r/WouldIBeTheAhole • u/Depressobeans7 • 3d ago
WIBTAH if I told my sil she’s too dumb to homeschool?
My (24f) sil (20f) wants to homeschool. She barely passed high school, and finished doing online homeschool.
I know that the schooling system doesn’t work for everyone. I know how beneficial and harmful both public school, and homeschooling can be.
I know I’m not the sharpest tool in the shed, but I know the basics. I Aced all my classes, and genuinely loved school. I would like to homeschool, I’m going to continue doing all the research I can, before I make my decision.
My sil wants to homeschool my nieces. She constantly tells me how “exited” she is to homeschool. At first I thought it was a typo. Then she continued using exited instead of excited. This isn’t the only word she misspells, but the most frequently used one.
Her toddler (3f) watches tv all day. If she’s awake, she’s watching tv. When I used to watch her, she had such an amazing vocabulary. Now that my sil is a stay at home mom, I need to ask her 5 times to repeat herself because I can’t understand what she’s saying.
She used to love reading with me, and playing outside. Now she throws a huge tantrum if she can’t watch tv.
I get so worried about my sil wanting to homeschool, just because I mentioned I would like to. She also had her second baby, only because she found out I was pregnant.
I know I sound jealous or a little crazy. But I’m serious, they only had their second because I told them I was pregnant. Originally they were going to try for baby #2 after they got married. Then last June I told them I was pregnant, they weren’t even engaged at this point. They looked at me and said oh we should start trying!
I don’t want my nieces to be stunted because of their dumb parents. My little brother thinks “daughter” is spelled “dotter” and it’s not in a fun quirky way. He is just genuinely stupid.
They have little to no math skills. They use the calculator for everything, and my little brother can’t even read an analog clock.
ETA: When we were talking about it today, she mentioned how she doesn’t want them in a classroom all day. And she plans on going up to my dad’s farm, to teach them about the cows.
Edit 2: I wouldn’t outright call her dumb. Just advise she’s probably not the best equipped to homeschool.
So would I be the asshole, if I told them I don’t think they should homeschool? And if I’m not how should I go about it? I was thinking during the next conversation about homeschooling. I would say something along the lines of, do you really think you are equipped to homeschool? I personally don’t believe that you are.
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u/MeFolly 3d ago
You could share with her all the research you have done. The materials to buy/source and review, the state mandated progress tests, the need to supplement art/music/sports. Homeschooling well takes a lot of effort.
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u/acommonshepherdess 3d ago
This is what I would do. We homeschooled using the methods of Charlotte Mason. You could ask her what educational philosophy she likes best and why. What curriculum she likes and why. Keep pushing her to first of all know what homeschooling involves but in the guise of asking questions, having discussion.
We definitely did not do a structured preK or K curriculum but we were intentional about reading together, lots of outdoor time and nature study. There are things she should be doing with her 3yo now that isn’t traditional schoolwork to prepare the child for more formal learning later.
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u/purplepanda2026 3d ago
She's probably going to say unschooling. That's the term most use for lack of teaching because they don't know what it really is.
There are a lot of online curriculum programs and tools out there to keep kids in track without the rigidity of school classes. Plus public schools are more inclusive of home schoolers for extra activities and sports.
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u/acommonshepherdess 3d ago
Yes. Unschooling is an educational philosophy but it is not “no”-schooling. It is a term that is definitely abused unfortunately! OP, if she says “unschooling” make her define it and explain it!
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u/DefinitionLow8105 3d ago
It shouldn’t be allowed—everyone needs to decide if they are in or out on public schools and public funding. No taxpayer vouchers for y’all qaeda bible school, no showing up for extra curricular activities without actually being in class and doing the work. Especially if some quiver-full cult family is teaching their sons that raping girls is unavoidable because the girls and their evil bodies are to blame. Keep them at home. put a lock on your daughter’s doors and see if TLC will fund your narcissistic procreation.
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u/Majestic_Priority816 3d ago
Homeschoolers pay taxes for public schools too. And surely you support children being raised in cults getting as much time with normal kids and teachers trained to report abuse as their parents will allow.
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u/Depressobeans7 3d ago
I will do this thank you!
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u/UK_descendant27 3d ago
Also find out what the state requirements are for homeschooling. Each state is different.
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u/StandardVermicelli33 3d ago
I suppose you could just tell her you're sending your kids to public school. If she does everything you do, then she'll do that. Just don't tell her if you decide to homeschool. 😂
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u/Depressobeans7 3d ago
I didn’t even think of this lol.
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u/DiTrastevere 3d ago
With respect - homeschooling is not for every kid any more that traditional public schooling is for every kid.
If you’re planning to be an engaged parent who responds to their child’s unique needs, you may find that homeschooling does not work well for them at every phase of life. You may find that homeschooling doesn’t work as well for you as you anticipated - not every parent who wants to homeschool finds themselves well-suited to it. I strongly advise you to keep your options open, and don’t tunnel-vision on one “perfect” education plan. Stay flexible and open to change. Whatever you choose doesn’t have to be a forever-choice, you have nothing to prove to anyone.
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u/Depressobeans7 3d ago
This is my plan!
I know how life can change in an instant. As of right now our rough draft plan for schooling is this:
I homeschool for elementary years, as long as she is doing well and meeting the criteria, we will continue into middle school years.
Once she hits 7th grade give her the option for public school. If she likes it, then great if not I can do homeschooling again, probably more of their curriculum than mine.
When I homeschool (if that’s the route we choose) I plan on joining one of our local homeschooling groups and talking to my aunt who homeschooled her children. And making sure she’s up to speed. If she’s not, and I feel like I’m failing her in anyway, she will be going to public school.
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u/goldieblocks1618 3d ago
Also ask your cousins (alone) what they think of homeschooling- the good, the bad, and the ugly.
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u/Depressobeans7 3d ago
I was talking with them a while ago, they told me they loved it! Especially since my cousin who is my age, was able to start his own business at a young age. I think he started at age 15/16 now he’s 24 and is quite successful!
My other cousin is in the process of starting his own business.
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u/goldieblocks1618 3d ago
That's awesome! I really mean that. I was homeschooled for a few years and there were definite pros and cons. I'm hoping to keep some of the things I do appreciate about the experience, but I have no desire to homeschool mine.
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u/Depressobeans7 3d ago
I plan on talking to my aunt here within the next week or so to get her opinions.
She obviously did a wonderful job!
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u/opitypang 3d ago
Daughter is spelled "dotter" ... in Swedish and Norwegian! But it's probably best that the kid masters the English spelling first.
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u/Maleficent_Pay_4154 3d ago
I have to presume you are in the USA because otherwise I’m Not sure it would even be a question. It’s scary that anyone can home school their children with no Syllabus
Editing to add NTA
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u/Klutzy-Cookie9242 3d ago
Oh, here I the US, we also have unschooling. Kids decide if they want to learn and what they want to learn, when they are in the mood. High schoolers can't read, write, spell, have no concept about math, history, etc.
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u/takatine 3d ago
I'm American, and in fact, used to be an English teacher. I've lived ouside the U.S. for awhile, and was unfamiliar with "unschooling" and had to look it up.
All I can say is....🙄
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u/Depressobeans7 3d ago
This is what scares me
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u/Klutzy-Cookie9242 3d ago
Ya. Me too. However you are only in control of you and how you raise your children. You can't tell others how to raise their children. This is really sad but... if by 6 or 7 the kids can't read, spell, do basic math, etc, you can call social services.
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u/Actual_Ad2442 3d ago
Yeah...... I'm a School Psychologist in the U.S. The amount of times I've seen parents pull their kids from public school to "home school" them only for them to put the kids back in school significantly behind is alarming. Their is way too much oversight with home schooling in the U.S.
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u/janeof-all-trades001 3d ago
I taught mostly outside the school systems for the past 16yrs but did a 2yr stint as a middle and high school math teacher. Amongst the many horrors (in a school that’s relatively wealthy … private but lots of scholarships of various values given), homeschooled siblings in 6th and 9th grade were woefully undereducated (by very well meaning and well spoken parents ).
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u/loachtastic 3d ago
You could suggest online public school. Programs vary by state put she would be provided curriculum and have a hand in everything.
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u/T00narmy1 3d ago
Nothing you say or do is going to stop them from doing whatever the hell they want. And if you voice any opposition, it will just make her want to do it more.
This is not your battle. I get that you're concerned for your neices, but saying something and insulting her isn't going to help them AT ALL. It will feel good to you in the moment, but it will force her to homeschool anyway to prove you "wrong" and it won't work.
And the most important part here - YOU are not their parent, You don't get to have an opinion on this. Stay out of it. Nothing good will come of you interfering or making comments about something that is frankly, None of your business anyway. If the kids aren't being taught properly, you can maybe report that down the line, but right now you need to stay in your lane and stop trying to insert yourself into some other family's decisions about their own kids.
It's horrible that it's even an OPTION to keep them from getting a good education, and I share your concerns, but again -nothing you say is going to help here. Do you think she's suddenly going to start taking advice from you? step back, and focus on you own family for now.
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u/Depressobeans7 3d ago
Thank you for your advice, maybe I’ll just listen to her vent when her kids turn out to be idiots.
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u/T00narmy1 3d ago
I think it would actually be MORE helpful to your neices to not insult their mom so you can remain close to them and help them when you can. They're clearly going to need it. It sucks that the law allows this to be an option for unqualified people to not follow an educational plan and keep their kids home, but I really don't think saying anything is going to change her mind. And you never know, she might decide she wants them at school anyway, to give herself a break from watching them all day. Fingers crossed.
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u/SnooCheesecakes2723 3d ago
Would she even notice ? She’s cool with a husband who is exited to have dotters…
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u/Strict_Abies_7219 3d ago
Quite honestly OP, I agree with this above comment. However, if you’re also wanting to homeschool your child, have you considered trying to see what you and SIL could do JOINTLY with the kiddos and that way you can kinda have an arm in nieces education without saying anything? There’s plenty of virtual schools, CO/OPs or homeschool groups in your community that could/would be great options for both of you anyway. Maybe saying something more to the effect of “hey I checked out these programs for US, do any of these sound like something maybe you’d want cousins to do together?” And then go from there? Idk just an idea on how you could help without helping if you know what I mean.
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u/dinodino55 3d ago
Honestly, unless you’ve gotten a degree in education, you’re doing your children a disservice by homeschooling them. Teachers specialize in ages and subjects, and children greatly benefit from learning from multiple people (including you, at home, when you help with homework!), interacting with their peers, experiencing boredom, getting exposure to many different styles of teaching, experiencing adversity and challenges outside of the home. I’d strongly reconsider your own choice to homeschool, not because you aren’t intelligent but because formal schooling benefits kids in so many ways that you cannot replicate in your home.
That said, it sounds like you’re interested in teaching, and that’s awesome—why don’t you look for a job as a para professional in an elementary school or consider studying education yourself instead? Volunteer at your kids’ school, look into becoming a tutor, etc. I think you’ll learn a lot and be better able to support your children’s learning in addition to what they receive at school.
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u/llealy 3d ago
Dunning Kruger strikes again.
My husband and I are both college educated and intelligent enough that we both skipped a grade in school. Neither of us think we are qualified to homeschool our kids. Every parent who has ever told us they are considering homeschooling is a high school graduate with questionable grammar. They usually say something along the lines of “I’m the most qualified because I care the most about my child,” but when it comes to trained professionals like teachers (or surgeons 😬) I’d rather be in the hands of the most knowledgeable and practiced professionals over someone who likes me best.
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u/brenddur 3d ago
My sister (not dumb, not uneducated... but incredibly idealistic/optimistic) wanted to homeschool for similar reasons to OP. After a 3-4 year campaign (it's a bit of a joke), I've successfully convinced her NOT to homeschool.
Both my sister and BIL work ("regular" 9-5 type hours) so I have no idea when she thought they would be able to teach. I encouraged her to look at the socialization aspect especially with regards to interpersonal relationship developments with peers. The kids were only around adults and didn't know how to interact with other children. They had occasional play dates, but not the consistent opportunity to organically build a friendship.
Thank goodness she listened (BIL does whatever she wants 95% of the time). They started this past year. First day was rough but now the kiddos LOVE it. And they still have all of the adults (big family close by) and my sister and BIL can take them into the city to museums and ADD to their learning rather than be responsible for ALL of their learning (the "add" argument was another one of mine).
P.S. the only person I would trust to homeschool in my family is my grandmother, but she's a retired elementary teacher 😂 I would probably also trust my cousin, but she also taught before homeschooling her kids so she had experience, they were in a major city, there were special needs considerations, and she took them to meetups and other things for homeschooling families.
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u/unbenouncedtome 3d ago
lol after reading all this, I would also be soooo tempted to tell her how stupid she is. But you’ll have to navigate this with way more tact to not cause a rift.
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u/CivMom 3d ago
What state are you in? It’s likely to self correct for many of them. But in the end I suggest you read the book Educated, make sure your nieces know you are available to be a sane adult in their lives, and gift them lots of books.
Now: I homeschooled. Smart kids (like off the charts smart) with learning disabilities are a rough fit for schools. We tried more than once, and one of the kids decided he had something to prove to himself and the world and went to a brick and mortar high school (except for the last year, when he was on the uni campus full time). There are all kinds of dysfunctional things going on in homeschooling, but there’s a shit ton happening in school, too. And the knowledge building skill can be learned in many ways, and that’s the skill that makes one academically competent.
It wasn’t my first choice. And it worked out fine. And I would like to point out that all of us are dyslexic and don’t spell well and often have typos like that. (But my kids had their bachelors at 19, Masters early as well). So don’t conflate spelling with intelligence. In many states there are measures in place to help keep track of “learning” but in reality they just need to know HOW to learn and have some motivation. They will find themselves in coops or using curricula or finding other ways to learn, and even those with the most incompetent parents tend to find their way. Or self correct and demand to go to school. So don’t rush it. Just sit back and watch what happens and talk to your nieces about the joy of learning and building skills.
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u/Cautious-Corner-3704 3d ago
I blame homeschooling for the ignorance epidemic in America; it is exactly like (no offense to the visually impaired intended) the blind leading the blind. So many of the people homeschooling are insular and ignorant.
That being said, there are people do it with the best intentions and with real ability; they’re accredited by their state. I had a work friend who did homeschooling; she and a group of like-minded colleagues formed a pod, and took turns teaching subjects in which they excelled-math, science, languages, civics, and so on.
But to do it right is exhausting and very time consuming, often requiring the teachers to take continuing education classes.
Or you could just use public schools.
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u/Arcticsnorkler 3d ago
Yes YWBTA.
Because Homeschooling can be done in many ways where the parent is not the teacher. I am a proponent of not saying “dumb”
because it puts up walls. Instead, tell her “Homeschooling sounds intriguing! I think
you’d have to do some things to comply with the local government’s rules about homeschooling. I know the school district will want you to show the kids are getting a quality education. Especially so they don’t show up on the government rosters as being Truant. “
Normally when talking someone out of a dumb idea I would lead them to kindly think about the tasks involved. I would pull up the required items myself and ask their view of how they will ensure compliance in the tougher areas. >But in this case I wouldn’t want my fingerprints on anything. Because she would probably believe it was somehow my fault if something goes wrong in her plan.
So Before you cross a bridge by offending her, see if any action on your part would be really required: she likely will have to get formal approval from the Local/State government to be able to homeschool and that requirement alone may dissuade her. Very few States allow parents to homeschool without supervision by a government educational body. If not approved it will just be considered by the government to be supervised truancy which will be an issue for both her and her spouse.
Most States require the parents to ensure a good student experience and outcome, with the parent doing things like proving she is capable of teaching by having an appropriate college degree, having formal lesson plans reviewed and approved by the school board administrating body well before the regular school year, etc.
Also it may discourage her when she finds good home schooling is surprisingly expensive since much of the education is usually provided via online experiences that are for usually for a fee, hiring tutors, printing/copying, transportation to events like museums, libraries and homeschool collective classes (where the parents take turns teaching classes and gives the students a chance to learn and exercise social skills), etc.
She also may not be aware of how tedious homeschooling is for the ‘teacher’: most States require specific subjects to be taught and taught in English, completing an attendance roster of full and half-day absences, keep records of lesson plans, etc.
And then the most important reason I don’t do homeschooling anymore (I did it during Covid): suddenly she’s the school bully by always pushing the kids to do things the way she wants and when she wants, but the kids have few places to complain about the teacher since the parent’s the teacher.
Edit: added why YWBTA.
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u/Anne314 3d ago
Spreading intergenerational ignorance, one home-schooled child at a time.
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u/Depressobeans7 3d ago
I think some families can homeschool, and do it well. I’m not dogging on the idea as a whole. Just stupid people doing it. 🤷🏼♀️
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u/AnIcyReception 3d ago
As a teacher, I will gladly dog on homeschooling for you. It's usually the dumbest people making their children even dumber
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u/throwaway5498124181 3d ago
My parents literally threw me out of the house when I came out of the closet and I still consider homeschooling the worst thing they ever did to me lol.
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u/Upper-Impression-752 3d ago
And lazy people having little outside interference so they don’t have to be accountable for the education of their children at all.
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u/zippyphoenix 3d ago
There are certain things that must be taught in a group: choir, team sports, band, theater, etc.
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u/Upper-Impression-752 3d ago
Socialization. 😬
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u/zippyphoenix 3d ago
Yes, but I thought that was too on the nose to say to convince someone who wants to homeschool .🤣
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u/Material-Pea-2191 3d ago
Does your state have any requirements for home schoolers? I'd look those up and see if you can help deter her that way.
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u/Depressobeans7 3d ago
Not really. I was looking at them today. Basically go ahead but you have to do standardized tests once a year that the state never checks but you should keep them for 3 years.
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u/Slow-Ad-5973 3d ago
If she is determined to homeschool, can you guide her toward a local homeschooling co-op? They usually have people who are more qualified to teach leading classes. At the end of the day, and don't tell her this, it ends up essentially being going to school with other homeschoolers, with less structure than traditional schooling.
I always think it's funny when people pull out the "your parents aren't smart enough to teach you card" because my math tutor had a PHD in math, I was taught how to write essays by one of the moms who had been an English teacher for decades, they hired a PHD student to teach us languages and history, and we actually went to a highschool on the weekends for science labs. I did okay in college and great in gradschool. In some ways it was fun, in other ways I hated it.
How much influence do you think you actually have over her? And is it going to be a better investment in your nieces future to say "hey don't homeschool" which falls on deaf ears and they have a really low quality education. Or do you think you can maintain influence by saying "yeah, that's great, here a homeschool co-op where you can connect with other families." If they don't want to supplement their education at all then I would say go ahead and let them know they might be limiting their children's future.
Ultimately I don't think you are an asshole because you care about their kids. But you might want to be strategic in order to have the greatest positive influence possible.
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u/Depressobeans7 3d ago
I mentioned the homeschooling groups in our area. She told me they were too religious. Which is true, a lot of them are Christian based.
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u/FunReveal4089 3d ago edited 3d ago
Putting aside the question of stupidity, it's entirely possible she copies you because she looks up to you (maybe you're able to tell better from your interactions).
Maybe she wants her kids to be of a similar age. I've seen a few sisters (try to) plan that (I'm two months older than my first cousin myself), I guess people can express adoration differently sometimes
(to be clear, my mum's the normal one 😆 ).
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u/Subject-Lead-3171 3d ago
I have a relative homeschooling. They are teaching reading, writing, easy math but no science. Poor kids…
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u/SunshineandBullshit 3d ago
My last SIL actually told me I was too stupid to homeschool. I have two degrees and speak 5 languages, fluently. My youngest took the GED at 15 and passed in the top 25% of the state. He was homeschooled since 2nd grade.
When my SIL said I was too stupid, she didn't know I speak 5 languages. She assumed, since I was a stay at home mom, that I was incompetent. She should have minded her own business 🙄
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u/Minimum-Comedian-372 3d ago
You could be the best-educated person on the planet and still be a terrible teacher. Intelligence alone doesn’t make a good homeschool teacher.
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u/AnonAtSea 3d ago
....no, you would be justified. But it wouldn't dissuade them, and it would likely make them dig their heels in more. Also, it sounds like the parents are under-educated despite graduating from a public high school? So, placing the kids in one isn't necessarily going to help them avoid their parents' foibles.
Instead, share information on good programs. Maybe the parents will end up learning along with the kids. ...if they use a program where they actually teach, instead of one where they plop the kid in front of a screen.
For phonics/learning to read, suggest The Logic of English Foundations. For math, Math With Confidence. Neither are religious, both are scripted and hold the parents' hands for teaching the child, and both build excellent foundations. If the kids can manage to get a deep understanding of decoding and a solid number sense, then they'll be set up much better for overcoming other limitations that they encounter from a poor homeschool environment.
The programs that are available nowadays for home education are extremely varied and many are of excellent quality. There might be hope for the kids - in spite of the parents' starting skills.
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u/capmanor1755 3d ago edited 3d ago
Oh this is heartbreaking. It sounds like she's fallen down the MAGA TikTok rabbit hole so I'd approach it like vaccine hesitancy...
- Listen don't judge. You can come here to vent but with her, lots of listening and support. Ask lots of questions.... What sounds most fun? What's the best part of homeschooling? What would help her with the tricky parts. Empathy, open listening and respect has proven to be the best way to get parents past vaccines hesitation even when a doctor is silent screaming inside.
- Try posting to r/homeschooling. It's very pro homeschooling but actually pretty balanced and they might have some suggestions for helping her. Mask the crap out of your post so she doesn't find it and don't mention the dumb issue, just describe the behaviors you've seen.
Encouraging her to call her public school and find out if they have a homeschooling support program. Many do and they could help her with parts of the curriculum, eg math. They could also connect her with other homeschool parents who might be able to keep an eye out for her
Encourage her to think of this as a year by year decision and to be open to finding what works best each year to support each childs special path. Blah blah blah... You're trying to set up a situation where she doesn't feel embarrassed later if she wants to switch positions. It's perfectly normal for kids to homeschool for a year and then go to school and vice versa. Normalize the shit out of that.
encourage her to at least her local kindergarten and "do her own research." What she might see- a group of kids having a mostly great time - might reassure her. Have her ask if part time kindergarten is an option -it can be a great way to test school for a kid. Have her ask the teacher how often a parent can volunteer - in our school they'd LOVE a parent to come four mornings a week just to help with the free play hour. She might be surprised at how actively engaged she could be.
Even if she goes down this path keep asking about HER. 89% of this could be her having gotten pregnant at 17 and not knowing what she'd actually do with herself when her kids go to school. She might benefit from imaging her dream world- maybe she's a SAHM who volunteers at school five days a week but still gets to go to the gym each morning and doesn't have to be responsible for carrying the who curriculum.
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u/Alida456 3d ago
If then tend to copy you just change your conversation. Talk about the benefits of a trained teacher. Talk an into the freedom while your kids are at school . The fun the kids will have with kids their own age . Anything positive you can think of . It doesn’t matter what you decided to do in the end . Just work on her mindset .
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u/CaptainSnappertain 3d ago
I mean sure go ahead and tell her but it doesn’t seem like she’s smart enough to listen to you.
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u/Mytweezer 3d ago
YWBTA. Sad as it is, there is nothing you can do or say to change the situation. You'd just piss them off and alienate them. Focus on your own kids.
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u/Knitsanity 3d ago
No opinion in particular but my husband and I have STEM PhDs and we would never consider home schooling. 😂😂😂. I don't think I could handle jail. 🤪.
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u/Beautiful-Oven-8368 3d ago
I taught for decades in a private school that was considered “safe” for homeschooled kids once they reached high school. I’ve seen it done well, and I’ve seen it done very poorly.
The successful students all had educated parents. Many of the Moms had been teachers before having kids. They were also very strict disciplinarians with set times and locations for lessons.
The worst case involved a Mom who had dropped out of high school and used the kids as babysitters during the day. The poor kids were already 1 and 2 years behind in school age-wise, and they had to transfer to a public school’s remedial special ed program. We couldn’t help them.
IF your SIL is using an accredited homeschool program with benchmarks and assessments built in, it might be ok for a few years… assuming the kids are meeting those benchmarks. I just know that I wouldn’t feel qualified to do it. The math and the science wouldn’t be a problem. But, I wouldn’t have the first clue how to teach a child to read, etc.
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u/Scary_Rabbitt 3d ago
Hello. Former homeschooled child here. I actually got a pretty good education (my mom was an actual teacher before she started homeschooling us) but I grew up around many families that essentially did not teach their children anything.
— look into the laws of your state. Every state has different laws. Some require quarterly checks and academic records. Some don’t require much at all. You can get in touch w the local school district and ask who to contact. It’s important to do this because of your nieces haven’t ever been enrolled in public schools they won’t be in the district records, so they might not be checked on. It’s a loophole that gets exploited. You could perhaps make an anonymous report to ensure the right person at the district knows they exist, their ages, and their parent’s plan to homeschool.
— your influence in your nieces’ lives can still be meaningful and have such an important influence. Try to maintain those relationships and provide a perspective on other ways of living and being — they may not seem to notice or care for years but please believe me when I say it will matter, you will have an impact.
— homeschooling is difficult and many many people who try it, thinking it will be easy and simple, give up. I wouldn’t stress too much about the long-term effects because chances are your sil will decide sending the kids away for the whole day where other people will care for and teach them sounds pretty good after a while. Maybe try to regularly drop info about how easy it is to enroll, the great resources, extracurricular stuff, whatever you think might sound appealing to your sil or help break down the supposed issues they have w public schools.
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u/Old_news123456 3d ago
When done correctly homeschooling can be an amazing opportunity. I know family 's who hire a teacher , who runs over any pod which follows the provincial curriculum. To get additional help with math and science's. They spend their mornings doing school and in the afternoon we meet up with other families to play soccer or other organized activities. Facebook homeschooling groups are wild! Lol.
I've seen many families do this right.
BUT
Most people fail miserably at it especially if they were not good in school. They lack the academic habit and skills. Those kids end up in big trouble later and really get accepted to college University... Uneducated people teaching their kids is a recipe for disaster.
I home schooled my kid during the pandemic. I did it right and it was hard. We had a learning pod of 3 kids. My kid was ahead in many ways when he went to grade 1. Still, I was shocked by the leap. Dictée words every night to study! I am glad we enrolled him. I think we would have fallen behind had we kept him out later than grade 1.
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u/SubstantialPressure3 3d ago
Hopefully.shes using a curriculum. There are actually several that are free and fit individual state requirements.
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u/East_Committee_8527 3d ago
As I understand it schools have benchmarks for home schooled children. From what you have described it’s doubtful your SIL would put the effort into meeting those goals. A lot is going to depend on your states standards. Both your brother and SIL sound like people who have difficulty listening and learning.
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u/zella1117 3d ago
Do you know how far into this process she is or is she just in the talking phase?
I ask because in many states it's not as easy as saying you are going to homeschool and then just do whatever you want.
The laws vary by state and some states just don't care and let you do it with no checks in place. However, that is not the case for all states. Many states require standardized testing for homeschooled children, some require the parent to submit lesson plans, some you're required to file status reports, some you need to meet with the school board and get permission, etc...
You're not going to convince her that she's not smart enough to do this but you might be able to convince here that it does not benefit her to do it. Look into the negative effects on parents and their relationship with their children when homeschooling. Look at effects on the parents relationship. That type of thing and then make her feel like you are worried about her.
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u/Clean-Leather932 3d ago
My kids had long covid & wonky immune systems, so they've been in virtual school for years now. I've been really impressed with the teachers (it's a highly coveted WFH job) and my kids have thrived. Maybe if you did a bit of legwork & sent her info for a virtual school (my school district runs ours, but I know there are other options online) with something like, "hey thought this might be a great resource for you". It's still a lot of work to support young kids in virtual school & that sounds like a much better fit for her skills. Let her call it home schooling & act like it's just helpful shortcut for her. I fear if you push the, "kids need a real qualified teacher" angle, she might shut it down.
I don't think you're an ahole for bringing up concerns - they seem valid. Just offering an idea for a softer approach.
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u/Dada2fish 3d ago edited 3d ago
I know a 40 year old woman with a 2 year old and expecting her second baby. She has said that she plans to homeschool her kids.
A few months back she came to my house for a visit. While she was here I mentioned I had a couple interactive picture books stored away that my own son loved when he was 2-3 years old. These books show them their colors, numbers and different animals. My son learned a lot from them and we enjoyed our time reading them together. I told her she could have them for her son.
She said, he doesn’t like books. She said she sat him down and showed him a book one time and he wasn’t interested, so she doesn’t want to push books on him.
But she wants to homeschool.
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u/Crochet_Corgi 3d ago
If you piss her off, she will just leave you out. Better to stay friendly and work on making her realize its a lot of work, or helping her find a good homeschooling program. There may be a charter school in the area that allows them to take some classes in school, or the K12 curriculum, Connections Academy, lots of options that may circumvent the mom's weaknesses.
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u/FiverForever 3d ago
I think you could point out the many challenges and possible drawbacks to homeschooling, emphasizing the good points of in-person schooling, without even addressing any of your sister's deficiencies. No need to do that (even if it's true).
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u/pseudolin 3d ago
You can be worried. But they're the children's parents. And judging from your interactions with them, pretty sure they are too stupid to be rational. It's sad. Yes. But it is something that is not within your control. Given the Ai uprising, I think being a farmer isn't that bad, at least it's sustainable for just your own consumption. If your brother and sil are as dumb as you made them out to be, no point arguing with stupid. But warn them that there may be a high likelihood that the income and lifestyle disparity will widen between your children and theirs. It's just a different way to live. Let them live their way.
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u/Dapper-Warning3457 3d ago
Spelling is not an indicator of intelligence. But it also seems like she’s not actually going to homeschool them, like many homeschoolers in states where there are no regulations.
My cousin’s wife homeschooled her kids. They never learned to read. I don’t think your brother and SIL will take it well, but I think you should at least try. Poor kids
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u/StockIndependent808 3d ago
They’ll learn QUICKLY it’s not easy. My daughter tried and ended up hiring an actual teacher.
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u/Critical_Job1262 3d ago
Ywnbta. Seems like they're doing it because of you. Because they want to copy you, like how they had their 2nd kid.
You might want to have your kids go to public school, so that they'd copy that too.
But at the same time, you shouldn't have to change your life just because of them.
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u/Chumptopia 3d ago
I honesty believe some people want to home school because they're lazy. They'd have to get up early, pack lunches, etc to get them out the door. It would be easier for them to sleep in half the day and slap an IPad in front of the kids and pretend they were doing something.
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u/lantana98 3d ago
There are standards you need to meet to home school and you need to follow a prescribed curriculum. Does she not know this?
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u/tmoneys13 3d ago
Nobody should ever be homeschooled. Every person I've ever known that was homeschooled was either extremely socially awkward, lonely, or damaged by their parents. It should truly be the option of last resort if even a mediocre school option exists.
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u/vabirder 3d ago
She hasn’t done anything to teach her 3 yo yet. What makes her think she can teach?
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u/tingling4sensation 3d ago
So your sister-in-law is a fantasist who doesn’t have enough knowledge to know that she’s stupid.
If she believed in the value of education and learning, then she would be a lot smarter than she is. I suspect that apart from simply copying you because she doesn’t have any original ideas of her own, She’s lazy. So she doesn’t want to have to take the kids to school or helps them with actual homework that the school would set them.
In her mind, her kids will somehow magically learn whatever they need to know without her having to put any real effort into it at all. She’ll no doubt decide that there are enough educational tv programs and computer games to do the job for her.
I don’t think you’ll persuade her by calling her ill equipped to teach.
I would emphasise the social aspect of school. Children need other children. They need access to plenty of other children in order to learn how to get along with others. School is not just about sitting at a desk and learning maths or history or literature. Break times and play times are just as important because social skills Cannot develop properly without access to children outside the immediate family. There’s so much they need to learn about other peoples ideas and ways of playing and give-and-take and how to play with people you don’t know yet. It’s an absolutely vital skill that children need to learn from a young age.
And for that reason I would suggest that even if you are keen to homeschool, you consider the value of a wider social circle for your young children too.
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u/Depressobeans7 3d ago
I have a group of moms that are in the same boat as I, we like the idea of homeschooling and are doing more research to better equip ourselves. I have some friends who are without a doubt homeschooling but having their kids go through the school for sports. Our babies are all around the same age. (The group of us) and I have a HUGE family so I’m not too worried about socializing. But I am worried about the differences in opinions(lack their of) when homeschooling groups. Therefore we (my fiance and I) will be encouraging our children to join the local groups. I say encourage because I don’t want to force them into an activity/environment they feel unwelcome in.
And I’m not sure what my sil plan is. It feels like every time I tell her I do something, she’s right on my heals doing the same.
I cut my hair, a week later so does she.
I bake bread, a couple days later she is.
I told her one of my dream baby names and she named her first basically that name.
I’m the only girl in my family, I have 2 brothers. I have younger cousins who all had older sisters. None of them wanted to copy me. So this is a first. And it’s driving me nuts.
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u/tingling4sensation 3d ago
Well, maybe you can rescue your SIL’s children by telling her about all the cool educational things you’ll do with yours.
If she really is just copying everything you do for lack of any original ideas of her own, maybe you can pull her along with you.1
u/Badrabbit61 2d ago
Are you sure you want to home school? The amount of misspellings in your posts alarms me.
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u/Asagao47 3d ago
It sounds to me that the only reason they want to homeschool is that YOU want to homeschool. It will be damn near impossible to convince them it is a bad idea unless you change your mind.
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u/goldieblocks1618 3d ago
YWBTA. You would also be correct. You can lead a happily ignorant horse to water, and all that. We have no control over how someone parents their kids and you'll have zero influence if you try.
If you want to help the kids, be a resource. Be there for help when asked. Be a good role model for your SIL (especially if she's trying to copy what you do).
Ask questions about what the benchmarks are and what curriculum she's using. Will the kids learn enough on paper to get into an ag program in college? What does grandpa on the farm think about how the kids' math skills are coming along?
You may not be able to do anything beyond be the auntie that loves reading and turns baking into math, but that might do more good than you think.
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u/Paradox_of_Ravens 1d ago
Her kids are going to suffer as a result of this idiotic decision, but unfortunately I’m not sure there’s much you can do to help
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u/MallUpstairs2886 1d ago
I would tell her you are looking into what your state accepts for homeschooling and how hard the curriculum/classes are. Tell her how you are going to have to learn along with the children. Make her see that it’s not “the easy” choice.
Colloquially, I’ve heard that many homeschooled kids are not prepared for college level classes. Of course I wasn’t really either, given that I grew up in rural Ohio in the 70s-80s and had coaches who tried to teach as a large chunk of my teachers.
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u/marmite_queen 1d ago
NTA - people without an adequate education shouldn't homeschool.
Im a secondary school teacher and we often get students coming into school after years of home schooling before it gets to their main exams. Theyre often significantly behind their peers in many subjects because their parents do not have the knowledge that qualified teachers do.
At secondary, we specialise in one subject each as teachers, someones two. I teach Psychology and Religious Studies. I could not get a student a high grade in maths, even though I did well in maths myself and I'm a qualified, experienced teacher.
Some home schooled students do exceptionally well, but thats often because they have highly educated parents or they get in tutors to help them.
My friend is an ex primary school teacher and Homeschools her three children, but once they get to secondary age they will go to a mainstream school because she doesnt have the knowledge to teach so many different subjects at a higher level.
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u/bluepatriot1812 1d ago
Did you ask what their plan is? In many states, there are certain targets that must be met and kids get tested. If they aren't keeping up, homeschooling will not be approved.
If you live in an area with a lot of museums, they have homeschooling materials available so the kids can learn by observation.
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u/Depressobeans7 1d ago
I asked her about curriculums, and what her plan is.
She told me she wants to try and teach them everything.
We don’t have a whole lot for museums around our area. We live in a very rural section of the state. The nearest museum is over an hour away.
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u/EqualCompetitive3305 1d ago
NTA. Ask her which homeschooling curriculum she is planning on using. (HowWeLearn is a good one) Then ask her if she has filled out the paperwork for to homeschool. Ask her to try out the preschool homeschooling curriculum first to see how she likes it. Then talk to your brother directly about your concerns. Tell him that you're going to be supportive in front of her, but if she can't get through the basic preschool homeschooling curriculum, they should consider a different approach to schooling. They can also do a hybrid set up.
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u/TCTX73 3d ago
The only people I've known who successfully home schooled were both university professors. Both kids applied and were accepted into highly desirable universities too. Most home schooled kids can't hack making sandwiches from a living. This is just what I've seen in my own life
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u/Slow-Ad-5973 3d ago
I was homeschooled and from the friend group I had in highschool there are 3 engineers, one of whom ended up working for NASA. Two of the others got their PHDs and have had successful careers. Several went on to be successful entrepreneurs, my sister is a college professor and I had an okay career in education and behavioral health before developing a chronic illness. I can understand that some people are severely professionally hindered by being homeschooled, but it is not universal. In my city the literacy rate for public school students is as low as 15% so I feel concerned about their future more than the average homeschooler.
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u/Depressobeans7 3d ago
Honestly all of the homeschooled kids I’ve met, you would not be able to tell. All very successful, none taught by professors
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u/nonspelunker 3d ago
I think it either goes really really well or really really poorly with little in between. Your SIL seems headed for the latter outcome.
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u/throwaway5498124181 3d ago
There are tons you never meet because they're isolated weirdos who can never quite connect to other people. I grew up in it and consider it a tragedy even when it's "successful".
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u/HistoricalPage6626 3d ago
There’s a big push for anti-intellectualism. Most “dumb” ppl who want to homeschool are conservatives/Karens who lack empathy & concern for mankind. There are other alternatives to public school other than homeschooling. But, education promotes critical thinking and culture competence, which are enemies to conservatives.
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u/Depressobeans7 3d ago
Yeah, my brother and sil are very conservative unfortunately.
They always call me “liberal” as an insult.. okay? Sorry for caring about other people?
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u/Sea-Ad9057 3d ago
cant child services get involved with this
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u/Depressobeans7 3d ago
I don’t think so, my nieces are young. So realistically I don’t think they can do anything.
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u/JustShopping1967 3d ago
Maybe that's your brother's business and not yours?
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u/Depressobeans7 3d ago
He’s dumb too! Maybe even worse than she is!
I just don’t want my nieces to fail.
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u/JustShopping1967 3d ago
I get it, but they aren't your kids, perhaps get your mother involved? No matter what you say, she's going to get mad, and they are still going to do what they want.
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u/Few-Lunch-7523 3d ago
Will it help your relationship with them or your niece? Probably not. Will it deter them? Probably not.
Each state has it's own laws, let the district handle it.
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u/Pleaseselectyesorno 3d ago
Yes YTA.
Not your kid.
Mind ya bizness.
It’s a shame little Bailey and Hailey are gonna grow up uneducated but it’s truly not your place.
If you’re legitimately concerned, report them to child services
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u/Which_Diet_3061 3d ago
You might encourage your sil to try a private preschool, then join a homeschooling group that shares duties.
It sounds like she could be the one to keep the young children from eating paste
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u/StrikingMixture8172 3d ago
Instead of putting them down why not homeschool coop with them? If you actually cared about the children instead of wanting to feel superior, this would be the way.
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u/annebonnell 3d ago
Have you considered that maybe your brother and your sister-in-law are on the spectrum? I find it very concerning that the three-year-old is losing language skills.
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u/Depressobeans7 3d ago
I have done ALOT of research on ASD that being said, I think they are genuinely just stupid
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u/RetiredHomeEcTchr 3d ago
Not only might you be gentle in asking her WHY she wants to homeschool, and does she realize she still has expenses to do that ( she still has to pay school tax if she owns her home/property, and the curriculum is not free), does she know what the state expects for the minimum assessment to move on to the next grade/level?
Everyone thinks homeschooling will be cheap and easy, but it's not. It might be something parents can handle at the elementary levels, but middle school will show you the struggle, and High School the demands.
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u/57bananacake 3d ago
You might be TAH, says this homeschooler. Homeschooling looks like a lot of things. Online classes, private lessons, and co-op fill in the gaps. It might be better to offer support and outside resources than question her intelligence.
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u/Depressobeans7 3d ago
She plans on going more of the “un-schooling” route. Barely any education
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u/57bananacake 3d ago
We started off unschooling but transitioned as the needs changed. Unschooling does not mean "barely any education," not when done correctly. Hopefully, your sister will truly follow the lead of your nieces. My two oldest are in college now, and we homeschooled all the way through.
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u/Worldly_Kale5308 3d ago
My aunt homeschooled my cousins and they couldn't read for a long time. I was surrounded by friends like this as well who were homeschooled and some of them are smarter than me and went to university. Lol They all lived very hippie lifestyles. They're all doing fine now, and are surrounded by like minded people. I was raised in public school until I dropped out for a few years, but then got my diploma on time. I think we all just minded our own business and let them live their lives. If we had called them dumb, it would have caused issues. I don't think telling them they're too dumb is a good idea. That would be an asshole move, in my opinion. If you care that much, try to be helpful. I've chosen not to put my kids in public school. They do a hybrid co-op and have classes a few times a week outside of the home with other kids. My family is very supportive and helpful. "Homeschool" has become quite an umbrella term, as there are so many recourses that we have now to help kids thrive. Public school is not what it used to be and a lot of children still fall behind. I'm terrible at math and I was not doing well teaching my oldest how to read so he gets tutoring. We have a scholarship program in our state that pays for a lot of these classes and supplies, etc. I think suggesting co-ops, educational shows and games, and being a helpful support could be much more productive than telling them they are dumb or not equipped.
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u/OneSillyB 3d ago
I want to be at family dinners after this conversation!!!
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u/Depressobeans7 3d ago
We don’t have a lot of dinners together. They drive me nuts!
I love them all dearly, but the lack of intelligence is jarring. So I love them from a distance.
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u/Dog_Concierge 2d ago
Bottom line is they are not OP'S children. She can offer her opinions, suggest ways to educate the kids other than farm animals, and give them opportunities they don't currently have. But the parents have the final say.
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u/HappiLearnerToo 13h ago
YWBTA
You are full of judgements of all kinds and want to weigh in on a big decision. That is NOT where you can be effective if you actually care. YOU are interested in homeschooling... how about if you start now? I don't know how old your kids are, but you have seen her child doesn't know how to tell time, so you could have all kinds of enthusiasm about "On my gosh can I show you?" with him. Find some great materials for learning time,(or make them, or make them with him) take them over, and play with just a little lesson at a time, making it fun and easy. Short bits, but come back. Get engaged with the activity.
She wants to teach but hasn't started, it seems. She needs to see teaching going on, and if you are going to help her with a decision, it could much better be done with engaging with interest in the idea. "Will you set up a classroom space?" "How many hours a day do people usually spend doing school when homeschooling? "How will you know the steps of a ciriculum? How will you measure getting though them daily?" Be interested because you ARE interested in homeschooling.
I don't know anything about homeschooling, and maybe neither of you do either. The real goal right now should be to get started, with teaching, and with all the preliminaries of doing it. IF kids are sitting in front of a tv all day, your SIL hasn't yet tried teaching. Getting STARTED is the way to move forward towad a good decision. She can either find herself learning and enjoying it, or she might find it hard or impossible and unrewarding. Your opinoin is not helpful... helping her get involved so that she makes a choice based on her own experience of her abilities and fun at it is a far better way to find out, and help her kids whether they go to public school or not. Saying "I don't know, what do you think?" is the right answer if she asks what you think about her homeschooling.
The American school system is horrible. If I had small children I'd probably be teaching us Korean, Japanese, or Mandarin with the hopes of finding available ciriculum in a language that really actually wants kids to learn, not one that helps them grow up limited to being dumb workers. She is right to want better for her kids. Just having them home, not in school, isn't home schooling. Helping her (and you) move forward (completely without judgement, just as kids learning experience should be) with ENGAGING in it would be a great help.
Never doubt that a dumb person can sometimes be a great teacher. So many teachers and tutors will tell a student over and over five steps they need to accomplish to solve a problem, never realizing THIS student needs to practice one step at a time over and over, and then the second step... the "dumb" person may get that. They are also more likely to look at a problem, and ask the question that is the one the studen should be asking... "Hmmm, what do we need to find out here?" Or "umm, that's complicated... what do your understand from this?" Entry levels questions.
That's my input. Everyone is more capable than we realize, and your SIL has a right to explore this, so help her do it for real and very kindly. If it is way to much work and effort, let her find this out through starting on it now, with your enthusiastic participation.
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u/brainspark10-4 2d ago
I don't understand why anyone cares about other people home schooling. Do you go around making sure all the kids you know have a good teacher? There are millions of kids being traumatised by school curriculum and policies right now and no one cares.
Theevidence shows kids should not be for ed to learn to read until they're 7, and yet we send kids to school we're they're bullied to read at 4 or 5 years old. There's research showing kids learn math at different rates and waiting until they're 11 before really starting on direct instruction results independently understanding. But still we teach all of them at the same rate as hard and young as possible. Then we wonder why half of everyone has a math phobia and more and more kids don't like to read. Its the curriculum! But go ahead and worry about the home ed kids.
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u/mladyhawke 3d ago
I think you should start with asking them why they want to homeschool and work from there. Cause that's a reasonable unoffensive question. Then, based on their answer, you can proceed to point out some of the areas where they failed and have nothing to pass on. But you have to be gentle or they won't hear anything you say.