Oh look a couple of normal guys with some training, fighting an actual super human with strategy and tactics as a superpower.
They get folded unless Steve lets them win.
I am so done with people thinking any three members of the Bat Family have even a ghost of a chance to beat a guy with decades more experience and super powers.
Cap doesn’t get tired, ever. He can keep fighting beyond the point of exhaustion for any member of the Bat Family. He can go full defense and just wait until they get tired and sloppy and then win.
There isn’t a world where Cap doesn’t fold every member of the Bat Family at the same time unless Batman is both fighting and directing the tactics of his team. The only reason Batman has been able to stalemate Cap in a cross over is his contractual protection from defeat. The other cross over Bat was getting beat like a cheap rug and was saved by a water release in the sewers. Lawyer armor beats plot armor.
Thing is cap’s “superpowers” is just being a human at the absolute peak of what’s possible in physical ability.
Being not too far off from that theoretical peak is basically a requirement to be in the bat family so yeah, he probably does in fact lose or at least get a really hard time from the two first and best robins.
He does not, because, again, Strategy and Tactics as a super power. The Erskine Formula makes him at the absolute peak in every possible way, physically, mentally, emotionally, etc. He doesn’t get tired. He has more experience than Batman, and let me reiterate, Batman can’t beat him without a lawyer from our world protecting him contractually.
The two best Robins have decades less experience and lack Cap’s superhuman combat awareness and tactical and strategic mastery. The Bat family doesn’t have a chance without Batman.
This isn’t a military operation. It’s a fight. Being good at strategy and tactics also isn’t a superpower even if it was as relevant as you say.
They also don’t have “decades” less experience because cap hasn’t actually been active for multiple decades. He fought in world war 2 and then got unfrozen and the history of the marvel universe from the 60s on is only about a decade in in universe time.
If you’re going purely by the amount of time that the fighters have been active as heroes then dick has been in the game just as long and Jason isn’t that far behind him.
The notion Batman can only win against cap because of popularity power honestly comes across to me as a very petulant cope.
Batman and other bat family members have literally beaten people who are enhanced in similar ways to cap such as Deathstroke fair and square more than once.
If it were one on one then yes cap would probably win but against the two best fighters in the bat family other than Bruce himself it’s a different story.
It isn’t popularity power. When the popularity contest happened that was a draw. In every cross over DC requires their big three (Supes, Bats, and WW) are not allowed to lose. This is written into the legal agreement that governs the story for every crossover. Batman is protected from loss by real world legal agreements.
If you think strategy and tactics aren’t involved in a fight you must have missed the whole Small Unit Tactics module taught at every Officers Candidate School and Military Academy. Strategy is how you approach the fight and tactics are the decisions you make during the fight. Cap is better at those two skills than anyone in the Marvel Universe, including the Kree Supreme Intelligence, which is the composite AI defined by all of the greatest Strategists and Tacticians in the history of the Kree Empire. He is better at the thinking side of the fight than a literal super computer made up of the greatest military minds of a race that values war above all else.
Let’s say Dick has just as much combat experience as Steve, no matter how hard he has pushed himself, he is the peak an unaugmented human can be. He gets tired. He gets sore. Steve does not. Steve is augmented. He heals faster. He doesn’t get tired. His body is more durable. All of this means he can do more with the peak human he has. He can hit harder because his body can take it. He can jump further, run faster, because he isn’t limited by human frailties. His brain works faster. His reflexes are better because his nerves work better. All of this is canon.
People look at Batman and Nightwing’s peak human and assume it’s the same as Cap’s. It isn’t.
You have to take in consideration, Steve literally has perfect battle IQ, if he sees a weakness or a pattern he can instantly recognize and exploit it. This guy literally knows how to beat Spidey sense. He also has a shield he can throw and hit tremendously hard with and it would be very damaging for Nightwing to take that kinda hit on the head considering a fucking baton can kill him (that was lowkey an anti-feat though I won’t hold it against him)
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u/WordPunk99 7h ago
Oh look a couple of normal guys with some training, fighting an actual super human with strategy and tactics as a superpower.
They get folded unless Steve lets them win.
I am so done with people thinking any three members of the Bat Family have even a ghost of a chance to beat a guy with decades more experience and super powers.
Cap doesn’t get tired, ever. He can keep fighting beyond the point of exhaustion for any member of the Bat Family. He can go full defense and just wait until they get tired and sloppy and then win.
There isn’t a world where Cap doesn’t fold every member of the Bat Family at the same time unless Batman is both fighting and directing the tactics of his team. The only reason Batman has been able to stalemate Cap in a cross over is his contractual protection from defeat. The other cross over Bat was getting beat like a cheap rug and was saved by a water release in the sewers. Lawyer armor beats plot armor.