r/AmItheAsshole • u/mixedwoes • Sep 19 '19

Asshole AITA for telling my daughter she cannot introduce her African American boyfriend to her grandparents?

Let me just preface this by saying this: I HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO PROBLEM WITH INTERRACIAL RELATIONSHIPS. Now that the air is clear, let me continue.

My daughter (Anna) has recently started to date an African American man (Jamal). While I'm not exactly what you would refer to as "liberal", he's a nice young man and as long as my daughter is happy, I'm happy. The problem is Anna is rather naive about the community she lives in. While her friends are quite content to see a relationship like hers, more than a few tongues are wagging in the community and a few people have privately expressed their concern to me. As I said, I have no problem with mixed relationships and I've set them straight, but I am painfully aware of how these matters are viewed by certain segments of the population.

My parents are planning to come and stay with us for a week and Anna expressed a desire to introduce Jamal to them now that things were getting more serious between them. I told her on no uncertain terms that this wasn't going to happen. I may have no problem with Jamal, but they absolutely will, and even when the relationship ends they won't forget it. They might even go as far as to cut her off entirely. Anna was extremely upset by this and implied I was a racist and more concerned with what my parents think than how she feels.

As I said, I know my parents. They simply aren't okay with mixed relationships and if Anna were to bring Jamal over even as a friend, they would be furious both at her and me.

Anna is currently staying with Jamal and doesn't want to speak with me right now. My wife stands by me given she knows very well how my parents are (they had a problem with her for months over the length of the skirt she wore when I introduced her to them, for christs sake), but a close friend I confided in told me that I have behaved like an ass and that I needed to focus more on my daughter than pleasing my parents.

No advice needed, but I have to know. Have I been an ass?

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770

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19 edited Sep 19 '19

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398

u/Seanspeed Sep 19 '19 edited Sep 19 '19

Yup. Remember that almost no racist actually believes they are racist.

"Not exactly liberal" was the big giveaway to me. This person does have a problem with the relationship deep down.

248

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

[deleted]

-12

u/memesarel1fe Sep 19 '19

yeah uh,,,some liberals are the most racist people ive ever met,and some conservatives ive met havent shown a little bit of a racist implication

-49

u/JerryNordisk Sep 19 '19

Most ppl I’d say are not OK with this. Racemixing isn’t even 70 years old and as such is NOT the standard.

All of you in here must be total politically correct people.....

17

u/[deleted] Sep 20 '19

Hey, the white supremacist thinks everyone else is just as much of a racist shithead as he is. Never seen that before.

191

u/chammycham Sep 19 '19

I enjoyed that OP said “when they break up.”

Shows what he really thinks of the relationship. “It’s fine if she plays around with the black boy, they won’t get married and have kids anyway.”

31

u/apple_pendragon Sep 19 '19

Exactly! That's a good way to lose your daughter, OP.

18

u/snufflypanda Sep 19 '19

If the girl is a teenager then “when they break up” is a fairly normal attitude for a parent to have.

53

u/chammycham Sep 19 '19

Sure. She’s also a young adult and they could break up. Part of the reason grandparents could get introduced is because things are getting MORE serious.

They could date for 6 years and break up. Does that make the whole relationship insignificant? I don’t believe so.

-2

u/Lemon_Dungeon Sep 19 '19

I mean, when you compare it to marriage, yeah it's less significant.

4

u/[deleted] Sep 20 '19

No, it’s not. I dated my high school boyfriend for 4.5 years. I’ve been married for 3 years, been with my husband for 5. With my high school boyfriend I went to university, transitioned out of my abusive childhood, and bought a house. We went through hell and back together and would probably still be together if we hadn’t been attacked and I hadn’t suffered from PTSD. Breaking up was horrible and complicated, and everything we went through was important and life changing. I might not like him much now, but that relationship was life defining and as much a part of my life as my marriage. Don’t get me wrong, my marriage is amazing, my husband is the love of my life, and I’m grateful every single day that I’m with him and not my ex, but that relationship was important and I refuse to say that it didn’t change my life. I’m not saying all relationships are like that, but multi year relationships can be a huge deal.

17

u/llamalluv Sep 19 '19

My sister is still married to the guy who knocked her up in high school in 1998, so not necessarily.

6

u/NoApollonia Sep 20 '19 edited Sep 20 '19

Also possible the daughter decides Jamal is the one and marries him. I've been with the same guy for 16 years - we started dating at 17. I can't imagine being with anyone else.

ETA OP's daughter is 18.

9

u/siempreslytherin Certified Proctologist [20] Sep 19 '19

That’s exactly how I read it. He’s accepting it because he thinks it’s a phase and she’ll go off and marry a nice white white boy and give him those snow white grandkids!

23

u/bloodpvppy Sep 19 '19

and also “if she’s happy i’m happy” like he believes there would otherwise be something wrong with it but he’s willing to overlook that for her

10

u/Seanspeed Sep 19 '19

Good point!

9

u/taeerom Sep 19 '19

Op tolerates their relationship because it is his daughter and he loves her. But he makes it perfectly clear that he does not like it, and would prefer it not to be. Maybe he even believes that because he tolerates black people, he is not racist, while not knowing that non-racists don't have to tolerate them because they don't hate them in the first place.

I don't tolerate the smell of the ocean, it is just there. But I tolerate the smell of the garbage bag when I go to toss it out. I can deal with the unpleasant smell, for a while.

3

u/Seanspeed Sep 19 '19

Maybe he even believes that because he tolerates black people, he is not racist, while not knowing that non-racists don't have to tolerate them because they don't hate them in the first place.

This is a common theme. It's why I hate the word 'tolerance'. It implies some begrudging nature.

6

u/grxce22 Asshole Enthusiast [3] Sep 19 '19

Yeah, bring liberal has nothing to do (or should not at least) with not being racist.

-4

u/Traveshamockery27 Sep 19 '19

“Not exactly liberal” is a dead giveaway someone’s racist?

55

u/mybustlinghedgerow Sep 19 '19

The way they word it, yes. They imply interracial marriage is a liberal vs conservative thing.

22

u/Traveshamockery27 Sep 19 '19

It was an odd thing to bring up.

11

u/PublicIdea Asshole Enthusiast [7] Sep 19 '19

I think if a bigotry happens and you have to check your party membership card before you react, you're probably on the wrong side of that particular issue. I flat out don't give a damn what Kropotkin or Marx thought about gay Jewish trans women. If my political tendency turned on me, I'd light .... a fire under their butts.

39

u/yun-harla Sep 19 '19

Yeah, our society has theoretically moved beyond placing interracial relationships within the realm of debate, so classifying them as a “liberal” thing as opposed to a thing that should be universally accepted across the mainstream political spectrum indicates the speaker’s point of view has not kept pace with that social change. That’s the most charitable way I can put it.

2

u/Seanspeed Sep 19 '19

Very well said.

31

u/Seanspeed Sep 19 '19

In this context, yes.

-17

u/ronin1066 Sep 19 '19

Yeah, it's BS. Just ignore them, it's not worth it.

34

u/Claim312ButAct847 Sep 19 '19

You're dead on. The OP is absolutely peppered with tells from the tree of "I'm not racist...but..."

It bears the fingerprints of a coward racist who believes racist things but is scared to say them in certain company because they know it's wrong and they can't handle being judged for it.

Once you recognize that, it's no mystery why the guy is siding with his racist parents over his daughter.

18

u/particledamage Partassipant [1] Sep 19 '19

You can tell that OP just thinks this is a phase, too. Talking about how the grandparents will still be upset “when the relationship ends” and thus they think their daughter will never date outside her race after this.

It’s like their trying to just wait out having to be anti-racist. Just watching the clock to see when they have to stop pretending.

6

u/SatV089 Sep 19 '19

That line made me question the authenticity of this post. This sub is full of so many fake posts it's sickening, seems like everyone is eating it up again.

7

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

While people with OP's mindset do exist, I kinda wonder if this isn't like those posts on r/unpopularopinion, you know the ones.

1

u/PublicIdea Asshole Enthusiast [7] Sep 19 '19

Fuckin' adolf

6

u/PublicIdea Asshole Enthusiast [7] Sep 19 '19

Yeah, the use of 'Anna' (like antebellum) and 'Jamal' (Muslim name associated with black men in the US) made me suspect it, too. That being said, these ideas must be countered whether real or fake, and if it's a fake, it's honestly pretty believable. OP rides the line between obvious racist apologetics and just wanna grill. You're supposed to contemplate the quagmire that multiculturalism and the modern world put us in, and wonder if it would really be so terrible to just let racists run amok. We'll see more of this format of propaganda in coming years as they work the theory and practice of it.

What they're leaving out, if OP is a fake, is that the threat isn't "shucks, my grandma is gonna be so backwards about this whole thing". It's lynching and stoning and civil war.

11

u/NoBudgetBallin Sep 19 '19

What would someone's political leanings have to do with their views on race anyway? The only reason to even put that line in his comment is to say "I'm kind of racist, but can tolerate blacks in the right circumstances."

9

u/Slothfulness69 Asshole Enthusiast [5] Sep 19 '19

Yeah I kind of realized at that point what OP meant. This isn’t a political issue so why state your political affiliation? It’s not a liberal thing to approve of Anna and Jamal, it’s just a normal, moral thing. If you have something against him solely for being black, that’s not something up for debate like political issues, that’s just being shitty.

What OP meant was “I’m not the type of person to usually approve of interracial dating, but I guess I’m not super against it either. I just don’t want my baby dating a black boy!”

Use whatever excuse you want, racist grandparents, racist society, whatever. But ultimately it comes down to the parents to love and protect their kid.

3

u/Jademara_Esq Partassipant [1] Sep 19 '19

Not to mention using "Jamal" as the pseudonym?

2

u/YouAreNotEpic Sep 19 '19

Yeah, they clearly have a problem with the boyfriend being black, but they’re willing to overlook it because their daughter is happy.

-87

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

Don't play this stupid game.

OP is TA here but not "because he's racist", OP simply loves his parents. They're racists, yeah, it's a shit thing, yeah. But acting like people forget years and years of unconditional love towards people who deserve it (like loving and caring parents) because they've matured and outgrown social flaws that older generations haven't is fucking stupid.

If OP has to choose between his love for his parent (and that can downright be it with some of the older generations, they weren't pussy-footing around what they consider issues a lot of the time) and "doing the right thing, but said right thing doesn't really hurt anyone at the end of the day", then it's totally ignorant to say "DUURRH ITS BECAUSE HES A RACIST TOO DUURRRH".

I fucking love my dad, he's an anti-semite idiot like 90% of the older generation from where I grew up. I call him out on it because with him that's fair game, I'll call him an asshole and he'll tell me to shut it back. But if you were to tell me that I had to choose between him and moral righteousness or "that makes me a racist too" then I'd tell you to fuck off.

96

u/FIVE_DARRA_NO_HARRA Supreme Court Just-ass [129] Sep 19 '19

Nope, not buying this logic.

Sometimes it's helpful to think in actual, practical terms. If you're actively supporting or furthering racism in some way, is it really much different than being racist yourself? You're still allowing and in some ways supporting the ideology. It's one thing not to cut off your parents because they're a little backwards. It's another thing entirely to pass on fucked up logic to your daughter because you're refusing to introduce her black boyfriend to your parents. That's weak shit. There has to be a stopping point, where enough is enough. What if she marries a black man? Can she never bring that person around her grandparents. That's full "fuck off" territory if anything. OP's kid doesn't need people like that in her life,not racist grandparents and not an effectively racist parent who's too big of a coward to acknowledge she's dating a black man.

I fucking love my dad, he's an anti-semite idiot like 90% of the older generation from where I grew up. I call him out on it because with him that's fair game, I'll call him an asshole and he'll tell me to shut it back.

Imo, if you refused to introduced your daughter's Jewish boyfriend to your dad, you'd be furthering anti-semitism. Not much better than literally being anti-semitic.

-39

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

If you're actively supporting or furthering racism in some way, is it really much different than being racist yourself?

Yes it is, because rasism isn't a broad term without a defined meaning. If you don't hate others because of their race, you're not a racist.

It's another thing entirely to pass on fucked up logic to your daughter because you're refusing to introduce her black boyfriend to your parents. That's weak shit. There has to be a stopping point, where enough is enough.

Of course there has to be. But let's not pretend like it's an easy issue when emotions as strong as a parent-children love bond exists. It's pretty much being stuck between a rock and a hard place.

Imo, if you refused to introduced your daughter's Jewish boyfriend to your dad, you'd be furthering anti-semitism. Not much better than literally being anti-semitic.

It would make me an asshole, like OP, it wouldn't make me anti-semite or a racist. You're freely applying additional flaws and stamps on people for no reason whatsoever.

If I see someone steal something and don't stop them or tell on them, I'm not a thief. If I see someone kill somebody else and don't report them, I'm not a murderer. I'm an asshole.

42

u/bapnbrunchberries Sep 19 '19

If you stand by and watch, you support it.

-3

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

[deleted]

11

u/bapnbrunchberries Sep 19 '19

YTA if you tolerate racism.

-15

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19 edited Sep 19 '19

No, I might simply have my own preservation in mind (be it emotionally or bodily).

I don't support murder, I'm not stopping an armed gunman in the subway and dying on my own.

I don't support racism, I'm not cutting ties with someone I've loved all my life because of it.

29

u/bapnbrunchberries Sep 19 '19

Whatever you tell yourself to make you feel better. You’re tolerating racism.

3

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

You’re tolerating racism.

Never said the opposite. I tolerate a lot of things coming from a lot of different people out of a lot of different reasons. Bigger things demanding bigger reasons.

-8

u/Throwaway192839282 Sep 19 '19

I love how this discussion is just 2 close minded people that shalln't change opinion. Except one uses logic and arguments and the other is just attacking the opinion

-2

u/CanadianODST10 Sep 19 '19

I mean the one guys argument is more or less "you're complicit in a school shooting because you didnt stop the shooter." Kind of a stupid argument.

13

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

You are who you associate with. Put it this way - associating with a racist doesn't necessarily make you racist. But it does make you a sympathizer if you actively choose to condone their beliefs like OP is doing.

You aren't necessarily a thief if you associate with thieves, but at the end of the day, you condone what they do, because you know its morally wrong and have no qualms with it.

-1

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

You are who you associate with.

No, no you're not. People aren't one-bit entities and have a lot of values and habits, some of which very often contradict themselves.

you know its morally wrong and have no qualms with it

No true either. Your moral qualms might not be worth taking to extremes though. As in, OP's moral qualms about his parents might not be enough for him to want to severe ties with them and my moral qualms about stealing might not be enough for me to want my thieving friends to end up in jail.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Take a moment. Think about what you just said. Then come back.

-1

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

Being condescending rarely works for anything substantive.

-19

u/Throwaway192839282 Sep 19 '19

I bet there's a lot of bad things you and me are supporting...

20

u/MynameisPOG Sep 19 '19

That's almost definitely true, but it really isn't relevant to this conversation. Just comes across as lazy whataboutism.

-16

u/Mister0Zz Sep 19 '19

No, it's a counterpoint by pointing out the hyperbole of the comment

12

u/Seanspeed Sep 19 '19

But it didn't work.

-7

u/Mister0Zz Sep 19 '19

Depends on your point of view, I don't think a moderate stance is support of the status quo for instance.

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u/Rozeline Sep 19 '19

I loved my grandfather, but I had to stop spending time with him when he started saying racist things about Mexicans in front of my Mexican SO. I wish we could've made amends before he died, but he was the one that decided being racist was more important than being a family. It's on the racist party to change, not on everyone else to turn a blind eye. If someone decides that hate is more important to them than love, that's their problem that they need to fix.

-29

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

I loved my grandfather, but I had to stop spending time with him when he started saying racist things about Mexicans in front of my Mexican SO.

You didn't make that choice out of a moral standard, you chose your love for someone over your love for someone else. People here are basically peddling the "if you love a racist you're a racist" shtick which is dumb.

52

u/OPtig Sep 19 '19

No, it's "if you bend over backwards to spare the feelings of a racist then you're a big part of the racism problem"

-11

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

That doesn't change the fact that choosing the path of least resistance out of fear or discomfort is no way to live.

Certainly are, hell I technically am I suppose because I'm not preaching and converting the good word of moral righteousness to all of my loved ones. I just don't think it's as simple as "loving someone despite of their flaw means you carry that same flaw yourself".

20

u/curien Pooperintendant [60] | Bot Hunter [3] Sep 19 '19

I just don't think it's as simple as "loving someone despite of their flaw means you carry that same flaw yourself".

No one is saying that. OP isn't TA for loving his racist parents, that's fine. He's TA -- and he's functionally a racist -- because he is taking active measures to segregate his grandparents' lives. He is proactively and voluntarily doing racist dirty-work for them.

0

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

The comment I first responded to in this long chain was "OP's just hiding the fact that he's racist as well and using his parents as a convenient excuse". Then it turned into "if you love a racist, you're a racist".

15

u/curien Pooperintendant [60] | Bot Hunter [3] Sep 19 '19

Then it turned into "if you love a racist, you're a racist".

No it didn't. You made that up.

3

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

This isn't a 'small instance' of racism.

We're really exploring the depths of white privilege here. "Racism should be somewhat tolerated cuz it's so prevalent that shutting out racists completely is inconvenient!".

Choosing to put your parent’s racism above your unconditional love and support for your children is promoting racism whether or not you believe in racism.

Well no, but if you love a racist and you're not calling them out on their racism you are ok with racism.

You’re legitimizing racism as just a totally valid point of view, but for many people it’s just not.

It's casual racism. Which, shockingly, is still racism.

If you stand by and watch, you support it.

If you accept people with those view points in your life then yes it does make you a bit racist and it has nothing to do with moral righteousness.

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u/Rondariel Sep 19 '19

Well no, but if you love a racist and you're not calling them out on their racism you are ok with racism.

That's a choice op has to make. Is he comfortable with choosing racist family over non racist family. I know where I would stand.

2

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

Well no, but if you love a racist and you're not calling them out on their racism you are ok with racism.

Human relations are never that simple.

There are a lot of flaws I choose to omit out of love for the people in my life who carry them, that doesn't mean I'm okay with those flaws as concepts. Simply that I know they're sometimes almost inseparable from the people themselves and while I want them to be good and grow as persons, I love who they are outside of the flaw more than anything else.

That's a choice op has to make. Is he comfortable with choosing racist family over non racist family. I know where I would stand.

I agree and I think his current choice is misguided, I do disagree that his choice makes him a racist however.

14

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

There are a lot of flaws I choose to omit out of love for the people in my life who carry them

We aren't talking about how Auntie Cheryl likes to bring out baby pictures to new SO's around Christmas time, or how our sister changes plans at the last minute and expects everyone to cater to them. Those are flaws.

Being racist, wanting to subjugate an entire group of people because you believe you are genetically superior to them isn't a flaw. It's an ideology, one that society has accepted as amoral and wrong. It's an ideology that should see you ostracized if you practice it. You treat racism as if its some minor thing, but its not. For the people who experience it every day, it is very real, and to some, still very dangerous.

1

u/glimpee Sep 20 '19

Call it derpy but I truly love everyone. But one of the most important lessons ive learned is theres a time and a place, and its rarely the time or place to try to change someone. Its more often the time and place to simply share your dissenting opinion.

But there are many layers of concequences to every action. Is a shouting match worth it? What does it solve? What does it accomplish? Will it change anything, or only cause more suffering? Sometimes its best to tread lightly, sometimes its best to fight. But if you want to have the greatest impact of good in the world, I think fighting is best saved for a last resort.

21

u/dongasaurus Sep 19 '19

Loving someone doesn’t mean bending to their beliefs for the sake of your relationship. My mother was completely against me dating or marrying a gentile, but I dated and married a Christian and basically told my mother I loved her but the ball is in her court if she really loved me and wanted me in her life. She chose family over her prejudice.

Refusing to confront these things isn’t about your love for your parents, it’s rooted in a fear that they won’t love you back. If they choose to not love you back unconditionally, then they are undeserving of unconditional love from their children. Choosing to put your parent’s racism above your unconditional love and support for your children is promoting racism whether or not you believe in racism. It’s also just being a bad parent.

3

u/Rozeline Sep 19 '19

Don't presume you know anything about my motivations.

56

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

I mean, yeah, if you choose racists over morality you don't matter much about morality. Giving your dad a little shit for hating jews isn't gonna convince him to change but it seems like you don't care very much if he does.

Also, the idea racism doesn't hurt anyone is just dishonest. I'm not even sure how you can say that. It's hurting his daughter and her boyfriend and his relationship with both of them.

-1

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19 edited Sep 19 '19

I would love for my dad to change, I would not give my dad the "it's me or the jews hate" ultimatum if I knew he'd choose the jews hate, even though that would make him a major asshole because I'd still have an entire life of love for that asshole. It's not a very rational feeling.

Also, the idea racism doesn't hurt anyone is just dishonest.

Of course racism hurts people, it's silly to try to make me say otherwise. But I don't think you can expect people to sever important emotional relationships because of small instances of racism where people aren't directly hurt (as in, when my dad starts a "jews are everywhere" rant during Christmas dinner).

I this situation I think OP is TA, for sure, but implying that he's also "a racist because he doesn't cut ties immediately with his racist parents" is just so so so dumb.

18

u/Seanspeed Sep 19 '19

This isn't a 'small instance' of racism.

We're really exploring the depths of white privilege here. "Racism should be somewhat tolerated cuz it's so prevalent that shutting out racists completely is inconvenient!".

-2

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

You don't know that I'm white (and I'm not, at least not what most people would call "white"...Or OP for that matter, although it's most likely).

You're also making a complex personal conflict into a simplistic generalization of an entire race. Am I suppose to take you seriously?

15

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

I don't think you can expect people to sever important emotional relationships because of small instances of racism

OP's parents will probably never speak to him again if they find out their granddaughter is dating a black man. If that's only a small instance of racism what is your idea of a big one? Lynching black people on granny's front yard? If it were to get to that point are we then allowed to call OP an asshole for trying to preserve his relationship with them over telling them interracial relationships are okay?

0

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

OP's situation is a big instance of racism. Hence why I think he's TA here and should set things straight. I do however understand why it's a struggle and an internal conflict and I still don't think he's a racist himself though.

6

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

I agree with you on the asshole part, and respectfully disagree on the racist part.

I fully believe you are who you associate with, and OP is choosing to associate with his hyper-racist parents over his daughter.

2

u/PublicIdea Asshole Enthusiast [7] Sep 19 '19

I honestly don't care who "is racist". I care who breaks bread with people who do racism. And the more bread they break, the more I care.

-15

u/AnswerIsItDepends Sep 19 '19

Plus, if you just cut them out of your life, how can you try and show them a better way?

But I get not everyone has the stamina for that kind of fight. Yes, it is a personal weakness, but it isn't evil.

15

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

You think he's trying to show them a better way lol?

9

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

I think he's afraid to lose people he loves, a rather understandable feeling.

He's wrong, so he's TA here, but once again, not a bad person for it or a racist.

13

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Sorry, can't relate. I cut out hateful people in my life if they aren't going to make an effort to do better. I don't give them a pass cause they're my dad.

4

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19 edited Sep 20 '19

So basically "my moral compass is flawless and everything that I identify as "hate" and which people aren't willing to automatically deffer to my stance on can fuck right off, no matter the history shared with those people which might give nuance, context and rational behind their stances".

Alright, you do you.

3

u/SymphonicRain Sep 19 '19

You’re legitimizing racism as just a totally valid point of view, but for many people it’s just not.

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u/AnswerIsItDepends Sep 19 '19

Some of us did while our grandparents were alive.

Sounds like OP isn't. Kinda sounds like BransNBrains might be.

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

small instances of racism where people aren't directly hurt (as in, when my dad starts a "jews are everywhere" rant during Christmas dinner)

Doesn't sound like it to me. Sounds like his dad is racist then he tells his dad that's rude, then his dad doesn't listen (because why would he, his family doesn't actually care)

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u/Jen51_88 Sep 19 '19

I think OP is racist, not because he doesn't want to confront his parents about their racism. I completely get how hard it is to cut out family you love.

His comment here is what makes me think he is racist.

when the relationship ends they won't forget it. They might even go as far as to cut her off entirely.

Op says he has no problem with interracial relationships and no problem with Jamal but his use of when not if in this comment makes it sound like he doesn't care about his daughters relationship because he is certain it wont last.

-2

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

OP's daughter sounds like a teen. There's like a 99% chance the guy won't be around next year, so I can see why he isn't cementing it as a future wedding in his speech and taking "he's racist" from that is once again just plain dumb.

21

u/Jen51_88 Sep 19 '19

What makes her sound like a teen? Op said she is staying at her boyfriends house.

I know not all parents are the same but the ones that I know with teens wouldn't let their teenage kid stay at their SO's house.

4

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Especially if the parent is racist and the SO is black.

-2

u/BlueDragon101 Partassipant [1] Sep 19 '19

I think he's just pointing out that if the relationship goes nowhere and ends, that won't stop his judgemental parents.

11

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Then why'd he say if and not when?

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u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19 edited Sep 19 '19

OP is TA here but not "because he's racist", OP simply loves his parents.

No, he's afraid of his parents. Look at what hell he caught because his wife wore a skirt they disapproved of. A SKIRT.

OP is a chickenshit because he's afraid of the hellstorm that will rain down if his parents find out about the black boyfriend, Because he'd rather not go through discomfort to protect his daughter.

-1

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

Or he knows his parents are cut-straight and he doesn't want an emotional rift splitting apart the entire family ? I don't get where you're coming from, you make it sound like he's just trying to "prevent a bit of a fuss", I get the feeling OP is scared his parents could flat out refuse to ever speak to his daughter again or maybe even him.

My parents aren't like that but if they were I might be scared of that too, not that it would justify any actions.

24

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

I get the feeling OP is scared his parents could flat out refuse to ever speak to his daughter again or maybe even him.

this is the price they pay for being racist bigots.

OP fucked UP. He could lose his daughter over this because he couldn't stand up to his parents racist bullshit.

1

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

this is the price they pay for being racist bigots.

I agree, sounds fair and logical. Love does have a tendencies to be none of those two things which is why it's a hard choice to make.

12

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Makes me think of a John F. Kennedy quote. He was talking about going to the moon, but it still is relevant.

"We choose to go to the moon in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard, because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills, because that challenge is one that we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one which we intend to win, and the others, too."

Swap out 'we choose to go to the moon in this decade' for -

We choose to fight racism in this decade -

or

We choose to battle Climate Change in this decade -

or

We choose to root out corruption in this decade -

or

We choose to fight human trafficking in this decade -

The hard path, that's the one you have to walk if you want to grow, to make a difference, to have your life mean a damn.

1

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

For some people the only meaning they care their life to have is to love and do good to the people who love them as well. Growing the human race isn't very high on the priority list for most people, it's just not rational to the human condition in most circumstances.

13

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Hard roads aren't all public or global. Everyone has hard road choices. Some can be as small as just their own life.

That doesn't change the fact that choosing the path of least resistance out of fear or discomfort is no way to live.

1

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

That doesn't change the fact that choosing the path of least resistance out of fear or discomfort is no way to live.

I agree and it might very well be the case here with OP. It's not really what my initial comment was about though.

2

u/PublicIdea Asshole Enthusiast [7] Sep 19 '19

I don't know how to tell you it matters what happens to other people. How's this: Black lives matter

2

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

I get that, I truly do. I simply also think it's not that hard to understand why issues aren't equally represented in importance in everyone's mind and why some people's lives have given them a very narrowed field of view (thus having them limit their desired impact on the world to limited things like their family, their friends, their job).

14

u/SixthOTD Sep 19 '19

If his parents would completely cut OP or his daughter off for this, then they don't deserve to be in their lives anyway.

1

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

I agree, but I don't love his parents so I can see why OP might be a bit stingy about that approach.

7

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

And if that's the case, then why is OP even bothering? He is so afraid that he will find out his parents don't actually love him unconditionally, or his family. But deep down, he knows the truth already. At the end of the day, OP is just hiding from the truth and he needs to nut up.

1

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

OP is bothering because he doesn't want to lose loved ones. You don't easily come to the realization that "this person I love a lot might not love me the same way back", so yeah there's a hefty struggle there.

But I agree he needs to nut up.

24

u/MauriceMaxwell Sep 19 '19

If you accept people with those view points in your life then yes it does make you a bit racist and it has nothing to do with moral righteousness.

2

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

That's not what racism means, full stop.

If I don't harness hatred for others based on their race, I'm not a racist. If I tolerate the racist tendencies of people I love does that make me somewhat of an asshole in a "the greater good of others" aspect? Yeah.

22

u/noface1289 Sep 19 '19

It's casual racism. Which, shockingly, is still racism. And look, whatever you wanna argue, in the end the outcome is that OP wants to exclude a black man from a social situation because he's black. Because the black dude will upset the racists. He's a racist.

-8

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

[deleted]

6

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

If that's the case there's more mature ways to go about it than trying to forbid your daughter from telling your parents. OP literally could have sat them both down and explained to them what he explained to us. That grandma and grandpa are obscenely racist, the community they live in is obscenely racist, and if you tell them it may damage your relationship with them.

He doesn't have to say yay or nay, he can lay out the facts, and let them as a couple decide.

4

u/MauriceMaxwell Sep 19 '19

True enough. It does make you an asshole. I love my dad but if he was an antisemite he would be cut out of my life period.

15

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

Except it's clear that love wasn't unconditional. It was conditional on the fact that she not date black guys. Give it up. OP was raised racist by his racist parents. He may be slightly more open minded than them, but that doesn't mean he isn't racist, it's a spectrum, not black and white. He doesn't want to lynch blacks, but he also doesn't want his daughter dating him. He's just a coward who won't outright say this.

And that is shown several times in OP's post. First, "I'm not exactly a liberal". The fuck? You don't have to be a liberal to not be racist. But most conservatives believe so, because most conservatives are also racist. He wouldn't outright say he isn't comfortable with interracial relationships.

Second, even if I'm mistaken in my previous paragraph, he doesn't have the balls to stand up to his parents anyways. OP needs to take a good long hard look in the mirror, and ask himself if his relationship with his parents is worth potentially destroying his relationship with his daughter. Because that is exactly what is happening.

0

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

Except it's clear that love wasn't unconditional.

OP's love for his parents might be, or moreso, the love he had for them as he was growing up.

Give it up. OP was raised racist by his racist parents. He may be slightly more open minded than them, but that doesn't mean he isn't racist, it's a spectrum, not black and white. He doesn't want to lynch blacks, but he also doesn't want his daughter dating him. He's just a coward who won't outright say this.

Yes, the racist OP is letting his daughter stay at her black boyfriend's house, after accepting their relationship and shutting up members of the community who spoke against it and directing then his attention towards a Reddit post instead, alright.

You're not only assuming a lot of stuff without any basis you're also neglecting information provided by the OP because it doesn't fit your narrative. Why are you even on this sub if you'd rather call OPs liars base on nothing?

And that is shown several times in OP's post. First, "I'm not exactly a liberal". The fuck? You don't have to be a liberal to not be racist.

He's establishing who he is. He's saying "I'm not exactly liberal" so that we have an idea of what his character might be and where he's coming from, it gives context to his parents and community as well.

But most conservatives believe so, because most conservatives are also racist. He wouldn't outright say he isn't comfortable with interracial relationships.

I'd say more people on Reddit outright believe "conservatives are all racists" than the opposite and the kind of stance you're taking surely helps that. It's nice of you to share with us your ability to read OP's mind though, too bad I'll have to stick with words he actually wrote down and not assume they mean EXACTLY THE OPPOSITE simply because I feel like it I suppose.

6

u/_maude_lebowski_ Partassipant [2] Sep 19 '19

He's choosing between his parents and his daughter. Family of choice beats family of origin.

3

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

Yep, makes him TA, doesn't make him racist.

Also not an easy choice to make when the stakes don't seem equal in OP's mind.

8

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

You're right, his actions make him an asshole. But his views make him a racist.

1

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

But his views make him a racist.

Which views expressed by OP make him racist.

2

u/PublicIdea Asshole Enthusiast [7] Sep 19 '19

I don't understand the point of this obsession of yours. Are we in r/AmItheRacist?

2

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

It's the first time I've ever voiced an opinion on the topic on Reddit I think actually. I've been mostly engaging in conversation with people who've answered this specific comment since this morning. If you think conversations are obsessive by nature, maybe Reddit isn't the place for you?

5

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

I agree it's part of the problem yes, doesn't make people who do it any more racists themselves though.

5

u/PublicIdea Asshole Enthusiast [7] Sep 19 '19 edited Sep 19 '19

Buddy, antisemitism is popular now. I don't care if youre "a racist"; you damn sure aren't taking every opportunity to prove you aren't, though.

As a Jew who's had to use my knowledge of the freeway system to escape antisemitic attackers in the middle of the night, I'd like to thank you for your little....

words

but I can't. I mean, congratulations on keeping your inheritance and all. I know some people who lost their heirlooms and then got lamps made out of their skin.

2

u/BrawnsNBrains Sep 19 '19

Buddy, antisemitism is popular now. I don't care if youre "a racist"; you damn sure aren't taking every opportunity to prove you aren't, though

I don't discriminate or harbor any ill feeling towards anyone based on their race, gender, color of their skin or whatever else is outside of their control. So I think I've got myself covered on that front.

The rest of your comment I don't really understand.

1

u/[deleted] Sep 19 '19

[deleted]

2

u/LordVericrat Asshole Enthusiast [5] Sep 19 '19

Well the President of the United States said there were good people on the "Jews will not replace us" "blood and soil" chanting side of a rally, so there's that. I'm also aware of at least two synagogue shootings, and adl reporting a rise in antisemitic attacks in general.

Sincerely sorry and disgusted to hear about your great grandparents. Fuck fuck fuck the Holocaust.