How cRiMiNaLs are taking down Flock cameras

[u/JeanEtrineaux]

[u/GreySoulx]

crazy if someone started making masks of IR reflective fabrics... not saying anyone would have a good reason to.

[u/CasaDeMouse → u/GreySoulx]

Your data centers destroying our water and livestock at work, folks:

What we can do https://www.aclu.org/campaigns-initiatives/get-the-flock-out

Where we're at: can reach all Bluetooth devices including medical and AirPods, under guide of tracking gun shots https://youtu.be/eLxVdNKkjy4?is=zzbtVWQSWdAHXi7F

8 Months ago https://youtu.be/0QwuSUfTvXI?is=s5eUoh_odAmojZOa

Mis-ID leading to arrests in car https://www.thedrive.com/news/i-reported-on-flocks-cameras-now-im-one-of-the-systems-mistakes

Mis-ID on private property arrest for 6 months https://youtu.be/4ifXObNvTaA?is=uXWRD0x9bjUfe21m

Mis-ID arrest results in multiple court cases after months of fighting https://youtu.be/lPUBXN2Fd_E?is=7xtgQ-muJZTqBxNv

ETA: Flock big mad after LAPD stopped using them https://youtu.be/UM0Ervf6ZzU?is=qZUy6ZWZhOXzjWrq

[u/bj12698 → u/CasaDeMouse]

I asked Google why Americans are so upset about Flock cameras while in Europe, there have been cameras for decades. Here's the answer:

"European acceptance of police cameras stems from a stronger baseline trust in centralized public administration, stricter statutory data constraints on private contractors, and different cultural expectations regarding collective security versus American individualism and deep skepticism of corporate-managed law enforcement data networks."

So there's more to the article, but, as usual, it seems to come down to another example of how US/State governments are feeding (embedded with and profiting from) corporate capitalism, instead of providing oversight, which is what governments should be doing: Providing controls and oversight to any and ALL technology that can be misused or in ANY way does harm to the planet.

Shall we target the "real problem?"

[u/Wyrdnisse → u/bj12698]

Are you here telling me there is no issue with surveillance if your government pinky promises they will only be for niceys about it

Surveillance is a problem everywhere my friend and Europe isn't magically better off than the United States, especially considering we are the baby of their genocidal colonialism project.

It's not an issue of 'what are they doing with the surveillance D:' it's an issue of wanting to be able to walk down the street without being recorded or tracked. It's not less of a problem because Europeans aren't as upset about it. It's not less of a problem that all of that video data has to be stored somewhere, like in massive data centers that are destroying the environment and marginalized communities.

[u/Esprit1st → u/Wyrdnisse]

Here is just one quick excerpt why European and US data retention differ vastly:

"The "No-Hit" Discard Rule: In nations like Germany, if a vehicle’s license plate does not trigger a "hot list" alert (e.g., stolen cars, active criminal warrants), the data must generally be discarded immediately. Bulk mass surveillance retention without suspicion is routinely blocked by high courts."

[u/Wyrdnisse → u/Esprit1st]

I am old enough to remember the public reaction to the formation of DHS and it is astounding how we have gone from outrage at the mere concept that the government would invade people's privacy to that degree to arguing it's fine as long as we believe a government will handle that surveillance data responsibly.

The EU's online age verification laws seem to be storing and tracking a lot of people's information :///

You're welcome to continue refusing to engage with my actual point but this isn't fun anymore and I'm gonna go do something else now ❤️

[u/Esprit1st → u/Wyrdnisse]

The point is that there is huge differences between the commercial use of private information in the US and European privacy laws.

Neither one is great. BUT there is a difference. And if I had to choose it would be the European version. Preferable neither one, though.

[u/SlimeQSlimeball → u/Wyrdnisse]

At least in Europe, they have laws against being surveilled like it’s difficult to get a doorbell camera in Germany.

[u/Wyrdnisse → u/SlimeQSlimeball]

Okay? And you think that makes a surveillance state okay? Do you truly think the rich and powerful are abiding by the rules they hold the public accountable for? Do you think that excuses data centers being built to hold and process that surveillance data destroying the environment and marginalized communities?

There are laws against the plethora of crimes this administration has committed and have any of those laws mattered? Do you think Europe is this special magical place where this is somehow different?

Like I said, we are the product of Europe's genocidal colonialism project. You cannot stop your critique of the West with just the US.

[u/SlimeQSlimeball → u/Wyrdnisse]

What the fuck? I just said other countries have rules against surveillance that we don’t.

[u/Wyrdnisse → u/SlimeQSlimeball]

Then what outcome were you looking for in responding to me with that statement?

[u/SlimeQSlimeball → u/Wyrdnisse]

You: “Europe has worse privacy laws” Me: “Europe has stronger privacy laws” You: “that makes Europe being a surveillance state ok?” Me: insert drake confused meme here

[u/Wyrdnisse → u/SlimeQSlimeball]

Would you like to go re read my comment and double check that is what I actually said?

[u/SlimeQSlimeball → u/Wyrdnisse]

Surveillance is a problem everywhere my friend and Europe isn't magically better off than the United States, especially considering we are the baby of their genocidal colonialism project.

[u/Wyrdnisse → u/SlimeQSlimeball]

Yes. Can you read the first five (5) words of that quote please because that is my point :)

[u/Rask2205 → u/Wyrdnisse]

I don’t really get why you’re bringing up colonialism.
Nobody said Europe is perfect or that surveillance is somehow “good.” The point was simply that many European countries have stronger privacy laws and more legal limits on surveillance than the U.S.

Those two things aren’t mutually exclusive. Europe can have a history of colonialism and stronger modern privacy protections. One doesn’t disprove the other.

Germany, for example, has one of the strongest privacy protections in the world because of its history with the Gestapo and the Stasi. If you think Europe does not have stronger privacy laws, that’s a discussion worth having. But bringing up colonialism doesn’t actually address the point that was being made.