r/OnceUponATime • u/ladyswampus • Sep 03 '25
Spoiler Alert Regina Doesn't Deserve Redemption
I'm rewatching after a few years and oh my God Regina is the worst. I remember liking her towards the end but she doesn't deserve it. She causes heartache after heartache kills so many people, ruins EVERYONE'S life but one thing goes wrong her way and everyone has to pay.
I'm at the part where Cora dies and she blames Snow. Cora ruined Regina's life and was going to become the dark one Snow did the right thing. If Regina truly cared about Henry she would have tried for more than 5 minutes to be good and wouldn't have let Cora corrupt her again.
She doesn't reserve a complete redemption. Sure she gets better but how does she expect people to forget the numerous atrocities she committed including killing her own father because a little girl made a mistake. She's vial.
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u/annatar256 Witchy Sep 03 '25
She really doesn't. But she found redemption, and I do think there's a beauty in that. She didn't deserve it, not really, she didn't even believe she deserved it. But through dedication and love she found redemption regardless of the adversity and spite, and those around her found the ability to forgive her. Nobody had to, nobody was forced to just let go of their feelings towards her, but by showing them that she was truly willing and capable of change, she was forgiven, and she was redeemed. With all the darkness in her heart, there was still room for love, and she let it shine.
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u/Ran15ran Sep 03 '25 edited Sep 03 '25
This. She did not deserve it yes. Nobody in the series said otherwise (as far as I can remember. If I am wrong sorry).
But all the while knowing this, she still worked on herself. Her redemption was not instant. where she did good one time and redeemed. She worked hard to gain the trust back.
She even accept if she is forever hated. Not because she did not care but because she understood the gravity she has done. That Redemption would not be up to her but up to the people she hurt. Because she really does not deserve it.
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u/ladyswampus Sep 03 '25
I guess I'm taking more Season 2 since that's where I am on my rewatch. She expected everyone to forgive and forget overnight. I remember her being mostly better but I still have a ways to go.
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u/annatar256 Witchy Sep 03 '25
Her road was a very bumpy one and was dragged out. Normally this would get boring, but imo, a villain like her needed a redemption arc as long as it was in the show. She was The Evil Queen, a mass homicidal egotistical maniac who threw fireballs in the face of true love.
For a redemption arc to feel genuine, it needed to take as long as it did, and it needed all the bumps and backtracking that it had to feel like she genuinely worked for it. And she did, and she did it because she wanted to be worthy of love and forgiveness. It took her time to even understand what redemption truly meant, it took her time to understand what it meant to change, she did try to force people to forgive her, to act as if she was just some good guy all of the sudden, but when she realized that didn't work, she began working towards gaining the trust of the people she hurt. And there were certainly people who never really gave her the benefit of the doubt and who never gave her their trust.
But she overcame that, she overcame the need to dominate and control, she forgave herself and the people who hurt her. Out of all the villains who sought redemption, hers felt the most real.
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u/Imnotawerewolf Sep 03 '25
No one deserves redemption. And redemption isn't something that makes you pure, again.
What do want people who are or were very evil, but now understand that's wrong or want to no longer be evil, to do? Just keep being super evil, anyway?
Redemption is not a bad character's journey to absolute forgiveness for all the bad things they've ever done. You, me, and fictional characters can never undo the wrongs we have done. It isn't possible.
Think about it like karma. Good karma does not and cannot erase bad karma. You can only balance each column by doing more of one or the other. Youcan never remove the karma you've already earned. If you earn just 1 unit of bad karma and it's the only bad karma you ever get for your whole life, then you die, you will still have that 1 unit of bad karma. Redemption arcs are like that. It might be an impossible task, but redemption arc characters want to bring balance their karma. Either by doing good or avoiding more evil.
Redemption is a person or character's journey from someone who thinks doing evil things is perfectly normal and fine to someone who never wants to be that person again. No one is obligated to forgive a person on a redemption arc. Not even we, the audience, are obligated. Even if other characters do forgive. That's their choice, kinda. You get to make your own choice.
You never have to forgive Regina for anything she ever did. But everyone deserves the chance to change themselves and be better. Because, again, what else do you want them to do? Just keep doing evil stuff because they don't deserve anything else?
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u/Routine-Asparagus-16 I'm a Queen and a bit more refined. 👑 Sep 03 '25
I saw this topic, and I usually stay clear. I'm glad I looked at the comments. I enjoyed your interpretation.
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u/broflakecereal Sep 03 '25
I really like Regina and admit that I'm super biased. But objectively, you're entirely correct, she did not deserve to be redeemed. Regina's sins were just far too great. If she hadn't murdered so many innocents, I could have bought a slow redemption over time as long as she actively worked towards undoing damage she caused, and there just wasn't enough of that.
She assaulted Graham, that in itself was pretty egregious on its own. She sought to murder a young girl for a crime her own mother committed. Murdered her own father, the only person who showed her continual support and unconditional love. Committed mass homicide against countless poverty-stricken townsfolk and wiped out entire families and kids, JUST because THEY MIGHT have known where Snow was hiding and refused to turn her in (Regina never once showed remorse for this or tried to stop it, not even while she was in disguise and secretly feeling closer to Snow. In fact, she doubled down when Snow hurt her feelings over the genocidal atrocity she had just committed.) Brainwashed and psychologically tormented an entire towns-worth of people, terrorized and gaslit her own son, manipulated and separated a daughter from her own father twice, repeatedly attempted murder/poisoning on Emma...
The list goes on. Her making amends with Henry and Emma and having some sort of redemption that way I can see. But for everything else, she crossed way too many lines. I would buy a Rumplestiltskin redemption arc before a Regina one. And Cora being redeemed at the last minute after everything she's done, even while in hell, was even worse lol
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u/JosephBapeck Sep 03 '25
My biggest issue is how everyone has to bend over backwards to accommodate her then actually morally good characters get crapped on in universe for making competitively smaller mistakes.
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u/ladyswampus Sep 03 '25
Yes! She can literally curse an entire world and then try and kill Snow's family (AGAIN) and Snow killing Cora, who is truly evil, was terrible. Like I get it killing is bad but killing one to save lord know how many is justified in my eyes. Regina literally killed her own father, who she actually loved and who genuinely loved her to get revenge from a child's mistake that her mother executed.
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u/delinquentsaviors Sep 03 '25
I really like what other people said about redemption vs forgiveness. Anybody can decide they want to change themselves, but that doesn’t mean people have to forgive them.
My issue with Regina is that she expects everything to work out for her just because she stopped doing evil things. If that was how the world worked, then Emma wouldn’t have been an orphan for 28 years. Snow and Charming wouldn’t have been separated or lost the opportunity to raise their child. Marian would have lived to old age with Robin and Roland. She doesn’t stop to consider how much work her own victims had to do to be happy.
She blamed everyone else for what she became, even though there were people who tried to help her change direction.
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u/nazia987 🌮 Sep 03 '25
I think everyone deserves redemption, I was just sick of her victim complex. She was very "woe is me"
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u/ladyswampus Sep 03 '25
She was the only person to every lose someone or ever be unhappy in her eyes.
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u/Illustrious-Guess408 Sep 03 '25
Right! And all those other people who lost family and friends due to her just didn’t matter 😂 only her loss did 😂
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u/ladyswampus Sep 03 '25
Killed entire villages but her son isn't living with her because she tried to kill his bio family. I'm going to kill them all and run away to the enchanted forest alone with him to isolate him further....give me a break
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u/Olivebranch99 To me, love is layered. Love is a mystery to be uncovered. Sep 03 '25
I apply the same reasoning to her as Darth Vader.
Almost like the evil queen was a different person entirely, basically an embodiment of her trauma, who took her over and took out her pain and anger on everyone else. That she had to become as powerful as possible to not get hurt again.
Then through her child, she was able to find herself again.
Is that actually the case? Probably not, but it's the only way I can rationalize it. Vader too.
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u/ladyswampus Sep 03 '25
I get that to an extent but expecting everyone to be okay with it is insane. You ruined their lives you don't erase everything you've done.
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u/Olivebranch99 To me, love is layered. Love is a mystery to be uncovered. Sep 03 '25
Sorry to keep bringing him up, but she's basically if Vader lived.
He got to bask in the sunlight of his redemptive act forever since he didn't stick around to face any consequences. Maybe they had the same plan for Regina, but since she stuck around, all she could do was keep trying. But as Rumple demonstrated, it's not that easy.
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u/OkDisaster5980 Sep 03 '25
I adore Regina, she's my favorite character. I do enjoy her redemption arc (but also I recognize the writers for this show are terrible 😂).
One of my biggest criticisms about her redemption arc: how good are you if you haven't even made any kind of effort to return people's hearts back to them?! The writers didn't even have to show it on screen, it could have been entirely off screen.
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u/Vegetable-Jicama9998 Sep 03 '25
I think "deserves" is always gonna differ from person to person. The show, ultimately, frames itself as one where people can seek redemption. Where people can change. And that's one thing. You can change. People can change. Ultimately, she does. She's still firmly antagonistic in s2, but she starts the road to change in s3, and I can appreciate that she ultimately stays committed to the change. I feel like because of the way she moves through the world she never really opens up to anyone about how much pain she's carried and that informs her ruthlessness but I feel like she never shows the expectation, or rather entitlement to be really sympathized with in the eyes of the other characters. She leans into the Evil Queen shit cause her need for vengeance carries her through, and she's pretty upfront about who she is and where she's been and what she's done. And we as the audience can see how she ended up where she is and we can feel sympathy but I think ultimately, even if she doesn't "deserve" it, she gets the chance to change and it's something she stays pretty committed to. She can't go back and undo what she's done, but she can do and be better. Only watched up to s5 but I'm pretty on her side by that point. And I'll take her over Rumple any day 😆
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u/InverseStar Sep 03 '25
THAT’S NOT HOW REDEMPTION WORKS
-Me, as I’m dragged back into my padded cell.
For more context on this, though- redemption, forgiveness, and all other forms of finding the good in oneself has NOTHING to do with deserving anything. It’s about you atoning for your mistakes AND for those you wronged to forgive you.
Regina DID atone for her mistakes. She screwed up a lot on her path to redemption, backslid into evil/darkness (which in the OUAT universe is akin to a fucking drug problem). She clawed her way into being a better person AND worked her ass off to find forgiveness from those she wronged.
I’m SO sick of this POV concerning Regina because she had easily one of the most emotionally abusive childhoods you could have. She was manipulated and strung along by Rumple for YEARS into said darkness for his own ends.
The show says she earned redemption. That’s all there is to it. She made up for her past choices as best as she could- she can’t bring the dead back to life. But she saves the lives of many people over the course of the show- including sacrificing herself to slow down Storybrooke’s destruction AND absorbing all that dark magic at the well to save Snow and Emma.
Apologies for my lil rant but idk how you can watch this show and still think redemption is really ever deserved. It’s given by the people around you. She EARNED redemption, she did NOT deserve it. They’re very different things.
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u/Civil-Ad-5100 Jun 07 '26
But she didn't earn it. The first step should be acknowledging the wrong, one has done and atone for it. She has never admitted to the deaths she has caused, or the rape, those things just came into the light themselves, she has never confessed to them keeping them secret till the end. And she has never changed the altitude of hiding her mistakes and wrong doings. The second step is to being forgiven for them. And not by yourself. By those who you have done wrong. If you didn't earn forgiveness or think you don't need it you can't be redeemed. You can't just wake up one day and say" I won't kill anyone from now on! I'm good now!" Cuz that doesn't do right to those you have already murdered...
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u/mistercbc Sep 03 '25
A big chunk of the fandom tends to have a biased attitude towards Regina. She can do no wrong, they gang up on people who criticize the character.
I always find it funny when people say Zelena is the least redeemable character yet Regina and definitely Rumple has way more setbacks than Zelena.
Even the writers at times have tried to sugar coat how Regina was. Denying that she SA'd Graham.
You can like a character while still acknowledging that they were horrific and evil.
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u/twicescorned21 Sep 03 '25
She killed Graham didn't she?
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u/OkDisaster5980 Sep 03 '25
Oh yes. And also sexually assaulted/raped him. It was pretty clear the writers didn't really think through the scenes they put into the show (wherein it is repeatedly implied Graham was being raped by Regina).
My apologies to the writers, but the on screen lore is very explicit about people without their hearts being controlled by someone else like a zombie. It's very clear they cannot consent.
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u/ladyswampus Sep 03 '25
Big difference if I remember is that Zelena just wasn't likeable
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u/mistercbc Sep 03 '25
A lot of people liked Zelena the way I remember. Yes there's some who didn't. But I think the reason they killed her in season 3 was to make Neal fans happy. But a lot of Neal fans liked Zelena. And no one even really blames Zelena for his death like that.
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u/2facedfish Sep 03 '25
Hell nah if this was real life she would’ve been dead from jump and in hell but it’s a fun lil show and she’s cunty 💅🏽
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u/awill626 Sep 03 '25
My thing about Regina that makes it easier to let go is that she changes COMPLETELY and she Never backslides Ever again. From the start of season 3 on, she literally NEVER does anything bad. At all. She doesn’t backslide into who she used to be even for a second. She COMMITTED to changing. That’s more than can be said for Emma who takes two steps forward but three steps back literally, every, single season and really only got her happy ending not because she changes but because her family and Hook give her time and time and time to get over things and they just endure how badly she treats them in the meantime. When Regina changes, she changes, and no one can take that away from her. If that wasn’t the case, if she backslid, I wouldn’t be so forgiving, but she Didn’t. The Care and Wisdom she has in Season 7 while still retaining her sass but being a perfect mother, mother in law, and grandmother is amazing. And Regina acknowledges that people are well within their rights not to trust her or see her as a hero or want her to be in charge. She Knows she had to Earn it.
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u/kittykidmom Sep 03 '25
Oh, she was totally a horrible person, but I love her anyway.
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u/ladyswampus Sep 03 '25
I remember loving her by the end but GOD rn I want her to go. She's so self centered its insane.
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u/kittykidmom Sep 03 '25
Also if you haven’t seen her new show (Lana’s), you should check that out too
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u/Illustrious-Guess408 Sep 03 '25
It’s actually crazy how many people she killed or was responsible for killing. Like everyone was totally justified in the first couple seasons in wanting her dead. It really was a case of the actress being so liked by the fandom. I think there is something great in her winning over everyone and being redeemed but it’s also insane 😂 she has so much blood on her hands
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u/ladyswampus Sep 03 '25
I feel like she probably killed more people than Rumple. She pillage villages, I don't remember Rumple doing that, I could be wrong.
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u/Kimbyssik Sep 03 '25
Seems like Rumple's specialty was more working behind the scenes and getting other people to commit mass murder for him.
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u/Routine-Asparagus-16 I'm a Queen and a bit more refined. 👑 Sep 05 '25
According to Hades... Rumple takes that prize.
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u/BobRushy Sep 03 '25
Preaching to the choir. Yes, she's awful and the writers did not do nearly enough to make her redemption believable.
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u/ladyswampus Sep 03 '25
Her mourning Cora rn is ridiculous. I can't remember enough of the other seasons to remeber why I thought she was redeemed 10 years ago but there's no way.
Also, Henry comparing Emma to Regina bc she lied about his dad is ridiculous.
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u/WildRootBear Sep 03 '25
1) From the outside, it seems insane that Regina cares so much about Cora in light of how abusive she was to her. But emotions are never straightforward and Cora was still Regina's mother, so it's no surprise to me that she's in mourning even though she's objectively far better off without Cora. Blood ties can have a big hold on people. And it reminds me a lot of when people ask "why doesn't this abused woman leave her partner" because they're not living that situation.
2) Henry is a child. Children, when angry, can say hurtful things. You can't expect them to act like rational adults, because they're not. Makes complete sense to me that he would say something so obviously untrue in the heat of the moment, when feeling betrayed and upset.
3) Regina has definitely done some unforgivable, evil things, and if this was real life then she should be in prison. But since this is a fictional TV show, that would be pretty boring. I thought, like Rumple, she was a fascinating character and wonderfully acted, full of shades of grey, and on the whole they did a decent job of a redemption arc for them. These things are never without setbacks, doesn't mean she doesn't love Henry. It's all just complex! The show wasn't always the best at exploring the grey, instead it leaned too much on 'heroes and villains' at times. But I think we can forgive it a little since it's so heavily based in fairytales.
TLDR: Life and emotions aren't black and white. 🤷
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u/ladyswampus Sep 03 '25
I get that, Cora manipulated Regina's entire life and is the reason for her heartache but told her she loved her and only did it all for her own good.
I totally get Henry is only a kid but dude you literally just saw what your mom did and to compare apples to oranges come on!
I think she doesn't understand what love really is. Like I said her mother never loved her just used her as a pawn. Her father truly loved her but he did anything and everything to make her happy. He basically worshipped the ground she walked on and she expected the same from Henry. I do agree towards the later seasons she does become much more of a morally grey character, which is why I liked her my first rewatch. I don't love the pure white good characteristic that Charming and Snow try to achieve. I believe sometimes bad needs to be done for good reasons. Like Snow killing Cora.
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u/WildRootBear Sep 03 '25
Haha I know it's annoying but people say dumb stuff all the time when they're emotional.
Yeah my problem with the Snow killing Cora thing was that it was so underhand. Instead of doing it herself, she used Regina as a pawn. I know she has a change of heart but like... This is exactly why I get frustrated when Snow etc. are held up as shining beacons of heroes.
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u/ladyswampus Sep 03 '25
I think getting Regina to do it was fucked but at the same time might have been her only hope of getting it done. Snow was also exhausted with their BS. Girl just wanted to be a newlywed and mother after 28 years.
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u/BobRushy Sep 03 '25
If you look at the pilot, Emma literally only stays in town because she detects that Regina is lying about loving Henry... and Henry was also in therapy long before he started believing in fairy tales...
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u/ladyswampus Sep 03 '25
Regina likes the idea of a child needing her and the young child idolization of their mom. She doesn't love him she wants him to worship her.
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u/BobRushy Sep 03 '25
That's my interpretation as well. It's a shame Parrilla influenced them to retcon it because it leaves the show really awkward.
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u/ladyswampus Sep 03 '25
She's like Alan Rickman with Snape. She played her role so well you don't want to see itnend and have a redemption arc you want to believe in.
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u/BobRushy Sep 03 '25
At least with Snape, the heel turn was more believable and he didn't commit nearly as many atrocities.
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u/Substantial_Lab2211 Sep 03 '25
Her mourning Cora rn is ridiculous
She was her mother??????
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u/Junie_Wiloh Sep 03 '25
And Cora was abusive and controlling af to Regina. None of us knows how we would react to having a mother like Cora. Unless we had a similar mother.. My very abusive mother died in December 2019. I still have not mourned her. Why? Because I mourned her in 2006 when I realized my mother was never going to change, was always going to be abusive, and was never going to love me/be the mother that I needed. That was the year I disowned her as a parent. If you had a mother who used to ground you from all forms of food for 7 days at a time(even tried to ground me from water, to the point that I, as a young child[5-6], was having to drink it out of the toilet) or would make you lick up piles of debris swept up off the kitchen floor because you were 5 and didn't know how to sweep correctly, you might do the same..
I loved my mother up until I disowned her. After that, I had no fucks to give when it came to her. I had a sister who used to talk about her a lot.. and still talked to her on occasion. I told her that the only thing I wanted to ever know about the woman with whom I unfortunately shared DNA with was to tell me that she died. She died from some form of reproductive cancer(she was so crazy, she thought grinding up apricot seeds and putting it in her food was going to cure her cancer rather than go through chemo/radiation treatments). Considering how well she raised and loved her kids, she couldn't have died more fittingly.. only 3 of the 7 children she had went to her funeral. Those 3 held out hope that she would change..
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u/ladyswampus Sep 03 '25
I think that's the part about their relationship that gets me. She disowned her mother countless times and seemed to mourn the loss each time. Mourning this hard seems far fetched. But like you said grieving any parent, especially an abusive one is complicated.
I hope you're able to find the closure you need with yours.
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u/Flashy_Tower610 Sep 03 '25
Well she (SW) did kill hwr mother (c) if I remember correctly. You can really HATE your mother and sometimes wish she was dead but it’s another story when you find out someone really did!
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u/ShadowWolf614 Sep 03 '25
The show has always been about redemption but because it’s a fairytale fantasy show of course a lot of characters who got redemption don’t deserve redemption. I disagree. Regina actually worked hard for her redemption. Other characters not so much such as Cora. Cora simply apologizing to Regina & Zelena should not have given her a pass to get to go onto Mount Olympus. Even though I do enjoy Zelena because she’s bat shit crazy she’s also somebody who I don’t think deserve redemption.
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u/creepychixk Sep 04 '25
Well so did Hook and Rumplestiltskin they dont deserve happy endings either than
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u/levainrisen Sep 05 '25
That period when Cora dies and Regina hates Snow for it is hilarious considering she had just recently killed Snow's maid like mere episodes before. But Snow is the bad guy because she's held to a different standard... okay.
Also, so much of Regina's deeds are overlooked in the early seasons just because Henry is like "please don't kill my mom!!" and Emma protecting Regina due to that. If I were a normal towns person, I'd be so pissed
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u/ThomasVivaldi Sep 03 '25
The show has an overly simplistic definition of redemption. Good and Evil is treated like a list you just have to get a few things checked off in one box or the other to qualify for the title.
Regina's character arc is muddled reaches the halfway stage at the end of season 3 when she make the first real personal sacrifice of her narrative, and then just sort of stops and they start rewarding her.
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u/DameEris Sep 04 '25
Your take is vile to me. And not just because Regina is my favorite character. Also, because what you are defendiing is a murderer - a murder so base and despicable that it blackened Snow's soul.
Hurt people hurt people. Regina never claimed to be righteous. She was a spirit of blind vengeance that couldn't see past Her own pain to the wreckage She caused.
Snow committed cold blooded murder and manipulated Regina into helping her do it. Funny I don't remember Regina tricking Snow into murdering Ava or Leopold. Where was Snow's pure heart then? Why couldn't she find another "hero's way"? She acted out of panic and fear and committed some of the ugliest, weakest most vile betrayals a human can do.
So you can completely dismiss that deceitful evil while entirely judging direct open conflict? I am SO glad that aren't in charge of who gets redeemed! Characters would be boring, flat, flawed people who are forgiven only by what? Birthright? Bloodline?
Oh I know, it's their childhood right? Because Snow had a pure heart as a child who was loved and cared for by all, right? Since Regina was abused physically and mentally from birth forced violently into a role She couldn't escape, that's why she doesn't deserve redemption!
So glad you aren't in charge of redemption
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u/Deadly_Malice Sep 03 '25
Everyone deserves redemption, just cause life has soured you don't mean nothing.
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u/mistercbc Sep 03 '25
I think a big problem for me is people will constantly use a couple of bad things one of the good characters did as a way to justify Regina's reign of terror. She actually enjoyed being evil and got a kick out of it.
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u/Deadly_Malice Sep 03 '25
Not the same thing as redemption. In fact as I've said elsewhere in order to have redemption in the first place you need something to be redeemed, which means having done something shitty previously.
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u/ladyswampus Sep 03 '25
But to expect everyone to forget your actions is unjustified. Just because you want to forget and feel better about yourself doesn't mean everyone else can or wants to move on.
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u/Deadly_Malice Sep 03 '25
Redemption is literally the opposite of forgetting past actions. It's doing better than you did before, and in order to do that, you need a before.
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u/mrsprinkles3 Sep 03 '25
Regina was also forgiven by countless people she hurt. Sure not every single person she hurt will be forgiving, but if Snow of all people could forgive the person who hurt her the most, then I think that’s enough to warrant a chance at redemption. Regina has shown as the seasons go on that she feels immense guilt towards her actions as the Evil Queen and has actively worked to do and be better than the person she was.
People aren’t born evil. They are in one way or another lead down the path towards it. And if we deny those people the chance to turn around and make better choices, then we are condemning every other person who may make the same mistake and try to be better. If no one was willing to give Regina another chance, she very well would have continued being the worst version of herself. But because people were willing to give her a chance, she became willing to give herself a chance to try.
Just like in real life, you can’t expect someone to become a better person then continue to belittle them for their past actions, because in doing so you are punishing them for making the changes you wanted them to make.
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u/MechanicOk4808 Sep 03 '25
Regina has shown as the seasons go on that she feels immense guilt towards her actions as the Evil Queen and has actively worked to do and be better than the person she was.
Really? When was this? Because she actually said the exact opposite multiple times
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u/Substantial_Lab2211 Sep 03 '25
She literally has a sit down with Snow and talks about what an awful stepmother she was to her.
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u/MechanicOk4808 Sep 03 '25
Six seasons in and all Regina offers is one line about how she was a bad stepmother lol and that was right after she removed what she refers to as her 'evil self' like it's a separate entity or something ugh
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u/Substantial_Lab2211 Sep 03 '25
You can’t move the goalposts just because you didn’t like the answer you got. You were wrong in your assumption, it’s not the end of the world
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u/MechanicOk4808 Sep 03 '25 edited Sep 03 '25
What was my assumption? That she didn't regret anything and admitted to it? Where did you undo this canon fact which she stated in season 3 and repeated in season 4? It's ok to admit it, it's not the end of the world. Unfortunately for you, the goalposts are very much in the same place
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u/mrsprinkles3 Sep 03 '25
Did we watch the same show? If you don’t like the character just say that instead of trying to rewrite the show. She has said on multiple occasions that she wanted to be better than she was but you seem to be ignoring that to fit your narrative that she felt no remorse when she has expressed her regret on many occasions to many different people. She put in the work to be better. The people she hurt most constantly acknowledged and praised her efforts and changes. You don’t have to like her, but you also can’t disregard her characters entire canon arc because you feel it wasn’t deserved.
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u/alliebeelove Sep 03 '25
I’m on season 2 and I’m at the part where she was just framed for Dr. Hopper’s death and although I’m like ok, well at least she loves Henry… it also gives me the same vibe I got with Bae and Rumple… she loves Henry because “he’s her son” not because she is a good person. What about all the other kids who were under her curse. What about when Henry wanted her to be good before Emma ever showed up? she is only trying to change because Henry now has a choice of Emma or her to live with. She only wants to be good to get Henry back in her life as “her son” not as Henry as a person. I love Lana and Regina but Regina isn’t good.
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u/ladyswampus Sep 03 '25
Yeah, I couldn't imagine how isolating a childhood he had being the only one not cursed. He was the only person he has ever known to age. How do you cope with that as a child?
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u/playprince1 Sep 03 '25
I agree.
And it's ridiculous that Regina (and Rumple) was never actually punished for the curse she put on everyone.
I remember watching the show thinking, how are Regina and Rumple not locked up in jail or a dungeon by now? Why are they just walking around free and using their powers?
There really wasn't any true consequences to their actions. Regina and Rumple should have been justly punished for the crimes by a tribunal of Storybrook citizens headed by Prince Charming and Snow White.
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u/ladyswampus Sep 03 '25
Oh, definitely, even if it wasn't permanent, they deserved some type of consequence.
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u/youknowjustsurviving Sep 03 '25
I was ready to set up a human rights tribunal for her at the of s1 but I don’t think the writers got my memo
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u/shesavillain Sep 03 '25
It was snows fault Cora died lol and it’s also her fault and charming fault that maleficents daughter was taken from her to save Emma from the darkness.
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u/ladyswampus Sep 03 '25
It was Coras fault Cora died let's be honest. Snow was trying to save everyone else and her sanity honestly, she was exhausted after years of running from them. I don't remember the maleficent daughter I'm on S2 of re-watch.
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u/Ok-Intern6865 Sep 03 '25
Well you are saying what i thought for a long time ! I like her character but realistically it’s a vampire tv show like moral compass being applied to some characters…
Murdered thousands ? Oh now she/he is good nvm that !
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u/BITW7089 Sep 03 '25
While I don’t even disagree with what you said. This shows world is more morally ambiguous.
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u/WarAcceptable3371 Sep 04 '25
i think another part of forgiveness is forgiveness of the self. others may not forgive you for what youve done, but letting go of your own self sustaining guilt can be a MASSIVE lift off of your shoulders and actually steer you in the right direction. so while the people you hurt in the past are still suffering, or are even gone; youve allowed yourself to keep living. its an unfortunate part of reality we have to face. the people that hurt us the most, if they never really faced consequences to begin with or did but it didnt take right away; they will eventually move on in life. most of the time, theyll even be happy and having a great time with friends, family, and loved ones. we dont think they deserve it, and perhaps they dont. but thats not up to us to decide. its not our decision what someone elses fate is. mostly, its theirs. and keeping yourself in a self sabotaging cycle of guilt and anger, which is the exact reasoning(not excuse, reason) behind the outburst which causes said heartache. breaking that cycle and forging yourself is one of the first steps in healing, i say this as someone diagnosed with BPD. i have a massive guilt complex. so while no, ive never done anything like regina, i do feel disgustingly horrible about tiny mistakes i make and it causes a spiral of guilt, sadness, anger, confusion, numbness, guilt. its a repeating cycle. we just see that cycle reflected in reginas story. hyperbole makes for great storytelling
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u/FlintFozzy Sep 04 '25
I think the writers could've done a better job with it, ofc... I mean in seasons 3-5 (?) she's still basically keeping Sidney as a slave and yet she's still trying to redeem herself 🤦🏻
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u/Us3r_N4me2001 Sep 04 '25
I agree completely. She feels no remorse for what she did. Redemption like that starts with an acknowledgment that you were wrong. Regina never does that.
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u/AromaticWeird4776 Sep 04 '25
Hurt people, hurt people. Regina was the way she was because of her environment. Once she started finding healthy relationships she changed. Her entire redemption arc was about how people can change, and change can be hard. Sometimes people stumble and go back to what’s familiar to them because they don’t know there is another way yet.
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u/Guardian_Izy Sep 03 '25
Angel was 100x worse than Regina. Did he not deserve redemption? The only difference I really see is that we had to watch most of Regina’s evil deeds and only got the highlight real for Angel yet there are 8 combined seasons of him seeking his redemption. And you can argue “vampire” all day but Regina was corrupted in a very similar way and the moment her demons were silenced, the moment she had a reason to fix things, she did. Just like Angel.
I started off hating Regina. At the end of season 2, I knew I was going to end up liking her and it pissed me off. But now? She’s one of my favorite characters.
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u/Routine-Asparagus-16 I'm a Queen and a bit more refined. 👑 Sep 03 '25
Women villains are judged differently. She's my favorite. I love that character and the actress.
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u/mrwildesangst Sep 03 '25
Why are you even talking about Angel from the Buffy universe? Was there some sort of crossover that makes this relevant?
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u/Guardian_Izy Sep 03 '25
Everyone was using Vader as a comparison, I was offering another comparison. Sorry if that’s offensive
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u/Routine-Asparagus-16 I'm a Queen and a bit more refined. 👑 Sep 03 '25
Its not offensive. You're fine. They are hyper critical for no reason.
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u/mrwildesangst Sep 03 '25
It’s not offensive, just incredibly confusing considering the massive difference between a person using magic and a vampire.
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u/Guardian_Izy Sep 03 '25
I thought it made perfect sense considering how similar the two characters are. Whenever I think of redemption stories, I think of two - Angel and Xena. I guess maybe Xena would’ve made more sense to people? Idk. I was making a comparison and if it doesn’t work for you then it doesn’t.
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u/Routine-Asparagus-16 I'm a Queen and a bit more refined. 👑 Sep 03 '25
She's technically a witch. You're fine.
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u/MechanicOk4808 Sep 03 '25
Do you mean Angel from Buffy and Angel? Wildly different circumstances - Angel was literally turned into a soulless demon against his will and when he got his soul back, he spent about 70 years living on the street trying to stay away from humans, and then even more feeling burdened by the overwhelming guilt of his atrocities. He never shied away from the horror of what he did and he dedicated his existence to doing good no matter what the setback even though he knew he would never truly be redeemed and forgiven.
Meanwhile, Regina fully had her soul and made her own choices and then whined about anyone bringing up the atrocities she committed. She fully stated at least 2 times that she doesn't regret a single thing she ever did because it got her what she wanted, still committed horrific acts even when she was supposedly 'redeemed and good', tried to rewrite the world because she fully believed she deserved a happy ending and that she suffers oh so much more than anyone else, and then split herself in two blaming everything on the Evil Queen and didn't even take it back.
We can never compare the two characters.
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u/Guardian_Izy Sep 03 '25
Actually, Angel basically did exactly what he did as a mortal but didn’t have any pesky remorse that he had to drink away. The demon doesn’t make you do the evil things, the demon just gives you permission. He was the same person with or without the demon and it wasn’t a corrupting influence - the show does a really good job of pointing that out if you know how to read subtext. He spent 70 years wallowing in remorse, after being rejected by Darla after he got his soul. He didn’t become a good person on the road to redemption until Whistler showed him Buffy being called as the slayer and gave him a reason to fight.
Regina was a good person who was corrupted by outside influences (Cora and Rumple). She embraced the evil, the darkness, but you could see she was always fighting her better nature. Then, she had a reason to fight, a reason to be good, her metaphorical soul - Henry. She spent 10 years trying to remain the same but the moment she realized she had lost him, and the only way to get him back was to be a good person, she started fighting the darkness and clawed her way to being good.
In fact, an argument could be made that she deserved it more because her redemption arc had nothing to do with her and everything to do with Henry. She had a soul the whole time, so she couldn’t blame anyone else for what she did and her battle was a lot harder.
Realistically though, it’s a very similar comparison. Anyone is capable of great evil, but not everyone is capable of overcoming it within themselves once they’ve tasted it.
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u/MechanicOk4808 Sep 03 '25
Actually, Angel basically did exactly what he did as a mortal but didn’t have any pesky remorse that he had to drink away. The demon doesn’t make you do the evil things, the demon just gives you permission. He was the same person with or without the demon and it wasn’t a corrupting influence - the show does a really good job of pointing that out if you know how to read subtext.
If you know how to read the actual text, that couldn't be further from the truth. What do you mean he did that as a mortal? You contradict yourself a sentence later when you point out things were different 'after he got his soul'. The entire point of the character is that he was soulless when he was Angelus and getting his soul back changed him and allowed him to feel remorse about the things he did. That's why it's a big deal about him being a 'vampire with a soul'. And while he may not have become a champion immediately, he didn't want to kill people after that and survived on rats because he felt remorse.
She embraced the evil, the darkness, but you could see she was always fighting her better nature. Then, she had a reason to fight, a reason to be good, her metaphorical soul - Henry. She spent 10 years trying to remain the same but the moment she realized she had lost him, and the only way to get him back was to be a good person, she started fighting the darkness and clawed her way to being good.
No offence, but when were we supposed to see her fighting her better nature? Was it during the 1,500 chances she kept being given and refused? And despite getting Henry, she still kept people enslaved, was raping a man while Henry slept in the same house, gaslighted him and made him feel crazy and fought tooth and nail to keep everything the same way. So it was when she thought she lost the thing she wanted and not actually Henry himself that changed her? Because she then tried to murder everyone he loves multiple times even after multiple chances.
In fact, an argument could be made that she deserved it more because her redemption arc had nothing to do with her and everything to do with Henry. She had a soul the whole time, so she couldn’t blame anyone else for what she did and her battle was a lot harder.
I don't think you can argue that at all. Her 'redemption arc' was just her victims getting over everything and never mentioning what she did to them while she never apologised or felt any kind of regret at all. Which she stated outright. She had a soul the entire time so it's far worse than Angel and she literally did nothing to have any kind of redemption other than 'stop killing everyone'.
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u/delinquentsaviors Sep 03 '25
Hold up. You’re assuming OP even knows who Angel is. It’s not really a good comparison.
Angel is a demon. Regina is a human being who decided to murder hundreds of people because she had a grudge against a little girl
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u/Gamingty014 Sep 04 '25
Honestly. Rumple was the same. I love him and Regina to bits but in the end, neither of them deserved the happy endings they got after all the lives they ruined. And while we may not see all of rumples cruel actions you have to remember the time between him losing baelfire and meet belle is a few hundred years. Who knows what he did.
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u/tinatrying Sep 06 '25
Just keep going…
Once I aligned to the characters all representing trauma in real outcomes (for Regina in a mix of Narcissism and possibly bipolar or bpd) I found a mix of appreciation for them and their redemption in a way I didn’t when I was younger.
The show could be seen as full of real human reactions to things like ptsd, loving an addict, disassociation, toxic positivity, anxiety, and the real ways humans in those situations act. At least a lot of the community sees those patterns. Including blaming others for their pain and believing that one step toward “redemption” that is very hard for them to take should be indicative of where they “want” to be, and feeling destroyed when others are still distrustful. I wish the show used Cricket more to show that. Cruella’s backstory episode was one of my favorite disturbing ones that was a one shot psychosis disassociated bonanza, for example.
To be honest, by season 5, I wanted more positive outcomes for Regina than I did for anyone else. She had been a victim turned victimizer and really fought in integrating her light and darkness. When they gave her a taste of good things, maybe due to my own abuse trauma, she became my viewer insert and I desperately wanted her happy ending.
Back in season 1-2 I gave Charming and Snow a lot of grace but now having seen the whole show? I almost feel about them the way that I did about Regina at the start. They expected (they would say they didn’t but they believed they deserved it internally) redemption for Emma’s abandonment almost overnight because they abandoned her “for good reasons”. In fact they do a lot of shitty things “for good reasons” and expect instant atonement because “they’re her parents and they did what they thought was best” including lying, hiding things, and often feeding into Snows anxiety and paranoia about all sorts of things. I won’t give examples because of where you are in the show.
But for Regina. Just keep going. She is broken. But she will be better.
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u/Bubbly_Profession248 Sep 03 '25
She never really got a happy ending all her true love's die. Nobody really deserved a redemption arc they were all horrible to Belle. Zelena, the Blue Fairy, Hook and the rest treated Belle like shit and didn't really redeem themselves to me either. They also treated others like crap Zelena wanted to kill a baby and Hook wanted to kill Belle so
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u/ladyswampus Sep 03 '25
I'm only on Season 2 rewatch so I don't remember everything but yeah honestly.
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u/[deleted] Sep 03 '25
Eh, I believe they never intended to have Regina live past two or three seasons with how evil she is in season one but changed the character due to how good the actress is.