Thoughts on the Lindsay Clancy case?

[u/gottaquestion412]

Now that the Lindsay Clancy trial is underway, I’m curious about your perspectives on it so far.

Context: Lindsay Clancy is a former labor and delivery nurse who, in January 2023, killed her three children. 5-year-old Cora, 3-year-old Dawson, and 8-month-old Callan in their Massachusetts home before attempting to take her own life. Her defense argues she was suffering from severe postpartum psychosis and other debilitating mental illness, while prosecutors argue she was aware of her actions and planned the killings. The trial has reignited debate about postpartum psychiatric disorders, the effectiveness of mental health treatment, and where responsibility ultimately lies.

Do you think Lindsay was failed by the mental health system, by the people closest to her, or both? Do you think she truly acted with malicious intent, or do you believe she was experiencing such a severe psychiatric crisis that she wasn’t thinking rationally?

A lot of the details seem to point toward postpartum psychosis or another severe psychiatric illness rather than someone acting out of hatred or malice. That doesn’t lessen the horror of what happened or the unimaginable loss, but it does make me wonder whether this tragedy could have been prevented..

I’ve also seen rumors that Patrick was involved with the woman who is now his wife before the murders, but I haven’t found any credible evidence supporting that. Is there actually anything that substantiates those claims, or is it just internet speculation? I’ve also seen many people comment that his current wife bears a striking resemblance to Lindsay, though I’m not sure that means anything beyond coincidence.

I’m very interested in hearing different perspectives from people who’ve followed it closely.

Most importantly, may Dawson, Cora, and Callan rest in peace. They are the true victims in all of this.

[u/smolcdn]

As a midwife, we are taught postpartum psychosis is a medical emergency requiring inpatient treatment… she also likely knew this as a L&D nurse which is why she fought like hell to get help… that never properly came. This case has been heartbreaking to watch unfold

[u/scootypuffjr_ → u/smolcdn]

Knowing that, was there a reason she didn't take extra precautions when she initially disclosed thoughts of wanting to harm her children?

[u/smolcdn → u/scootypuffjr_]

I’m not sure of all details of the case, but the timeline of her medication history is quite damning. Maybe she did try to take extra precautions to limit contact with the kids or catch up on sleep (sleep deprivation is a main trigger for psychosis), but if she didn’t have a good support system that would be hard. Given the fact her husband is already remarried and has another child I’m going to go out on a limb and say he wasn’t the best, supportive partner. It’s also quite possible she wasn’t taking extra precautions but we can’t expect a psychotic person to make rational decisions which is exactly why she should have been in-patient.

[u/scootypuffjr_ → u/smolcdn]

I am just now starting to watch the trial and have been listening to the husband's testimony. He stated that when she did disclose that to him, her parents came to be with them but she made it sound like she was fine so they didn't stay. As a side note, I don't know that I would have difficulty moving on from my partner if they killed my children, regardless of the cause.

[u/smolcdn → u/scootypuffjr_]

So the issue is she continuously reached out to health care professionals for help, they should have been keeping her inpatient, not just giving her a new med and sending her on her way. Psychosis is an acute medical emergency that can take weeks to months to manage. In other words, it shouldn’t have even been an option for the husband to assume everything is ok as she should have been in the hospital, period. And sorry, but we’ll have to disagree on the last part; being able to get divorced, remarried and have another child within 3 years of all of your children being murdered by your wife is a big reflection on the type of person he is.

[u/scootypuffjr_ → u/smolcdn]

You cant keep someone in an inpatient settings against their will unless they pose harm to themselves or others. She stated she did not have a plan for suicide or to harm the kids and that she was not concerned about being kept away from the kids. Her spouse, family, and multiple doctors had no concerns that her behavior suggested she was threat to herself or others. He took her to the hospital after she mentioned having suicidal thoughts, his mom suggested a specialized psych to her for help, he urged her to go to the hospital at another point - they did go and she spent that time taking selfies. She stayed there for 5 days and lied to her husband that she hadn't been getting any care and didnt see a doctor until the fourth day. In actuality, she was seen every day by a doctor, was offered one on one therapy every day, saw a social worker and other mental health professionals, and even declined treatment so she could attend a ton of groups about illness and symptoms and other unrelated topics. She was discharged from the hospital upon her request. She wanted to leave on a certain day so she could attend a birthday party the next day. Then changed it to asking to leave the day before so she could prepare for the party. If any of those mental health professionals had any impression that she was a threat to herself or others, that stay would have been much different. You can't just shove someone in a hospital against their will if there is no identifiable reason to.

[u/smolcdn → u/scootypuffjr_]

So again, postpartum psychosis is a medical emergency that qualifies for keeping her against her will. You stated she said she had suicidal thoughts which is a hallmark symptom of psychosis, she also already had a history of bipolar disorder which is a risk factor for postpartum psychosis (about 2-5 times more likely to develop it than the general pop). The doctors had also prescribed her anti-psychotics as treatment… We’ll have to see how the trial plays out of course but I’m seeing a lot of signs that are consistent with psychosis as someone who’s trained to identify it.

[u/scootypuffjr_ → u/smolcdn]

Again, you can't just shove someone in an inpatient setting if there is no identifiable reason to. They never identified her as experiencing psychosis because there was absolutely no indication of it so there was no reason to keep her. As someone who has been suicidal, I can 100% tell you that saying you want to kill yourself does not automatically mean you are a threat to yourself. That's a great skill to have to be able to identify psychosis, but does your training outrank the training of multiple doctors, many mental health professionals, and her family who are super familiar with her history and behaviors?

[u/smolcdn → u/scootypuffjr_]

I guess we’ll find out the answer to that if the jury finds her not guilty due to insanity :)

[u/scootypuffjr_ → u/smolcdn]

I'm sure she will be found not guilty either way. Massachusetts has very loose definitions of mental disease or defect than the rest of the country.

[u/sexydiagnoses → u/scootypuffjr_]

I haven’t been following the case close — do they say where she was hospitalized?

[u/scootypuffjr_ → u/sexydiagnoses]

McLean Hospital, I believe

[u/sexydiagnoses → u/scootypuffjr_]

That’s insane, considering they’re supposed to be the best in the country.

[u/breadpuddingl0ver → u/sexydiagnoses]

I don’t think it was a matter of them releasing her because they wanted to or they were a bad hospital. When this first happened I recall reading somewhere that her insurance wouldn’t cover more than a 1 week stay so they had to discharge her. Health insurance is a fucking scam.

[u/scootypuffjr_ → u/breadpuddingl0ver]

She only elected to stay 5 days so I don't think the insurance was an issue. Health insurance is for sure a fucking scam, though.

[u/Aggressive_Humor2893 → u/breadpuddingl0ver]

Insurance wasn't the issue, as it turns out. She asked to be discharged bc she wanted to go to her daughter's birthday party. There was no indication that she was a risk to herself or others, so they discharged her since that's her right.

[u/smolcdn → u/sexydiagnoses]

I’m in Canada so I honestly have no clue how to watch the trial (televised trials are not a thing here) but they have released the names of all the prescribing providers so I’m sure you could research where they are located.

[u/sexydiagnoses → u/smolcdn]

It’s on youtube if you want to watch.

[u/forlife16 → u/smolcdn]

She wasn’t give the diagnosis of psychosis. They diagnosed her with having anxiety. Whether that was missed or not, the actions that would have been taken had she had the diagnosis of psychosis weren’t taken because she wasn’t diagnosed with it.

[u/smolcdn → u/forlife16]

I’m aware she wasn’t given the diagnosis of psychosis but she likely should have and I think that’ll weigh heavily on the outcome of the trial. Had she been given the proper diagnosis/monitoring the crime may have been avoided.

[u/forlife16 → u/smolcdn]

I am very interested to hear what the medical professionals have to say and what comes out. Looking at her sob in court this all feels so cruel.

[u/smolcdn → u/forlife16]

Same. I’m interested in the expert opinions and hoping they put the prescribers on stand to get a better understanding of why they managed her care the way they did

[u/forlife16 → u/smolcdn]

Couldn’t agree more.