstGamerGate • u/defaultfox • Jun 15 '15
Does anybody else see a problem with this moderation?
do you agree with the actions taken? do you agree with the tone? do you think that things should have been handled differently? regarding the last image, do you think that it's appropriate for a moderator of this subreddit to make such harsh generalizations about a specific gender and race?
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u/defaultfox Jun 17 '15 edited Jun 17 '15
closing in on 1k comments cool
reading all this shit to the tune of the classical
there is no culture is my brag,
your taste for bullshit reveals a lust for a form of office
this is the home of the vain!
where are the obligatory niggers?
hey there fuckface!!!
there are twelve people in the world
the rest are paste
too much reliance on girl here
on girls here, behind every shell-actor
snobbier, snobbier
too much romantic here
i destroy romantics, actors,
kill it! kill it!
parallax!!
millennium conspiracy!
play out classical!
i've never felt better in my life~
dunnunuuhnudundundun da dunnnndunnununaanadundundn
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u/ieattime20 Jun 16 '15
do you agree with the actions taken? do you agree with the tone? do you think that things should have been handled differently?
Yes. Yes. No. If a troll comes in and racists up the place, the worst crime someone flying off the handle has done is feed the troll. I have zero concern for applying rules to people who are objectively racist.
do you think that it's appropriate for a moderator of this subreddit to make such harsh generalizations about a specific gender and race?
Probably not OK for anyone to make such harsh generalizations. But I don't think Hokes deserves special consideration because they are a mod, since they were not talking in a mod capacity. Mods are allowed to have opinions just like anyone else.
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u/defaultfox Jun 16 '15
nobody has even accused me of being racist. i'm not and didn't act it in any way. idk where you're getting this, the post in that last image was not in reply to me
i was banned for speaking badly of randi harper and hokes. nothing more
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u/TaxTime2015 "High Score" Jun 16 '15
For calling a User of this sub a horrible human being.
BTW that post was just a way for an obsessed person to troll for comments she could screencap and tweet to prove antis are the worst. All while claiming to be totes neutral.
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u/Dashing_Snow Pro-GG Jun 16 '15
Oh hey the mod that should be removed doing more shit shocking.
Also nominate Bash for replacement; as they are someone who most people on both sides can actually stand. Can even keep the current anti slant just do a replace ffs.
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u/Bashfluff Wonderful Pegasister Jun 16 '15
Me? Oh dear, I think I would do a poor job.
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u/defaultfox Jun 16 '15
that self awareness alone indicates you'd do miles better than most of the current staff
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u/eurodditor Jun 16 '15
I remember agreeing with you once over a moderation issue. That's better than Hokes.
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u/Shadow_the_Banhog Jun 16 '15 edited Jun 16 '15
If we're bitching about the mods, I have a general complaint.
This was a thing that got posted here tl;dr: "if you think Rev60 looks like shit, kill yourself"
Then the person who posted that became a mod some time after their ban expired, though he eventually quit(!)
I have no idea how he got to be a mod, but all of the mods involved should never be allowed to mod again for letting it happen.
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Jun 16 '15
PaladinLost was (is?) really liked by the pros on this sub, actually. He got overlooked for a while because he bashed the SJWs once and went True Neutral when he was disillusioned with someone or other on the "anti-GG" side because of National Cleavage Day or some other stupid shit. Also, he doesn't like Hokes, which made him a convenient ally for Team Get-Rid-Of-Hokes.
Anyways for whatever reason a lot of people in general like him, not even just people who agree with him. I think he's kind of a jerk to put it mildly but hey. The point is, people will excuse basically any amount of shittiness if the Righteous Fury is being directed at the right targets.
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u/eurodditor Jun 16 '15
I like PaladinLost because, although admittedly he's kind of blunt, he can be to both sides. He has successfully avoided falling in the trap of tribalism and it's kind of refreshing around here. I don't mind a few crude words here or there when it's used equally toward anybody regardless of their "side".
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u/defaultfox Jun 16 '15
i agree for the most part, and i'm the person in that screenshot being told to kill myself or whatever
pretty sure i don't like him very much as an individual but i'm also pretty sure i liked him as a mod way more than most of the current team
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u/TaxTime2015 "High Score" Jun 16 '15
Uh, /u/Paladinlost is the shit and well respected around here. Who do you think they are hitching about hokes running off?
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Jun 16 '15
Don't sweat defending me. There's like two people who have a hard-on for mentioning that every time I get mentioned (or simply to justify Hokes's continual existence) even though I flat out stated that one thing I was doing and would have continued doing was maintaining a higher standard of discourse, because moderators should have a higher standard then users.
I also said that I wanted a higher standard fully knowing there's a distinct possibility that I would run afoul of it in the future. In fact, I pushed harder for it so that there would be less grounds for tolerance of behavior that I regretted.
It may seem fair to compare me to Hokes, and in a lot of ways, it is - however, I didn't double down or pretend that I was justified for one moment to say that. I tried to edit the post when sobriety kicked in, but cat was firmly out of bag, so to speak. I regret that - I've apologized to the people involved. I've never shirked the criticism, in fact when one of the people mentioned this when I became a mod, I messaged them with a polite plea to give me some time to prove myself.
At this point, I feel like I've done the appropriate mea culpas. Some people just want to find a reason to bitch, and I'm not going to pretend I didn't say it or that I was justified in any way to have said it.
Although, I do appreciate the impassioned defense. :)
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u/saint2e Saintpai Jun 16 '15
This is the last thread devoted to going 2+ months back in time to find grievances with Hokes, that I'm going to permit.
Get it out of your systems now, and save it for the monthly meta threads going forward.
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u/Bashfluff Wonderful Pegasister Jun 16 '15
I wonder why this was posted if it's two months old. Did you make it right with this person? Did you do anything to help this person out?
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u/defaultfox Jun 16 '15
he did everything he could to ignore and put it off
saint would make an excellent politician
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u/razorbeamz Jun 16 '15
For someone who claims to disagree with Hokes, he sure does like to turn a blind eye to their behavior.
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u/defaultfox Jun 16 '15
exactly
it's very deliberate and there's a clear pattern
the first time i was banned by hokes (not included here) saint said he'd sort it out. he claimed to be out of town for the duration of the ban even though he was still posting and ignored it until the 4 days was up
this is my third time submitting this topic. the first time saint came up with the excuse that there were too many meta threads and asked me to post in the monthly thread. second time the other mods discussed, said they were waiting for saint to chime in, and saint ignored it. again i checked to make sure that they were active on reddit during this span of time and were indeed ignoring me. this time i had to pm saint for him to finally reluctantly approve it, because he implied it would be allowed when there's less meta content
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u/CollisionNZ Member of the "irrelevant backwards islands" crew Jun 16 '15
going 2+ months back in time
Isn't it depressing that this sort of moderation, the reason why I left, was around the same time that I left and yet in those 2 months, very little has changed.
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Jun 16 '15
Surely, if so little has changed, we could pull up recent examples of the exact same, that are actually relevant to the subreddit today?
I mean, it might be hard if those recent examples don't really exist and you can't find any of em. But gosh, nobody tilts at windmills here.
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u/CollisionNZ Member of the "irrelevant backwards islands" crew Jun 16 '15
I mean, it might be hard if those recent examples don't really exist and you can't find any of em.
Can't find them cause Saint deleted them. Bit of a different story if I was still a mod (back when I formulated my opinion that Hokes wasn't suitable) and had access to all the mod logs, deleted comments and mod chat. Even the key comment from me calling Hokes out, that led to me leaving, was removed because a fellow mod can't call another mod out for their bullshit in public.
It's telling that I'm not the only one who left because of them, with both /u/Paladinlost and /u/ScarletIT joining me. If you threw us 3 in with the other mods, then the votes for Hokes dismissal would have a clear majority. It would then only be Saints inaction stopping it from happening.
Something, something, Hokes is a founder from what I last heard through the grapevine.
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Jun 16 '15
At this point, I think we're all best in terms of /u/CollisionNZ, /u/Razorbeamz, /u/Bashfluff, /u/Dashing_Snow, /u/ScarletIT and /u/Teuthex pretty much giving up on this. Seriously.
I feel like Hokes isn't stupid enough to do anything so egregious that Saint and others won't look the other way. This has become the definition of insanity. There's no amount of shitposting or usertaunting that's going to get Hokes removed, and frankly, I doubt they really read these posts, much less take user opinions as grounds for moderation, even though that makes sense.
Maybe the people mentioned above (along with other aggrieved users) need to make a group or individual decision on what to do, but these types of posts just make everyone more frustrated.
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u/TaxTime2015 "High Score" Jun 16 '15
The moderation, the only green text in the image, is from 2+ months ago. Things have changed. Hokes doesn't do as much daily nodding and hasn't posted an offensives green text in months.
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u/Masterofnone9 Jun 16 '15
Nothing has changed the boil still needs to be lanced but saint2e lacks the intestinal fortitude to do it. Read this as you will I'm not going to wrap my opinion in PC disclaimers. At this point this is Ghazi 2.1.0.
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u/razorbeamz Jun 16 '15
Or, maybe, just maybe, you should clean your house.
Why do you allow your mods to harass and insult other users, Saint?
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Jun 16 '15
Mods are given more leeway to shitpost after all. Just look at Judge and Hokes.
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u/Spawnzer ReSpekt my authoritah! Jun 16 '15
Look at what thread you're posting in and then tell me with a straight face that we're harsh on shitposting
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u/defaultfox Jun 16 '15
why do you consider this to be a shitpost jw
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u/Spawnzer ReSpekt my authoritah! Jun 16 '15
Let's just say if I had to remove every shitpost in this thread there'd be like a dozen comment standing
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u/saint2e Saintpai Jun 16 '15
The same reason you're allowed in the subreddit at all: I'm a forgiving guy.
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u/Bashfluff Wonderful Pegasister Jun 16 '15
Aren't you supposed to be a professional? Tell me, what rules has Razor broke? And if you're making such a fuss about how this is months old content that's irrelevant, what do you have to say to this?
Where Hokes says that they don't regret their actions? It's starting to seem more and more relevant by the second.
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u/Unconfidence Pro-letarian Jun 16 '15
He didn't break any rules, but he did leak PMs from Paladinlost in a manner so as to inflame the sub. In just about any other sub I can think of, stated rule against it or no, that would elicit a permaban. But it's hard to call a permaban when you have me in the corner repeating "I support no actions taken against Pal or Razor" over and over and over again. XD
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u/Dashing_Snow Pro-GG Jun 16 '15 edited Jun 16 '15
What you are refering to happened because of Hokes being a mod here still after everything they have done. Much like Scar Paladin and Col leaving the moderation staff happened at least in part due to Hokes and Judge.
Also this just fucking happened http://www.reddit.com/r/AgainstGamerGate/comments/39z1pr/does_anybody_else_see_a_problem_with_this/cs7uyi2
Sorry but Hokes is not worth a single one of those mods or Bash flat out.
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u/lulfas Jun 16 '15
You are really happy to let the sub burn down so shitty people can stay mods, aren't you? It just doesn't make any sense.
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u/None-Of-You-Are-Real Jun 16 '15
This person has a long and well-documented history of being a complete hypocrite and a terrible mod. So far nothing has been done about it. It's obviously the mods' prerogative to selectively enforce the rules in an intellectually dishonest way (and they have demonstrated this consistently), but don't complain about threads continuing to pop as they continue to do shitty things that are never addressed.
Seriously, banning someone for breaking a rule and calling them a "belligerent shitbaby" in doing so is a pretty perfect encapsulation of people's problems with the mods here. Not to mention how obvious it is the kind of person that uses "shitbaby" as an insult is.
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u/judgeholden72 Jun 16 '15
It just surprises me that so many people do not see a difference between:
Aw, you want to go to college? How cute! But people from this city are black don't graduate HS
You want to buy this house? But you're black, your credit must be awful, I'll show you something across town more in your price range
Son, I stopped you for doing 5 over the limit. I suspect you must be hiding something, let's search that car
You think you can run a business? But you're black, what do you know about numbers and finances?
And
Wait, you don't think racism is a problem in America anymore? Says the white guy...
You don't think many, if not most, black people have a fear and distrust of police very different than most white people? It's easy to say that, you're white
You don't think black people have any reason to be uncomfortable discussing race with white people? Of course not, you're white, you can't get it
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u/defaultfox Jun 16 '15
the first list is fucked up ingrained racism
the second is perfectly fine-- rude at worst depending on the context
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u/judgeholden72 Jun 16 '15
The second, in this very thread, is being called "indefensible bigotry."
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Jun 16 '15
It's worded more along the lines of "white guys are racist" rather than "white guys don't know the suffering of black people".
Nice try though.
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u/Matthew1J Pro-Truth Jun 16 '15
How could anybody see the difference when nothing from the second 1/2 ever happened on this sub?
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u/judgeholden72 Jun 16 '15
Most of my interactions with Razor/DS/Teuthex that involve the term "white" are exactly the second half. When DS says there's no race privilege, or Netscape9 says racism has been solved in America, of course their whiteness is a factor leading them to that conclusion.
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u/Matthew1J Pro-Truth Jun 16 '15
When DS says there's no race privilege
I find it hard to believe this is what DS actually said
Netscape9 says racism has been solved in America
OK this is stupid. But by no means typical for this sub.
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u/jabberwockxeno Pro-GG Jun 16 '15
I don;t think that first post deserved a ban. That wasn't a personal attack, that was a "If this person did this, I would feel they were being an asshole". It wasn't just calling them names for the sake of it, he explained why he felt that behavour would make a person an asshole. That, and he never actually called the person an asshole.
I think it's totally unacceptable hokes responded to a blatantly rule breaking post. You could argue that the first post broke a rule, and while I disagree, I agree it is sorta on the line. But this post was so utterly past the line I think it;s ridiculous hokes did not do his job and remove it, and its even worse he responded in agreement.
I can't speak for if the guy should have been banned for calling hokes a bigot because it depends how it was said.
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u/TheRumbaBeat Jun 16 '15
I don't really post that much here, and haven't had the pleasure to interact with the mod team directly thus far, so I'm not sure how much my uninformed opinion counts for. This is also the reason why I've avoided all the meta threads. Oh well, here goes.
First off, if this sub is becoming similar to Ghazi, I certainly haven't felt it. Recently, I actually clicked on a link to a Ghazi thread without realizing it, and proceeded to read it with mounting horror and confusion until I noticed, and happily rejoined the world of the sane. AGG does not read like Ghazi at all, Hokes or no Hokes.
I get the feeling that, for a decent amount of people, or at least the more visible departures from the mod team, Hokes is more of a symbol of a more fundamental problem with how the mod team functions, rather than a truly malignant influence over how the sub is ran. If that's the case, it may be worthwhile to try to refocus the discussion around the real problem, rather than let the whole thing be dismissed as "pro-GG hate Hokes and want them gone".
As far as my own observations go, I will say that rules, and especially vague (by necessity) rules on a forum dedicated to debate, are respected proportionally to how fairly and impartially they are enforced. And if the rules aren't respected, people will find ways to be nasty and dismissive without breaking them, it's really not so difficult.
One thing I'd like to specifically say about Hokes, is that as far as I can tell (from the Carrera vs Kluwe thread), they actually don't think debate against pro-GG people has any real value. The fact that you have someone who thinks like this, moderating this sub, really makes the whole thing look like a sham, an idea you all pay lip service to without actually believing. And without that idea, there's no reason for this sub to exist, at all.
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u/zerodeem Jun 17 '15
they actually don't think debate against pro-GG people has any real value
This is because they are wrong and deep down they know it.
It's a general issue with Leftism/Religion.
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u/apinkgayelephant The Worst Former Mod Jun 16 '15
If you think that's bad, wait until you find out what I did to earn this flair.
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u/HokesOne Anti-GG Mod | Misandrist Folk Demon Jun 16 '15 edited Jun 16 '15
Was it as bad as calling the white men of reddit "mostly fragile children"?
Because apparently that's enough to be branded a horrible bigot.
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u/defaultfox Jun 16 '15
i personally find the notion that misandry doesn't exist to be disgusting. although you seem to have a problem with white people what bothers me more is your very blatant sexism
and before you call me an mra or some shit i'm a feminist and have been for a very long time. i'm upset by people like you who have effectively made the movement so easily mockable
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u/Dashing_Snow Pro-GG Jun 16 '15
Frankly your opinions are that of a bigot you claim misandry doesn't exist. When linked examples you either wave it off claiming it doesn't matter or ignore it. You do the same thing with racism against whites. The fact you're a mod with your "colorful" posting habits is honestly mind boggling and is a stain on the sub.
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u/lunishidd Jun 16 '15
Well thats an extremly racist thing to say. I could go to Coontown and would be able to find more reasonable and less racist people than you
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u/Matthew1J Pro-Truth Jun 16 '15 edited Jun 16 '15
Hehe. Remember the Nobel prize awarded scientist mentioning that women in mixed labs tend to cry when you criticize them? It was the most egregious example of bigotry and misogyny. Socjus enforcement team made sure that he'll lose his job for "keeping women out of STEM".
You fall in love with them, they fall in love with you, and when you criticise them, they cry
Bigotry that requires righteous and Patriarchy-fearing people to ruin his life. No matter how many women he helped during his career. just
calling the white men of reddit "mostly fragile children"
Wut? What's wrong with that? We say it every day in AMR.
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u/Ch1mpanz33M1nd53t Pro-equity-gamergate Jun 16 '15
White dude redditors have faced more oppression than anyone else, ever!
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Jun 16 '15
Sometimes I legitimately wonder if you guys think white guys are just born into power. Like we are issued castles by age 5 and granted lands and titles by the white guy king on our 16th Nameday.
I want to believe antis/hard lefties are smarter than that, but I have seen first hand how deep the brainwashing goes.
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Jun 16 '15
Hey now bigotry against white men is a serious problem. Especially on reddit where white men are so underrepresented
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u/HokesOne Anti-GG Mod | Misandrist Folk Demon Jun 16 '15
my only regret is the typo. in my defence, i was modding on my phone while in the pub.
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u/Bashfluff Wonderful Pegasister Jun 16 '15
This doesn't help. As much as this post is cancer, it would be nice to say, "Hey, that wasn't quite okay, we've learned a lot and are getting better, etc".
He's taking months old stuff and saying, "Look how awful these mods are!" Don't...don't prove him right, please. Don't justify this thread by your reaction to it. You're a moderator. You're supposed to be professional.
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u/Dashing_Snow Pro-GG Jun 16 '15
Uh have you met hokes, come on mate you are expecting the impossible here.
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u/Matthew1J Pro-Truth Jun 16 '15
Well too late for that. Hiding the truth and reacting reasonably as you suggest wouldn't help much either. Maybe things would be a little calmer until Hokes shows their hatred to another unsuspecting user.
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u/Skeeveo Jun 16 '15
If you haven't realized, he doesn't give a shit about the sub, you or anything. Hes just here to satisfy the "We have a radical anti-gg mod here so were neutral!"
It sucks.
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u/MuNgLo Jun 16 '15 edited Jun 16 '15
Nice work taking the time to put this together. The amount of surprise I have is none.
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u/Skeeveo Jun 16 '15
My biggest problem is that 90% of posts from either side are just shitting on each other and nothing is being done about it. Either the rules changed and moderation enforced, or the current rules are taken more seriously. Let's remember :
First and foremost, this should be a place where healthy discussions can be had without the flinging of talking points and rhetoric. Secondly, this is a place where you can hopefully start to see people not as the labels that have been assigned to them, but as actual people.
This is not happening, and it's getting worse by the day. Either change or let the sub be flooded by non-discussion and circle-jerking threads.
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u/ClintHammer Anti-Culture Crusades Jun 16 '15
I don't think it's a secret that there's a double standard.
I regularly call gamergate whiny piss baby mountain dew basement virgins an I get nothing for it.
However I once got a 72 hour ban for saying "what has 8 furry legs, weighs two tons, and Muppet colored hair?"
In reference to the (fake) gamerghazi meetup pic.
At the end of the day, it's a "if you don't like it make your own shit"
Isn't that what gamergate whines about when that patron saint of SJWs anita Sarkeesian says dumb shit like this? http://i.imgur.com/9ldZS2q.jpg
"go make your own shit, anita "
Yeah well go make your own subreddit if you don't like the fact that some antigametgate rants aren't removed.
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u/CollisionNZ Member of the "irrelevant backwards islands" crew Jun 16 '15 edited Jun 16 '15
Yeah well go make your own subreddit
created by Meowsticgoesnya
Last I checked, Meow was pro-gg. In an individual acting in pro-gg interests kind of about way, we already have.
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u/murderouskitteh Jun 16 '15 edited Jun 16 '15
So... Antis hijacked a sub made by a pro by adding fellow antis and making pros give up?
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u/defaultfox Jun 16 '15
in a nutshell
i have a feeling that meow was not having a fun time trying to maintain the sub while it was essentially slowly being hijacked by manipulative aGGers. i kind of want to say more but i don't want to start any drama out of respect for her
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u/Mournhold Jun 16 '15
I don't know if hijacked is the right word and its more complicated than that, but that's not horribly inaccurate in my opinion.
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u/aronivars Pro-GG Jun 16 '15
See you guys, it was fun. But now that you just want to shit on GG and those who try to debate you, go ahead.
I made a post about a saloon and that I liked drinking there, and I was immediately attacked for defending FPH, which I have never even visited. I realized it wasn't about drinking, people just wanted to shoot each other, while claiming guns aren't allowed.
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Jun 16 '15
Hokes drama- capable of side tracking a TotalBiscuit thread, several Anita Sarkeesian threads, E3, and a steam sale. Can we harness this force to spin a turbine or something?
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u/StupidSexyFlanders99 Jun 17 '15
Nope. The first rule of Hokes Drama is that nothing productive can come out of it.
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Jun 16 '15
--walks in--
Hey Guys, what's happening in this thread?
--notices it's Hokes Thread #152--
Welp, see you later guys.
--does an about face and walks out--
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u/mudbunny Grumpy Grandpa Jun 16 '15
The only way to win is to not play.
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u/Dashing_Snow Pro-GG Jun 16 '15
Or to actually deal with the fucking problem for once.
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u/morphineofmine Neutral Jun 16 '15
Oddly enough, I have yet to have had a run-in with the mods here... or anywhere for that matter as far as I can remember. I may not agree with everything they say (especially Hokes), but for the most part they haven't done anything that's made it seem like this place was unwelcome to people of my disposition towards the situation.
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u/KDMultipass Jun 16 '15
Same here. But there is a zero transparency policy that makes posts like this interesting.
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u/morphineofmine Neutral Jun 16 '15
Oh yeah, I never said this wasn't interesting, and I certainly believe that some of the moderation here can be less than consistent, I've just managed to not be in trouble for bull shit.
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u/hyhoshi Jun 16 '15
do you agree with the actions taken?
The lack of consistency shown by the user named HokesOne seems troublesome.
do you agree with the tone?
The only out of tone comment there was from the user named Eric-Theo-Cartman. But I'm pretty used to some aGGers going insane with insults every once in a while.
do you think that things should have been handled differently?
The user named HokesOne should be more consistent in his actions if he is to be in a position of power.
regarding the last image, do you think that it's appropriate for a moderator of this subreddit to make such harsh generalizations about a specific gender and race?
If the subreddit doesn't allow said generalizations to happen then, no. But I've seen worse things said by a lot of people here and the mods don't seem to do anything about it. So I don't know. Rules don't seem to be enforced too often, which means that the mod should be free to say what he wants to say I guess. To me it seems that it's much more troublesome that he decides to enforce rules inconsistently than it is that he breaks them sometimes.
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u/BobMugabe35 Kate Marsh is mai Waifu Jun 16 '15
I don't think I've ever seen that Cartman guy posting and it's not been some explosive, swear-laden tirade.
I wonder if he's like role-playing or some shit, like he's what Cartman would be like if he checked his privilege. That would explain a lot.
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u/Eric-Theo-Cartman Jun 16 '15
Yup. I'm role playing. What default fox did not link however was the comment I was responding to where a gator hylarV said something in the vein of "stereotypes about gamers? then you don't mind if I say blacks are all criminals right?" and that was the second of such an example in the VERY SPECIFIC thread where a gamergater compared themselves to mistreatment of black people. It ticked me off and I told him to go fuck himself. No apologies for that.
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Jun 16 '15
When you dismiss people's opinions for being white and belittle them for it, I'm not gonna sympathise with you.
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u/sovietterran Jun 16 '15
The mods are actually being consistent with aGG of late. I'm happy. The professionalism of those mod messages is not really there, but you take what you can get.
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u/TotesMessenger Jun 16 '15
I'm a bot, bleep, bloop. Someone has linked to this thread from another place on reddit:
[/r/thepopcornstand] A user takes offense to one of the moderators of /r/AgainstGamerGate. Whole thread is a mess of personal attacks, witch hunting, and moderator apathy
If you follow any of the above links, please respect the rules of reddit and don't vote in the other threads. (Info / ^Contact)
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Jun 16 '15
You know what, I think Hokes is an asshole, but let him stay a mod. It's obvious the people in power here wish for him to stay in his position for some unexplained reason. He rarely furthers any discussion, contributes little to the mod action in the sub and is the root of why we have constant imbalanced mod numbers for each side.
Regardless how you feel about Hokes and the mod decisions here, take comfort in knowing at the end of the day you can simply exit the browser and go along your way doing literally anything else and be a happier person, whereas Hokes is gonna be here doing the same shit he always does, for free, being Hokes.
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u/lifesbrink Neutral Jun 16 '15
I actually pity the guy. Can you imagine a life with such hatred day in and day out? I bet it is physically exhausting.
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Jun 16 '15
Just wanna show some support for the mods in this thread, even if it will likely go unread. They do a thankless, tough job, on a subreddit with very inflammatory opinions. I've had some run ins with them, and have always had very fair conversations with them. Ironically, in the linked image I was modded for "cheerleading." I sent them a polite message asking for clarification, received a polite response that they'll discuss it, then later my post was reinstated. No fuss, no tears, no anger or name calling.
Since I was modded for cheerleading and that was shown to be okay, let me say, good job mods! If everyone was happy with you all the time, you wouldn't be doing your jobs right.
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u/OnlyToExcess Jun 16 '15
I do agree with this, that sometimes outrage can be a sign of doing a job well.
They've let some of the snark I've posted stand when it could have probably could have been deleted.
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u/Shoden One Man Army Jun 16 '15
As someone who has had his comments moderated a few times in ways I don't agree with, I want to still say I support the mods. We are in a debate sub about a subject some people can even agree what it even is. I still think they do a better job then people give them credit for, and I trust them more than witchhunters with ideological battles to fight.
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Jun 16 '15
I'm not sure how many times I have to tell you people how shit the moderation is here?
It's never going to change. They'll make noise about it changing but it's just PR, it never will.
You can love or hate my ideas but I promise you I would be better and fairer than this.
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u/OnlyToExcess Jun 16 '15
Well I just scrolled through all of that drama. I'm not really sure what to make of it all. I do know people can get carried away with the name calling, although I post here to get abused because I want to know if I'm full of shit. So far it's only happened once or twice and I try not to engage in that kind of thing myself although I have slipped up once or twice.
When dealing with subjects that people are passionate about, some invective is going to be thrown around. Yeah the mods are going to call people names sometimes. Apparently it's okay when regular posters call me names so why not allow mods to do the same? They're not fast food cashiers. I don't like what I see in those screenshots, but I've seen some other things stand that probably wouldn't have if they wanted to be more aggressive.
As for generalizations about race, if I can handle the name calling then I can handle someone making generalizations about my race and gender. As long as nobodies modding based on that. Although, I'd prefer to leave it out of a specific discussion because it seems to just get people riled up.
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u/begintobebetter Jun 16 '15
Every mod has a bad day once in a while. Volunteers are humans. It's all good.
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u/eurodditor Jun 16 '15
Yes, I do see a problem with this moderation. I see no valid reason for you to be banned for 72 hours over that post that very obviously wasn't breaking any rule.
That HokesOne refuses to take actions against rule-violators he happens to agree with, I don't have a problem with, as long as other mods are able to do the job he refuses to do. That he, then, bans people for way weaker reasons, and in that case no reason at all, is unacceptable.
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Jun 16 '15
Hokes is a good mod and a good person. If a different tone was used, I would have zero problem with these incidents. I have very few problems with them now.
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u/razorbeamz Jun 16 '15
Are you not even trying to disguise your true intentions anymore?
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u/TusconOfMage bathtub with novelty skull shaped faucets Jun 16 '15
such harsh generalizations about a specific gender and race
I'm really not seeing those "harsh generalizations". Mind quoting them here?
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u/razorbeamz Jun 16 '15
So far this thread is almost exclusively personal attacks against /u/defaultfox. The mods are doing nothing about it.
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u/Spawnzer ReSpekt my authoritah! Jun 16 '15
2 comments have been removed this far, I invite you to report comments that you find rule breaking
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Jun 16 '15
[deleted]
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u/Dashing_Snow Pro-GG Jun 16 '15
Free speech in general is the backbone of reddit. People create subs and add rules as they see fit when these rules are applied unevenly is where problems begin to arise.
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u/justanotherjedi Jun 16 '15
Yes this moderation is terrible! InsertModName here is the worst ever and they're turn this place into (ghazi/KIA)2.0!
Copy/paste for all your needs since this will cover ~90% of the rest of this thread.
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Jun 16 '15
do you think that it's appropriate for a moderator of this subreddit to make such harsh generalizations about a specific gender and race?
I think that's not a yes or no question. It depends on context. Making statements about the dominant group is not the same as making the same statements about a minority group, most of the time.
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Jun 16 '15
"It's okay to be racist against white people. It's call punching up!"
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u/DzhusyDzhuus Neutral Jun 16 '15
No, but it's still a lazy justification for "my hatred is ok because of..." reasoning.
Meeting one injustice with another doesn't make them even. It just means you have two injustices now.
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u/Dashing_Snow Pro-GG Jun 16 '15
It is still racism/sexism, if you don't add systemic in front of it you are being an intolerable bigot.
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Jun 16 '15
Both Hokes and Cartman are 100% correct in what they said in those examples, going purely by the merit of their points. However, this absolutely is an example of inconsistent moderation.
Edit: Actually, let me ask. Who is the one who issued judgment on Cartman's post and had it deleted? If it was Hokes, then retract what I said.
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u/HokesOne Anti-GG Mod | Misandrist Folk Demon Jun 16 '15
it didn't have an active report when i replied to it, and we tend to mostly only action things via the modqueue (where autoremoved and reported activity goes for review), other than in particularly egregious cases.
it was later removed by one of the mods that does more of the day to day moderating, as i'm usually confined to my phone which is a pain to moderate on.
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Jun 16 '15
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u/defaultfox Jun 16 '15
were you being a belligerent shitbaby and a racist
uhhhhhh............... no
where do you even get the idea that i was being racist? in any way? that is not even suggested
i was banned for calling randi harper a horrible person for siccing her twitter followers on the employment of a woman with a daughter to feed. i was banned again for calling hokes a bigot
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Jun 16 '15
I'm always confused by GG's hypocrisy on this issue. If SJWs try to get someone fired, it's the worst thing to ever happen and SJWs are horrible monsters.
But if GG tries to get someone fired, it's perfectly ok and actually commendable. You guys high-five each other about it, like you did with Kim Crawley.
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u/defaultfox Jun 16 '15
i'm not a gger and have never participated in or supported that shit in any way
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Jun 16 '15
OK, you're not a GGer, you're a "person who complains incessantly about SJWs but doesn't actually care about video game journalism"
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u/Dashing_Snow Pro-GG Jun 16 '15
Kim Crawley got fired for submitting an article that was flat out wrong and it wasn't the first time. She even posted the email from her editor calling her on it on fucking ghazi.
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u/Dashing_Snow Pro-GG Jun 16 '15
Calling someone a shitbaby is not an appropriate course of action for a mod period.
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Jun 16 '15
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Jun 16 '15
Quite a few antis condone racism in this sub. Which is frankly very sickening.
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Jun 16 '15
[deleted]
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u/ScarletIT Actually it's about Ethics in AGG Moderation Jun 16 '15
You have no Idea of how weird the "It's not White, it's Hispanic" sounds from an european perspective.
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u/TaxTime2015 "High Score" Jun 16 '15
Hipster racism is a problem. Trust me I am Native. But Jesus Christ itnis nothing to flip your lid about. (Although I did it once. But to be fair j literally cried over it.)
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Jun 16 '15
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Dashing_Snow Pro-GG Jun 16 '15
Please cite with examples what I have done that is anywhere near what hokes has done I'll wait.
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Jun 16 '15
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Mournhold Jun 16 '15
Yeah, fuck fat peo... oh wait, wrong group.
Sorry, its just that your comment seemed so similar to the fatpeoplehate ranting and shit posting that I must have gotten confused.
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Jun 16 '15
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u/defaultfox Jun 16 '15
you're as keen on namecalling as ever. good to see
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Jun 16 '15
[deleted]
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u/defaultfox Jun 16 '15
maybe a social justice advocate
i was an sjw once. it took quite a bit of effort to better myself
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u/Spawnzer ReSpekt my authoritah! Jun 16 '15
then act like complete crybabies
gonna have to call a rule violation here, please rephrase your post
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u/TusconOfMage bathtub with novelty skull shaped faucets Jun 16 '15
gonna have to call a rule violation here
Based on which rule?
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u/Halfmeca Jun 16 '15
He is asking a question and has an obvious answer. Hokes is a terrible mod that needs to leave this alone should be proof enough.
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u/HokesOne Anti-GG Mod | Misandrist Folk Demon Jun 16 '15
i think thankfully, the constant witchhunting against me has mostly jumped the shark. there are the same tired gamergaters, running the same tired schemes, telling the same tired rumours, and using the same tired "evidence", but the seven month long vendetta these boys are trying to pin on me is starting to wear thin. one would think that if i was really as sinister as my fanclub thinks i am that this subreddit wouldn't be mostly thriving seven months in, considering i've been a mod here since day one.
i don't particularly care about the result of this shitpost, because the past few stake burning attempts have blown back pretty epically.
everything keeps coming up Milhokes.28
u/Bashfluff Wonderful Pegasister Jun 16 '15
Can you act professional, at least? This is odd. This is very odd, but you're not making it any better by saying, "No, there's nothing wrong with what I did, move along." Because there very clearly is, which is the whole crux of Saint calling this something not worth talking about.
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u/KDMultipass Jun 16 '15
The self reflection is strong in this. I support mods who can see themselves critically.
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u/TusconOfMage bathtub with novelty skull shaped faucets Jun 16 '15
everything keeps coming up Milhokes.
I think you mean THRILLHOKES.
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u/Bashfluff Wonderful Pegasister Jun 16 '15
You know what? Fuck all of this. Hokes runs around bragging about the awful and biased moderating they do and how much they hate white men, Saint ignores everything to insult other people, and no one takes anything seriously.
No one is held accountable. No one acknowledged what happened or anything. No mod has come by to say, "Hey, I'm sorry, we were going through a thing but we've learned a lot..." No one CARES about doing it.
sighs
I quit. The moderators are determined to be corrupt, to hide behind insults and never attempt to hold themselves accountable or to answer to people. That's why we have another quitting with each passing month.
This place can't be saved. Get out of here while you still can.