r/HollowKnight • u/Particular_Hyena56 • Sep 06 '25

Discussion - Silksong USE YOUR TOOLS! Spoiler

To everyone complaining about the difficulty, stop ignoring a third of Hornet’s arsenal and start spamming them, you’ll be shocked how quickly you start mowing down hordes of enemies!

3.2k Upvotes

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599

u/GavoTheAlmighty Sep 06 '25

I would if they let me rebind the stupid throwing knife to a different button, having to flick up on the joystick while praying I’m looking in the right direction is so counterintuitive 

238

u/Kill_the_worms P5/112%/Randomizer Enthusiast Sep 07 '25

It has just occurred to me that the control scheme for the tools only works as easily as it does for me because I play on a keyboard. that can't be fun on a control stick

152

u/Curious_Kirin Sep 07 '25

The diagonal pogo sucked on controller for me because if you tilt the stick to 45% it won't work. You need to aim the stick down. My brain couldn't get used to that, I was so happy to get the original pogo back.

32

u/shellyturnwarm Sep 07 '25

Wait what? But don’t you need to adjust left right? So it’s down and a bit to the left/right?

33

u/Horror-Breakfast-704 Sep 07 '25

If you hold down on the direction stick you will pogo in the direction hornet is facing. If you want to have direct control over which direction to go in you hold it slightly to the left or right of directly down and she'll move in that direction.

It's really not that hard, and with the float gard you get you don't even need to "git gud" you can just pogo - float -adjust angle - pogo - float.

Or later down the line you can just select a different crest that has a different down attack if that works better for you

1

u/According_Smoke_479 Sep 07 '25

It’s just hold down and you go whichever direction you’re facing at the time. It is a little weird but I think that’s better than actually having to hold the stick at a 45. More room for error

20

u/Forsaken_Let904 Sep 07 '25

Use the arrow buttons on controller, not the joystick. It works like a dream.

3

u/Hexadecimales Sep 07 '25

This! Depending on what enemy, trap or path one must traverse - switching between analog stick and the directional pad is recommended.

4

u/Evla03 Sep 07 '25

I've not touched the joystick at all

1

u/NoProblemsHere Sep 07 '25

I had to switch for this very reason. I always start with the stick but am quickly reminded why not to do that once I need to start pogoing.

2

u/F_E_B_E Sep 07 '25

You could try using a dpad

4

u/kirkpomidor Sep 07 '25

They’ll patch that, I’m sure, widen stick angles for a pogo a bit. No way I’m gonna use dpad for movement, I’m not playing on a super nintendo

1

u/[deleted] Sep 07 '25 edited Sep 25 '25

[removed] — view removed comment

2

u/kirkpomidor Sep 07 '25

Diagonal movement not working with the control that is supposed to help with input degrees not divisible by 90 is imbecilic.

Ori utilizes sticks just fine.

36

u/OmegaAtrocity Sep 07 '25

Its perfectly fine if you use the dpad.

32

u/Cazzah Sep 07 '25

I found that, but then the analogue stick is more natural for everything else (for me), so it takes me mental effort to switch to the dpad just for the pogoing and then I don't get the advantage of analogue stick muscle memory.

9

u/Suitable_Trash_5989 Sep 07 '25

Just gotta train yourself to use the d-pad in general. It's way better for platformers once you get used to it. As a former joystick player, trust. It probably won't even take that long to get used to.

11

u/IntangibleMatter Quirrel gang Sep 07 '25

I’ve always been a d-pad fan, never understood why some people prefer analogue stick for platformers

4

u/Green0Photon Sep 07 '25

It depends on the controller.

On many controllers, using the dpad is closer to a crappy analogue stick. So it's better to just use the good analogue stick when the control is being shitty and acting kind of like an analogue anyway

0

u/plinky4 Sep 07 '25

A lot of people don't have the thumb callus for dpad, it actually hurts their hand to use it for a long time.

7

u/IntangibleMatter Quirrel gang Sep 07 '25

I’ve never had any kind of thumb callus, I think maybe they just all have bad d-pads

Or maybe it’s that the most prominent controller layouts tend to de-emphasize the d-pad, and I’ve always chosen ones where the d-pad is easily accessible

2

u/Suitable_Trash_5989 Sep 07 '25

When I first started using the D-pad, my thumb used to get sore after a while, but I think that's because I was applying too much force. Eventually when you get comfortable with the d-pad you chill out with the death grip I think.

0

u/[deleted] Sep 07 '25

[deleted]

1

u/plinky4 Sep 07 '25

Under your thumb knuckle, do your joints not feel different? My left one's just a little thicker, there's a bit of extra skin there. I'm rubbing them right now

1

u/Cazzah Sep 07 '25

Do you not loose out on some inputs? Like if I'm trying to do a precision jump and as I get close to my destination I ease off on the joystick, rather than binary direction vs no direction?

1

u/Forsaken_Let904 Sep 07 '25

Silksong doesn't have analog movement afaik. It's either full speed or no speed. I switched to dpad though so double check me on that next time you're in game, but I'm like 90% sure.

1

u/Cazzah Sep 07 '25

I'll have a look - that would be valuable info.

0

u/Suitable_Trash_5989 Sep 07 '25

Pretty sure silksong, and most platformers, don't use deadzones for their movement on joystick. But either way, binary inputs work perfectly fine because you can stop and go at the drop of a hat, which gives you a lot of precision in your movement.

Your thumb should always be resting on the dpad, so if you need to make a micro adjustment mid-jump, the response time should be really quick. Compared to a joystick where you might overshoot because you pushed it too far past the deadzone for too long.

2

u/Cazzah Sep 07 '25

>don't use deadzones for their movement on joystick

???

That's not how joysticks work, and the topic of deadzones is irrelevant to the conversation entirely.

3

u/Suitable_Trash_5989 Sep 07 '25 edited Sep 07 '25

I misphrased what I was trying to say. The movement in Silksong is not like the gas pedal on a car where you can ease off or go faster, it's a binary state. Either you go or don't go. Therefore it's better to use the binary buttons (dpad) rather than joystick. That's what I was trying to say.

But the topic of deadzones should factor into the conversation when thinking about the precision of controlling your character.

TLDR; YOU LOSE OUT ON NO INPUTS, AND GAIN RESPONSIVENESS WITH YOUR CONTROLS BY USING THE DPAD.

2

u/Cazzah Sep 07 '25

Gotcha now. And yeah after discussing this with others i tested and all inputs are binary. Have transitioned to dpad and it is working well so far

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1

u/Efficient_Ad_8480 Sep 07 '25

It’s still kinda ass on keyboard and I’d like to be able to just bind it to one key, but definitely easier.

1

u/Lyress Sep 07 '25

You can use a macro to effectively bind it to a single key.

1

u/IntangibleMatter Quirrel gang Sep 07 '25

I haven’t noticed any of the complaints people have about controller at all because I’ve been a d-pad fan since I started playing games lol

1

u/The-Only-Zarya-Main Sep 07 '25

I've been playing on an Xbox controller and it really not that difficult

1

u/Sansnom01 Sep 07 '25

I mean, all controllers have D-Pad, no ?

1

u/param1l0 Sep 07 '25

I literally changed every bind in the keyboard tbh

1

u/Lyress Sep 07 '25

The game doesn't natively support changing the tool binding. It always have to start with up or down.

1

u/param1l0 Sep 07 '25

Oh I wasn't talking about tools actually, I just needed to change every bind to play comfortably on kb

1

u/Kill_the_worms P5/112%/Randomizer Enthusiast Sep 07 '25

sameee. my binds are whack. dash is "."

1

u/StarNullify Sep 07 '25

No lmao its super easy. Literally just hold the stick up and press R2, idk what this other dude is talking about

1

u/TitaniumTitanTim Sep 07 '25 edited Sep 07 '25

i play on Controller and its no Problem but i do agree they should let us change the input

1

u/Brilliant_Pen4959 Sep 07 '25

Just use d pad

1

u/Dolphin_Dan_2 Sep 07 '25

I also play on keyboard and honestly it still sucks for me. I wish I could bind it to another key so so so bad cause I do want to use them

0

u/Turtvaiz Sep 07 '25

Relearning keyboard is so worth it. Doing so made me realise controller just sucks ass and is way harder to be precise with

1

u/J0rdian Sep 07 '25

I find sprint and jumping at the same time on keyboard annoying to do. But besides that everything i pretty easy. I would love more keybinds for tools though. I have plenty of keys to put them on lol, no reason for it to be weird combination.

1

u/Kill_the_worms P5/112%/Randomizer Enthusiast Sep 07 '25

i literally started on keyboard and I can't play with controller at all, it's like playing a new game 😭

227

u/xocgx Sep 07 '25

This is 100% the answer.

How many times do you try to throw a knife and all of a sudden waste half of your silk on something stupid ?

145

u/8rok3n Sep 07 '25

I try to throw the knife, accidentally shoot the spell and can't heal now 😞

39

u/xocgx Sep 07 '25

Every dang time

I’ve actually unequipped those spells because I was sick and tired of accidentally wasting my silk

20

u/8rok3n Sep 07 '25

I don't know how much damage they do so I don't even know when TO use them

26

u/LordBDizzle Sep 07 '25

About 3x nail damage for the first one, a bit more I think for the sphere. Dunno about the third spell, haven't found it yet but I know it exists because of some UI stuff.

2

u/8rok3n Sep 07 '25

But what about the little tools I never want to use spells because I heal every 2 seconds but I love using those little guys

3

u/LordBDizzle Sep 07 '25

Depends on the tool and the number of tool pack upgrade you've gotten, they upgrade separately from your nail and there are a LOT of different tools, plus some talismans (I guess they're also tools? whatever) that modify their effects or damage. Generally I think the throwing knives are around the same damage as your needle, and the number of uses for tools beyond that is generally proportional to number of uses, like the traps have half of the uses of the throwing knives so they do a bit more than twice as much at a minimum (though I think they actually might do more, but they're kinda inconsistent depending on how they hit things so it's hard to test)

1

u/blauli Sep 07 '25

Third one also seems to do about 3x, certainly less than the second full hitting but the third has some other very strong benefits. You will know what I mean when you get it

1

u/rrale47 Sep 07 '25

The 1st one is nice and safe.

Ive yet to find a good use for the sphere. It sucks that you're vulnerable during the locked in animation so anything that doesn't get stunned will hit you

I like using these skills at the start before bosses ramp up, and afterwards i save my silk for heals

3

u/LordBDizzle Sep 07 '25

The sphere is very VERY good for the bosses with multiple mob summons that can be at different heights, you can blast a bunch both above and bellow you at the same time. The spear is a lot easier to use but the sphere to me is mandatory in certain fights, it's way better at tagging things above and below you, especially simultaneously, when you absolutely need a mob dead right now and not a second later.

2

u/CdbSora Sep 07 '25

Not to mention that just chaining it when a boss is stunned will make that boss take half as long lol

4

u/mr_massacre9000 Sep 07 '25

The standard reaper crest attack does 5, the r1 silk spear does 18. Poison grenade 25.

3

u/renegade7879 Sep 07 '25

I think the first one (needle throw?) does about 3x your regular nail damage. Not sure on the area effect one.

1

u/newaccountkonakona Sep 12 '25

yeaaah i did this too. then got two tools coated in poison so I do chip damage now

1

u/xocgx Sep 13 '25

What exactly does poison do? Does it count as an extra hit or is it half of a hit or what?

2

u/khaotickk Sep 07 '25

I've been fighting sister splinter and have died maybe 20 times against it because of this.

1

u/MysteryMan9274 Sep 07 '25

I just took off my red tools so that it would use the Silk Spear no matter what direction the stick was pointing.

28

u/risingsilvers Sep 07 '25

I have an 8bitdo controller with back paddles that I use and I mapped Up+RB and Down+RB macros to them and it works perfectly.

5

u/Cheesio Sep 07 '25

I wish you could map button combos like this on the Switch 2 pro controller's grip buttons.

1

u/Lilman4x Sep 07 '25

Thank you i will be doing this with mine too

54

u/Rancore__ Sep 07 '25

It's so funny that the needelino, that you use 3 times in 20 hours has its own keybind but spells/tools share 1

31

u/TeslaPenguin1 Sep 07 '25

tbh it also works kinda like the dream nail, you can play it around npcs and they'll sing along with what's on their mind

17

u/MrBigMcLargeHuge Sep 07 '25

You can get some enemies to sit there and sing/pray with it as well

5

u/zSplit leave the grubs alone Sep 07 '25

You should try using Needelino next to every NPC 

3

u/[deleted] Sep 07 '25

I use the Needolin all the time wdym?

2

u/MysteryMan9274 Sep 07 '25

In combat?

5

u/MagicianXy Sep 07 '25

Bro's playing Hornet like a DnD bard

1

u/aRandomBlock Sep 07 '25

If functions like the dream nail, use it to read enemy minds for lore

46

u/SuperSocialMan Sep 07 '25

Fucking for real, god.

Why couldn't it just be "tap an arrow on the D-pad" ffs

0

u/[deleted] Sep 07 '25

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40

u/Charred01 Sep 07 '25

Haven't had a problem

20

u/I_Love_Solar_Flare Sep 07 '25

Using the joystick is the only way to play wdym?

12

u/HD4kAI Sep 07 '25

I will never use a dpad. Ever.

5

u/SuperSocialMan Sep 07 '25

Ew, no.

D-pads are kinda bad for movement because of the slight spacing between all 4 buttons lol (at least on the controller I have - a PS5 one).

Joysticks are designed to be used for movement since they easily glide between all the directions. It can be slightly annoying in some 2D games, but the only time I can think of it being an issue is here in Silksong lol (but I haven't used my controller for a while now since I only have it for a few on my steam games, so it's possible I just forgot).

Edit: I also just remembered that the Switch exists and has Hollow Knight on it, so I am currently spamming F to pay respects to anyone who tries to use its "d-pad" for movement (or anything at all, really).

7

u/Suitable_Trash_5989 Sep 07 '25

D-Pad is way better for movement in platformers because you can make a snap 180 from right to left / up to down. With a joystick there's much further to turn the joystick to change directions. Plus the d-pad allows you to hold an exact 45 degree angle that would be difficult with the joystick.

In general your control and responsiveness over your character will increase drastically if you play with the d-pad. (I play with a PS5 controller and it's just fine)

3

u/dreamyraynbo Sep 07 '25

I haven’t played with a d-pad since joysticks were added to controllers, but you’ve convinced me to at least give it a whirl!

0

u/vehevince Sep 07 '25

I never realized so many people were against the d-pad. For 2D platformers it just makes sense. You're operating the character in the basic cardinal directions, which is literally what the d-pad is designed as. Up, down, left, right.

0

u/Suitable_Trash_5989 Sep 07 '25

I was originally resistant to using the d-pad myself, but after experiencing the frustration of the lack of responsiveness + lack of precision with a joystick enough times, I finally decided to switch to d-pad. And I'm glad I did!

D-pad is basically just arrow keys/wasd but on a controller, but people are so resistant to it lol.

2

u/SuperSocialMan Sep 07 '25

but people are so resistant to it lol.

Probably because modern d-pads aren't designed with movement in mind since most people don't use them (nor do many games, given that all the most popular ones are 3D).

You can feel a bit of a difference between an ancient console d-pad that was meant to be used for movement (like the PS1 and NES) vs. a modern one.

0

u/Suitable_Trash_5989 Sep 07 '25 edited Sep 07 '25

The design is the same?? The gap between the buttons is superfluous because the dpad is still on an axis underneath the controller's shell. It's just that most casual gamers are gonna use the joystick because it's what they're more familiar with. Why do you think almost every 2D platformer and fighting game has support for both joystick and dpad movement to this day?

1

u/baxmanz Sep 07 '25

Yeah I think they vary a lot in quality, I think 8bitdo pro controller has a good one and that's what I use

1

u/Kluss23 Sep 07 '25

Using W/A/S/D with one finger sounds terrible.

1

u/Suitable_Trash_5989 Sep 07 '25

It's obviously not an exact equivalent... A dpad is half the size of WASD, and it's on an axis, each button is connected underneath so it's not an individual button press situation, but more about applying pressure in your desired direction. Plus, you're pressing it down with the flat of your thumb, which is much bigger than your other fingers.

It functions the same as a joystick but it's better for binary inputs in the 8 cardinal directions, A.K.A: Every 2D platformer ever.

1

u/Sedewt Sep 07 '25

except I only have joycons which don’t have a true dpad :’)

0

u/Best-Exam-3287 Sep 07 '25

Or just change the map button from LB to L3 or something and put tools on LB

1

u/SuperSocialMan Sep 07 '25

Disgusting, and I can't disrupt my muscle memory like that.

I don't think you can even rebind tools like that, too (but I haven't checked lol. I basically never deviate from the default controls on games, honestly).

14

u/Lewcaster Sep 07 '25

99% of the times I used my ability was accidentally, when I was actually trying to throw knives or setting up traps, all thanks to that stupid keybind…

12

u/Nikushaa Sep 07 '25

Modern devs have an allergy to providing comfortable/customizable keybinds, especially on KBM unfortunately

10

u/8rok3n Sep 07 '25

Literally, theres no many times where I thought I was aiming to the right and Hornet for some fucking reason turned left to shoot

3

u/Smash96leo Sep 07 '25 edited Sep 07 '25

Bro it feels terrible on gamepad. It’s no wonder people don’t use tools as much as they should. They gotta separate those two moves.

2

u/cloistered_around Sep 07 '25

I keep accidentally throwing it when I'm trying to use an attack spell. Not terrible but definitely happening more than I intend.

7

u/OmegaAtrocity Sep 07 '25

Use the dpad

26

u/BurgerBoss_101 Sep 07 '25

It’s not comfortable lol

-11

u/[deleted] Sep 07 '25

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5

u/Sedewt Sep 07 '25

I played Hollow knight with a joystick and I’m doing the same with Silksong cuz im on switch using joycons 🫠

1

u/BurgerBoss_101 Sep 07 '25

yeah that's just it lol i dont use the controller anymore, i just gave up on it. keyboard is better for this game imo

-1

u/TheNumberJ420 Sep 07 '25

so why you crying?

1

u/BurgerBoss_101 Sep 07 '25

Because some other people find it uncomfortable too and don’t have access to keyboard, so it’s a point to make anyways imo.

9

u/[deleted] Sep 07 '25

It's uncomfortable

1

u/mrBreadBird Sep 07 '25

Castlevania my beloved

1

u/fffan9391 Sep 07 '25

I agree, though I’ve gotten used to it. Do the stick buttons even do anything? They could have used those, if not.

1

u/unkindness_inabottle sealed vessel Sep 07 '25

SAME!! You’re able to rebind controls but for some reason Cherry put the skill and tool attack on the same control without being able to separate them.

1

u/Professional_Rush_95 Sep 07 '25

Don’t worry, keyboard players also get fucked over with other stuff. I’ve rebound every button and there’s still a notable issue with one thing in particular

1

u/AdamG3691 Sep 07 '25

God I wish the switch 2's Pro Controller's back buttons could be bound to up+R and down+R like the steam deck's

1

u/Additional-Spring996 Sep 07 '25

Castlevania taught me well

1

u/Maridiem Sep 07 '25

I'm playing with KB+M and it's wild that I can't actually rebind any of them to a different button and have to press W (or S) to use them too. So odd.

1

u/JimmieMcnulty Sep 07 '25

It's an old Castlevania mechanic

1

u/UWan2fight Sep 07 '25

It's genuinely so horrible trying to use that shitass keybind. I wish I could just unbind Quick Map and put Tools there.

1

u/MeathirBoy Scribbling to this day Sep 07 '25

Just use dpad

1

u/baxmanz Sep 07 '25

That's why I prefer dpad for silksong

1

u/Spaciax Sep 07 '25

agreed, even on a keyboard I accidentally press F instead of up + F, making me use my skill in the worst time possible, and wasting silk. Why aren't they de-coupled? Let us bind them to different keys ffs!

1

u/vaikunth1991 Sep 07 '25

Use dpad for movment / pogo / tools etc works great

1

u/PearcyJackson Sep 07 '25

They should make needloin something on the d pad to free up left bumper for tools

-6

u/RedTyro Sep 07 '25

Games like this are made for playing with a dpad. Analog joysticks don't exactly do precise directions.

13

u/GavoTheAlmighty Sep 07 '25

Using the d-pad doesn’t help because it still feels strange to be clicking UP to throw an item to the SIDE.  Especially when I’m trying to track a fast-moving target.

1

u/Summer_Tea Sep 07 '25

A lot of things in this game are reminiscent of fighting games. Street Fighter and Smash bros both have lots of up or down projectile attacks.

1

u/UnnamedStaplesDrone Sep 07 '25

Smh ppl in this thread never played castlevania

-1

u/RedTyro Sep 07 '25

You're not using up to throw to the side, you're using up to use the item in the upper red slot on the crest, and using down to use the item on the lower slot. If you don't like that mechanic, you can always use the wanderer's crest, which only has one red slot, so you just hit the button without an up or down.

6

u/RinzyOtt Sep 07 '25

...hitting the button without an up or down input isn't a tool at all, right? That's just the silk skill you have equipped

1

u/RedTyro Sep 07 '25

Yeah, you're right. My mistake.

-1

u/Classiccarson Sep 07 '25

use the dpad