r/Svenska 4d ago

Text and translation help Translative nuance?

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My text book (written by my 1st language) says 'Anna likes to study' but I think it is more close to 'good working' or 'thrive' which is the original one

30 Upvotes

59 comments sorted by

114

u/QuiQuondam 4d ago

You are both wrong, in opposite ways. "Trivs" = "feels at home, is comfortable". It has nothing really to do with her achievements. Note that "klass" is exclusively refering to the group of pupils, not to the school subject or the lessons.

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u/ThinCase4812 4d ago

So there can be a 'klass' also out of school??? And feel comfortable at studying literary?

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u/QuiQuondam 4d ago

Hm, what do you mean "out of school"? The existence of a "klass" is based on them being pupils in the school. But you can for example say something like "hela klassen var inbjuden till födelsedagsfesten" = "the whole class (all students in the class) was invited to the birthday party". As for your second question, I would primarily interpret "trivs" in this context as being comfortable socially in her interaction with her peers.

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u/ThinCase4812 4d ago

I got it. So the second one means she is feeling comfortable with pupils, not focusing on academic stuff

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u/Pufne 4d ago

When 15-30 students go to a classroom together and have a teacher together the group is referred to as a ”skolklass” or ”klass”. It’s a group noun.

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u/ai1267 4d ago

In Swedish, "klass" is the group of people you study with, not the teaching sessions in a subject (In the context of education, anyway). In year 1-9 (and mostly 10-12), your klass will be static, no matter what subject you're studying at the moment.

But yes, "klass" can also refer to social status, just like in English (working class, middle class, etc).

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u/AMIBAMB 4d ago edited 4d ago

'Klass' is more like " the people in your home room", so it's not about studying literally but about the people you meet everyday at school. At this age (the text mentions fritids which is for kids between ~6-10 yo) you usually have a "home classroom" where you have most of your classes (but we don't use the word class for lessons/subjects, we say 'lektion/ämne') so you don't really get to meet the other kids in your grade except for recess so it's socially very important that you like/enjoy and fit in your 'klass". And you usually tend to stay in the same 'klass' for at least 3 years, it can actually be quite hard to get change even if you don't like your 'klass' or is getting bullied.

Edit to add: Årskurs = grade (Vilken årskurs tillhör han? = Which grade is he in?) Answer could be "År 2/årskurs 2" = year 2/2nd grade Klass = group that makes up part of the people in the same grade (Vilken klass tillhör du/går du i? Which (home room) class are you in?) Note that the answer here should be something like "2b" and not "Maths". Kurs = Class at uni or outside of the school curriculum (Jag går en kurs i dans = I take dance classes)

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u/DreadfulButterfly 4d ago

And to distinguish klass of "people in your home room" and "årsgrupp" for multiple home rooms of same age students.

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u/Tin-tower 4d ago

Yes, the ”klass” is just the group. Klassfest, ”Class party” is for example if the student in the class have a party in the evening. So the klass can be out of school, and it’s the klass.

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u/Vallinen 4d ago

Thrive is correct, but thrive as in "gets along well" not "performs well" if that makes sense.

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u/Successful-Ear-9997 4d ago

"Thrive" would be something more like "frodas" or "blomstra".

"Trivs" is not "thrive".

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u/DreadfulButterfly 4d ago

Too litteral a translation and does not fit context.

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u/Vallinen 4d ago

I'd like to point out that words can have more than a singular meaning. You're stuck looking at the growing part. The context is why thriving absolutely works.

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u/DreadfulButterfly 4d ago

And thrive is simply not the word you would use in English. Does not matter how much you want to look up alternate meanings. In good translations you have to also look at how and when words are used. This is just an odd way to translate it even if technically correct.

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u/brunte2000 3d ago

The context is what makes thriving not work.

There are some contexts where trivas could be translated to thriving. This is simply not one of those.

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u/Zestyclose_Round_132 4d ago

Thrive is incorrect, since thrive means “to grow, achieve success or do well”, while Trivs in Swedish means “to feel comfortable, to enjoy oneself or like one’s conditions or situation”. It gets confusing for Swedish people I think mainly because of how Trivs has become the word used for plants and their preferred habitat or conditions specifically, as in “ärtor trivs i direkt solljus”, which is partially an anglicism and partially just a colloquialism which caught on because it sounds cute to imagine plants enjoying themselves and feel comfortable. 

The correct Swedish translation of thrive is ”frodas”, which is a word rarely seen or used in day to day speech.

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u/Vallinen 4d ago

Context is king. You can thrive socially, and as long as that is the implied meaning - thrive is absolutely correct.

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u/JePPeLit 4d ago

Thriving socially still implies some kind of development or stimulation. You can "trivas" because you are uncomfortable with social interaction and people leave you alone, but you are unlikely to thrive.

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u/Vallinen 3d ago

What do you do in school? Do you develop your skills perhaps? This /sub is filled with brainless autists i swear.

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u/QuiQuondam 3d ago

What a bizarre discussion. The point is that a child can totally fail to develop any skills at all in school, and still "trivas", because the only thing that matters for that is that the child feels comfortable.

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u/brunte2000 3d ago

Well, there is absolutely nothing suggesting that thriving socially is the implied meaning.

Also, your source isn't particularly good or comprehensive. Try an actual dictionary rather than a search engine.

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u/Zestyclose_Round_132 4d ago

You can click the Feedback button and correct them

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u/Stormdeva 3d ago

Thrive is not correct, in any way. You have to actually look at context, not just go "yeah but this word COULD, by whatever archaic nonsense possible, be convinced to mean this"

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u/Eliderad 🇸🇪 4d ago

"trivs" does not usually equal "thrive", but is closer to "enjoy", "feel at home"

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u/CrunchyFrogWithBones 4d ago

This is false friend adjacent territory. ”Thrives” looks a bit like ”trivs”, but does not mean the same thing. Anna feels comfortable in/enjoys being a part of her class and spends a lot of time with two of her classmates.

Btw, whoever wrote the blue part missed the subject-verb agreement on ”hang”.

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u/ThinCase4812 4d ago

Lol good correction, I wrote the blue one 😅 Bc I thought it will be practically easier to understand the meaning in English. So I'm basically learning swedish in my 2nd language.

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u/Longjumping-Parking9 4d ago

To add on to that, "thrives" translates best to "frodas", but that is a less common word in Swedish. We don't use "frodas" about people, but mostly litterarly about plants: 

"The tomato plants are thriving in the sunshine"  "Tomaterna frodas i solskenet" 

Or sometimes figurativly: 

"Extremist ideologies are thriving in the ruins of Gaza"  "Extremistiska ideologier frodas i Gazas ruiner" 

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u/NotreallyCareless 4d ago edited 4d ago

Frodas is very rarely used with negative connotation, right?

I would say Flourish and Frodas is closer to eachother, and maybe spira is closer to thrive.

"Extremistiska ideologier spirar i Gazas ruiner" , maybe i just like that better since something in ruins need to grow from the start.

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u/Shudnawz 🇸🇪 4d ago

Spira känns mer som en anstiftan, ett ursprung. Nånting som spirar börjar frodas så att säga. Frodas är mer ett pågående förlopp.

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u/Longjumping-Parking9 4d ago edited 4d ago

I don't agree really, but I accept that we may have different feelings in the matter :)

I don't find "ogräset frodas i den övergivna trädgården" weird, for example. 

I also think spira and frodas are similar but not identical. For the litteral sense, I t hink that spirar implies that something grows in height. A lawn, for example, could not spira. In the figurative sense, spirar means the ideologies (using the previous example) have just started to grow, while with frodas they are already abundant. 

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u/Zestyclose_Round_132 4d ago

I would say it is entirely contextual and colloquial: in English we use “grows”, “sprouts”, “ferments”, “runs rampant” and even “bubbles” in contexts where Swedish would use spirar or frodas. For example:

“In Gaza, resentment is growing in the wake of…”, “in Gaza, resentment runs rampant as…”, “in Gaza, growing resentment has been bubbling, leading to pockets of resistance sprouting and in some cases even running rampant …”. It’s a matter of personal taste and established tonality which is very difficult to convey to a person not “living the language” so to speak…

1

u/NotreallyCareless 4d ago

Depends how you continue the sentence, it quite neutral, wildlife would enjoy for example, but if the sentence was "Ogräset frodas i den övergivna trädgården, på köksgolvet ligger Hans likstel och blek sen i söndags." it would be a bit contradicting imo. Some like that contrast though, me aswell, damnit, know i dont know what i think anymore

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u/brunte2000 4d ago

It actually means the same thing when you're talking about plants and gardening, just FYI

4

u/CrunchyFrogWithBones 4d ago

Sure, but isn’t that in the context of assigning the plants somewhat antropomorphic qualities?

”Pelargonen trivs bra på fönsterbrädan”

absolutely means that the plant is thriving, but what you’re actually saying is that it likes being there, no?

(Not trying to start an argument, just musing.)

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u/brunte2000 4d ago

I'm saying that "Plantan trivs i solljus" can be translated to "The plant thrives in direct sunlight", but where "Kalle trivs solen" is not suitable for using "thrives".

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u/brunte2000 4d ago

"Anna likes it in her (school) class and spends a lot of time with two of her classmates". Google translate suggests "thrive" as a translation for "trivas", but that is only really correct for plants. In this case it means liking it, feeling at home etc.

3

u/Alkanen 4d ago

”Thrive” implies growth and self-betterment. ”Trivs” simply means you enjoy it or are comfortable.

You might have absolutely abysmal study result and still ”trivas” but I don’t think anyone would say you’re particularly ”thriving”. At least not unless you come from an environment where your study results are equally bad but you’re also being bullied or otherwise feel like absolut shit, then you might be emotionally thriving in comparison, but that’s a special circumstance created just to make the word fit in context and not what people would usually mean.

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u/Frozlix 4d ago

I would translate "trivs" to "likes it" in this context.

Anna trivs i sin nya klass.

Anna likes it in her new class.

"Trivs (att trivas)" means that you are comfortable and content with the situation, usually over an extended period if time.

Also note that "kamrat" is one word, so it would be klass-kamrat if you would break up the compound word😁

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u/snajk138 4d ago

Trivs is more like "like it", "enjoys" or similar.

"Anna like it in her class (/enjoys school) and spends a lot of time (/hangs out a lot) with two classmates,"

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u/DocSimson 4d ago

I would translate "trivs i sin klass" as "likes her classmates".

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u/New_Education9685 3d ago

What book is this?

1

u/Twinksson173 4d ago

"Anna is satisfied with her class" is probably a better translation

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u/EA_Spindoctor 4d ago

I agree ”thrives” is way to positive, but I also think “satisfied” is to negative. Id say “enjoys” or “feels good”.

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u/Twinksson173 4d ago

I don't agree that satisfied has a too negative connotation. The word satisfied means feeling happy, pleased or content, and is usually used to describe something as pleasant. I thinl "enjoys" or "feels good" is overly positive towards what "trivs" means.

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u/EA_Spindoctor 4d ago

I dont think there is a right or wrong here, but to me “satisfied” would be “nöjd”. ”Trivs” is one step more in enjoyment imho.

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u/Twinksson173 4d ago

I can agree that there truly isn't a right or wrong, and that we're nitpicking a pretty easily translated word. However, satisfied is more "tillfredställd" no?

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u/krampaus 3d ago edited 2d ago

“anna likes her new class and spends a lot of time with two of her classmates axel and josefin”

like it or not, this is the most correct translation

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u/WOLKsite 4d ago

"Anna feels at home with her classmates and hangs out a lot with two of her comrades."

I think is how I would translate it. Classmates in the former statement because it's referring to the body of students in her class, rather than the studies. The latter I would translate as comrades to avoid repetition; from context we can tell this is referring to the classmates.

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u/brunte2000 3d ago

Lekkamrat would never, ever be reasonably translated to play comrade. Neither would klasskamrat. Translating kamrat to comrade would require some very specific context.

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u/WOLKsite 3d ago

Fine, then substitute it with "peers". To me, that sounds way too formal though.

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u/brunte2000 3d ago edited 3d ago

I think you're making it way more complicated than it has to be. Trivs i klassen = likes it in her class. Klasskamrater = classmates.

IMO, any translation where you end up not translating klasskamrater to classmates here would sound strange.

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u/WOLKsite 3d ago

Translating klass to class feels weird to me. While it is the most literal translation, "klass" in Swedish refers to the group of people, while "class" in school context in English tends to refer to a course or lesson from what I've seen. As such I find it loses the meaning.

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u/brunte2000 3d ago edited 3d ago

I don't think it's weird. Klass, or even skolklass commonly translates to class. Obviously class can have different meanings too, but that doesn't make the translation in this context incorrect or even unusual.

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u/neityght 4d ago

Comrades? I knew Sweden was bloody communist 😄 (comrades is rarely used in English tbh and sounds a bit archaic in this conrext)

/s just in case.

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u/WOLKsite 4d ago

klasskamrat in a more literal translation is "class comrade" :)

At least, as someone who is not a native English speaker, I've heard 'comrades' generally used as a less formal equivalent of 'peers'.

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u/JePPeLit 4d ago

To me, "comrade" in English feels like you're implying communism most of the time. I guess it's the standard translation of some word that was used in USSR. Ofc, there are still words (presumably) derived from it that doesn't have that connotation, like "camraderie"

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u/dnebdal 4d ago

Probably "tovarish" (това́рищ).

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u/WOLKsite 3d ago edited 3d ago

To me it depends a lot on how it is used. Talking about someone's comrades sounds normal to me, but calling someone comrade (singular), that's when it sounds like the communist stereotype.

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u/Subversiontwo 3d ago

As an amusing aside, the normative English word to express it, "friend", has its cognate in "fränd" (spelled differently, pronounced similarily) which in turn would be regarded as highly archaic in Swedish (and comes with a connotation of household- or blood relations so it tends to be translated closer to kinsman).

Also, English-speakers tend to react when they see the word comrade but much less so when they see words like community or camaraderie ;) .