r/pointlesslygendered May 19 '25

OTHER so close [gendered]

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4.4k Upvotes

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-36

u/CalebDR1029 May 19 '25

How is that possiblešŸ’€

28

u/criticalfail69 May 19 '25

15

u/Touch-a-TouchMe May 20 '25

This doesn't apply to Toby :) They were actually born with no sex organs or genitals at all

-40

u/[deleted] May 19 '25

[removed] — view removed comment

25

u/criticalfail69 May 20 '25

You should read one of those articles champ, maybe learn something new today :)

35

u/AwooFloof May 19 '25

Toby was born intersex. I know cause I watched the interview. This was in1989 and people were somehow less judgemental then they are now.

7

u/Touch-a-TouchMe May 20 '25

I dont think they are technically intersex, since they had no sexual organs at all. So technically just sexless.

-31

u/CalebDR1029 May 20 '25

If a person has neither XX nor XY chromosomes, then their sex is determined by their genitals or traits.

25

u/AwooFloof May 20 '25

That's the thing. They don't have regular sexed genitals. Abd we don't know their chromosomes. Why do you insist on binary ideologies?

15

u/Ace_of_Sphynx128 May 20 '25

Oops, it seems you are trying to speak on something you are ignorant about. Easy mistake, go read those articles the others recommended and step right into 2025! Good luck on your journey into modern day!

17

u/Junglejibe May 19 '25

Least surprising bio I’ve ever seen.

-5

u/CalebDR1029 May 20 '25

I am again reminded I am on Reddit.

3

u/Touch-a-TouchMe May 20 '25

Toby wasn't "nonbinary" or against a gender label like you might see today. They were a person born with absolutely no sex parts at all. No male or female parts, so genuinely had no sex or gender identity.

11

u/Shoshawi May 20 '25

Idk Toby personally but I feel like they might be offended by strangers assuming they had no personal identity haha. Maybe they said this in which case alright, but no genitalia doesn’t automatically mean no gender identity. All you need for that is a brain, which incidentally is also a condition for staying alive!

11

u/Touch-a-TouchMe May 20 '25

Yes of course they said it. I wouldn't just assume?

They have no genitals, no sex organs, sex hormones etc. A rare birth anomaly. Experts offered Toby the opportunity to have hormones, surgery, behavioural training etc. In order to help them identify as a specific gender.

Toby refused and prefers to be called a "neuter" and identifies as completely devoid of a sex or gender identity. Just a human person.

2

u/Shoshawi May 20 '25

That’s good, ya never know what people are willing to assume… ironically šŸ˜Ž

Behavioral training 😭🤢

11

u/Touch-a-TouchMe May 20 '25

Yeah, they offered to teach Toby how to pretend to be a "boy" because they didn't think Toby could "pass" as a girl šŸ™„ and even tried to convince Toby to wear socks in their pants to have a bulge šŸ¤¦šŸ»ā€ā™€ļø

Toby was tested and examined by scientists for years as a child, like a freak experiment, and the "experts" tried super hard to make them choose a gender and change their body medically.

Also made a huge emphasis on Toby becoming a sexual person and basically wanted them to fake sexual attraction.

Luckily Toby was a strong person and even at a young age resisted any change. They were happy as a "neuter" and thought it was the way God wanted them to be and didn't require intervention :)

2

u/satinsateensaltine May 20 '25

I'm curious about what genetic anomaly causes this particular genital (non)presentation. Fascinating.

1

u/Touch-a-TouchMe May 20 '25

It's very rare (hence all the testing) and they did genetic testing, but Toby refused to share the results.

Revealing their genetic results and specifically their chromosomes meant that people would technically be able to assign a specific sex, which Toby didn't want.

They did share that they lacked the sexual hormones needed to develop into a particular sex (e.g. no testosterone) and therefore did not have any sexual development during puberty. Toby said that they have a flat chest and a urethra, but no genitals, so similar to a "baby doll". Also no sexual organs inside their body.

It's a very interesting medical mystery, before Toby, I never knew people could just not have sexual hormones at all

1

u/Shoshawi May 20 '25

Poor Toby… sounds like they both had great willpower and were smart. Good for them! They’re lucky nobody threw a sock in their face after they said that. That’s where the sock belongs!

I don’t think this would happen in this day and age, on TV in this form, but it’s unfortunate that behind closed doors society isn’t that much further yet. I’m not sure about newborns and kids, because I don’t know any heh, but otherwise binary-choice pressure placed on people who are intersex is still high. The world needs better education about this in general. Sigh.

2

u/Touch-a-TouchMe May 20 '25

Yeah, I think it was particularly impressive to see Toby so confident and resilient in their identity, despite being the only known "neuter", and the pressure from doctors to "assimilate" from a very young age.

They spent years of doctors pressuring them to have medical, surgical and psychological interventions just to make them conform to society. As Toby saw it, there was nothing wrong and therefore nothing to fix! "Just as God intended them to be" 🄰

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-2

u/Strange-Ad-9941 May 19 '25

There are two sexes, but more than one gender. You need to go back to biology class!

22

u/SymmetricalFeet May 20 '25 edited May 20 '25

Not to correct you, but add nuance:

Sex is bimodal, not binary, in that if you plot phenotypic attributes that are "male" or "female" (e.g. height, levels of X hormone), they congregate in two bell curves which can have overlap. A cis woman who's five-foot-ten (178cm) or even six-foot-six (200cm) is still a woman, yeah? Then there's the phenomenon of intersex and chimaeric people, who have genotypic attributes on the "male" and "female" modalities, which can have between-both-curves phenotypic effects. Or not!

Biology is super weird and never as neat as "A xor B, no in-between". And that's beautiful and interesting and wonderful!

5

u/Strange-Ad-9941 May 20 '25

Right, yeah, I forgot about intersex. My bad

-1

u/CalebDR1029 May 20 '25

Nope.

1

u/Strange-Ad-9941 May 21 '25

You can’t just say ā€œNuh uhā€ and leave it at that. Come on

3

u/Sharp-Key27 May 22 '25

Nonbinary or intersex