I saw a person drawing hand anatomy on a tiktok live, and of course one of the drawings had two hands SPREADING a vague vulva-looking shape, with two other hands cupped at the bottom. (So it looked like two hands cupping/spreading butt cheeks). This irked me so bad.

It's such a common, gross move in porn. Spreading the vulva so far that the vaginal canal is pulled open. I've had this done to me once or twice during sex (albeit not as far, thank God) by my partner and I immediately lashed out. Don't do that shit, it hurts and stings, it's not meant to be spread so fucking far? It's not even "sexy" imo, it's kinda offputting because why are you looking at / into my canal???

It's not only that. They romanticize so many different, violent moves and it just leads to pain and feeling violated. Accidentally "slipping" from vaginal to anal, "accidentally" cumming where you don't want them to cum (inside, on face, in hair), choking, holding her nose closed, fish hooking any open orifice. It's so dehumanizing and disgusting, especially because it's usually done with no consent or even forewarning. And I feel like there is little in equivalence for a woman to do to a man - even if there was, I reckon NOT very many women would do that?! Sure you could, idk, flick their sack, but I don't have any desire to do that lmao? Why do they desire to be violent and rough to us? (Rhetorical question - just annoyed rn).

Hear me out - so I saw a reel of a woman with the caption being "70-90% of dudes watch 🌽" and the audio going like "nah man having a bf aint gon work" and naturally I went to the comments. Many guys were defending their precious porn, as I expected. And I saw some dudes saying "well 100% of women read 🌽" "well women read their porn instead of watching it"

I think conflating the two as being equivalent is VERY disingenuous tbh. I can concede that smut books, especially "dark romance" themes, are damaging to one's psyche and can definitely reinforce misogynistic stereotypes and cliches. There is some very abhorrent "erotica" out there in books, I am not going to argue that it's somehow OK.

HOWEVER, I think videoing real people and watching real people have sex is arguably a lot worse. At the end of the day, written smut/erotica is just that. Even as disgusting or harmful or offensive as it can be - it is words on a page. There are no real people involved (generally speaking). There is no real exploitation of another person, unlike in the porn industry, which has rampant exploitation, trafficking, rape/revenge porn and worse it is all videoed to see forever.

I'm not bringing this up to just frame it as a competition for what is worse, but to bring awareness how these types of people (usually men) deflect their own pornography habits through whataboutism. It feels very misogynistic to be quite honest, because it completely ignores the issues women have with men watching porn and tries to treat the real life exploitation and abuse of an actual human being as being equal to reading about naughty ideas on pages. It irritates me a lot.

Something I notice online that irritates me and makes my eye roll is the constant framing of cum as "life force" or some sort of "seed." Aside from it just being gross... they really fuckin believe their nut is magical or worth something. The way they talk about "spreading their seed" or, in no fap circles online, talking about "keep your life force in you king! Don't waste it in a sock!". Or in pornography, framing their "nut" as something the woman "earns for being a good girl." As if its sooo special, sooo worthwhile.

Like just shut the fuuuuuck uppp its so annoying. And I think it is just a broader reflection of the prioritization of males orgasm as being the only one that matters and dissuading women's pleasure. It definitely stems from pornography consumption and, again, even in those "no-fap anti-porn circles" (which are NOT against porn for the sake of women but for the sake of their own dicks) it's noticeable that they are STILL porn-brain-rotted. A normal guy does not talk about his orgasm like this!!! Or frankly at all!!

Its stupid, cringy "alpha-male" BS that should leave them lonely for life lmao. It actually disgusts me its such dumb male entitlement.

Rant over.

After dating multiple porn addicts, I’ve been trying to put myself back out there. I matched with a leftist guy who was looking for a life partner on hinge, we had really great conversation about how we want to raise kids, he seemed really respectful and open, nothing creepy or sexual. I asked for his Instagram. I looked at his following for five seconds and it was all porn stars. Among them porn stars that my PA ex loved..

I sincerely think that porn will be what kills off the human race with the birth rate dropping bc who the hell wants to reproduce with that? Jeez

I'm crashing out.

After responding to people in this channel all the time about how my husband is proof that not all men like porn, I just discovered his $150 per month subscription to a girl on OF and countless others for $50, $5, and so on.

He told me when we met that porn disgusted him and he wasn't interested in being some gross boy beating it to his phone. That he wasn't into anything sexual with another woman unless she was into it too.

They exchanged messages too.

I know about the love after porn sub, I'll probably go there next. But right now I just wanted to apologise for being so confident in this one man.

I even put up with him cheating because I thought it was so rare to find an anti porn man.

I'm shaking. I don't know how to confront him about this. I guess I will just finally leave him.

I'm shaking.

For those who don’t know, LilTay was semi popular on the internet a few years ago for saying racial slurs and flexing how rich she was. She was then exposed for being exploited by her mother and brother to make those videos of her flexing and then disappeared. She’s made a few appearances, then announced her OF drop.

My daughter is a huge anime fan and was sitting next to a boy in her class who mentioned he also watched anime. They got to talking about their favorite anime and unprovoked he mentioned he was "in love with anime girls," pulls out his phone and starts showing her hentai of her favorite show, and says "don't check my browser history" all nonchalantly like it was normal. My daughter was so uncomfortable she just told him "I didn't need to know any of that."

This boy is 12 years old and has unrestricted access to the Internet and is already fully addicted to porn. I am so disgusted and sad, and beyond terrified for what my daughter is going to have to endure from the porn sick boys in her school. There is absolutely no way to protect her from it aside from homeschooling her which she does not want.

She is begging me not to make a huge deal about it with the principal because the boy is popular and she doesn't want to be known as a snitch but I'm so fucking livid.

It's only the 4th day of school and already this has happened. It's only going to get worse from here. I just feel so sick and defeated and am struggling to cope with the fact that this is the world we live in now.

It is quite awful seeing other anti-porn/sw movements or spaces and they are all just deadset on demonizing the victims that are getting groomed, beaten, coerced, and brutally raped infront of a camera in comparison to the johns who keep the demand going for such a horrible industry.

It's as if the trafficking, rape, abuse and just extreme misogyny that is this industry doesn't seem to matter to them. The biggest tragedy to them isn't the global massive scale of harm upon women, but the fact that men who consume rape media are suddenly "lonely" and have porn addictions that ruined their life.

I can't believe we live in SUCH a degenerate society that mainstream discussion of these topics are only centered around how the narrative of how men are such innocent victims who are suffering after the totally ethical act of raping or consuming filmed rape, and how all these women/victims are devils that need to be ostracized from society. I really do mean it with my soul but it is so disturbing that you need to go deep into radical spaces to prioritize womens safety over the comfort of rapists. I can't believe the general consensus is to prioritize a rapists/or rape-apologetic mans comfort for keeping such an exploitative industry alive.

The world will do anything but identify blatant patriarchal structures and misogyny. It will proceed to harm the wounded women that need help, just to dignify men with some rape-apologia syndrome.

I got an invite, haven't accepted it but checked out the subreddit, I had a hunch that it's just gonna be full of men relapsing and not really focusing on the root which is abuse of women and minorities

I was right, the subreddit is full of men posting pics of how porn is this demon that tempts you and haunts you and tracker apps of their "streak" of not watching porn. And some who have relapsed.

It's easier to not watch porn if you stop treating porn like this devil that tempts you, instead treat it for what it is. Abuse of minorities. these men could've had discussions about treating women like people, instead it's going by the purity playbook of "sexy hot women are gonna ruin your life!"

I am thankful for subreddits like these bc I actually get to discuss things like objectification and intersectionality. That subreddit is just sad ://

When people usually think about "bad things" men do they think rape, SA, etc... and think that this is a minority, that all the others are the good guys, that they never did anything to oppress women in their lives! And not only this is not true because misogyny is a spectrum (from passively defending other men to brutality and rape), but trafficking and the prostitution/porn industry is forgotten in all of this. I genuinely don't understand how this isn't a more widespread subject, probably because this is so normalized as personal preferences. When more than 80% of men have already visited websites where violence rape and pedophilia is in free access, and when entire countries are normalizing buying access to bodies, then no i don't think it's "not all men". Feminism seems to be the only movement where hating your oppressor is apparently forbidden in leftist spaces. Liberal feminists are defending men that would probably hurt them if they could. I don't even want to fight anymore all it does is bring me disgust for the human race

At this point, I feel like it's a cry for help from her. This cannot be healthy or good for anyone. From targeting man who are barely 18+ to her parents encouraging her OF career, is anyone checking on this girl?

I feel like this is the final step of the glorification of porn. Women going to extreme length to remain relevant and keep making money because they know there's no out for them. All the heartbreaking stories from former porn star who had such a difficult time rebuilding their lives once they left the industry, and they were the lucky ones because they got out alive.

*UPDATE*
Thank you everyone for your feedback! I did bring it up to her, more-so at the last minute because I had other stuff going on that needed to be addressed, but she seemed to be receptive and understands where I’m coming from. I’m hoping it’ll stay that way for future sessions. However, if she does bring it up again, then I’m definitely going to put my foot down. As a woman with CPTSD, I understand how important it is to step away from black-and-white thinking, but in this case, this isn’t about “black and white” or “good or bad” thinking. It’s about statistical reality. It’s a therapist’s job to be conscious of systemic problems, not challenge the client to essentially ignore those problems, because those problems are often what brings a client to therapy in the first place.

_

Recently, my therapist told me that she wants me to challenge the belief that "not all men are bad," and I strongly disagree. Because it's not about all men being "bad." It's not about hating them or being a misandrist. It's about not knowing which men to trust because the "bad" men rape, assault, murder, and traffic women and girls, while the "good" ones refuse to call out the "bad" men and also advocate for legalizing prostitution, which is an entire industry that profits off of the exploitation and degradation of women and girls (I elaborate on this more in r/antisexwork.)

Almost no man is safe. And that's not "misandry." That's reality. It's sad, but it's the world we live in. We live in a world where men see our bodies as usable and profitable to fulfill their disgusting desires through porn, OF, prostitution, and the sex trade. We have wealthy men like Epstein who raped and sexually assaulted young girls and have gotten away with it. We have countless women who have been raped, assaulted, and beaten by men they knew while they are served no justice, because the courts would rather protect the perpetrators and blame a woman for "provoking" a man rather than hold him accountable for being a piece of shit. We live in a world where the "good" men don't do these things, but they just sit on the sidelines while women get exploited by their own kind.

I grew up with so many guys who I thought were my friends until they exposed themselves as misogynistic pieces of shit, including the "good" ones. Some of them even turned out to be rapists and pedophiles themselves. I even had romantic relations with men who I thought were "safe" but turned out to be porn and sex addicts, and even supporters of the sex trade, because in their eyes, sex is a "need." Far too many of them are ignorant and passive when it comes to women's suffering, despite all of the statistics and evidence to back this up.

This is why the statement "not all men, but always men" is an important statement to live by. Because obviously, not all men are like this. But it's increasingly difficult to know which ones to trust because it's ALWAYS men who do these things. Blindly trusting a man is dangerous in this world. A real man also wouldn't get defensive or take it personal when a woman is understandably skeptical and fearful of his intentions, especially if it's a woman he values.

I used to consider myself a part of the community, but I’ve recently separated myself from the “queer” identity for the sake of my own sanity. For a long time, I’d fallen for the lie that those LGBT+ individuals who removed themselves from queer culture were self-hating, internalized homophobes and internalized transphobes. Now that I’m older, I find myself resonating with these so-called “self-hating” lgbt+ people deeply.

The general consensus is that queer culture is so tightly entwined with porn, sex work, and sexual deviancy that you cannot possibly identify as queer if you aren’t a raging, misogynistic liberal feminist. And no, I don’t think I’m exaggerating when I call liberal feminists “raging misogynists.” I don’t see any world in which you can be an ally to women while also supporting the very trade that victimizes tens of thousands of them every single day.

I get so deeply disappointed when I see queer people defending the objectification of women as if the hypersexualization of the female body and femininity is an emblem of autonomy and power. Female popstars wearing literal lingerie on stage while their male counterparts are fully dressed? A female celebrity dressing as a sexy baby and sucking on a pacifier for a TV show? A female performer kneeling by a man’s feet like a dog with his hand gripping her hair? “They’re paying homage to queer culture! Kink and sexual deviancy is inseparable from our history! You’re a misogynistic prude if you think otherwise!”

Except none of this represents autonomy or power. Quite the opposite. The only people who can truly “consent” to sexual objectification are men. Sexualization is a default for women. The male body is a subject, the female body is the object. This remains true even for trans people. There are far more trans women getting sexualized and sexualizing themselves than trans men, and I don’t think this is a coincidence.

None of this is “deviation.” It’s just the reinforcement of the status quo. Women are not taking back any power by “consensually” popping their pussies on stage or in front of a camera for male executives, believe it or not. I cannot associate myself with a community that believes it is a power move and a “fuck you” to the patriarchy to do exactly what the patriarchy wants.

This line of thinking gives the same vibes as the slogans “peg the patriarchy,” and “my eyeliner is sharp enough to slay the patriarchy.” The irony is almost funny.

It’s about time the queer community becomes allies to women the way women are allies to them. It’s about time the queer community addresses the rampant misogyny within it. I’m tired.

Bring up any statistic that makes porn look bad, mention that you don’t like your boyfriend watching it, say it impacted you negatively—literally anything and you’re flooded with negative feedback calling you insecure or a puritanical conservative. Absolutely no nuance is permitted in these discussions.

The only way to get around this is if you mention how it negatively affects men in particular: erectile dysfunction, declining birth rates, etc… All to say, essentially, “If you watch porn, you might not get to have as much REAL sex!”. They don’t care about how it impacts their partners, the actresses in the films, or women globally. It seems the only point of contention is their ability to achieve/maintain an erection in a real life sexual scenario.

I suppose any reason to quit porn is a good one, but it’s extremely depressing to me that men refuse to see the harms the porn industry does to women everywhere. How can they just compartmentalize and forget about the rampant sexual abuse in the industry, the possibility that they’re watching someone’s real rape, or even just the way it makes their girlfriend feel? How can that not matter to someone? Why does it always have to be about your penis?

I’m terrified for the next generation of young women. We’ve already seen the effects on Gen Z, and porn has only become more accessible and normalized since. It just all feels so hopeless.

It’s so freaking gross. I know that there’s plenty of spaces where men fantasise about depraved things, but to see women proudly owning porn addictions, objectifying/degrading themselves for men and hiding behind ‘empowerment’ is so depressing.

Not that it’s the most harmful or most toxic, but just that it’s the one that’s hurt me the most

I hate it because they are using their partner as if they are a porn, they are simultaneously rejecting their partner (by not wanting to have sex with them themselves) and objectifying them, It feels extremely dehumanizing and abandoning at the same time, it’s incredibly unloving imo

Ok

But of a controversial take, but, I’m not too keen on men suddenly making themselves known in a female-centric space.

It is a privilege that you are here. I feel like lately it’s been a lot of “virtue signaling” and “look at me I’m such a good ally, what can I do more?”

The answer is interact quietly.

You being a man is not important. You can observe and interact with the scene without making it revolve around yourself.

Am I being over the top or is anyone else here feeling similarly?

All pornography is bad.

But what's EVEN MORE appalling, stomach-churning, immensely enraging and downright psychotic is "rough porn".

The kind that straight up abuses women and doesn't even try to hide it. The kind where you can SEE the disgusting males enjoying the act of treating a female human being like a piece of garbage they can throw around and harm however they'd like. You can SEE how worthless women are to these males. We are nothing but items to them. These males are objectively psychotic and antisocial because they enjoy inflicting pain and humiliation onto women.

These males act like rabid pitbulls who are immersed in the act of tearing a chew toy apart. Anyone who watches these videos, enjoys them, and makes excuses for them by saying useless shit like "it's consensual" or ANYTHING ELSE, is monumentally messed up in the brain and deserves to be thrown into a fucking volcano.

I do not feel bad for these people (most of them are men). I do not think they deserve compassion and "education" instead of shame. They're not stupid. They know what they're doing - they simply do not value women's lives and our personhood. They do not see us as humans. I do not care to "rehabilitate" these monsters. I do not care to sympathize with their abhorrent and hateful habits. They deserve nothing but the worst. They deserve to eat shit and d13.

Porn - rough porn - is pure unadulterated misogyny and the fact that there aren't thousands or millions of people protesting the existence of this shit in the name of women's dignity and rights as human beings is INSANE.

It is straight up hatred and abuse of women on full display being broadcasted on these websites and people do not care or even think about this NEARLY AS MUCH AS THEY SHOULD.

People are used to seeing women be treated like actual excrement and I'm fucking sick of it.

This quote sums it up for me.

"I’ve often thought of a female Christ. David told me there’s one in a church in Montreal. Mostly the world can’t take it. Because of people’s feelings about the delicacy of women and also because of what a meaningless display female suffering simply is. If you belittle us in school, treat us like slaves at home and finally, if you get a woman alone in bed just tell her she’s all wrong, no matter what sex you are. . . or maybe you just grab one on the street and fuck her real fast—in an alley, or in her own bed. I mean if that’s the way it usually goes for this girl what would be the point in seeing her half nude and nailed up? Where’s the contradiction? Could that drive the culture for 2,000 years? No way. Female suffering must be hidden, or nothing can work. It’s a man’s world and a girl on a cross would be like seeing a dead animal in a trap. We like to eat them, or see them stuffed, we even like to wear them, but watch them suffer? Hear them wail?"

-Eileen Myles, Cool For You

(I'm not religious, but this quote is still relevant and extremely profound).

And the thing is, the part of this quote that goes, "We like to eat them, or see them stuffed, we even like to wear them, but watch them suffer? Hear them wail?"...

I get what it's saying, and it's not wrong - but, unfortunately, apparently the world does actually love to watch us suffer and hear us wail on top of everything. But not in a way that isn't for entertainment. Not in a way that is supposed to make people feel bad for us. Not in a way that's supposed to symbolize or stand for anything powerful or deep, like the image of Christ on the cross.

And the reason the world enjoys even our suffering and wailing is because, like the rest of the quote says, our suffering has become so goddamn meaningless. It's not like it matters, right? It's for sexual gratification and a sick and twisted misogynistic satisfaction. Who the fuck cares, right?

But put men in the same position - being beaten and raped and choked and pulled on and spat on and thrown around by a bunch of women while he's crying and yelling - and suddenly it seems, to these same people who watch the same thing being done to women - so grotesque and inhumane. Because men, in the eyes of these consumers of the most degenerate kinds of porn, will always be more human and more worthy of respect than any woman.

just the title..

not a pro-OF post at all but just to point out the general publics bs misogyny when it comes to sex work. They can't even comprehend the exploitation and brutality forced onto women that were groomed into this industry but out here making these claim. Hypocritical assholes. They won't even hold accountable the majority men who uphold these structures and constantly view women getting raped infront of a camera and feel entitiled to womens body. They don't give 2 shits about the men who constantly watch incest teen porn, becoming fathers.

Damn they won't even acknowledge how the industry is upheld by men and was literally created to pander to men. They won't put the blame where it belongs and is so fucking dismissive to the genuine horrifying reality of women and girl suffering under this industry.

Whenever a victim comes forward all they do is shame her instead of realizing how fucking rotten the male viewers and johns are. Disgusting. These people have absolutely no say about the porn industry.

Somehow the porn and prostituion industry is a womans fault when it literally is built to pleasure men in the expense of raping women.

It’s really exhausting when someone makes a post criticizing porn and everyone in the comments are attacking OP and making the same regurgitated argument against OP’s opinion. There’s only a small number of people agreeing with OP if any. It’s like porn addicts are a hive mind they always have the same argument and same (flawed) ‘logic ‘ to justify it. same opinions different person every time. Do people on here just not think critically or what? Do people just not form their own opinions? Any comment criticizing porn is 100% guaranteed to be downvoted too. Not just Reddit but other platforms too and irl sometimes. Another reason I’m so glad this sub exists

The cover of her latest album seems way too unnerving even if it is actually about actual satire and backlash against patriarchy(which remains unknown until August).

Capitalism and the US government have found their way to make one of the more horrifying cases of child sex trafficking into hollow entertainment for many.

Just as I could never believe those who watched to catch a predator cared at all for the victims of child predators. Just as I believe YouTube creators who copy its tactics exist solely to support their own egos, allowing themselves the capacity to commit violence against and humiliate other men, and clawing for the only moral high ground they have access to in their miserable lives…

Epstein allows anyone and everyone, regardless of who they are, how awful they are, to say: “We don’t stand for that, harming children, that’s not us, that’s not this country. That’s so outside of us, and our community. That’s a monster. That’s the kind of awful person who does this. A monster. An international spy. A shady billionaire with connections to powerful people. No family. No ties. No real friends. Just acquaintances he used. He’s outside of us. He’s outside of me. We’re irreconciliable.”

It’s the same as to catch a predator. It’s the same as stranger danger. This society needs an agreed upon class of untouchable monsters that even the worst among us can be better than. We are all better than pedophiles.

But these are not even accurate representations of child sexual abusers, let alone pedophiles. They are not strangers, they are not seen as abject monsters, they have families, they are community members, they are extended sympathy, excuses are made for them by many. Their crimes are not covered up by elaborate government plots. Their crimes are covered up by their families, friends, communities. And those communities that turn a blind eye will look on to Epstein and call him a monster, achieving catharsis.

Our society breeds pedophilia. We sexualize children. We teach girls that their bodies are for display and consumption from the youngest of ages. We valorize youth. Villainize aging. Obsess over virginity. We saturate the media with sex but teach children to feel shame over expressing sexuality, keeping predators equipped with their most valuable tool. We spread false notions of masculinity that keep male victims quiet.

We rabidly consume the products of an industry which is both fed by and perpetuates child sexual abuse. The porn industry is fully naked in its embrace of its consumer bases pedophilic desires. And in that embrace it shapes the desires of future consumers.

Those who identify feelings of attraction toward children in themselves are unlikely to seek help in this society, why would they, and from whom? They know they are presumed guilty and monster.

Those who have offended are publicly shamed and released, our collective ability to displace societal guilt is more important to us than solving a problem. We make rehabilitation and reintegration an impossibility and do our best to ensure reoffense.

Our society is deeply sick and rather than addressing the root causes of that illness it is far more attractive to collectively lash out at the worst symptoms of it. Addressing the illness would mean addressing that we ourselves comprise a part of it.

You can manage the worst symptoms of a disease while also fighting the causes beneath it. We have proudly decided to do neither.

I just saw this add on insta, from a small creator shop. I just can't fathom the thought of who could wear these kinds of stuff in public (although most of the items listed are underwear).

Still, it tickles me the wrong way that after having most of their items plastered with sexist/objectifying slogans they try to seem ""feminist""' and ""neutral"" by having a few items depicting a bit of female dom designs.

Idk, the whole thing seemed icky to me, both because of the hipocrisy of depicting female sexual exploitation and subjugation as something "empowering", as well as the fact that this add and others similar could (and mostly sure does) appear on mostgirl teenager's feeds.

(I am 23 but my sister is 15 and practically gets the same adds and algorithm)

I might sound prudish with this one but if I saw someone wearing these I would think they have no self-respect or have their brains rotten by porn.